Will water cooled Turbos bottom out and appreciate? - Page 3 - 911/Carrera GT - PistonHeads UK

I am a water cooled Turbo fan, having owned a 996 Turbo and 996 Turbo S and enjoyed driving their successors. I have been following 997 Turbo and Turbo S prices for a year or so. I had expected asking prices for good 997.2 Turbo Ss to rise a little, as they are effectively run out specials, and also gen 1.5 Turbos. But from what I see, they are following a gentle depreciation like all other water cooled Turbos a few years or more old. I bought my 996 Turbo S, manual with very low miles, for £70k in 2015 and sold it in 2019 for around £62k. This pattern seems to be continuing. I realise there is also the important element of the value of money, and that £100k in 2014 is worth £154k now, which is alarming, as well as the slip in nominal values. In any case, does anyone see a scenario in which water cooled Turbos follow air cooled in an upward nominal value? I realise good 996 Turbos have probably cratered out.

Tricky to say as there's no metzger in the newer stuff. Personally 997 manual turbo was peak water-cooled imo. Although 991 is great, and I'm personally after one, they don't have the same appeal. IMO.

I thought 997.1 turbos had the last of the Mezger engines. I suspect the production numbers (though I have no idea what they are!) preclude 996/997/991 cars coming up to the values of 993 cars. Having had a 996 turbo and a 991 turbo S, the latter is streets ahead in every department. But I doubt that that will mean anything when it comes to depreciation bottoming out/appreciation.

BlackTails said: I thought 997.1 turbos had the last of the Mezger engines. Not sure but I'm referring to manuals. The latter stuff was pdk I think, or at least very scarce. The 991 will be streets ahead in terms of performance, but how fast does one want to go? Is it more refined? Probably but that's not a critical ingredient personally speaking.

BlackTails said: I thought 997.1 turbos had the last of the Mezger engines. Correct !

So comparing 997 1.5 and .2 to 996tt depreciation curve is irrelevant then? Or perhaps no one cares about the metzger in the turbo?

They will eventually be 6 figure cars 😁so snap them up while you can owned for 9 years keep thinking about changing it but its still here

Gazzac2 said: They will eventually be 6 figure cars ??so snap them up while you can owned for 9 years keep thinking about changing it but its still here Agreed ... here's mine:

Both lovely examples.

Its a tough act to follow the 930, 964 and 993 turbo. They're from a by gone era in terms of manufacturing where bean counters were irrelvant and engineers decided on how to build the 911 money no object. The watercooled era the complete opposite and this really shows on the 996 interior. I think models like the gen 1.5 997 turbo and gen 2 997.2 turbo manual may appreciate one day though. So will 996 turbo s you should have kept I love them. But a watercooled turbo really needs to be sub 10k mile timewarp examples so you can not really drive them if you are looking at capital appreciation which is a bit sad. I think a Mac 12c maybe a better investment as you see them sell for circa £55k to 65k on auction sites which is incredible value for a supercar that cost approaching £300k in 2011/12. All crystal ball gazing they could be worth nothing if Labour go mad and ban ICE cars. They hate cars.

IMI A said: Its a tough act to follow the 930, 964 and 993 turbo. They're from a by gone era in terms of manufacturing where bean counters were irrelvant and engineers decided on how to build the 911 money no object. The watercooled era the complete opposite and this really shows on the 996 interior. I think models like the gen 1.5 997 turbo and gen 2 997.2 turbo manual may appreciate one day though. So will 996 turbo s you should have kept I love them. But a watercooled turbo really needs to be sub 10k mile timewarp examples so you can not really drive them if you are looking at capital appreciation which is a bit sad. I think a Mac 12c maybe a better investment as you see them sell for circa £55k to 65k on auction sites which is incredible value for a supercar that cost approaching £300k in 2011/12. .... Pretty much spot on from might point of view aswell.. I've had most of the older turbos, 993 def. my favourite, but the 997 Turbo with a manual is a great car to own and use without having to worry too much about residuals, especially if you keep it for a good few years. Anyone who's looking at these, get one now and use it before they start to properly appreciate !

