£70k 981 GT4 or £85k 718 GT4? - Page 5 - Boxster/Cayman - PistonHeads UK

I have the opportunity to buy a 981 GT4 around the £70k mark. Has all the essential options incl cage, PCCBs, chrono pack etc. I had a cursory look at the 781s and they are cheaper than i would have expected given its a 4 year newer car- around £85k I get the newer one doesnt sound as visceral but wouldnt a £5k exhaust from someone like JCR sort it? You could then sell the exhaust come sale time. I guess my question is- what would you do, newer car + exhaust so totalling £90k or 70k for a 4 year older car? What do you think is a safer bet money wise?

The older car is far better VFM in my view. It's a brilliant car, sounds great and subjectively looks better. A £20K difference is not work it my view.

I’ve owned both, the 718 lasted 6 weeks.

All IMHO: The 981 is cheaper, sounds better, is more raw feeling but has an asthmatic engine. The 718 is more expensive, more useable day-to-day as it's more compliant and has a far superior and meatier engine. If it's your only car then it would always be a 718 for me. If you want a car to thrash around a track (a lot) and/or fancy modifying the engine to Clubsport spec the 981 is the way to go.

This would be purely a weekend/track car. My only concern really is how the 718 prices are developing, there might be a decent chance they put downward pressure on the 981 if things continue this way.

R33FAL said: This would be purely a weekend/track car. My only concern really is how the 718 prices are developing, there might be a decent chance they put downward pressure on the 981 if things continue this way. If you’re concerned about future price movement, then maybe this is not the car for you. Go for something cheaper..

R33FAL said: I have the opportunity to buy a 981 GT4 around the £70k mark. Has all the essential options incl cage, PCCBs, chrono pack etc. I had a cursory look at the 781s and they are cheaper than i would have expected given its a 4 year newer car- around £85k I get the newer one doesnt sound as visceral but wouldnt a £5k exhaust from someone like JCR sort it? You could then sell the exhaust come sale time. I guess my question is- what would you do, newer car + exhaust so totalling £90k or 70k for a 4 year older car? What do you think is a safer bet money wise? For me a £15k gap for a 4 year older car is a no brainer, at that price point I would get the new one. Yes the old car sounds a little better, but don’t believe the hype the new one doesn’t sound at all bad. There are pro and cons to both, for me the 718 pros far out weights the 981’s.

diffstar said: R33FAL said: I have the opportunity to buy a 981 GT4 around the £70k mark. Has all the essential options incl cage, PCCBs, chrono pack etc. I had a cursory look at the 781s and they are cheaper than i would have expected given its a 4 year newer car- around £85k I get the newer one doesnt sound as visceral but wouldnt a £5k exhaust from someone like JCR sort it? You could then sell the exhaust come sale time. I guess my question is- what would you do, newer car + exhaust so totalling £90k or 70k for a 4 year older car? What do you think is a safer bet money wise? For me a £15k gap for a 4 year older car is a no brainer, at that price point I would get the new one. Yes the old car sounds a little better, but don’t believe the hype the new one doesn’t sound at all bad. There are pro and cons to both, for me the 718 pros far out weights the 981’s. Having owned a 981 GT4 and 718 GT4 both from new both same spec I would agree entirely with this. The higher revving and stronger pulling engine alone on the 718 GT4 is worth the extra over the detuned and strangled C2S engine of the 981. Yes the 981 is a decent package and the exhaust sounds better than the 718 due to gpf but the 718 proper Porsche GT engine is streets ahead of the 981 and induction noises are far better as is economy which is frankly dire on the 981 and actually far worse than even a manual 991.2 GT3. OP says a 5 year old 981 CS with ceramics is £70k and an identical spec 718 CS is £85k but unless this is a private sale am unaware of any 718s in this spec CS with ceramics at £85k unless it is high mileage most understandably are £90k plus and more at OPCs. £20k more for a current model 4 year old newer car with better engine and full manufacturers warranty really a no brainer imo but the OP is advised to drive both cars to see which is preferred.

Interesting perspectives, thanks. This would indeed be a private sale- so a bit of an opportunity. At a dealer it would probably be up at £75k. This will be my first Porsche- I have considered just getting a manual 991.2 GT3 (as rare as the seem to be), but i figured I want to enjoy the “progression” in cars rather than just go straight to the “top” of the tree. Enjoy a GT4 for a year or 2 then get into a GT3- perhaps the new one softens prices a bit there by then.

I’ve recently bought a 981 GT4; I tried both the 981 and 718 before I committed and chose the 981. Preferred the 981 so seemed like a total bargain, came with a 2 year Porsche warranty too.

982 (718) for me. 981 a fine car but relatively flawed engine-wise alongside the 982. But the 981 is rather cheaper.

Maxym said: 982 (718) for me. 981 a fine car but relatively flawed engine-wise alongside the 982. But the 981 is rather cheaper. Flawed?

