New Porsche 911… which flavour? - Page 3 - 911/Carrera GT - PistonHeads UK

So you have the freedom to choose any new 911(ish), what do you choose as the best drivers car? - 992 GT3/Touring/ GT3RS etc - Singer Turbo - Theon design 911 - Tuthill 911k - RUF SCR - RUF CSR

Any car is a one trick pony - only as good as the roads or track it can be used on. In the UK, the roads put a huge limitation on the extent to which any car can be properly exploited. In that respect, I would argue that lesser cars than those on the list above can provide more accessible enjoyment.

Without the pleasure of driving them I wouldn’t know, but I suspect that I’d be happy enough with a Theon design.

I do wonder how much the driver experience differs between them

There will be many opinions on lesser cars, but of those suggested I would say the 992.2 GT3 Touring would be the most useful. Handy enough on track, more than fast enough on the road, but a really useable flavour of the "best" that Porsche can do ???

911K for me..

Agree 992.2 Touring to my spec. Your 90% quote reminded me of Sex Panther Cologne. “60% of the time it works every time”

Pre gpf and more analogue new(ish) 991.2 GT3 manual with standard mech diff and flatshift is the sweetspot.

RUF CSR for me as a dream car, but these are mega money, so a 992.2 Touring with rear seats would be my choice. Euromillions win would see me in a RUF as well though.

My betting is whilst it’s a law of diminishing returns it’d be nice given money no object. On real roads in the UK I do wonder if the older restomods/recreations with a bit more side wall would work best or if something with shorter gearing would be more involved. If I could tailor one I’d take the Tuthill engine and find a way to fit it to the RUF carbon tub!

Slow progress said: So you have the freedom to choose any new 911(ish), what do you choose as the best drivers car? - 992 GT3/Touring/ GT3RS etc - Singer Turbo - Theon design 911 - Tuthill 911k - RUF SCR - RUF CSR Non of those. For UK B roads, Cayman 981 GT4 or Cayman R.

But the question limited the answer to "New 911 ... which flavour?" ????

I am biased because I have one I will admit, however I think I have driven all of the 992s now except for the Dakar and the S/C. Depends whether you want a toy or a car. I think the best one for owning and driving on UK roads is the basic C2. For a start it is the cheapest. That means you will have more money left over after you have paid for it. Depreciation seems the same as the other lower end models- in other words very good indeed for an expensive car. It also has the highest suspension setting for clearance and the highest side wall on 19/20 inch tyres. So I think it has the best ride of our bad roads in a 911. Make no mistake though it is still a very low car with a firm ride and huge wheels. The smaller turbos in the 992.1 C2 spool up instantly with no discernible turbo lag. It is very much like my old Tesla Model S in its throttle response below 90mph. I think all the other models will feel quicker beyond these speeds but as I dont take this car on the track I am not too bothered. This makes it very quick in the real world with instant acceleration when you want it without having to change down. In fact in my car 0-60 is measured at 3.6 seconds with no sports chrono. Porsche tell you it is 4.2. It is not. So you wonder what the Sports Chrono does? I have asked directly and not received an answer as to what ECU/gearbox parameters are altered. I think they dont want to tell me. I think it just affects the characteristics of the engine/exhaust valves and pdk at light/ partial throttle openings, not make the car any faster, just makes it a bit more exciting for your passenger. With no S/C, if you mash the pedal it instantly gives you max beans no matter what. That works for me. The C2 also has rear seats, unlike some other sports models. They are surprisingly useful to use from time to time and fold for useful storage space behind the seats with the tops folded down. Rear wheel drive gives loads of grip. Traction is superb with the weight over the rear wheels. You would have to be driving it like a complete cretin to get it out of shape at the back end. 4 wheel drive does nothing for the steering feel, adds to the complexity, reduces the frunk size, adds to the the cost and the weight of the car. 4 way seats are the lightest, and the cheapest. Mine have been great. My pov. spec 992 has been weighed at 1490kg, which makes it one of the lighter 992s, This is about 200 kg lighter than an electric Mini Cooper and about 20kg heavier than my old 996 C4S. The general rumor in the pub section is that the 992 is a bit bloated. I dont think it is, things have just moved on. One of my old E types with no safely aids whatsoever weighs 1,200kg. I think Porsche have done well to keep the weight down. With no options a C2 still has loads of gadgets as found on most new cars these days such as satellite maps with instant traffic updates, music streaming, cruise etc. So I dont feel I am missing out on anything, even after getting into it after 140,000 miles in a Model S. My 3 criticisms are that the huge rear tires produce noise in the cabin. You can improve the insulation in the rear wheel wells to combat this. Also in extreme cornering, understeer varies depending on the tire temperature. You really should be on the track for that shenanigans though. A tight roundabout on the inside lane could catch you out. Finally I asked for a manual gearbox in 2020 and was told I couldn't have one unless I spent another £15k on an S. Another way of Mr Porsche increasing his profit IMHO. The PDK is superb I must say. So 65,000 miles in, 34 mpg, a few service items and it has been a great choice for me, much more interesting than a Golf GTi, which is the only other new car I considered at the time 5 years ago. Edited by politeperson on Tuesday 22 October 19:05