If I was buying a water cooled turbo for myself today I'd probably buy a used mint 991 turbo s from an OPC. Its peak 911 turbo. The build quality and materials are a step above the 996/997 especially the gen 2 991 turbo s which at improved engine components and materials over gen1. They go like a stabbed rat the PDK being miles better than in 997 turbo. Miles quicker than Porsche claim too just like all the turbo gens. Steering far more precise and direct than 997 too.

Let be realistic. 991.1, 991.2 and 992 turbos will never appreciate to any degree, they are likely to continue depreciating and then settle at some point. They are big, fast cars but aren’t special enough in any way and you can get similar performance in an EV Hyundai so their USP naturally is now diminished. 996 Turbo manuals again I don’t think will gain much more value than they have today. Not great to drive and high maintenance cost and 996 (unfair) poor reputation for styling and reliability, despite being Mezger. 996 tiptronics with old merc gearbox are poor and will always be the cheapest entry point into a Turbo and won’t see any increase. Important distinction needs to be made between 997 generations. 997.1 manual Turbo is the one to watch, this is the ultimate water cooled turbo, is already a classic and is likely to appreciate. Prices seem to have stalled but long term surely only going one way. Based on looks, shape, size, mezger, manual gearbox, driving. On the other hand I would avoid 997.2 Turbo/Turbo S. Don’t fall into the trap of thinking values will rise as they are last of the 997 and they will mirror the popularity of 997.2 Carreras. The 997.2 DFi Turbos are unbelievably rapid but not much fun to drive, engine and exhaust note is characterless and it’s ultimately a disappointing and one dimensional driving experience. The 1st gen PDK gearbox now feels very slow even in sport plus mode with Chrono. The manual mezger 1st gen so much more rewarding than the jet fighter feel of the 997.2.

Mezgerking said: Let be realistic. 991.1, 991.2 and 992 turbos will never appreciate to any degree, they are likely to continue depreciating and then settle at some point. They are big, fast cars but aren’t special enough in any way and you can get similar performance in an EV Hyundai so their USP naturally is now diminished. 996 Turbo manuals again I don’t think will gain much more value than they have today. Not great to drive and high maintenance cost and 996 (unfair) poor reputation for styling and reliability, despite being Mezger. 996 tiptronics with old merc gearbox are poor and will always be the cheapest entry point into a Turbo and won’t see any increase. Important distinction needs to be made between 997 generations. 997.1 manual Turbo is the one to watch, this is the ultimate water cooled turbo, is already a classic and is likely to appreciate. Prices seem to have stalled but long term surely only going one way. Based on looks, shape, size, mezger, manual gearbox, driving. On the other hand I would avoid 997.2 Turbo/Turbo S. Don’t fall into the trap of thinking values will rise as they are last of the 997 and they will mirror the popularity of 997.2 Carreras. The 997.2 DFi Turbos are unbelievably rapid but not much fun to drive, engine and exhaust note is characterless and it’s ultimately a disappointing and one dimensional driving experience. The 1st gen PDK gearbox now feels very slow even in sport plus mode with Chrono. The manual mezger 1st gen so much more rewarding than the jet fighter feel of the 997.2. I'd agree with most of this but I think you'd have to own a very low mileage, mint example or maybe a rare PTS 997.1 Turbo manual to have any meaningful appreciation in value. There are simply loads of them out there. I think the best you can hope for is to get your money back over a 10 year ownership, or for any appreciation to offset the running costs (unless something goes wrong with it of course because nothing is cheap and there are two of everything). Prices of 997.2 Turbo S are bonkers really. As are prices of the mythical 997.1.5, which is basically just a 997.1 with an updated PCM system.