MannyLon said: Maxym said: 982 (718) for me. 981 a fine car but relatively flawed engine-wise alongside the 982. But the 981 is rather cheaper. Flawed? Feels restricted, poor fuel economy, hole in the midrange, doesn't like to rev. I'd call that flawed too. IMO, other opinions are available

Twinfan said: Feels restricted, poor fuel economy, hole in the midrange, doesn't like to rev. I'd call that flawed too. IMO, other opinions are available Naa, let’s agree to differ. “Poor fuel economy”, not sure that’s relevant to performance cars? “Hole in midrange”. Not experienced it. “Not like to rev”. You are kidding me. Seems 718 owners just don’t like the 981 For me it’s a screamer of an engine and the Spyder version is one of the most fun road cars..

MannyLon said: Naa, let’s agree to differ. “Poor fuel economy”, not sure that’s relevant to performance cars? “Hole in midrange”. Not experienced it. “Not like to rev”. You are kidding me. Seems 718 owners just don’t like the 981 For me it’s a screamer of an engine and the Spyder version is one of the most fun road cars.. The 981 Spyder is mapped differently remember even though it has the same 3.8 lump, and I preferred to the 981 GT4 but we're talking Caymans here Just to show you what I'm talking about:

Twinfan said: The 981 Spyder is mapped differently remember even though it has the same 3.8 lump, and I preferred to the 981 GT4 but we're talking Caymans here Just to show you what I'm talking about: Not sure how graphs equate to driving fun. Probably best to test drive both. I enjoy my Spyder more than the GT4 on the road.

MannyLon said: Not sure how graphs equate to driving fun. Probably best to test drive both. I enjoy my Spyder more than the GT4 on the road. Yep 981 Spyder is a great car and in many ways apart from over farty exhaust in Sport plus mode is more convincing as a package than the 981 GT4. Thing is the pre Porsche GT focused(non GT brakes and suspension and standard Pirellis v Cups) 981 Spyder doesn't have to try furthermore it doesn't NEED a proper Posche GT engine unlike 981 GT4, and the Spyder I found invariably to be the more usable car of choice between the 2 for weekends away to the Lakes/Scotland etc. Perhaps the OP should consider the 981 Spyder too. After all they are rare with only c220 UK cars v over six hundred 981 GT4s. Just a thought.

OP should drive both. 718 4.0 is a better engine out of the box. 981 engine can be easily tweaked with a light stage 1 tune and filters to smooth out the torque curve and optimised power delivery. For a very small outlay - c£3k all fitted. Then it’s down to the characteristics of the car. As has been said, If it going to a pure weekend toy- b-road blaster 981, has more to offer and gives the immediate GT car feel. Steering, clutch, gearshift, sound. 718 has been refined to broaden appeal and therefore loses the immediate feeling of edge. It’s more like a series 718 up until you want to get on it and extract the performance. So you need to go faster to ‘feel’ it. Drive both and take your pick… depends what you want from the car. Something to consider: 981 GT4 can be make to perform as well as, and better than standard 718 GT4. However 718 GT4 cannot recapture 981 GT4 or be what it is: For many reasons - Iconic and historically significant. Edited by TDT on Sunday 21st March 13:14

Interesting points TD but should most buyers of 981 GT4s have to seriously consider immediately throwing £3k at it to improve the engine and make it perform as well as a 718 GT4? The true and fair comparison would be to also throw £3k at a 718 GT4 engine and see what transpires. OK I get there would be warranty issues. Simpler and fairer merely to compare both cars as stock. I find the gearbox action in the 718 identical to the 981 btw. The 718 clutch is lighter which is a minus imo but bizarrely it is still heavier than the GT3. Edited by av185 on Sunday 21st March 13:20

av185 said: Interesting points TD but should most buyers of 981 GT4s have to seriously consider immediately throwing £3k at it to improve the engine and make it perform as well as a 718 GT4? The true and fair comparison would be to also throw £3k at a 718 GT4 engine and see what transpires. OK I get there would be warranty issues. Simpler and fairer merely to compare both cars as stock. I find the gearbox action in the 718 identical to the 981 btw. The 718 clutch is lighter which is a minus imo but bizarrely it is still heavier than the GT3. Edited by av185 on Sunday 21st March 13:20 It’s up to the individual.... it’s not a must. But c3k is still much less than the 15-20k difference between 718 and 981 GT4 Yep I do understand the standard v tweaked argument... I raised it specifically to address the point about power delivery and the charts.... just to say this point can be easily negated, and then you still have an immediately more ‘exciting’ car in the 981.. and you’ve avoided spending £12-18k for apple carplay. Clutch feel on manual GT3 is at odds with how my mind works... it’s really so, so light.

