19's to 18's and winter tyres! - Page 2 - Boxster/Cayman - PistonHeads UK

Yes I know it’s still September but tyres are a commodity and the price will only go one way as we approach winter, so I have bought a set of alloys & winter tyres early. I have to say though as much as I love my 19's I am looking forward to shunning them off for a few months and enjoying (dare I say) a more comfortable ride. The 19's look amazing and make the car look very expensive, especially when in motion at low speed, but I find myself wincing on approach to questionable road surfaces. There’s an extra 1.18cm of sidewall on the front, and 0.93cm on rear (265 vs 255) not to mention the extra cushion of air. Out of curiosity they weighed in at 19.7kg and 22.5kg respectively (including 30psi of air ), I'll weigh the 19's when I take them off come November. Edited by SkinnyP on Monday 29th September 19:10

I also have 19's with summer tyres and 18's with winters on my 987 CS. The 18's do give a more compliant ride, but given that I have PASM, its not that bad to start with.

SkinnyP said: (including 30psi of air Air, you say?

I’ve tried a 2.9 on 17” wheels and it was wonderful, logic tells me its probably one of the most enjoyable incarnations of the Cayman. Not sure how the 235 section rear tyres will respond to 300 horse power though. Maybe come summer I’ll have forgotten about the questionable ride quality and wont be able to wait to refit the 19s.

The winters are on, and so far so good. I must admit however that the difference in ride quality is barely perceptible, there is a subtle difference but not enough to warrant ditching the 19's purely for ride comfort. It may be worth keeping in mind that I've gone from PS2's to Pirelli's though. Still I am impressed that they dont squirm half as much as other winters I have had, perhaps they are extra tough being N rated or whatever...

Did you weigh them to see what the difference is between the two sizes?

No but I will do it tomorrow when its light out. Interestingly these Pirelli's are much quieter than the PS2's which is weird (its not like they had worn unevenly either). If only we could get N rated PSS in 18" they must feel revolutionary.

I have just had 18" winter tyres fitted by Porsche Leicester (£1260 btw) and the ride is so much less harsh than on the 19"s. I do live in a field accessible only via 5 miles of unclassified roads though.

From prior research most people did say the 18"s were much better but I just can't feel it. Yes there is a subtle difference and the interior rattles are a touch quieter but that's about it. Maybe the tyres are a significant factor here.

J12KJR said: Did you weigh them to see what the difference is between the two sizes? I've just changed from 19" Spyders to 18" Team Dynamics 1.3 235/35/19 19.8kg vs 235/40/18 21kg 265/35/19 22.4kg vs 265/40/18 23.6kg Winters are Sottozeros.

Yes my Vredestein winters are 18's and are noticibly quieter and less harsh than my 19" Super Sports. That doesn't mean I don't look forward to getting the 19's back on in the sprint for a good hoon.

Well its cold and wet, the rear end is certainly more lively. To be expected really though.

Trev450 said: Yes my Vredestein winters are 18's and are noticibly quieter and less harsh than my 19" Super Sports. That doesn't mean I don't look forward to getting the 19's back on in the sprint for a good hoon. Are you Michelins worn? Always amazes me how much quieter new tyres are for first few thousand miles.

drmark said: Trev450 said: Yes my Vredestein winters are 18's and are noticibly quieter and less harsh than my 19" Super Sports. That doesn't mean I don't look forward to getting the 19's back on in the sprint for a good hoon. Are you Michelins worn? Always amazes me how much quieter new tyres are for first few thousand miles. No they're less than 1K miles at the moment.

A bit more driving today, and yes they do squirm lol. Even in the dry I've been spinning up the rears in 3rd gear. Ah well, summers go to s t in the winter so its just a case of making the most of what grip is available. Not got round to weighing the 19"s yet I'll do it tomorrow...

SkinnyP said: A bit more driving today, and yes they do squirm lol. Even in the dry I've been spinning up the rears in 3rd gear. Ah well, summers go to s t in the winter so its just a case of making the most of what grip is available. I found the squirming got less after I'd done a few hundred miles.

I have a Cayman S (on 18s in summer) but I purchased a set of Boxster 17 inch rims off ebay . They need spacers to clear the front calipers, but the narrow 17s give the car a completely different character. I have 215 fronts and 245 rears (Goodyear UltraGrip Performance ) and the car feels delicate, almost Lotus like, on the winter tyres.

18" Winters 19.7kg and 22.5kg 19" Summers 19.3kg and 21.7kg

Redlake27 said: I have a Cayman S (on 18s in summer) but I purchased a set of Boxster 17 inch rims off ebay . They need spacers to clear the front calipers, but the narrow 17s give the car a completely different character. I have 215 fronts and 245 rears (Goodyear UltraGrip Performance ) and the car feels delicate, almost Lotus like, on the winter tyres. Interesting, can you expand on that? I have driven a car on 17"s and yes it felt great but I didn't push it too hard. Can't imagine 245 rears like deploying 320bhp though!

anonymous said: [redacted] I almost bought a 2.9 with 17" wheels, but I was kind of put off by the thought of people saying "thats a nice porsche, shame about the toy wheels though". I've since had a quiet word with myself.