Agree with most of the above however there is usually only about 10-15 manuals for sale at any time £50-£75k mileage dependant seems to be tha asking

ImbackYo said: Not sure but I'm referring to manuals. The latter stuff was pdk I think, or at least very scarce. The 991 will be streets ahead in terms of performance, but how fast does one want to go? Is it more refined? Probably but that's not a critical ingredient personally speaking.

“Prices of 997.2 Turbo S are bonkers really. As are prices of the mythical 997.1.5, which is basically just a 997.1 with an updated PCM system“ Agree, 997.1 with PCCM+ is a far better proposition…..

IMI A said: All crystal ball gazing they could be worth nothing if Labour go mad and ban ICE cars. They hate cars. And what's your view on the Tories love of motoring? Do you think that there's a chance that Labour will "ban all ice cars"?

no clue about values, but I keep seeing a black/black 996 Turbo parked around the corner from my place and every time I walk past, I think that would be a nice daily driver to have. As I get older, I just think it would be nice to have a reasonably quick manual car with 4wd to use year-round including going snowboarding etc. and I love the 996 interior, think it is much nicer than 997. there is a special place in my heart for manual cars and 420hp is more than enough for me, do not like going really fast anymore anyway (the whole do not want to "accidentally" die aspect of it...)

80sMatchbox said: And what's your view on the Tories love of motoring? Do you think that there's a chance that Labour will "ban all ice cars"? all new yes. Labour pledges to reinstate 2030 ban on new petrol and diesel cars - stating that this would provide ‘certainty to manufacturers'. Of late Germany and Italy are having doubts about 2035 (let alone 2030 for UK) but Von der Leyen vows to stick to 2035 ban. As to existing, I suspect Labour will put in punitive measures by keeping an ICE car on the road. I can see the pending year ban being a key factor in the 2029 election. https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/labour-rishi... Edited by KittyLitter on Wednesday 11th September 22:50

MDL111 said: no clue about values, but I keep seeing a black/black 996 Turbo parked around the corner from my place and every time I walk past, I think that would be a nice daily driver to have. As I get older, I just think it would be nice to have a reasonably quick manual car with 4wd to use year-round including going snowboarding etc. and I love the 996 interior, think it is much nicer than 997. there is a special place in my heart for manual cars and 420hp is more than enough for me, do not like going really fast anymore anyway (the whole do not want to "accidentally" die aspect of it...) It would have been a nice daily driver in 2002. Now it's an old Porsche with high running costs and lots that can and will go wrong. Great cars in their day, as were 997 Turbos, but I would not run either of those daily (speaking as a 997 Turbo owner). You could, but there are so many modern cars that are just as quick, capable, reliable and safer than a 996 Turbo. You'd have to really love a 996 Turbo to look past the drawbacks.

With regards to the OP’s question…there are very few 911’s that you’d put in the “will appreciate” box that don’t have a manual gearbox or a GT badge. To me modern 911 Turbo’s are the ultimate 365 day a year performance car. Does that make them the car that someone wants to drive on a Sunday morning down a country road ? Possibly not. PDK in the 997 is starting to age compared to modern gearboxes and 4wd is not that important once cars lose that “daily driver” tag. We are all different with what we want from our cars though !

A friend just bought/rescued a black Black manual. He's 12k in so far and it's miles from being perfect. When they crumble, it's big numbers. Parr charged him 2700 quid just to sort all the snapped studs and rotten toot around the exhaust. Every rad, every nut and bolt just crumbles when you touch them. As a daily, you'd have to factor that in at least once a decade.

KittyLitter said: 80sMatchbox said: And what's your view on the Tories love of motoring? Do you think that there's a chance that Labour will "ban all ice cars"? all new yes. Labour pledges to reinstate 2030 ban on new petrol and diesel cars - stating that this would provide ‘certainty to manufacturers'. Of late Germany and Italy are having doubts about 2035 (let alone 2030 for UK) but Von der Leyen vows to stick to 2035 ban. As to existing, I suspect Labour will put in punitive measures by keeping an ICE car on the road. I can see the pending year ban being a key factor in the 2029 election. https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/labour-rishi... Edited by KittyLitter on Wednesday 11th September 22:50 No real difference between the Tories and Labour vis a vis the motorist and ICE vehicles. They’ll both tax ICE cars in particular to the maximum. Labour will ban new ICE by 2030 in my view. A time warp 997 turbo with less than 10,000 miles is already not far off list price. If there is any capital appreciation on turbo models I agree that it will probably be set off by higher maintenance costs.