TDT said: It’s up to the individual.... it’s not a must. But c3k is still much less than the 15-20k difference between 718 and 981 GT4 Yep I do understand the standard v tweaked argument... I raised it specifically to address the point about power delivery and the charts.... just to say this point can be easily negated, and then you still have an immediately more ‘exciting’ car in the 981.. and you’ve avoided spending £12-18k for apple carplay. Clutch feel on manual GT3 is at odds with how my mind works... it’s really so, so light. Hi TDT, Just out of interest, could you give a bit more detail on the 981 mods, and where to go for them to be done. Cheers

Obviously modding the 981 is great but you're permanently removing the car from the OPC network, the extended warranty system and limiting resale. It's a fabulous option for a keeper car though

Twinfan said: Obviously modding the 981 is great but you're permanently removing the car from the OPC network, the extended warranty system and limiting resale. It's a fabulous option for a keeper car though The extended warranty is just an insurance policy with pretty limited coverage. If you have done any mods to a car 981/718 or Ford Fiesta you run the risk of your claim being denied. So if you change something in the drivetrain and then something connected to the drivetrain fails you might have to brace yourself for the prospect of needing to put your hand in your pocket. If the problem that you have is totally unrelated to the mod... you’d expect pragmatism to prevail.

kevs 172 said: TDT said: It’s up to the individual.... it’s not a must. But c3k is still much less than the 15-20k difference between 718 and 981 GT4 Yep I do understand the standard v tweaked argument... I raised it specifically to address the point about power delivery and the charts.... just to say this point can be easily negated, and then you still have an immediately more ‘exciting’ car in the 981.. and you’ve avoided spending £12-18k for apple carplay. Clutch feel on manual GT3 is at odds with how my mind works... it’s really so, so light. Hi TDT, Just out of interest, could you give a bit more detail on the 981 mods, and where to go for them to be done. Cheers I’ve pm you, but for the benefit of the thread: There are various options... if you just want optimised delivery.... I'd recommend a package based on custom tune and 82mm Throttle body (IPD plenum is commonly used to facilitate the fitting of the larger TB) The standard 74mm Cayman throttle body is replaced with the 82mm unit from the 911. This helps with intake ingestion at high revs. This can be done for c£3k fitted. It will nicely wake the car up, and isn't extreme at all... just optimisation. You can go further with headers with sport cats.... this will unlock even more. Headers with Sport cats are in the region of 3k. Headers are probably biggest bang for buck for HP. Then there are more extreme option with even larger intake systems.

The added benefit of headers is the sound should improve. Not that it needs to on the 981..

TDT said: The extended warranty is just an insurance policy with pretty limited coverage. If you have done any mods to a car 981/718 or Ford Fiesta you run the risk of your claim being denied. So if you change something in the drivetrain and then something connected to the drivetrain fails you might have to brace yourself for the prospect of needing to put your hand in your pocket. If the problem that you have is totally unrelated to the mod... you’d expect pragmatism to prevail. For sure, but I see the extended warranty as mostly a drivetrain warranty so if that's not covered there's not a lot of point to it

MannyLon said: The added benefit of headers is the sound should improve. Not that it needs to on the 981.. Ideally you do intake headers and a custom tune to match it all together... but it’s then down to cost and what you want. Can all still be done for less than half of the difference between used 981 GT4 and used 718 GT4.... but at that point the 981 GT4 is a different animal. For lightly breathed upon, optimised... with no down sides.... intake & tune works well.

Twinfan said: For sure, but I see the extended warranty as mostly a drivetrain warranty so if that's not covered there's not a lot of point to it I understand 3rd party warranty solutions are available, which can include/accept modifications if they appropriately declared. It’s all just a question of who will carry the risk and how much carrying that risk cost either directly yourself of as a premium to an insurance provider. Edited by TDT on Sunday 21st March 15:05

TDT said: Ideally you do intake headers and a custom tune to match it all together... but it’s then down to cost and what you want. Can all still be done for less than half of the difference between used 981 GT4 and used 718 GT4.... but at that point the 981 GT4 is a different animal. For lightly breathed upon, optimised... with no down sides.... intake & tune works well. At £15k gap the 718 is a no brainer to me. With that gap halved to £7.5k and a modded engined, It is even more obvious to get the 718, not less.

diffstar said: TDT said: Ideally you do intake headers and a custom tune to match it all together... but it’s then down to cost and what you want. Can all still be done for less than half of the difference between used 981 GT4 and used 718 GT4.... but at that point the 981 GT4 is a different animal. For lightly breathed upon, optimised... with no down sides.... intake & tune works well. At £15k gap the 718 is a no brainer to me. With that gap halved to £7.5k and a modded engined, It is even more obvious to get the 718, not less. Already addressed.... It depends what you want from a car. If I was starting at zero today… I’d probably just buy the newest car for the money. That the straight forward normal approach. But just because the 718 GT4 exists... I’m happy it does.… it doesn’t mean the 981 is obsolete… far from it in fact.… when you really look at the things drivers actually want from a sports car. GT4 isn’t, what it is, because of the drivetrain in either guise… The car is about chassis balance, agility, responsiveness and engagement. If you want the ‘proper engine’, you need a GT3 for the moment, and you’ll need to spend to get one.

