Early LHD Porsche advice - what to buy - Page 2 - Porsche General - PistonHeads UK

Hmmm, many swear by the seventies ones for pure porscheness and driving pleasure, but they are not very practical everyday cars. They take a lot of maintenance, care, money and attention to get running right. I'd suggest a LHD 1987 onwards G50 3.2, which has the classic looks but will be reliable, for about 8-10 grand. Or a 911 Club Sport from that era - Iguana knows one for sale at 18k. Like a 3.2 RS in effect. Email his profile directly. Or if your budget is higher, a 964RS for 25k is classic Porsche but with proper brakes and modern bits. Rgds Domster

thanks for the advice, gives me more food for thought. woolfie

Unless you realy like going slowly the impact bumper (ie '74 on)2.7 (K jettronic)cars are best avoided unless you feel that 150bhp in a relitively heavy 911 is the key to a good time.. They are however very cheap- but there is a reason for that... Im a real fan of the 1974 2.7 Carrera's tho same engine and running gear as the legendary 2.7RS of the year before but with the impact bumper style body & bumpers. (impact bumper is '74 to '89 and all look prety much the same the differences were under the skin) With RHD '73 RS lightweight prices now in the £100k area getting 'almost' that performance & handling and exactly the same engine for £10-20k the 2.7 Carrera is a bit of an undiscovered gem But But But a 1970s Porsche will rust just like a 1970's VW so be carefull. I agree with all Domster has said and it all depends on ya budget the most liked '70s porkers are '73 RS (obiously) '72 2.4S '70-'72 2.2S then probly the 3.0 Carrera of '77 They all reach top bucks in excellent cond even in lhd. go for E or T spec if you want a pre impact bumper car ie less power and they are cheaper but ther are a lot of hounds out there and even the best are 30yrs old so its only gonna be as reliable as a new TVR.... ohhhh Then its the late '70s with the not particully interesting SC's then on to the better 3.2's in '83 and the G50 (better gearbox) cars are the ones to go for. They all reach top bucks in excellent cond even in lhd. go for E or T spec if you want a pre impact bumper car ie less power and they are cheaper but ther are a lot of hounds out there and even the best are 30yrs old so its only gonna be as reliable as a new TVR.... ohhhh My consultancy rates are very reasonable......

Go for a late model 944 S2/turbo. Its a better car and they are VERY cheap to buy and cheaper to run than a 911. One of the best handling cars you can buy and equivalent performance to mid range 911s. (ok i'm very biased having just bought one )

I like the idea of learning about the Porsche by buying an early model and working through their evolution, so getting to know what it means to own a Porsche. Otherwise if I get hold of a later model I am not sure what I am owning..if that makes sense. On the 944..I am not sure what it stands for, but if its a good car to own and drive, or can it only be described in the negative, in that its not a 911. But I can see no reason not owning one at sometime, if it is an enjoyable car to use. I have some happy research ahead of me. woolfie

LHD 911s - 964 best buy. Early 911s rust like dogs, even those that from 1972 on that had galvanised floors. Best pre impact 911 for reasonable money? 2.4E. Avoid 2.7s like the plague, except for the RS 2.7 impact bumper. Iguana, if I could get you selection of a pre impact bumper RS (lightweight & touring) for a lot less than £100,000 would you be interested then? .....and above all,remember that you'll have a lot of trouble flogging on an lhd car unless it's something like a 964 RS. My advice? Find a nice low mileage rhd SC for around £10k or even an rhd 964 for £15k (they do exist - I know a man who regularly turns round high mileage rhd 3.2s for £7k, for example). Top tip, join PCGB, laugh at the prices people want for their cars, leave it 3 months, call them and offer them sensible money for their baby and they'll sell it to you. Best time to do this is around December or March when it's cold and no-one wants to buy a car.

Agree with Rubystone, apart from the LHD bit, LHD Porsches, like Ferraris, have very definite selling prices and are no bother to shift. Better value too if you can live with it - Oh, and don't mind being called a pikey by UV!!