MDL111 said: I love the 996 interior, think it is much nicer than 997. You should join the I Prefer the 996 Interior Club. I'm the Club President and there are no other members, so you can be Vice President if you want. But yes, I agree with what you've posted. It's quick enough for normal roads.

Oz83 said: MDL111 said: no clue about values, but I keep seeing a black/black 996 Turbo parked around the corner from my place and every time I walk past, I think that would be a nice daily driver to have. As I get older, I just think it would be nice to have a reasonably quick manual car with 4wd to use year-round including going snowboarding etc. and I love the 996 interior, think it is much nicer than 997. there is a special place in my heart for manual cars and 420hp is more than enough for me, do not like going really fast anymore anyway (the whole do not want to "accidentally" die aspect of it...) It would have been a nice daily driver in 2002. Now it's an old Porsche with high running costs and lots that can and will go wrong. Great cars in their day, as were 997 Turbos, but I would not run either of those daily (speaking as a 997 Turbo owner). You could, but there are so many modern cars that are just as quick, capable, reliable and safer than a 996 Turbo. You'd have to really love a 996 Turbo to look past the drawbacks. Well, the turbos may need a refurb (£6k), the suspension and brakes replacing but they would have been done over the years with MOTs, maybe bushes as they will be old even on a low miler, but the engine is supposed to be pretty robust isn't it? I guess it can add up but it's not likely to give you a £20k bill in one year, is it? Maybe £2-3k. That's my experience. If you have a newer Ferrari, you'd be paying at least that anyway. And didn't 991.2s have a risk of turbo issues on pretty newish cars?

I do regret selling the 996 Turbo S manual,..had only 15k miles. Black on black. What would that sell for now? Then every time I look, I wonder about a 997.1 Turbo manual..then you think..is a 997.2 Turbo S more collectible.. I do remember the 997.1 manual being more involving than the 997.2 Turbo S, but I had each when they were new, for a week, and that's a long time ago now. Like many of us, balancing what's most enjoyable with what might appreciate. I do agree that it would need to be a rare and special 997.1 to become super collectible - and probably with such low mileage it cant be used.

Hoofy said: Well, the turbos may need a refurb (£6k), the suspension and brakes replacing but they would have been done over the years with MOTs, maybe bushes as they will be old even on a low miler, but the engine is supposed to be pretty robust isn't it? I guess it can add up but it's not likely to give you a £20k bill in one year, is it? Maybe £2-3k. That's my experience. If you have a newer Ferrari, you'd be paying at least that anyway. And didn't 991.2s have a risk of turbo issues on pretty newish cars? Not long ago a friend of mine bought a 996 Turbo. It had a few modifications over the years but seemed well looked after by several 'enthusiasts'. He thought it was a keeper so in year 1 he spent £15k on tidying it up, refurbing bushings, replacing corroded fuel lines, fuel tank and other parts. 6 months into year 2 following a dreaded puff of blue smoke and he was quoted £33k for an engine rebuild. Engine issues are rare on a Mezger but nothing is certain. He sold it to WBAC for £17k less than he paid for it, totalling a £32k loss in 18 months. That's my experience, which has almost convinced me to sell my 997.

Venosta said: I do regret selling the 996 Turbo S manual,..had only 15k miles. Black on black. What would that sell for now? About £50k? Just get a 997.1 Turbo and enjoy driving it. If it goes up in value, great, if not you've still enjoyed driving it. If you get a garage queen that you're afraid of putting miles on, you might as well just buy premium bonds - at least you'll get a monthly thrill.