The nice thing about the 981 is that once you step outside the OPC extended warranty you really can please yourself what you do, and how much you spend. I have modified everything but the gearing on my GT4 and as Tyrone says, it's a very different car from a standard GT4 of 981 or 718 variant ... and much closer to a 981 Clubsport, but manual and road legal. In fact, the 981 and 718 Clubsports from Porsche both use the 981 engine as a base plus a six speed PDK gearbox with significantly higher ratios for greater acceleration in each gear up to a much lower maximum speed .. perfect for racing on circuits where maxing out at 140mph is a dream. The next step up is indeed a GT3 ... I have just bought one as a road car ! 991.2 and PDK. My modified GT4 will remain my track day special ... and I have optimised everything around running a complete season of trackdays with minimum consumable costs ... so we've dialled out all the Porsche designed shortcomings. Arguably the 981 is a better starting point for this than a 718 ... if that is what you want to do ! It is also 3dB quieter than a stock 981 GT4 ... Edited by ChrisW. on Sunday 21st March 21:36

Twinfan said: Feels restricted, poor fuel economy, hole in the midrange, doesn't like to rev. I'd call that flawed too. IMO, other opinions are available Are you sure we are talking about the 981 Gt4 and not something else I have now had a good chance to drive my 981 GT4 and power delivery is linear and boy it loves to rev. You can easily hit the red line in the first 3 gears, not tried it in 4th, 5th or 6th yet on a public roads but I think it would get close to red line in 4th for sure. Fuel economy is on apr with my Evo VI which is also close to 385bhp , similar weight but has 4wd. But to be honest for me it is a fun car and fuel economy is not a great issue as I enjoy driving it. What it could do with is shorter set of gear for 2-5 so you can use the rev range and maybe a longer 6th for cruising on a longer trip to get noise down / fuel economy up Also could do with maybe less cabin noise , which is fun on a fun run but could be tiresome on a longer run. But otherwise it is an amazing bit of kit

Silly question But why do people say the Cayman GT4 had a C2S engine "shoehorned into it"? Surely the physical size of the 3.6 and 3.8 would be similar if not the same? Also If the GT4 is a detuned C2S engine then what can be done to it to unleash the power . To be fair at present I find it fun but I think give it 3-4 months of some summer fun I will be thinking this could do with more power. So t would be nice to know what can be done and rough costs ?

EvoSid said: Are you sure we are talking about the 981 Gt4 and not something else. Yep, I'm definitely talking about the the 981 GT4. You clearly haven't read the thread properly, given your other questions...

EvoSid said: Twinfan said: Feels restricted, poor fuel economy, hole in the midrange, doesn't like to rev. I'd call that flawed too. IMO, other opinions are available Are you sure we are talking about the 981 Gt4 and not something else I have now had a good chance to drive my 981 GT4 and power delivery is linear and boy it loves to rev. You can easily hit the red line in the first 3 gears, not tried it in 4th, 5th or 6th yet on a public roads but I think it would get close to red line in 4th for sure. Fuel economy is on apr with my Evo VI which is also close to 385bhp , similar weight but has 4wd. But to be honest for me it is a fun car and fuel economy is not a great issue as I enjoy driving it. What it could do with is shorter set of gear for 2-5 so you can use the rev range and maybe a longer 6th for cruising on a longer trip to get noise down / fuel economy up Also could do with maybe less cabin noise , which is fun on a fun run but could be tiresome on a longer run. But otherwise it is an amazing bit of kit Wouldn't say the cabin noise is ever an issue in the 981 GT4 imo the noise levels are about right also bear in mind most subsequent Porsche GTs actually have far less sound insulation than the 2015 cars. Yes the 981 GT4 will rev as will any engine but the fact that it has a relatively low rev limit especially for a GT Porsche and as the graphs posted confirms there is little performance benefit in hanging onto the gears which essentially goes against the ethos of Porsche GTs and their high revving engines. Referring once more to the poor economy of the 981 it appears this is in part caused by the glacial warm up period compared to newer Porsche engines particularly during colder weather coupled with the drop in temp caused by the additional rad activated by sport mode. As ever the use of quality higher octane fuel always appeared to improve economy as well as performance.