KittyLitter said: Non of those. For UK B roads, Cayman 981 GT4 or Cayman R. In contrast to a 981 the 718 GT4 is almost as rapid as a 991.2/992 GT3 for road use.

Dakar for the UK country roads, that in some places near me look like the Somme. 991.2 Touring for European roads. If we had good road surfaces, and from I understand of the shorter gearing making it top out at under 140mph, I think a 911K would be superb!

ChrisW. said: But the question limited the answer to "New 911 ... which flavour?" ???? No, they said 911'ish

politeperson said: I am biased because I have one I will admit, however I think I have driven all of the 992s now except for the Dakar and the S/C. Depends whether you want a toy or a car. I think the best one for owning and driving on UK roads is the basic C2. For a start it is the cheapest. That means you will have more money left over after you have paid for it. Depreciation seems the same as the other lower end models- in other words very good indeed for an expensive car. It also has the highest suspension setting for clearance and the highest side wall on 19/20 inch tyres. So I think it has the best ride of our bad roads in a 911. Make no mistake though it is still a very low car with a firm ride and huge wheels. The smaller turbos in the 992.1 C2 spool up instantly with no discernible turbo lag. It is very much like my old Tesla Model S in its throttle response below 90mph. I think all the other models will feel quicker beyond these speeds but as I dont take this car on the track I am not too bothered. This makes it very quick in the real world with instant acceleration when you want it without having to change down. In fact in my car 0-60 is measured at 3.6 seconds with no sports chrono. Porsche tell you it is 4.2. It is not. So you wonder what the Sports Chrono does? I have asked directly and not received an answer as to what ECU/gearbox parameters are altered. I think they dont want to tell me. I think it just affects the characteristics of the engine/exhaust valves and pdk at light/ partial throttle openings, not make the car any faster, just makes it a bit more exciting for your passenger. With no S/C, if you mash the pedal it instantly gives you max beans no matter what. That works for me. The C2 also has rear seats, unlike some other sports models. They are surprisingly useful to use from time to time and fold for useful storage space behind the seats with the tops folded down. Rear wheel drive gives loads of grip. Traction is superb with the weight over the rear wheels. You would have to be driving it like a complete cretin to get it out of shape at the back end. 4 wheel drive does nothing for the steering feel, adds to the complexity, reduces the frunk size, adds to the the cost and the weight of the car. 4 way seats are the lightest, and the cheapest. Mine have been great. My pov. spec 992 has been weighed at 1490kg, which makes it one of the lighter 992s, This is about 200 kg lighter than an electric Mini Cooper and about 20kg heavier than my old 996 C4S. The general rumor in the pub section is that the 992 is a bit bloated. I dont think it is, things have just moved on. One of my old E types with no safely aids whatsoever weighs 1,200kg. I think Porsche have done well to keep the weight down. With no options a C2 still has loads of gadgets as found on most new cars these days such as satellite maps with instant traffic updates, music streaming, cruise etc. So I dont feel I am missing out on anything, even after getting into it after 140,000 miles in a Model S. My 3 criticisms are that the huge rear tires produce noise in the cabin. You can improve the insulation in the rear wheel wells to combat this. Also in extreme cornering, understeer varies depending on the tire temperature. You really should be on the track for that shenanigans though. A tight roundabout on the inside lane could catch you out. Finally I asked for a manual gearbox in 2020 and was told I couldn't have one unless I spent another £15k on an S. Another way of Mr Porsche increasing his profit IMHO. The PDK is superb I must say. So 65,000 miles in, 34 mpg, a few service items and it has been a great choice for me, much more interesting than a Golf GTi, which is the only other new car I considered at the time 5 years ago. Edited by politeperson on Tuesday 22 October 19:05 A good read, thanks !