So Scottster, what's the going rate for an lhd 3.2? I've seen them for £11k (lol)? Or how about an lhd 964 - I've seen them for £18k (lol2)? Took a friend of mine 6 months to sell an lhd 2.7 - admittedly some years ago - ended up virtually giving it away.

rubystone if you can get me sweet a rhd lightweight (only 17 made remember and only 15 or 16 left now) for less than £80k although i may not be able to afford it i know some who would consider it. A few years ago yes no problem but now the prices have shot up. lhd tourings you can get lucky and get for £30k ish. ref prices lhd 964 can be purchaced in the fatherland for under £10k and even full history sweet ones can be got for £12k and even in the UK sweet rhd for £15k is not unusual (Not RS's obviously)I agree with ya 3.2 prices tho. Also there was never an impact bumper RS, it was a 2.7 Carrera it was a very similar car but certainly not an RS.

Rubystone, I'm not saying they should be sold at high prices - just that there is a good market with fairly tight prices for the right car. 3.2 - £8,500 to £11,000 (depending on age etc) 964 - £12,000 to £14,500 (as above) 993 - £20,000 to £23,000 (again) 996 - £29,000 to £40,000 (you guessed it) Anything out of these ranges I wouldn't touch as you DO have a far more limited resale market, but the market is there. Maybe your mate's car wasn't as good as he thought or wasn't advertising to the correct people. I don't know anything about it so can't comment. I've sold about 3 LHD Porsches privately with no problems if they're at the right price. Buy 'em cheap and sell 'em cheap - As long as you don't expect to get top dollar for a LHD car you'll be ok, but you shouldn't have paid much either.

Iguana, I'll have to consult the bible ref. your lightweight figures, will do tonight and get back to you. Your figures sound a bit low to me.... As regards 2.7 RS impact bumper - I beg to differ. The impact bumper model still had the ducktail (but some had the optional early turbo spoiler) and was known as the RS - check out the scrpt on them. This and the 3.2 Clubsport are, IMHO, the best impact bumper 911s to buy, for future value, handling, performance and for being a bit different to the run of the mill 3.2 or SC. Scottster, sound advice on lhds. Wouln't touch them myself unless full provenance was known, but as you say, buy it cheap and sell it cheap and you "shouldn't" go wrong.

rubystone you may decide to differ with me but the fact is the 1974 2.7 Carrera wasnt called an RS ever in the UK or europe thats why its called the 2.7 Carrera not an RS!!. The yanks who couldnt buy the 73RS may have badged the 2.7 Carrera as such. yes they can have ducktails on them, I stuck an M3 badge on a 325 BMW diddnt make it an M3 tho!!!

oh and while im in rant mode, nothing wrong with my numbers either Total RHD '73RS production = 117. 100- M472 (touring) 17- M471 (sport, which we are calling lightweight)

LOL, this is like Godzilla vs Mechanoid. In one corner, Rubystone who is very knowledgable on RSs after having had a 964RS... and in the other, the ever-wise Iguana who used to work for Porsche specialists etc. Handbags at thirty paces gents, and let battle commence I may chip in with spurious info I made up, just to make things interesting. i.e. did you know that you could get a C2RS with a 944 Turbo engine in the glove box, driving the front wheels only

Who did Iguana work for? Obviously didn't get many impact bumper RS Carrera (to give them their correct name) in did he... ;-) ...as regards ducktails, I just used that as an example - after all, the only place on either the 2.7 RS or the RS Carrera where the "RS" nomenclature is on display. Glad to see you got your M471 and M472 the right way round too :-)

Back on the original topic, nobody has mentioned the early turbo cars. I once drove a '78/79 3.0 turbo that was really fun, as long as you do not mind a 'bit of lag'. I have absolutely no idea of prices for these though.

They're almost down to 10k these days.

Nothing more from Iguana eh? Not revealing who he worked for.... I must stop "Joshing" around and "Jack" it all in then. Early Turbos? half leather with red check trim, GP White with those wild Turbo decals on the rear wings, not forgetting chrome brightwork and Durant mirror, can't beat 'em...if you can find one in nice condition and are prepared to wait weeks for the Turbo to spool up.

You're a troublemaker Piper. Someone will tell you to p155 off back to blatchat soon

I know when I'm not wanted...but I'll be watching you BTW how do you get those emoticons into the text itself?

To get this emoticon, you write *colon*hehe*colon*. Smiles and winks are colonbracket and semicolonbracket. There are plenty more... your foray onto PH probably puts you in line for this one Cheers Dom

This is correct based on everything I've ever read, including the Porsche website history section. The 1974 Carrera RS was the 3 litre version which I believe is rarer than the 73, with the 2.7 just being called a Carrera. Then again, a lot of what I have posted recently has been proved to be wrong so this could be no different. >> Edited by Basil Brush on Wednesday 25th September 19:01

For a complete list of the smileys and how to use them click on 'Smiles legend' to the left of the text entry box when creating a post .

