Trading my Stingray for a 911 C4 - Couple Question

Getting ready to trade my 2015 Stingray for a [FONT=inherit !important][FONT=inherit !important]911 Carrera[/FONT] 4. After nine months, the new Stingray turning out to be limited as a fair weather car and not good as a daily driver. I got the 8 speed automatic and in traffic it is unpredictable sometimes lurching the car forward when downshifting in traffic. This is my third Corvette and I am not pleased with any improvements with the C7 generation over the C6 and C5 I owned. They at GM claim to be world class designers but the Stingrays not Porsche level engineering built. I've loved the 911 style and engineering for a long time but purchase was above my pay grade. What I'm doing now to counter this is looking to buy a lease turn-in or certified used Carrera 4 and trading in the Stingray. It is a loss but I'll have no doubt I won't need to keep the car parked on rainy and cold days because of crash worries. I live in Northern Virginia so the all-wheel-drive 911 Carrera 4 will give a year round sports car fun and daily driver for my commute into DC. Questions: 1. Please send me a good source for shopping the Lease Turn-in and Certified Used 911 Carrera 4 market you might know of? Maybe in a 12 hour driving distance of DC since I have the Vette trade-in. The 2013-2015 years look to be in my budget. 2. What body colors does Porsche do best for mirror non-distorted paint finishes? I understand the finish issues with the factory water based paint systems and that paint orange peel defects are found car industry wide. I read these defects are also being found in Porsche vehicle finishes. I'm old school and like mirror paint finishes. 3. Any other questions, comments, or concerns will be appreciated. Thank, Dan[/FONT]

Welcome. One source to locate CPO cars is Porsche.com/usa. There is a pre-owned car locator on the site. These are all dealer cars so will be asking full retail price. What years are you looking at? Presume you are aware of the model changes 997 to 991? Good luck in the search.

I think you'll find the paint somewhat improved. Still not quite show car perfect but the amount of factory orange peel is way down from when they started. No idea as to which colors are better. I'd think the clear coat would negate the differences between colors other than how easy it is to see. Why not stop and look at some cars. I always found that part of the fun.

If you are in NOVA commuting into DC, then despite having a C4, you really can't use the Summer tires. Any snow at all and the car will be dangerous to drive. You will need snow tires. Just saying. C4 doesn't get you much of anything in that part of the country. If you lived deep in the snowbelt, that would be different. You are lucky as you have at least 8 dealers within 50 miles. No need to drive 12 hours. hats like 700 miles away. You got Arlington, Tysons Corner, Silver Spring, Rockville right around DC. And many more 20 miles farther away. Just google Porsche dealers. I'm not sure what this means. You should google and contact Potomac Region PCA and talk to those guys about any local questions. [/FONT]

Thanks, I have some of the NOVA dealers looking for a 2013 -2014 Carrera 4 coupe with the PDK incoming. Nothing on local lots now. Post was that I wanted to check with you Porsche subject matter experts on this forum for recommendations. I appreciate the response! *A extra set of wheels with winter snow tires is a good suggestion. I could have some fun in those shoes on a snow shutdown day. *I worked in a paint shop so maybe I see more into perfect finishes than others. I found many new cars with messed up paint because of the somewhat environmental friendly water-based based paints having orange peel finishes like most every new car has in various areas over the body. I'm old school when car paint finishes reflected with no distortion like a mirror and looked six inches deep. It is real hit and miss on new cars and some people are touchy about the subject especially Corvette owners praising the use of our tax money to bailout GM's problems. I believe Porsche quality with vehicle finish control is more caring that GM without doubt. I carry a inspection light to check the full car finish for paint corrections repairs when looking at cars for purchase. The problem with the fix is is the paint orange peel finish correction removes the protective clear coat. This will lead to early sun damage to the color base coat. One can either accept the defects or find a better finished car. The reflective distortion shows up best under fluorescent lights at night. Here is the Porsche discussion I found. Porsche Quality Control Paint Defects - Page 2 - ******** Discussion Forums Typical distortion in GM New Vette finishes: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kia_fzEB9Q4

You can also use the Find My Porsche tool at the top of the page, not sure how fleshed out it is for 911's but give it a try and if you need more granularity let our developer know.

I agree with Chows. Living in NOVA there is really no need for a C4. The C2 with dedicated winter tires will get you through most weather we get here. The tipping point is ground clearance. In buying my car, I used the used car locator on the Porsche NA site and negotiated the purchase and trade in over the internet, driving to Connecticut to complete the transaction. Again, there are many dealers in the NOVA area.

You are getting rid of a Chevy Corvette to get a Porsche...GOOD CALL!! I have a group of close friends that I would LOVE for you to talk to here in the good Ol Mid West! Anyway, the AWD Porsche option sounds like an excellent driving plan. One thought is to sell the Vette outright? You would be less likely to take a $$$ hit (sure you know that). Or strive to find a 911 "4" @ a Chevy dealer and or an independent dealer... check out the independent dealer "sweetcars.com" They have two 911' 4's....A 2012 Targa 4- 6 speed and a 2013 911 Carrera 4's w/ PDK . GREAT STAFF THERE!!!