C2 boggo spec or Dakar

Dakar I’m already up over 9000 miles in mine now. Comfort seats No cage It’s just brilliant on grassy, muddy, snowy, gravel, icy, damaged roads. Useless on track I guess!!

I do love the C2 review, especially the commentary on sports chrono. I’d agree that all it really gives you is the occassional trip to an OPC for replacement dynamic engine mounts! Maybe if you have a manual gearbox coupled with a lightweight single mass flywheel as there is then the rev matching feature. I don’t think it’s really required with the normal dual mass. No idea how you get 34mpg!!!

Monch said: Dakar I’m already up over 9000 miles in mine now. Comfort seats No cage It’s just brilliant on grassy, muddy, snowy, gravel, icy, damaged roads. Useless on track I guess!! That would be my answer, if I had the funds. One of the Franchitti brothers has one in a very similar spec to yours, with PTS Brewster Green paint - looks absolutely epic.

The Dakar would be my second choice as a daily. Only second because it is twice the price of a C2. Every penny counts with 3 kids. What a daily a Dakar would be. Well I knew it probably wouldn't have terrible fuel consumption when I bought the C2, but I wasn't expecting 450 miles on a 60l tank. I own it privately, not wanting to be at the mercy of the Governments whims on company car tax. I did try and order the extended 90l tank when I purchased it but was told I couldn't have one. I wasn't holding back on this drive on the Autoroute and it was still doing 32 after a long run. I received 5 speeding tickets from the French authorities over the following 2 months. Day to day I am trundling around, so I suppose that accounts for the good fuel consumption. At Silverstone, in a PEC car, I got 7mpg. Edited by politeperson on Wednesday 23 October 11:09 Edited by politeperson on Wednesday 23 October 11:12