SkinnyP said: Redlake27 said: I have a Cayman S (on 18s in summer) but I purchased a set of Boxster 17 inch rims off ebay . They need spacers to clear the front calipers, but the narrow 17s give the car a completely different character. I have 215 fronts and 245 rears (Goodyear UltraGrip Performance ) and the car feels delicate, almost Lotus like, on the winter tyres. Interesting, can you expand on that? I have driven a car on 17"s and yes it felt great but I didn't push it too hard. Can't imagine 245 rears like deploying 320bhp though! I have had Elises and a Europa (yes, I was the one that bought one!)and I always loved the delicacy of the steering on the narrow tyres (the Europa was 250hp and had 195 front and 225 rear). If lap times at a track day matter, then you will want the grip of the wider tyres. But on a B Road, the narrower tyres are far more communicative. There's plenty enough grip for the road (Ferraris of the 80s had smaller tyres and no ESP It is difficult to draw an accurate comparison because my 17s are winter and the 18s summer, but I have driven a 2.9 on 17s and preferred it to one on 18s or 19s. It was just more supple and fluid, even if the grip was a fraction less.

Supple and fluid, yes good descriptive words. I agree, revving the 2.9 out on an open and flowing road with 17"s on felt great. The ride quality was vastly superior too.

What's '66' about?

Absolutely stonking cmoose.

Very similar to my summer wheels

17's are perfect, just also needs a 10/20mm ride height drop

I wish I could have found a red car in the spec I wanted, stop posting pictures you are making me jealous. They would look better lowered, but I enjoy not worrying about speed humps.

cmoose - cheeky... My car was bought ex-display (0.7 miles on the clock) in July 2011 for a reasonable discount but was a baseline spec. Ideally I would have liked something close to magnolia hide, reverse parking sensors, PCM, full climate control. I have retrofitted 3rd party sensors and ICE. The Boxster III wheels were sourced from pistonheads after 6 months of searching. So my car is nearly as I would like but a new interior is way too expensive and full climate control is impossible as the loom is wrong.

SkinnyP said: I almost bought a 2.9 with 17" wheels, but I was kind of put off by the thought of people saying "thats a nice porsche, shame about the toy wheels though". I've since had a quiet word with myself. I have two sets of 17" wheels Better ride, less road noise and more balanced handling. Looks just fine, couldn't give a flying f k what anyone else thinks. As for people panicking about 300+ hp and 235 rears... That's what your throttle pedal is for, it's analogue you know Gets over/straddles speed bumps, no intention of lowering it. Edited by juansolo on Monday 8th December 21:26

What they said...

anonymous said: [redacted] Thats fine, it really is, and I know being closer to the limit is fun. But for me I enjoy the instant hook up offered by the 265 tyres especially when you are being very naughty and need every fraction of grip. Not saying I want four wheel drive (that would be dull), but nothing worse than unusable power. All preference of course.

Would you take the 17"s over 18"s on a track, from either the perspective of fun or chasing lap times?

SkinnyP said: Would you take the 17"s over 18"s on a track, from either the perspective of fun or chasing lap times? Every time. Though if I was chasing lap times, I wouldn't be doing it in a Cayman or any other road car for that matter.

Re track times, for the sake of argument just give me a straight answer I feel like I'm missing out now, you lot all having red Caymanz and sporty wheels. The good news is these 18"s appear to have softened up, as weird as that sounds. Nvh is down despite the switch to winter tyres. Yes I like the 18s.

Straight answer Ultimately more grip = faster cornering, more effective braking and more traction out of corners. All good for going quicker. However on the wider wheels the car is less pointy at the front and not as progressive. So in confidence and dynamic terms, you might find you prefer the balance of the car with the smaller wheels on. But doing it just to go faster is ultimately a pointless exercise on a track day as you're only 'racing' against yourself and the clock (if you're being naughty and timing). So how you go, relative to how you went before is what matters rather than how much time a set of tyres will get you. That only matters when you're racing other people. So go with the set up that's dynamically the most interesting and/or challenging depending on what your goal is. Personally I'd see if you could get Yokohama A539s in the 17" sizes. It'll feel like you've got 600hp...

SkinnyP said: Re track times, for the sake of argument just give me a straight answer I feel like I'm missing out now, you lot all having red Caymanz and sporty wheels. The good news is these 18"s appear to have softened up, as weird as that sounds. Nvh is down despite the switch to winter tyres. Yes I like the 18s. We are comparing 17 Winters with 18 Summer, s its difficult to compare. Regarding track times, the diameter of the wheel makes no difference, unless you are using a bigger wheel to accommodate bigger brakes. The width of the tyre will help lap time. A 265 rear will have more grip (in the dry) than a 245. Whether the rim is 17 or 18 won't make a jot of difference to lap time. A wider front (say 245 rather than 235) will make the car more pointy as you will be moving the grip balance to the front. (That's why winter fronts are quite narrow...it moves the balance towards understeer which is probably what most of us would prefer on ice...) For lap time, I'd have 18s with Dunlop Direzzas, Cup Sports or similar track day tyres. For the road, 17s with Summer and Winter tyres. For posing, not driving....that's the domain of 19s For the road, for a better balanced car, more supple ride

I only picked the car up a fortnight ago, and took delivery on the winter 18s. My test drive was the only time I've driven it on it's summer 19s (Carrera Sports with PS2s) - so can't yet make a meaningful comparison. I will make two observations though: 1) Winter tyres / summer tyres - makes little difference on sheet ice (I discovered late on Thursday night in a bum-clenching < 10 mph slide towards parked cars on an ungritted suburban side street) 2) Winter tyres = more use of the car at this time of year - and the car looks great when filthy

Car looks nice. I'm really enjoying the 18's, they feel far more usable and pleasant than the 19's although I could have told you that before I even bought the car. No idea why at first they felt very firm, maybe because they have been sitting around in my conservatory, I duno.