Rubystone well you got my old workplace correct, but thats about all youve got right ref the RS saga. Yes there was an impact bumper RS in 1974 but that was a 3.0 litre, yes its rare as rocking horse do do but -and heres the bit you may not have picked up on- its a 3 litre!! not as you keep seeming to state a 2.7.... you are getting 2 different 1974 cars ie the 3.0RS and the 2.7 Carrera mixed up. Are you getting are getting a little bit confused? did the rock hard suspension of your 964 RS scramble the old gray matter??

Well, many multiple threads in this post. I am still unsure what to do for the best. But this is the way of it, i think. woolfie

Whatever you do I am sure you will enjoy the car.

At long last I think I've found what I want: a late RHD 993 Tip. S. I know this is totally at odds to what I started looking for, but nothing wrong with being fickle. Does this sound a bit wussy or ok? Maybe I should get a..........? Should i be looking at the Independents or the OPCs? Its all very difficult this car business, I think I'll take up alcoholism: its much easier on health, wealth and family. >> Edited by woolfie on Tuesday 12th November 18:34

I have to Iguana on this one. The only RS model in '74 was the Carrera 3.0 RS (109 built). The 1974 - 75 2.7 Carrera (I have one) was not an RS, but was very similar mechanically to the '73 RS

Woolfie, Pardon my ignorance here, but why make a post and ask for opinions on the early 911's then announce to all that you are going to buy a 993 Tiptronic (of all things) just a couple of days later? Surely you cannot be influenced so pronouncely by the licidity of PH members? Anyway, for what it's worth, why not sell the 4.5 and get yourself a 993 Turbo instead, more power, more control, better brakes, non auto and a totally practicable everyday supercar.

Not sure really. My circumstances have changed, before (ie a few weeks ago) i would have been unable to afford what i can now, so i might have a wider choice. The advice of PHers is very useful in helping to come to a decision. So I saw a low mileage 993, seemed interesting, but dont know much about tiptronics. Early days yet, will be trying out a bunch over the next few weeks. So i was only making a passing comment + some questions. Dont condemn me just yet.

A 911 should no more have an auto gearbox than it should have square wheels. Unless you have smashed up legs, or no legs at all, or perhaps you just dont enjoy driving very much please do not even look at a Tiptronic. Also in S form the lovely supple & alive 993 handling is thrown out the window for tramlining, all for the sake of a wider body, and in C2S form you dont even get the turbo brakes. The C2S Tip the worst 993? in many enthusiasts eyes certainly. Also as you were initially interested in early cars, why not look at getting a really decent early car? because your newly extended budget could now encompass most of the all the georgious desireable early cars ie 2.2S 2.4S right up to a genuine '73 RS Touring. >> Edited by iguana on Wednesday 13th November 01:38

Fair comments. I'll keep looking then. woolfie

No, forget the pre-impact bumper cars, they are just too fussy for modern traffic. My favourite has always been the 204bhp 911SC, cheap & simple, can be made to handle like an RS and with a few simple updates will hold its own on the track against many "superior" cars. A lot are suffering with the usual rust around the wings, B posts, kidney bowls and sills, but I truly believe that very soon these cars will aquire collectors status and will be worth spending a few grand on to make them perfect again. An absolute peach of an SC will sell for around £14k, you can run it everyday (provided it has got good heat exchangers and heater!), it will return 30mpg on a run and will potter about town all day without fouling the plugs (try that in a 2.2S). Good cars, underrated, cheap to buy, fun to drive, easily upgraded, sub 6 sec to 60. Suit you, sir!

hmmmmm..... Thats a matter of opinion, and I disagree with your opinion! NOTHING wrong with a Tiptronic Gearbox, In fact, I'll let it be known that tips are known to be faster around a track that a manual gearbox. AND the cost of tracking a Tip is massively reduced in that you dont need to replace clutches after every third or fourth meet. I also know for a fact that our local OPC has NEVER had to split a Tip box for repair (even on a regularly tracked Porker) they are literally bullet proof! A better name for the Tip Gearbox is the "Tiptronic Ox" But then, most the above is based on FACT and a little of my opinion!