politeperson said: I am biased because I have one I will admit, however I think I have driven all of the 992s now except for the Dakar and the S/C. Depends whether you want a toy or a car. I think the best one for owning and driving on UK roads is the basic C2. For a start it is the cheapest. That means you will have more money left over after you have paid for it. Depreciation seems the same as the other lower end models- in other words very good indeed for an expensive car. It also has the highest suspension setting for clearance and the highest side wall on 19/20 inch tyres. So I think it has the best ride of our bad roads in a 911. Make no mistake though it is still a very low car with a firm ride and huge wheels. The smaller turbos in the 992.1 C2 spool up instantly with no discernible turbo lag. It is very much like my old Tesla Model S in its throttle response below 90mph. I think all the other models will feel quicker beyond these speeds but as I dont take this car on the track I am not too bothered. This makes it very quick in the real world with instant acceleration when you want it without having to change down. In fact in my car 0-60 is measured at 3.6 seconds with no sports chrono. Porsche tell you it is 4.2. It is not. So you wonder what the Sports Chrono does? I have asked directly and not received an answer as to what ECU/gearbox parameters are altered. I think they dont want to tell me. I think it just affects the characteristics of the engine/exhaust valves and pdk at light/ partial throttle openings, not make the car any faster, just makes it a bit more exciting for your passenger. With no S/C, if you mash the pedal it instantly gives you max beans no matter what. That works for me. The C2 also has rear seats, unlike some other sports models. They are surprisingly useful to use from time to time and fold for useful storage space behind the seats with the tops folded down. Rear wheel drive gives loads of grip. Traction is superb with the weight over the rear wheels. You would have to be driving it like a complete cretin to get it out of shape at the back end. 4 wheel drive does nothing for the steering feel, adds to the complexity, reduces the frunk size, adds to the the cost and the weight of the car. 4 way seats are the lightest, and the cheapest. Mine have been great. My pov. spec 992 has been weighed at 1490kg, which makes it one of the lighter 992s, This is about 200 kg lighter than an electric Mini Cooper and about 20kg heavier than my old 996 C4S. The general rumor in the pub section is that the 992 is a bit bloated. I dont think it is, things have just moved on. One of my old E types with no safely aids whatsoever weighs 1,200kg. I think Porsche have done well to keep the weight down. With no options a C2 still has loads of gadgets as found on most new cars these days such as satellite maps with instant traffic updates, music streaming, cruise etc. So I dont feel I am missing out on anything, even after getting into it after 140,000 miles in a Model S. My 3 criticisms are that the huge rear tires produce noise in the cabin. You can improve the insulation in the rear wheel wells to combat this. Also in extreme cornering, understeer varies depending on the tire temperature. You really should be on the track for that shenanigans though. A tight roundabout on the inside lane could catch you out. Finally I asked for a manual gearbox in 2020 and was told I couldn't have one unless I spent another £15k on an S. Another way of Mr Porsche increasing his profit IMHO. The PDK is superb I must say. So 65,000 miles in, 34 mpg, a few service items and it has been a great choice for me, much more interesting than a Golf GTi, which is the only other new car I considered at the time 5 years ago. Edited by politeperson on Tuesday 22 October 19:05 I'm with you there. Base C2 a sweet spot. Mind you, I'm attracted to the 992.2 GTS, but then the C2 has more than enough power for road use.

Out of the list, it's the GT3 Touring that I look at and think would be a superb useable drivers car. S/T potentially better. However, the Dakar seems to get rave reviews as being useable and fun on road. i'd love a go in one of these. Not driven any of them so all based on the wasted hours spent on YouTube

politeperson said: I am biased because I have one I will admit, Depends whether you want a toy or a car. I think the best one for owning and driving on UK roads is the basic C2. Edited by politeperson on Tuesday 22 October 19:05 I could not agree more Had mine 2 years and 10,000 miles and it has ticked every box I wanted Poverty spec 992 C2 with a few personal choice extras.

I have a 2019 992 C2S. Regarding chrono - Sport plus is a step up when you want to really hoon it about, the car is in my opinion a bit neutered without it when you want to really fly and I don’t think you get it without chrono? Revs are held much higher in the gears, pdk change is like a shotgun in comparison to even sport mode. The suspension on base is more suited for uk roads as are the higher profile tyres. I still might get another set of wheels for mine.

rainmaker2 said: I have a 2019 992 C2S. Regarding chrono - Sport plus is a step up when you want to really hoon it about, the car is in my opinion a bit neutered without it when you want to really fly and I don’t think you get it without chrono? Revs are held much higher in the gears, pdk change is like a shotgun in comparison to even sport mode. The suspension on base is more suited for uk roads as are the higher profile tyres. I still might get another set of wheels for mine. In terms of the set up that Porsche put out there, chrono delivers something, but the truth is that with 3 pedals and a clutch, your right foot is chrono. Get yourself a remap, mechanical limited slip diff, a proper exhaust and better brakes then you can have a wilder ride than a GT3 for 15K extra. Having said all that, I’ll still consider a 991.2 GT3 when the kids are too big for the back seats. Helper springs and RWS do make for a good chassis. Or maybe just add an air cooled to the fleet.

Never heard of most of the models in the OP’s list. Although, having seen the launch videos and interviews, the new Touring does look very desirable. But, as many posters have said, the basic entry level model seems to be the true hero. Certainly, compared with the new complex, heavy, hybrid GTS, the C2 reminds me much more of a traditional 911, but how come no Manual option ?