996 GT3 has the same ‘low’ rev limit of 7800 also! I guess that’s not a proper GT car either. Edited by TDT on Monday 22 March 08:16

TDT said: 996 GT3 has the same ‘low’ rev limit of 7800 also! I guess that’s not a proper GT car either. Edited by TDT on Monday 22 March 08:16 Released 22 years ago... I've got a lot of time for the 981 GT4 but the 718 took the engine to a proper GT product level, they revised the internals of the engine for its intended purpose rather than just sticking an average C2 engine in barely untouched. Personally the value gap is hard to justify even if you ignore the better engine. Younger, longer warranty, newer, fresher, newer nav, slightly nicer interior etc... all for 15k That said I personally prefer the look of the 981 from the outside. With 718 prices where they are the 981 will suffer downward pressure because the value gap is too small imo. Edited by shantybeater on Monday 22 March 08:46

shantybeater said: TDT said: 996 GT3 has the same ‘low’ rev limit of 7800 also! I guess that’s not a proper GT car either. Edited by TDT on Monday 22 March 08:16 Released 22 years ago... This is true, but it was genesis for GT cars… and it started at the same level. shantybeater said: I've got a lot of time for the 981 GT4 but the 718 took the engine to a proper GT product level, they revised the internals of the engine for its intended purpose rather than just sticking an average C2 engine in barely untouched. Personally the value gap is hard to justify even if you ignore the better engine. Younger, longer warranty, newer, fresher, newer nav, slightly nicer interior etc... all for 15k All true. But I’d just say people forget how much of BARGAIN the 981 GT4 was… and Porsche were testing the market. With the lessons learned, you’d expect an improvement in a MK2. The reason this is a discussion at all though is that the professional consensus is that there isn’t much between the 2 generations in terms of performance. Of course we all know these cars are incremental, but then sometimes what is gained in one area is lost in another. The big difference is in character/demeanour. shantybeater said: That said I personally prefer the look of the 981 from the outside. With 718 prices where they are the 981 will suffer downward pressure because the value gap is too small imo. Time will tell. But yes as the 718 drops over time then usually in the simplest terms it makes sense to buy the newest car for the money. Edited by TDT on Monday 22 March 09:24

TDT said: But I’d just say people forget how much of BARGAIN the 981 GT4 was… and Porsche were testing the market. But the 981 Spyder at £60k was actually far better value than the 981 GT4 at £65k especially as the Spyder price INCLUDED various extras and importantly the now discontinued p3 folding buckets as standard which were a £1507 extra on the GT4. Since Porsche realigned the 718 Spyder pricing and increased it some c £13500 over the 981 this also shows the 981 Spyder was actually incredible value over the 981 GT4. Interesting that the 981 GT4 was c £35k cheaper than the far higher tech much more expensive engined 991.1 GT3 and the 718 GT4 is also c£35k cheaper than the c£111k 991.2 GT3 and these figures show the £65k 981 GT4 was priced about right but if anything slightly too expensive ££ at the time.

shantybeater said: Released 22 years ago... I've got a lot of time for the 981 GT4 but the 718 took the engine to a proper GT product level, they revised the internals of the engine for its intended purpose rather than just sticking an average C2 engine in barely untouched. Personally the value gap is hard to justify even if you ignore the better engine. Younger, longer warranty, newer, fresher, newer nav, slightly nicer interior etc... all for 15k That said I personally prefer the look of the 981 from the outside. With 718 prices where they are the 981 will suffer downward pressure because the value gap is too small imo. Edited by shantybeater on Monday 22 March 08:46 All no doubt true, but presumably any perceived value and the price of a car reflects both objective and subjective views on what constitutes 'better'. Objectively all of those points are probably right, but whether most people would notice the 'GT' engine in a GT4 road car, who knows. I expect there are better track cars around for similar or less money, but if you're mad keen on tracking a GT4, as mentioned above, modification seems to be the way to get the most out of them. In general, the 718 in all varieties is objectively 'better' than the 981 it replaces, but as is often discussed on these forums, plenty of people prefer the 981, for a number of different reasons. When it comes to those who enjoy the unmodified road car (like me), then the sound and look of the car are probably more important, and that's where the subjective determination comes in. I've not driven either GT4 so perhaps I have no idea, but regarding the Spyder, I have no particular desire for a 718 (probably because I've got it's predecessor and I don't recognise the difference in cost as being good value for me) and for an average driver who isn't going to see a track both generations are going to be great. So it all comes down to the subjective determination of which do you prefer - OP get driving both, I suspect that you won't be disappointed whichever you choose!

Flying machine said: All no doubt true, but presumably any perceived value and the price of a car reflects both objective and subjective views on what constitutes 'better'. Objectively all of those points are probably right, but whether most people would notice the 'GT' engine in a GT4 road car, who knows. I expect there are better track cars around for similar or less money, but if you're mad keen on tracking a GT4, as mentioned above, modification seems to be the way to get the most out of them. In general, the 718 in all varieties is objectively 'better' than the 981 it replaces, but as is often discussed on these forums, plenty of people prefer the 981, for a number of different reasons. When it comes to those who enjoy the unmodified road car (like me), then the sound and look of the car are probably more important, and that's where the subjective determination comes in. I've not driven either GT4 so perhaps I have no idea, but regarding the Spyder, I have no particular desire for a 718 (probably because I've got it's predecessor and I don't recognise the difference in cost as being good value for me) and for an average driver who isn't going to see a track both generations are going to be great. So it all comes down to the subjective determination of which do you prefer - OP get driving both, I suspect that you won't be disappointed whichever you choose! Good post, it is often very much a subjective choice. The stats can say one thing, but when you drive a car, it's how it makes you feel that's important. That's why I rate the 981 Spyder so highly.