Oz83 said: Hoofy said: Well, the turbos may need a refurb (£6k), the suspension and brakes replacing but they would have been done over the years with MOTs, maybe bushes as they will be old even on a low miler, but the engine is supposed to be pretty robust isn't it? I guess it can add up but it's not likely to give you a £20k bill in one year, is it? Maybe £2-3k. That's my experience. If you have a newer Ferrari, you'd be paying at least that anyway. And didn't 991.2s have a risk of turbo issues on pretty newish cars? Not long ago a friend of mine bought a 996 Turbo. It had a few modifications over the years but seemed well looked after by several 'enthusiasts'. He thought it was a keeper so in year 1 he spent £15k on tidying it up, refurbing bushings, replacing corroded fuel lines, fuel tank and other parts. 6 months into year 2 following a dreaded puff of blue smoke and he was quoted £33k for an engine rebuild. Engine issues are rare on a Mezger but nothing is certain. He sold it to WBAC for £17k less than he paid for it, totalling a £32k loss in 18 months. That's my experience, which has almost convinced me to sell my 997. Ouch. Sure, there's always a risk but as you say - it's rare to hear that with a Mezger.

I went from 997.1 Turbo to GT3 then back to Turbo again. Just found the a Turbo a more usable and enjoyable drive 365 days a year rather than the compromise a GT3 always seemed to demand. And of course it’s blisteringly quick. Thats not to say a Turbo is comfortable, i’ve read that description a lot of times and i find it completely unrealistic, they are still sports cars from 2007 on with the hard ride and high noise levels you expect, but definitely usable pretty much anywhere. The manual 1.5 used to be the holy grail, limited numbers and Gen 2 interior, but that benefit is gone now that a PCCM+ unit can be retro-refitted to the Gen 1. Some suggest the 1.5 had some tweaks to the chassis but every Porsche model guide, and Porsche themselves, deny this. So if you want a modern(ish) manual Mezger Turbo, the Gen 1 and 1.5 models are the only game in town and i’ll be keeping mine for a while yet. I don’t expect it to appreciate at all to be honest, the mileage will go up anyway but as said they are not especially rare. I don’t think the market values any mods beyond perhaps basic exhaust and suspension, so for people looking to maximise returns you need to keep it pretty stock but expect to spend at least a grand a year on maintenance.

Hoofy said: Venosta said: I do regret selling the 996 Turbo S manual,..had only 15k miles. Black on black. What would that sell for now? About £50k? Just get a 997.1 Turbo and enjoy driving it. If it goes up in value, great, if not you've still enjoyed driving it. If you get a garage queen that you're afraid of putting miles on, you might as well just buy premium bonds - at least you'll get a monthly thrill. That’s a bit lowball a timewarp no accident manual 996 turbo s with 15k mile worth £75k. Same with a manual 997.1 turbo, 997.2 turbo with 15k miles worth £75k - 85k. A 997.2 turbo s with 15k mile ask is £75-85k. It’s impossible to pick between them as investments but I’d pick the 997.2 manual turbo as an investment. I’d pick the 996 turbo s or gen 1.5 997 turbo or gen 1 997 turbo as a Porsche enthusiast.

Less than 500 gen 2 manual 997 turbo world wide I read somewhere. That’s less cars than 997 GT2 RS if correct. So only a handful in any given country. I can see them shooting up suddenly but to me just like say the Sport Classic whilst I l love them just do not understand crazy values even with the sport classics unique features. It’s only a 997 after all not an aircooled. I see all 997 as a good modern daily but all .2 991 even better from this stand point.

IMI A said: Less than 500 gen 2 manual 997 turbo world wide I read somewhere. That’s less cars than 997 GT2 RS if correct. So only a handful in any given country. I can see them shooting up suddenly but to me just like say the Sport Classic whilst I l love them just do not understand crazy values even with the sport classics unique features. It’s only a 997 after all not an aircooled. I see all 997 as a good modern daily but all .2 991 even better from this stand point. I think you might be correct re values of those. I looked at them 10+ years ago, but it was really difficult to find one for sale at the time.