Only owned 991 generation Currently in a 991.2 3RS. Looks rediculous anywhere on UK roads. Certainly settles into its natural habitat at the Nordschliefe both on circuit and parked at the Devils Diner. Awesome track car only out porked by the 992RS which takes you on a 12 month steroid cycle without a gym membership. The Dakar does grow on me. 997.2 911 variants has the crown for me. As I get older it has the appeal of a forever classic which is still affordable……..just

rainmaker2 said: I have a 2019 992 C2S. Regarding chrono - Sport plus is a step up when you want to really hoon it about, the car is in my opinion a bit neutered without it when you want to really fly and I don’t think you get it without chrono? Revs are held much higher in the gears, pdk change is like a shotgun in comparison to even sport mode. The suspension on base is more suited for uk roads as are the higher profile tyres. I still might get another set of wheels for mine. Well, this is the question I tried to get an answer for 5 years ago and have failed ever since. I can only talk about my own experience of driving C2/C2S/GTS Turbo and GT3 models with and without. My opinion on the non S/C car, is that the throttle pedal overrides all the "drive" settings, making them unnecessary. You can still launch if you want too.. If you are trundling around and you randomly decide to floor the pedal, the car instantly changes down and holds the revs to the redline. It gives max beans as far as I and as far as Dragy can tell. So what else can S/C bring to the party apart from chocolate engine mounts? If you do want to set the car up to overtake, you can use the paddles. Or you can lightly press the throttle and is will change down a couple of gears for you. If you change your mind, it will settle back into a cruise about 15 seconds later. The car will also change its "mood" if you brake or corner hard, as it assumes you are "up for it". However the PDK is so quick it doesn't really make any difference to the performance whether you are starting at 2,000 rom or 7,000rpm, as it changes with lightening speed. The car can see 2g on the computer with regular road tyres and the very low 911 centre of gravity. Something your passengers may not appreciate. Nor tailgaters. In the Alps a few years ago, I had a tailgating Berlingo van with 2 (probably drunk as it was 2pm in France) plasterers in it, whilst I was descending. It was like they had somewhere important to go (I dont think they did). I did not press the accelerator or brakes, gently letting the 911 go faster and faster on the twisty roads up to about 55mph. It was fun watching this poor old van eventually driving on its door handles trying to keep up until they conceded defeat having crossed to the other side of the carriageway more than once. I could see their smiles turn to horror when they thought they were done for. I am sad. Subtly entering tight corners quickly without slowing down is a great way of extracting revenge on the modern tailgater, as they assume they can get around if you can. They cannot 99/100 times I have found.

Not had the very best from the 911 lineage, like the 2.7RS, or any of the cars on the OP's list, but lucky enough to have have had most of the rest, from 2.2s to 996 GT3, and the only one still in our garage is an 16 year old 997 S (Trigger's broom) that we have had since it was a year old. Not saying it's peak 911 by any means, but the one out of 14 that has proved a keeper... It's is a 4.1 now though

I have always assumed that the Sport Button function on the 992.1 is similar in effect to the Sport setting on Sport Chrono but without the dynamic engine mounts. Am I correct in this? It certainly raises the rpm at which the PDK changes and tightens suspension settings and to me obviates the need for Sport Chrono for some of us, apart from the clock which I like. The Sport Button function no longer seems to appear as Standard Equipment on the 992.2.