"You are getting rid of a Chevy Corvette to get a Porsche...GOOD CALL!! I have a group of close friends that I would LOVE for you to talk to here in the good Ol Mid West!" This Stingray is my third generation owned Corvette and I know every nut and bolt on the cars. My garage is rigged up with tools for everything from wheel alignments to jacking the rear up at a 15 degree angle to drain the engine oil. I used to race the Vettes in SCCA autocross down in the Virginia Beach area and the main competition was the Porsche 911's. It really took a lot of 'learning to drive' and 'lot of suspension improvement' on my 2003 Vette to turn better times that the 911's. They'd probable say I finally started using my whole brain getting a Porsche. Some of the other sports cars i owned was a '06 Lotus Exige and '97 M3. The old M3 was the best of the lot even with 190K miles on her. My last daily driver was '13 338i and it lacked the build quality BMW claims in their designs. The new M3 is just a modified 328i so I'm not considered that punishment again. I really appreciate the comments on the Porsche finder tools and advice on the variants of the 911. I really feel the elegance and performance of the 911 will be quite an improvement for me. Thanks so much!

Some of the other sports cars i owned was a '06 Lotus Exige and '97 M3. The old M3 was the best of the lot even with 190K miles on her. My last daily driver was '13 338i and it lacked the build quality BMW claims in their designs. The new M3 is just a modified 328i so I'm not considered that punishment again. I hear you regarding the '97 M3. It's unfortunate what BMW did to what was arguably the best overall performance car of the late '90s, especially when price and practicality are considered.

I drove a C4S during a Germany trip. He car is fantastic. The AWD handles very well and can really put power down even in the wet -- which it was during my drive. I understand it can rain a bit in Va !! You won't regret the choice. D

I see debates on this Carrera 2 vs. Carrera 4 all over the web. The Carrera 2 with snow tires seems to be winning the debate. Long ago I owned a Volkswagen Type 3 Fastback. It remember she was a Toyota killer with a VW bus engine in the rear. I had a car pool going at the time and on snow days the riders hated me for driving in showing up on snow days making them go to work. She had plenty of traction but not brakes. I go three seperate dealer trade in offers for my $67,000 2015 Stingray. In eight months the trade in value has dropped to $44,000 in value. That's a 35% drop in GM flagship car's value in under one year of ownership unbelievable and bad decision I made for sure. This is really hampering trying to get a 2015 model, I'll need to look a 2013s to get in my budget.

Sorry there hear about the heavy depreciation you are looking at. Your Vette should depreciate slower from now on and your goal will become more achievable in time.

Thanks, I'm keeping at the multi-variable calculus for getting my 911 sooner than later. Don't want this to happen. I sold my 06 Lotus Exige to a gentlemen that wanted to own a Lotus his whole life. He flew into BWI to test drive the Exige and handed me a check for it. He understood the Lotus design criteria of light weight car over high horsepower. The car was shipped to his home in Ohio the next day. He drove the Exige the first day about 90 miles and had a great time. He then dropped it off at a shop for the oil change and got a ride home from a friend. He died on the ride home. " Bradley had dreamed of owning a Lotus sports car and had just picked it up the day he died. Although he had little time to enjoy it, he had achieved his life’s dream. " Bradley Louis Chapman - Stofcheck-Ballinger Funeral Home

I think you'd have better luck, and get more $$, selling the Stingray yourself on eBay. As far as finding a new C4, maybe you'd be better off looking nationwide rather than sticking local. I just bought my 1st Porsche last week. I'm in FL and couldn't find one locally with the colors / options I wanted. I found my ideal car (mostly) in TX and it's being shipped to me this week. I literally spent months searching Porsche dealers, GarGurus.com, AutoTrader.com and eBay before I found "the one". I flew out to inspect and test-drive (albeit in the rain [emoji33]) and enclosed transport was about $1,000 for delivery right to my front door. I'm 50 now and I've wanted a 911 since I was about 13 years old, so this is a dream come true for me. Good luck!

Update Working on a trade deal now 2015 Carrera 4 for my 2015 Stingray. All is going well! Doing math below helped make the decision. Might not want to show this to a math teacher, but works for me! Terms: Porsche Value = PV Porsche Depreciation = PD Porsche Owner Happiness = 1 * POH Corvette Value = CV Corvette Depreciation = CD Corvette Owner Happiness = 1/3 * COH Assumption: PD and CD are equal for the same year COH is 1/3 less that POH based on engineering with mechanical/electrical systems, human interface, and overall design/build quality. CV is less that PV by the base price - Considered equal in the analysis as better engineering and manufacturing drives up the PV. PV * PD * POH = 1/3 * COH * CV * CD (multiply each side by 3) 3 * PV * PD * POH = COH * CV * CD (multiply each side by PD and cancel CD/PD out) 3 * PV * POH = COH * CV Results: Porsche value and ownership happiness is 3 times greater that Corvette value and ownership happiness by the math.