Gazzac2 said: They will eventually be 6 figure cars ??so snap them up while you can owned for 9 years keep thinking about changing it but its still here Had mine 10 years manual 997.1 Turbo, thought a few times about selling.

I keep looking at the 991 versions which are looking good value but strangely I feel the interior feels too much like my cayenne shoot me down now😁 not convinced i'm a pdk man so been looking at various 992 models or a v12 Vanquish 🤔probably keep the 997 for my boys to fight over

Maybe the Carrera, S and GTS will continue to be place where values are strongest pound for pound in the 997 range. Complexity, maintenance and running costs of a 997.1 Turbo in comparison to an S or GTS may always hinder it in future. A rwd N/a model is also the purer driving experience. But do agree the Turbo has its place on the older 996/997 generations. Not sure how relevant in 992, I certainly don’t care too much about them.

Gazzac2 said: I keep looking at the 991 versions which are looking good value but strangely I feel the interior feels too much like my cayenne shoot me down now?? not convinced i'm a pdk man so been looking at various 992 models or a v12 Vanquish ??probably keep the 997 for my boys to fight over I think you hit the nail on the head with 991/992. Its a different class of car more a GT and no longer a sportscar like a 911 should be. Cayman/Boxster seems to fill that space now if you put a new Cayman or even 981 next to a 997 the 911 looks small. Things like Astons and Bentleys whilst the far more comforatble option are a better comparison to the 991/992 with the 991 materials and finish being up to Bentley and Aston levels. I find the 992 interior a bit too plain jane tbh especially at £200,000 turbo s or £235,000 ST. I too if looking for a car today and would go for more of a GT probably a 2012 DBS depending on how well they drive. Nicholas Mee a stones throw away you should visit him if looking for an Aston. His knowledge especially around the special models like Vanquish incredible. I've not even bought a car from him and he's happily had a few coffees with me chatting away for hours. Really good guy and its almost like a mini Aston Factory in Herts if you have look around they do everything from full ground up restorations to interiors etc. There were Vanquishes everywhere on my visits old and new. Some of the brand new Astons like Vanquishes he is having commisioned straight from factory on his clients behalf incredible. £1m-£3m some of them.

Some of the posts on here are comical. If you buy a dog it will cost you. That's no different with any performance car. The cost to get into a good 996 turbo is circa £40k+ and 997.1 turbo circa £50k+. The older cars are smaller and more analogue. The 991 and 992 are PDKs and have become more GT like and much more expensive. Yes cars can spit the odd large bill but that's the same with any car (newer 991.2 GTS seem to blow turbos). Personally I like a manual, coupe and a 996/997 turbo is still sharper than most cars and ability when the roads are damp is incredible. What other options are there that offer that performance at that value. Aircooled is expensive and slower. 997 GTS are slower and expensive. 996/997 GT3's are less usable and expensive. R8 (V8)'s are slower and (V10) thirsty. AM V12V are expensive. Merc AMG GT is auto only. There's alternatives but not many that can match a 996/997 turbo performance for the money. I may be a little biased.

Back on subject of will they bottom out and appreciate. Most sportscars have dropped a bit in the current market with less cash chasing cars. The trick is finding the right car at the right price. There are 67 996 turbos on AT. But only 15 if you want a manual coupe with up to 60k miles. And only 5 if you want an X50 pack. So your option list car soon reduces the pool of cars and finding the right spec at the right price is the challenge. Good cars will hold their price and appreciate. They're not making these cars anymore so the pool will only get smaller. When we hit 2030 there will be no new options and those that want a specific ICE car will have a specific limited market as owners hold onto what they have for longer. Demand may then drive prices (unless the government make ICE so unaffordable).

Hoofy said: You should join the I Prefer the 996 Interior Club. I'm the Club President and there are no other members, so you can be Vice President if you want. But yes, I agree with what you've posted. It's quick enough for normal roads. I am also a member of this club.