politeperson said: Well, this is the question I tried to get an answer for 5 years ago and have failed ever since. I can only talk about my own experience of driving C2/C2S/GTS Turbo and GT3 models with and without. My opinion on the non S/C car, is that the throttle pedal overrides all the "drive" settings, making them unnecessary. You can still launch if you want too... I thought I’d look it up on chatGPT: The argument that the base Porsche 911 "overrides" modes to give the same throttle response result as a Carrera S with modes is not accurate due to how **throttle mapping** and **engine control** are designed in modern vehicles. Here’s why: # 1. **Throttle Mapping Differences**: In the base model without modes, the throttle response is tuned to be **linear and smooth**, meaning the amount of throttle opening is proportional to pedal input (e.g., 50% pedal press equals 50% throttle opening). This is set by the car’s **ECU** to prioritize comfort, fuel efficiency, and ease of driving in daily conditions. Without driving modes, this remains constant. In contrast, the Carrera S with **Sport Chrono Package** has adjustable throttle maps through modes like **Sport** and **Sport Plus**, where the ECU remaps the throttle response to be more aggressive. Even at partial throttle inputs (e.g., 50% pedal press), the throttle opens more (e.g., 70-80%) in Sport Plus mode. This gives a much more immediate and urgent acceleration, which the base model cannot replicate because its ECU is not programmed for this aggressive mapping. # 2. **Engine Behavior and Driving Modes**: In models with Sport Chrono, the ECU not only adjusts the throttle map but also changes other dynamic parameters like **gear shifts**, **ignition timing**, and **turbo boost management** (in turbocharged models). These changes ensure that the car's performance behavior is altered for each mode, optimizing power delivery for sportier driving. The base model, without these selectable modes, does not access this recalibrated performance. # 3. **No "Override" Mechanism**: The base model without modes cannot "override" the default throttle mapping to behave like a Carrera S in Sport or Sport Plus modes. The ECU in the base model is not equipped with the software or mapping profiles to adjust the throttle behavior dynamically based on driving mode selections. Therefore, while the base model will give you full throttle at 100% pedal press, it won’t replicate the **aggressive and immediate response** of a Carrera S in Sport Plus mode, especially at partial throttle inputs. # Conclusion: The base 911’s throttle response is more linear and relaxed, and it lacks the ability to change its behavior dynamically as the Carrera S does in different driving modes. Therefore, the idea that the base model can "override" and deliver the same throttle response is incorrect, as the differences are inherent to the **ECU programming and throttle mapping** in each model. It seems that, foot flat does not equal max power in any variety of 992, however the modes change the deployment of the power.

rainmaker2 said: I thought I’d look it up on chatGPT: The argument that the base Porsche 911 "overrides" modes to give the same throttle response result as a Carrera S with modes is not accurate due to how **throttle mapping** and **engine control** are designed in modern vehicles. Here’s why: # 1. **Throttle Mapping Differences**: In the base model without modes, the throttle response is tuned to be **linear and smooth**, meaning the amount of throttle opening is proportional to pedal input (e.g., 50% pedal press equals 50% throttle opening). This is set by the car’s **ECU** to prioritize comfort, fuel efficiency, and ease of driving in daily conditions. Without driving modes, this remains constant. In contrast, the Carrera S with **Sport Chrono Package** has adjustable throttle maps through modes like **Sport** and **Sport Plus**, where the ECU remaps the throttle response to be more aggressive. Even at partial throttle inputs (e.g., 50% pedal press), the throttle opens more (e.g., 70-80%) in Sport Plus mode. This gives a much more immediate and urgent acceleration, which the base model cannot replicate because its ECU is not programmed for this aggressive mapping. # 2. **Engine Behavior and Driving Modes**: In models with Sport Chrono, the ECU not only adjusts the throttle map but also changes other dynamic parameters like **gear shifts**, **ignition timing**, and **turbo boost management** (in turbocharged models). These changes ensure that the car's performance behavior is altered for each mode, optimizing power delivery for sportier driving. The base model, without these selectable modes, does not access this recalibrated performance. # 3. **No "Override" Mechanism**: The base model without modes cannot "override" the default throttle mapping to behave like a Carrera S in Sport or Sport Plus modes. The ECU in the base model is not equipped with the software or mapping profiles to adjust the throttle behavior dynamically based on driving mode selections. Therefore, while the base model will give you full throttle at 100% pedal press, it won’t replicate the **aggressive and immediate response** of a Carrera S in Sport Plus mode, especially at partial throttle inputs. # Conclusion: The base 911’s throttle response is more linear and relaxed, and it lacks the ability to change its behavior dynamically as the Carrera S does in different driving modes. Therefore, the idea that the base model can "override" and deliver the same throttle response is incorrect, as the differences are inherent to the **ECU programming and throttle mapping** in each model. It seems that, foot flat does not equal max power in any variety of 992, however the modes change the deployment of the power. This all sounds like a great argument for a manual gearbox. Previous little of the old cars is captured by the current models, so no need to bring things closer to a Tesla with all this nonsense.