hmmm so I have driven more 911s than probabally most of the pistonheaders put together (Excluding 9M- Colin B in this equasion obiously) so other than having a passion for 911s I also feel my informed opinion, although still my own opinion, is formed by many miles of driving many differnet cars. For example I disagree with 9M ref SCs, I personaly dont like them any where near as much as an early mechanically injected car like a 2.2S, they just dont stir my soul to the same degree when driving. Yet what facts can I use to justify my decision?? none, really its all opinion. >> Edited by iguana on Wednesday 13th November 12:39

My woird, I find myself agreeing with Iguana.....except I'd say take a look at a 2.4E...Milder cams than the S make this an easier car to lvie with on a day to day basis and I never had any problems with plugs fouling up on mine....the main problem with using an early car has to be the rust problems. But then again I agree with Colin that an SC makes a sensible everyday car, but again I see very few of these that haven't started to rot or haven't had a blowover to disguise the rot....and don't think you can get away with a bit of filler and some paint to put things right....I priced up the work a friend will have to do on his SC to make it mint and got to £4,000 without even trying....oh and I think Tiptronics are pants too and I've driven examples of these in 964, 993 & 996 guise...best auto Porsche? 928 GTS by far....IMHO of course......BTW I have to come clean here, I used to own a 911 SC Sportomatic

Hmmmm, let me see what I can stirr up here.. So, you buy an original tired rhd £10k SC, spend £4k doing the body, £1.5k on decent suspension & brakes, £3k on the top ennd rebuild and £1k on the syncros and clutch, total spend £19.5k for expected lifespan of at least 100,000 miles before major work, value at end £10k or 10p per mile for 204bhp & 1175kg. OR you buy a nice low miles (who's kidding who?) rhd 2.4S for what, £35k? No original panels left on the car, unknown engine & box, non servoed brakes, but you do get 190bhp & 1030kg(?). No torque but better power to weight. 100,000 miles later, probably same engine and gearbox rebuild £4k, but now needs restoration which will be £10k to be "right". Oh, and the value is now £27k because the mileage is "above average". Total cost £22k or 22p per mile. Nuff said? I'm with Ig on the Tip, if they are so good why would Porsche race manual cars and why is there not a GT3 tip? They're fine for London but they really are a non-performance option that result in destroyed brakes on the track (which I think cost more than the average clutch kit). My RS lasts five or six TD's per set of pads and the discs last for 18 months, but I wrecked a set of tip brakes in one session which ended in flames from the pads. Sorry, I like them for de-stressing around town, the wife could have one with pleasure, but you cannot ever consider them a performance option. Oops, done it now......

woolfie, If you ever get round to buying an early 911 . . . . or if you want to ask actual owners their advice . . . please feel free to join the following e-mail group . . . . www.groups.yahoo.com/group/early911. The early cars, in my opinion, are the best looking and sounding of all 911's. Rust is the biggest issue, but it's not just limited to the early cars . . . . rust is a problem no matter what. Running costs aren't bad at all . . . if you're up for it, the engine is simple enough to work on yourself, and for me that's half the pleasure . . . it's technology you can understand. Whatever you do get the car inspected by someone how specialises in Porsches. . . . don't be put off by lhd as this usually means it's from the states, which could mean it's been exposed to a better climate. There are pit falls to buying an early car . . . but if you read up, ask Q's, and take your time . . . you could buy yourself a little bit of history. Phil 1971 2.2 T

Many thanks. I have mentioned on another post that I have now gone for a 996 as a daily driver but I would still be looking around for an early porsche, but most probably a bit later on next year. The reason for the change of mind was that I had an offer which was too good to ignore on my previous Cerbera 4.5; so i switched my thinking from a Porsche as a 2nd car and sought out a Porsche i could drive and not tinker with (one which the wife wouldnt give me any grief over..i think is the best way of explaining it). I can then look at leisure for something more interesting for the future.

Hi I am looking for a replacement 2nd car to go with my Cerbera 4.5. I thought of maybe a late LHD 70's Porsche? I know little about the marque besides what i can / have read, but have no understanding in practice. I wonder whether any of you would be able to provide an opinion as to what to look for etc. I would want to use it day in day out during the week, but like the idea of having something classic under my feet. many thanks woolfie