This one looks great and much cheaper than you suggest. Am I missing something? https://www.historics.co.uk/auction/lot/lot-161---... g7jhp said: Some of the posts on here are comical. If you buy a dog it will cost you. That's no different with any performance car. The cost to get into a good 996 turbo is circa £40k+ and 997.1 turbo circa £50k+. The older cars are smaller and more analogue. The 991 and 992 are PDKs and have become more GT like and much more expensive. Yes cars can spit the odd large bill but that's the same with any car (newer 991.2 GTS seem to blow turbos). Personally I like a manual, coupe and a 996/997 turbo is still sharper than most cars and ability when the roads are damp is incredible. What other options are there that offer that performance at that value. Aircooled is expensive and slower. 997 GTS are slower and expensive. 996/997 GT3's are less usable and expensive. R8 (V8)'s are slower and (V10) thirsty. AM V12V are expensive. Merc AMG GT is auto only. There's alternatives but not many that can match a 996/997 turbo performance for the money. I may be a little biased.

BennnTen1245a said: This one looks great and much cheaper than you suggest. Am I missing something? https://www.historics.co.uk/auction/lot/lot-161---... g7jhp said: Some of the posts on here are comical. If you buy a dog it will cost you. That's no different with any performance car. The cost to get into a good 996 turbo is circa £40k+ and 997.1 turbo circa £50k+. The older cars are smaller and more analogue. The 991 and 992 are PDKs and have become more GT like and much more expensive. Yes cars can spit the odd large bill but that's the same with any car (newer 991.2 GTS seem to blow turbos). Personally I like a manual, coupe and a 996/997 turbo is still sharper than most cars and ability when the roads are damp is incredible. What other options are there that offer that performance at that value. Aircooled is expensive and slower. 997 GTS are slower and expensive. 996/997 GT3's are less usable and expensive. R8 (V8)'s are slower and (V10) thirsty. AM V12V are expensive. Merc AMG GT is auto only. There's alternatives but not many that can match a 996/997 turbo performance for the money. I may be a little biased. Its not a manual which are much more sought after. Still lovely though for £29k.

Dammit said: Hoofy said: You should join the I Prefer the 996 Interior Club. I'm the Club President and there are no other members, so you can be Vice President if you want. But yes, I agree with what you've posted. It's quick enough for normal roads. I am also a member of this club. Gosh. 3 of us? Looks like there will have to be an election next year to decide the new Club President.

I struggle with the seats due to the (for my position) total lack of any under thigh support, but the (although I acknowledge that opinions on this story differ) interior intended for the 993 but shelved due to cost being put in the 996 make it even more of a cross-over car in the 911 line-up. I think if you like the stories behind things the 996 is probably one of the most interesting cars Porsche ever made - that it's also one of the most accessible due to its low (relative) cost makes it very unusual. But it needs better seats.

All the 997 seats fit 996. Plus you can get replica 996 GT3 seats nowadays too. Bit more difficult to get in and out of but I love them. I have a set of comfort 997 seats lying around too which also fit Replica GT3 seats 997/991 folding buckets

I fitted a Recaro SPG, which worked very well for me - but it's a little too snug for the friend with whom I leave the car. It's something I'll fix.

IMI A said: All the 997 seats fit 996. Plus you can get replica 996 GT3 seats nowadays too. Bit more difficult to get in and out of but I love them. I have a set of comfort 997 seats lying around too which also fit Replica GT3 seats 997/991 folding buckets Folding buckets are mental money though The pic you show are 997 GT3 seats, not 996, which look much better (in a 996)

Cheib said: With regards to the OP’s question…there are very few 911’s that you’d put in the “will appreciate” box that don’t have a manual gearbox or a GT badge. Just listened to the latest Chris Harris podcast they had a segment on cars they think will appreciate…one of the first things that was mentioned was that they felt a manual gearbox a requirement.