Discombobulate said: Not had the very best from the 911 lineage, like the 2.7RS, or any of the cars on the OP's list, but lucky enough to have have had most of the rest, from 2.2s to 996 GT3, and the only one still in our garage is an 16 year old 997 S (Trigger's broom) that we have had since it was a year old. Not saying it's peak 911 by any means, but the one out of 14 that has proved a keeper... It's is a 4.1 now though 4.1 sounds really awesome to me 👍

Grantstown said: This all sounds like a great argument for a manual gearbox. Previous little of the old cars is captured by the current models, so no need to bring things closer to a Tesla with all this nonsense. Mine is nannied about town and it’s capability wasted 80% of the time, like most, hence they sell the most by far pdk cars. Lazy drivers I looked it up, even with manual gearbox you still don’t get all the throttle , stlll mode dependent. The only certainties are that cognitive dissonance is real and the base model, be it manual or pdk is technically more neutered by throttle mapping than a car in sport plus mode. For better for worse it’s the 992 we’ve got. It’s brilliant, it’s heavy , it’s not analogue, the throttle mappings are a victim of product management - still love it.

rainmaker2 said: I thought I’d look it up on chatGPT: The argument that the base Porsche 911 "overrides" modes to give the same throttle response result as a Carrera S with modes is not accurate due to how **throttle mapping** and **engine control** are designed in modern vehicles. Here’s why: # 1. **Throttle Mapping Differences**: In the base model without modes, the throttle response is tuned to be **linear and smooth**, meaning the amount of throttle opening is proportional to pedal input (e.g., 50% pedal press equals 50% throttle opening). This is set by the car’s **ECU** to prioritize comfort, fuel efficiency, and ease of driving in daily conditions. Without driving modes, this remains constant. In contrast, the Carrera S with **Sport Chrono Package** has adjustable throttle maps through modes like **Sport** and **Sport Plus**, where the ECU remaps the throttle response to be more aggressive. Even at partial throttle inputs (e.g., 50% pedal press), the throttle opens more (e.g., 70-80%) in Sport Plus mode. This gives a much more immediate and urgent acceleration, which the base model cannot replicate because its ECU is not programmed for this aggressive mapping. # 2. **Engine Behavior and Driving Modes**: In models with Sport Chrono, the ECU not only adjusts the throttle map but also changes other dynamic parameters like **gear shifts**, **ignition timing**, and **turbo boost management** (in turbocharged models). These changes ensure that the car's performance behavior is altered for each mode, optimizing power delivery for sportier driving. The base model, without these selectable modes, does not access this recalibrated performance. # 3. **No "Override" Mechanism**: The base model without modes cannot "override" the default throttle mapping to behave like a Carrera S in Sport or Sport Plus modes. The ECU in the base model is not equipped with the software or mapping profiles to adjust the throttle behavior dynamically based on driving mode selections. Therefore, while the base model will give you full throttle at 100% pedal press, it won’t replicate the **aggressive and immediate response** of a Carrera S in Sport Plus mode, especially at partial throttle inputs. # Conclusion: The base 911’s throttle response is more linear and relaxed, and it lacks the ability to change its behavior dynamically as the Carrera S does in different driving modes. Therefore, the idea that the base model can "override" and deliver the same throttle response is incorrect, as the differences are inherent to the **ECU programming and throttle mapping** in each model. It seems that, foot flat does not equal max power in any variety of 992, however the modes change the deployment of the power. Seems like SC spices up the response at partial throttle openings then, like I said. Full throttle give you full beans.

politeperson said: Seems like SC spices up the response at partial throttle openings then, like I said. Full throttle give you full beans. Can I ask, do you ever use the "Sport Button" on your car and if so what is the effect?