av185 said: TDT said: But I’d just say people forget how much of BARGAIN the 981 GT4 was… and Porsche were testing the market. But the 981 Spyder at £60k was actually far better value than the 981 GT4 at £65k especially as the Spyder price INCLUDED various extras and importantly the now discontinued p3 folding buckets as standard which were a £1507 extra on the GT4. Since Porsche realigned the 718 Spyder pricing and increased it some c £13500 over the 981 this also shows the 981 Spyder was actually incredible value over the 981 GT4. This would make sense and yes 981 Spyder could look like even more of a bargain if you thought it had the same rolling Motorsport chassis (as per the 718 Spyder to the 718 GT4) and had the seats and stuff thrown in on top. But it wasn’t. It’s a Super GTS (based upon series production chassis) with the buckets at no cost. Lovely things but different again. Edited by TDT on Monday 22 March 10:07

MannyLon said: Good post, it is often very much a subjective choice. The stats can say one thing, but when you drive a car, it's how it makes you feel that's important. That's why I rate the 981 Spyder so highly. Agreed. I've said it before that as long as you like convertibles it's the pick of the 981 range IMHO. I don't, hence me preferring the 718 GT4 over anything in the 981 series. Horses for courses

Twinfan said: Agreed. I've said it before that as long as you like convertibles it's the pick of the 981 range IMHO. I don't, hence me preferring the 718 GT4 over anything in the 981 series. Horses for courses Indeed. With the Cayman electric cars being announced, I’d bet these petrol versions become very sought after..

I hope not MannyLon - otherwise they will disappear from the tracks and into speculator's garages ! I am already looking forward to receiving my mail order petrol in 3039 (I will be 70) and taking my noisy beast for a spin. By then we will all agree that the Spyders and GT4s under either 981 or 982 were smashing cars.

Snowy999 said: I hope not MannyLon - otherwise they will disappear from the tracks and into speculator's garages ! I am already looking forward to receiving my mail order petrol in 3039 (I will be 70) and taking my noisy beast for a spin. By then we will all agree that the Spyders and GT4s under either 981 or 982 were smashing cars. Sought after as in enjoyed by petrolheads like us

I see that all the engine and warranty details have been covered. No one has mentioned where you will spend most of your time , in the cockpit. The 718 has the latest PCM and an updated interior. Having watched many comparison videos on these 2 cars and pretty much all come out equal, it would come down to the fact you can have a 4 year newer car for not alot more cash. If you have tg cash for both, the 718 would be my move

Snowy999 said: I hope not MannyLon - otherwise they will disappear from the tracks and into speculator's garages ! I am already looking forward to receiving my mail order petrol in 3039 (I will be 70) and taking my noisy beast for a spin. By then we will all agree that the Spyders and GT4s under either 981 or 982 were smashing cars. 2039 or 1070 ... ?

Twinfan said: Yep, I'm definitely talking about the the 981 GT4. You clearly haven't read the thread properly, given your other questions... It seems i just make my mind up on how i feel the car is to drive than looks for holes in graphs. I honestly can NOT feel any hoe in the power delivery maybe I need to get it on RR to see the hole as for the rest no idea what you on about bud

I used the graph to show what I felt when driving a 981 GT4. YMMV! As for the other part: EvoSid said: Also If the GT4 is a detuned C2S engine then what can be done to it to unleash the power . To be fair at present I find it fun but I think give it 3-4 months of some summer fun I will be thinking this could do with more power. So t would be nice to know what can be done and rough costs ? TDT posted early in page 2, before you posted the above, how to modify the 981 GT4 engine and the associated costs. Hence my comment about reading the thread properly

Interesting that this is still a question 18 months later. One I'm currently grappling with. Sold my 991.1 GT3 in the summer to release funds for a house renovation, and I'd like 991.2 or maybe 992.1 when funds allow again (each to their own, but I only do cars outright). In the meantime thinking of moving on a Alfa i have and topping that pot up for a GT4. Really both would need modding for me personally: 718 an exhaust and resultant ECU change for missing filters. 981 some breathing. Currently leaving toward the 981 for the more weighty controls, but the 718 looks are appealing and breadth of choice.

