14 captured repliesDiscussion pagination complete · Source accounts, not a confirmed diagnosis
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Discussion summary
YOUR RESEARCHHorn can?t find ground ***Solved***
Reported or suspected cause
ground wire at the hub failed internally, visually fine
Reported cause
No successful repair reported for this finding.
1
Identified cause
0
Suspected cause
0
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Reported cause
Turned out to be the ground wire at the hub failed internally, visually fine.
Leading evidence: 'ground wire at the hub failed internally, visually fine' (1 discussions report identifying this cause; no attributable repair resolution). Across 1 matching discussions, the most frequently mentioned possible cause is 'ground wire at the hub failed internally, visually fine' (1 discussions; 1 report identifying it and 0 suggest it). The most frequently discussed action is 'Check grounds including those' (1 discussions). For that action, 0 discussions report a resolution and 0 report an unsuccessful attempt. No action has an explicit, attributable resolution report under the current rules. These are forum reports and suggestions, not a confirmed diagnosis.
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Reported cause
I cant fully remember but my issue was mostly with the contact pin.
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Performed · outcome unconfirmed · Original poster
I figured this was an obvious ignition switch issue and replaced the ignition switch and have the same results.
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I have a horn issue.
My horn honks fine in the key off position.
I have 12v to the horn switch (MOMO) and I have a good ground.
When the key is turned to key on position the honk won�t honk.
In this position I still have 12v, but not a solid ground.
I see only 6v.
If I ground to the seat frame, the horn honks.
I figured this was an obvious ignition switch issue and replaced the ignition switch and have the same results.
Looking at the Bentley manual I only see 1 ground for the horn circuit. CP6/GP4
Before I climb under the dash yet again searching for CP6 (7CP location) does anyone have any idea what happening to my ground?
Also anyone know where to look in the area?
7CP gets me in the area, but that�s a tight upside down area.
I had all kinds of issues with the momo hub and janky set up they use for the horn. Thats why i switches to the nrg hub.
I cant fully remember but my issue was mostly with the contact pin. I wonder if your loosing the ground or if its a contact issue. I dont think the ground is swiched?
Maybe the relay is going bad?
I think you may be correct that it is the MOMO hub.
I have had the horn wire break at the solder joint twice now.
It likely has broken again.
Maybe I need to check my solder job.
But since it honks when grounded directly and not through the steering shaft, it does make me wonder.
Maybe the extra load on the system is preventing enough current.
I wouldn�t mind replacing the hub with a better design anyways.
So for your NRG hub, do you have the short hub & a quick release?
If so, which QR did you go with?
I did replace the relay temporarily to see if it could have been the issue.
Luckily I have 400+ spare parts on hand, so �throwing parts at it� which is against my normal procedure in this case was easiest.
(Ignition switch and relay have been replaced)
Thanks, that does help.
I found two ground points (GP3 and GP3.1) on the other side of the steering column and they looked fine.
I traced the wires as far as I could and they looked fine fine.
As expected it appears that the outer column itself is a ground point, so the ground I’m looking for is inside the column.
But I‘ll venture underneath again and look on the other side of the column.
How hard is it to put take the hub off and put the original wheel back on?
What a crazy problem. None of those wires go near the ignition switch.
What about the old airbag connection? Is there any way that could be shorting to the ground wire in the hub and when the switch is on, it gets connected to something, creating a drop?
Total WAG that doesn't make sense.
Multimeter time. Pull the hub and check all grounds including those that appear sound. I had a similar problem w/ our Boxster S, but with the stock wheel. Turned out to be the ground wire at the hub failed internally, visually fine.
Only cause I could surmise is that the horn grounds through the steering wheel lock when the car is off and the steering shaft is not isolated.
The horn circuit is pretty simple ..
The ground ( GP4) comes into the steering wheel through the clock spring on the brown wire......when you press the horn button it connects the brown ground wire to the brown/white trigger wire ..The brown/white trigger wire grounds/activates the horn relay......horn relay sends 12v to the horns.....horns sound off ...( they are constantly grounded at GP-2 )....
yes i used the short hub and the disco. At the time there was only 1 option. The discos options r mostly cosmetic, last time i looked it was easy to figure out what would work. The nrg uses the factory clockspring so the horn is fairly reliable. I did see an nrg box the other day. Ill see what the part number was
For the question about swapping them.....its not hard to do but i probably would not plan on doing it in a regular basis (between each track event) maybe begining and end of track season would be reasonable?
Well, I resolved the issue.
I unlocked the steering column adjustment and moved the steering wheel toward the dash slightly and locked it into place.
The horn then worked at both key positions.
I then moved to different positions to see where the "dead spot" was and couldn't reproduce it.
When I unlock the steering column adjustment, the horn will work with the key in the off position, but not in the on position.
My guess is that when I adjusted it last, it did not fully lock, thus preventing the horn from working in the key on position.
Glad I kept my old clock spring!
I may swap to NRG if I start having issues with the MOMO hub horn wire again.
OK, so better locking on the column fixed it. But what does that mean was happening relative the ignition switch? For me it seems that with a poor clamp, and normal ground compromised, the horn is somehow finding ground through the ignition switch when it is off. And then when the ignition switch is on, that ground path disappears leaving the original compromised ground. Seem impossible given how simple the horn circuit is. Does the Momo hub connect to the ignition switch in any way?
Yes, still seems strange to me.
The Momo Hub gets it's horn power from wire that has to be added to the turn signal stalk the stalk.
That wire connects to the connector next to the airbag connector, down inside, not the one that connects directly to the airbag.
That wire has to be added because the clock spring is deleted with the MOMO hub.
This is a source reference. Confirm exact model applicability in the original material.