And my friends tell me I spend too much time rationalizing my decisions! The math works for me! My first Porsche (2013 Carrera S) will be here Friday.

Could you post the formula to work out the difference between a Cayman and 911? Only kidding. I try to not rationalise my purchases and Porsche balance sheet. When you're out having fun behind the wheel, it all makes sense. Good luck with your search.

Both would need terms for track & street driving not considering the computer driving aids and high end equipment/configuration options. The first thing I did to my Lotus Exige was disable the traction control system. The Porsche drivers used to change autocross classes just to avoid that mid-engine car.. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QW9OBgTZzTk For the track driving turn handling is the best comparison and with street driving collision avoidence would be good comparison. The 911 is the superior car in most functions and intention of marketing but the Cayman is a winner in its own way. Track - This gets into the physics of mid-engine vs rear engine. You can add preference to the type of handling to match your driving style. With the mid engine near the center of gravity turn in errors and corrections are more forgiving. The rear engine has the mass back more allowing acceleration earlier in the turn but requires more precision driving. Street - For everyday street driving, collision avoidence mid-engine vs rear engine has some influence at the slower speeds. The mid-engine may stop better in the rain with the better weight distribution, but the engineering in the brake system of the 911 makes up all the difference. ------------------------ Loaded the C7 Vette on the shipping truck and the seeing him pull away Roy Clark's song "Thank God And Greyhound she's gone” came to mind. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tx8x3LCnYZw

Similar story, traded in my 2013 Camaro ZL1 convertible for a 2009 carrera S. Went with the S over the 4 as I have a Subaru for the snowy days here in New England. The camaro definitely had sentimental value but getting back in a Porsche is great. For me I was particular to a 997.2 model. For me it's the best setup !!

Picked up my '15 Black C4 Yesterday in Illinois and drove her back to Virginia. Coming through Indiana, it was cool to run up on a bunch of track race cars on the highway. That's a Viper in the rain photo with manufacturer plates. Looks like the Tire Rack was having an event at their wet skid pad facility. Drove back 800 miles in 14 hours in the rain the whole way and thick mountain fog in places. The C4 was amazing to drive and traction control did well in all the challenging conditions. It good to have a rear engine car again. One heck of a first drive to test her in extreme foul weather. I'll get to the care and feeding come sun up. Can't wait to try out launch control. I believe the SCCA puts these in the SS class for autocross. Thanks of all the advice and feedback! The attention to detail is amazing down to the key.. https://youtu.be/u23oGNnJmgo

Congrats!! I've had my C2S for 5 days now and love it.

One month of ownership and results are she is simply a driver's car. It is amazing how well every 911 feature works vs. the immaturity of the C7 systems. My neck fells so much better with PDK perfect shifting vs. the unpredictable slam up and down shifting of the 8 speed automatic in the C7. I'm having fun again driving. Being a daily driver, keeping the black finish scratch free is a risk. Th two bucket wash method still left water spots. I spec'd out a foaming setup and am pleased with the results - video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6rj9sNOm71Y Winter wheel tires are next on the needs list - Sottzero's tires on OZ wheel look to be the best so far in my research for cost/quality. Not exactly on the needs list, but the Porsche Sport Exhaust system fully installed with the console with and computer update would a nice to have. *Enjoy the Memorial Day Holiday for those that have fallen in battle and thank those that defend our freedoms today.

Does anyone have a POC in Porsche America leadership that can help me with the dealership slackers trying to Title and Plate my 911 in the U.S.A? These guys have left me on my own. She is one year old and does not require emission testing. Thanks! Please call the VDOT again and explain Illinois is still a state in the U.S.A and Porsche imports all vehicles compliant to U.S.A Emission laws. I'll send a email to our Governor and County Tax Collector later tonight.

When I once purchased a car in Illinois they.collected the sales tax and personal.property tax and sent it to my state only to have my state send it back to the dealership claiming that wasn't allowed so the dealership sent me a check to cover those costs and all the paperwork and I walked into my local DMV and took care of it. Sent from my SAMSUNG -SM-G935A using Tapatalk

Need a in-car camera set up design to record my driving like golfers record their swing?

For a between-the-seats steering wheel/course view camera boom, all I could find are expensive heavy harness belts rigs and not many made for the 991. I fabricated one myself for about $50 and 4 hours of time. It uses a telescoping clothing bar, handmade b-pillar bracket, and tripod camera clamp. The b-pillar bolt is a tr iple Square Spline socket head M10. Hey the rig doubles as a clothing hanger too. I'll post a sample in-car video later. Photo Video of fabrication... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FIndjSCNMnY

After her first wax job. There is some orange peel that should be easy to paint correct. Need to look into checking the paint thickness since she was bought used.