Some good posts on this forum. I am very pleased with my 16 reg 981 GT4 owned since May. Agree with all comments about steering, brakes gearchange etc , not so much about ultimate performance especially regarding long ratios. If you need to go quicker drop down a gear or three, and you wont be dissapointed. Fuel consumption is around 28MPG driven normally which is not too bad for a 3.8 lump and my guess is a 718 is not much better in the real world. Most modern cars are long geared for MPG and emissions unfortunately, in fact I think 6th could be longer for motorway work as it would drop revs from 3000 to 2000 @70MPH, which would be the same as my previous 981 GTS PDK in 7th. 718 GT4s seem to be under some price pressure at present, and they are good value at around £80k,some of that I think is due to overall numbers,the big question is how long are they going to be made until the leccy one arrives? Another year or 18 months worth of production will not help values. Saying all that the only car I would trade mine for is a 718 GT4 PDK! and If the market keeps dropping I might be tempted, simply because of a newer car and it WILL be a keeper as I am not interested in a leccy one.

I'm no aficionado on either, but having driven both, the 981 would be my choice irrespective of the price difference.

isleofthorns said: I'm no aficionado on either, but having driven both, the 981 would be my choice irrespective of the price difference. I agree. Not many 981 GT4s seem to be moving at the moment even sub 10k miles for less than £70k. That said I'm now noticing quite a few that are being taken out of OPC servicing, hardly surprising when they're coming up to 8yrs old.

The much more beautiful rear of 718 compared to 981 is worth extra £5000.00 in my opinion

Far Cough said: I see that all the engine and warranty details have been covered. No one has mentioned where you will spend most of your time , in the cockpit. The 718 has the latest PCM and an updated interior. The updated interior basically consists of PCM 4 and a better steering wheel - I’m running a full 718 interior in my 981, including the multifunction steering wheel. Only way you can tell the difference is the location of the Sport Chrono on top of dash.

Riskins said: The updated interior basically consists of PCM 4 and a better steering wheel - I’m running a full 718 interior in my 981, including the multifunction steering wheel. Only way you can tell the difference is the location of the Sport Chrono on top of dash. Sorry to pick up on an old post. Have you changed the interior yourself may I ask ? Must have been quite a cost but a great improvement

GT3Manthey said: Sorry to pick up on an old post. Have you changed the interior yourself may I ask ? Must have been quite a cost but a great improvement Yes picked up full interior from a breakers and fitted myself, sold my full leather interior - net cost just under £2k.

Riskins said: Yes picked up full interior from a breakers and fitted myself, sold my full leather interior - net cost just under £2k. Great work total bargain

Armitage.Shanks said: I agree. Not many 981 GT4s seem to be moving at the moment even sub 10k miles for less than £70k. That said I'm now noticing quite a few that are being taken out of OPC servicing, hardly surprising when they're coming up to 8yrs old. have decided to buy a 981.. under 10k and 70k. There are now some cheap 718 coming through, so the once 20-30k premium is now 10-15k, making the decision harder. At the end of the day though, I drove both, and preferred the drive of the 981.

Had a quick look and the 718 Spyder seems to be down to only £10K more expensive now. Leaves the older car somewhat over priced in my opinion at least

And…. It’s only September, can’t help but feel these have a bit to slip over the coming winter as belts tighten and the weather gets worse?

this looks rather special for 70K. 1 of only 3 in this colour, unless your opinion is thats 3 too many! https://www.pistonheads.com/buy/listing/15726258

julian987R said: this looks rather special for 70K. 1 of only 3 in this colour, unless your opinion is thats 3 too many! https://www.pistonheads.com/buy/listing/15726258 'Stand out options leather dash and silver stitching' (so the basic cheapest stitching).....lol. No chrono or more importantly, no climate. Heres one of the other 2 in for service at Porsche Bolton:

The more it goes on, I look at the GTS package and "stitching" and it just looks way too busy for my liking "Gary we've charged them 3 grand for this so we had better stitch everything" Might be alone, think it looks naff, when it was a option I would have absolutely ticked.

Question for me on these is will they slide more as 718 prices get nearer, or are they sufficiently special to stand comparison with the 718s that are now just a few grand more? Invictus Porsche have/had a gentian blue 718 at only 8k more than that yellowy-green number.

He looks ill. Which OPC Dealer Principal is that I wonder. ^^^^^^^ Remain unconviced there is such little difference between a 981 and 718 GT4 of similar spec and relative mileage tbh. As usual folks like to quote apples and pears to suit their agenda lol. Edited by av185 on Thursday 19th October 12:47

Actus Reus said: Question for me on these is will they slide more as 718 prices get nearer, or are they sufficiently special to stand comparison with the 718s that are now just a few grand more? Invictus Porsche have/had a gentian blue 718 at only 8k more than that yellowy-green number. Comfort spec non clubsport and non pts drab Gentian blue explains alot.