996Targa said: Can I ask, do you ever use the "Sport Button" on your car and if so what is the effect? Yes of course. I did press it about 5 years ago. I seem to remember the effect of the button was to annoy me. I think it was holding the rev shift points high under lightish acceleration like the boy racers do. I have never felt the urge or the need to press it again. If I get a moment I will have another experiment for you, see if I have been missing something.

996Targa said: Can I ask, do you ever use the "Sport Button" on your car and if so what is the effect? Yes of course. I seem to remember the effect of the button was to annoy me slightly. If you google it, it is just a regurgitation of the Porsche PR departments justification of it. (sets up the car for instant reactions/performance blah blah blah) I did press it about 5 years and 65,000 miles ago. I think it was holding the rev shift points high under lightish acceleration like the local boy racers do the their boosted Golfs with 4D number plates. I have never felt the urge or the need to press it again. If I get a moment I will have another experiment for you, see if I have been missing something. As long as no one it looking that is. Edited by politeperson on Friday 25th October 17:31

politeperson said: I am biased because I have one I will admit, however I think I have driven all of the 992s now except for the Dakar and the S/C. Depends whether you want a toy or a car. I think the best one for owning and driving on UK roads is the basic C2. For a start it is the cheapest. That means you will have more money left over after you have paid for it. Depreciation seems the same as the other lower end models- in other words very good indeed for an expensive car. It also has the highest suspension setting for clearance and the highest side wall on 19/20 inch tyres. So I think it has the best ride of our bad roads in a 911. Make no mistake though it is still a very low car with a firm ride and huge wheels. The smaller turbos in the 992.1 C2 spool up instantly with no discernible turbo lag. It is very much like my old Tesla Model S in its throttle response below 90mph. I think all the other models will feel quicker beyond these speeds but as I dont take this car on the track I am not too bothered. This makes it very quick in the real world with instant acceleration when you want it without having to change down. In fact in my car 0-60 is measured at 3.6 seconds with no sports chrono. Porsche tell you it is 4.2. It is not. So you wonder what the Sports Chrono does? I have asked directly and not received an answer as to what ECU/gearbox parameters are altered. I think they dont want to tell me. I think it just affects the characteristics of the engine/exhaust valves and pdk at light/ partial throttle openings, not make the car any faster, just makes it a bit more exciting for your passenger. With no S/C, if you mash the pedal it instantly gives you max beans no matter what. That works for me. The C2 also has rear seats, unlike some other sports models. They are surprisingly useful to use from time to time and fold for useful storage space behind the seats with the tops folded down. Rear wheel drive gives loads of grip. Traction is superb with the weight over the rear wheels. You would have to be driving it like a complete cretin to get it out of shape at the back end. 4 wheel drive does nothing for the steering feel, adds to the complexity, reduces the frunk size, adds to the the cost and the weight of the car. 4 way seats are the lightest, and the cheapest. Mine have been great. My pov. spec 992 has been weighed at 1490kg, which makes it one of the lighter 992s, This is about 200 kg lighter than an electric Mini Cooper and about 20kg heavier than my old 996 C4S. The general rumor in the pub section is that the 992 is a bit bloated. I dont think it is, things have just moved on. One of my old E types with no safely aids whatsoever weighs 1,200kg. I think Porsche have done well to keep the weight down. With no options a C2 still has loads of gadgets as found on most new cars these days such as satellite maps with instant traffic updates, music streaming, cruise etc. So I dont feel I am missing out on anything, even after getting into it after 140,000 miles in a Model S. My 3 criticisms are that the huge rear tires produce noise in the cabin. You can improve the insulation in the rear wheel wells to combat this. Also in extreme cornering, understeer varies depending on the tire temperature. You really should be on the track for that shenanigans though. A tight roundabout on the inside lane could catch you out. Finally I asked for a manual gearbox in 2020 and was told I couldn't have one unless I spent another £15k on an S. Another way of Mr Porsche increasing his profit IMHO. The PDK is superb I must say. So 65,000 miles in, 34 mpg, a few service items and it has been a great choice for me, much more interesting than a Golf GTi, which is the only other new car I considered at the time 5 years ago. Edited by politeperson on Tuesday 22 October 19:05 Fantastic, real world driving response. Thank you!