If I was looking I'd also consider a 718 4.0 GTS and have a lightweight flywheel conversion. Maybe also have the gearing shortened. Transformative by all accounts.

av185 said: He looks ill. Which OPC Dealer Principal is that I wonder. ^^^^^^^ Remain unconviced there is such little difference between a 981 and 718 GT4 of similar spec and relative mileage tbh. As usual folks like to quote apples and pears to suit their agenda lol. Edited by av185 on Thursday 19th October 12:47 PH's review said to get the 981 so, with that saving in mind, perhaps it's the better choice. And agreed, Gentian is a bit dull on a day like today. These cars need stronger colours, I think. JZM's sapphire blue car was sold in days.

As an owner of a 981 I don't get the narrowing price difference either. I know my car is great (obv) and there are fewer but the 718s I've been in are great too and are 4/5 years newer with more power. I expect my 981 to fall a fair bit this winter and am glad I am not selling it. Maybe time for them to move into the 50s with the economy weakening. Specifically on mine though, although it's a clubsport/carbon interior and all the Manthey Racing bits, it is white and has a standard plastic dash and no leather on the cupholders and so it is worthless. Ah well I will have to just drive it and ensure my dog comes along for the ride.

julian987R said: this looks rather special for 70K. 1 of only 3 in this colour, unless your opinion is thats 3 too many! https://www.pistonheads.com/buy/listing/15726258 Looked at this but couldn't get past the silver stitching but the red belts. Outside of the colour I don't see why it is so expensive.

Snowy999 said: As an owner of a 981 I don't get the narrowing price difference either. I know my car is great (obv) and there are fewer but the 718s I've been in are great too and are 4/5 years newer with more power. I expect my 981 to fall a fair bit this winter and am glad I am not selling it. Maybe time for them to move into the 50s with the economy weakening. Specifically on mine though, although it's a clubsport/carbon interior and all the Manthey Racing bits, it is white and has a standard plastic dash and no leather on the cupholders and so it is worthless. Ah well I will have to just drive it and ensure my dog comes along for the ride. Unfortunately, the prices are falling. Was quoted a price for my 981 GTS and just laughed. No worries, won't be moving to a GT4 unless those prices also equalise down too.

Swine Enthusiast said: Unfortunately, the prices are falling. Was quoted a price for my 981 GTS and just laughed. No worries, won't be moving to a GT4 unless those prices also equalise down too. Same, I made some speculative calls about swapping my 981 GTS into a 718 GT4 and they were mostly quoting a £50k cost to change.

rawenghey said: Same, I made some speculative calls about swapping my 981 GTS into a 718 GT4 and they were mostly quoting a £50k cost to change. They let me know the WBAC quote of £28k, told me this was, of course, low and offered £37k. I know it would just end up online for £45-47k so I am just gifting a dealer £8-10k. Shame as the next logical step was 981 GT4

Swine Enthusiast said: They let me know the WBAC quote of £28k, told me this was, of course, low and offered £37k. I know it would just end up online for £45-47k so I am just gifting a dealer £8-10k. Shame as the next logical step was 981 GT4 Or sell privately at a sensible price and negotiate down the GT4.

Yeah they quoted me about £38k and for what? For them to list it the next day at £45 - £50k based on current AT pricing. And then the car you buy for £90k or whatever, you know they've just given the seller low £80s for. It's nuts. I think I'll aim to buy and sell privately from now on. The warranty follows the car anyway, so what do you gain from selling to a dealer, other than avoiding a few "best price m8??" queries.

Do people really expect retail money for their part ex? The dealer has to make a profit. I don't even bother asking for a part ex price now and just sell privately.

bigtime said: Do people really expect retail money for their part ex? The dealer has to make a profit. I don't even bother asking for a part ex price now and just sell privately. Exactly , Porsche take 10k spread on a car. And thought this was common knowledge.

Am I missing something or is this ridiculously cheap ? 22 plate, 8k miles, £20k of extras, ~£70k

What site is that?

bosshog said: What site is that? Motorway - Pro, you need to be a 'registered trader' (my mate does the searches for me) , there is a bid fee of around £500 on top.

bigtime said: Do people really expect retail money for their part ex? The dealer has to make a profit. I don't even bother asking for a part ex price now and just sell privately. The answer is yes, to many people over value there cars when trying to sell them. A porsche dealer needs a least a 10k to 15k spread on run of the mill porsche when buying and selling nowadays.

A friend has bought a 718 GT4 PDK recently and another one sold a 30k mile 981 GT4 a week ago. 911 Virgin offered to return £60k to £61k on SOR. Px bids with trade against a £100k Mac were £55k It sold privately for £63k to a chap that’s going to stick a 430bhp 991 engine he has lying around he races them and has engineering business that does engine rebuilds, custom liners and pistons for 911s. The 981 looks seriously slammed! Fully loaded PDK 718 GT4 was £80k a few months ago. Personally I’d take the 718 as I think the PDK solves the long gearing and I’m a sucker for yellow but both lovely.

Wilmslowboy said: Am I missing something or is this ridiculously cheap ? 22 plate, 8k miles, £20k of extras, ~£70k Went for £82k inc fees