981 Steering Remap - Page 2 - Boxster/Cayman - PistonHeads UK

I've got a Cayman 981 GTS. It's a fabulous automobile in many ways but the steering feel at speed for me is a let down. I don't want to start a fight here about if it's an issue or not (as opinions are like....noses etc. ) but I have found an interesting thread on one of forums in the United States of Freedom. One of the users found he could add a different remap to the Electric Power Steering (EPS) to change it to 991 GT3 map which has the same steering rack part number (using PIWIS). It's been getting pretty much only positive responses and has got me interested. https://rennlist.com/forums/981-forum/1339917-upgr... He makes a case as to why this may be an upgrade: Some Random Guy on the Internet said: I believe the EPS software for the non-GT 981/991.1 was Porsche's first attempt at using this type of steering rack. It clearly wasn't perfect and a lot of motoring journalists pointed this out during the time of release (2011-2012). A year or so later Andy Preuninger (head of the GT department) and his team got their hands on the software and tuned it over tons of track hours: Whatever they did worked and the 991.1 GT3 (~2013) was lauded for having the best electric power steering in any car made up to that point (per Chris Harris and other prominent journalists). But Porsche had zero financial incentive to retrofit this improved software into the outgoing models of non-GT 981/991.1 cars. Like all companies they are in the business of making money so why would they do that for free if people are already happily buying the outgoing cars. Instead they saved these updates for the next generation of cars and marketed it as one of the reasons why people should drop a bunch of cash on a brand new car. That's why the non-GT 718 and 991.2 cars are regarded as a return to form in the steering department, even without the fancy suspension components. Any thoughts on this one?

seefarr said: Any thoughts on this one? Very interesting/ cool. Hadn't ever thought about that before, guess it would make sense with EPS that you could have different control mappings as all software based.

I found the whole PIWIS thing interesting, hadn't realised you could get software like that to explore the car. Does anyone use it and is it worth getting? Little modes like this could be fun to experiment with.

Clearly if power steering + (PST?) is a software thing other parameters could be changed as well. Something for Lichfield or others?

But the parameters within the GT3 software will be predicated on the GT3 geometry and components. So it could work or equally not given the differences - and geo makes a huge difference to steering feel.

anonymous said: [redacted] I wouldn't mind betting half the people that moan about steering feel on here wouldn't even know they had a flat tyre if it didn't come up on the dash. But once they have read it on a forum ...............

Very interested in this! I cant see any reason as to why this wouldn't work, its just lines of code being changed. I suspect the early EPAS programming wasn't quite up to muster, hence it being changed for the GT3.

David W. said: Clearly if power steering + (PST?) is a software thing other parameters could be changed as well. Something for Lichfield or others? I think you're right....in theory! I get the sense that there is a dedicated bit of software (that runs either on a dedicated board on the rack or in the CPU) that controls the how much assistance the EPS is giving based on a range of inputs. Using the PIWIS you upload a different bit of EPS software tuned for the GT3. How you extract that bit of software, decompile it and rewrite it would be as hard as doing the same for an engine map but there's probably not the market to make it worthwhile. TGCOTF-dewey said: But the parameters within the GT3 software will be predicated on the GT3 geometry and components. So it could work or equally not given the differences - and geo makes a huge difference to steering feel. Yup completely agree - 1000s of hours of Porsche engineer time have been spent tuning the GT3 EPS map for GT3 rear-engined mass, suspension and steering kinematics not to mention the active rear wheel steering. But if it lowers the levels of assistance at fast road speeds I still think it could be an improvement. And if it's not, you can always flash it back to standard!

anonymous said: [redacted] With?

seefarr said: David W. said: Clearly if power steering + (PST?) is a software thing other parameters could be changed as well. Something for Lichfield or others? I think you're right....in theory! I get the sense that there is a dedicated bit of software (that runs either on a dedicated board on the rack or in the CPU) that controls the how much assistance the EPS is giving based on a range of inputs. Using the PIWIS you upload a different bit of EPS software tuned for the GT3. How you extract that bit of software, decompile it and rewrite it would be as hard as doing the same for an engine map but there's probably not the market to make it worthwhile. TGCOTF-dewey said: But the parameters within the GT3 software will be predicated on the GT3 geometry and components. So it could work or equally not given the differences - and geo makes a huge difference to steering feel. Yup completely agree - 1000s of hours of Porsche engineer time have been spent tuning the GT3 EPS map for GT3 rear-engined mass, suspension and steering kinematics not to mention the active rear wheel steering. But if it lowers the levels of assistance at fast road speeds I still think it could be an improvement. And if it's not, you can always flash it back to standard! If there is an oven ready (thanks Boris) software that is an improvement does it matter if it isn't 100% bespoke for that application?

seefarr said: steering feel at speed for me is a let down. are you still on Pirellis? i found that changing to Michelins made a big difference to feel, confidence and even ride quality

981Boxess said: If there is an oven ready (thanks Boris) software that is an improvement does it matter if it isn't 100% bespoke for that application? No, if it genuinely does. However, the GT3 software has been validated on a completely different platform across all areas of the performance envelope. It may offer improvements at 6-7 tenths as per the review in the link. But who's to say at 8,9 or 10 tenths it doesn't do something weird? That's the problem with safety important software.

I've used 20, 19 and now 18 inch wheel tyres on my 981 and they do feel different. Jumping from the 981 to a 996 you immediately notice the steering feel change. I've been toying with the idea of removing the assisted rack altogether but as no one else seems to have done it then this could be a lonely road of bleeding edge learning for me. I'd be interested to hear back from anyone here who tries this so please keep us posted.

Geo, tyres and a reset of the steering angle sensor after any adjustment do wonders for the steering in the 9x1. If yours is off try the reset after adjustment it's often missed especially if your car was aligned outside the opc. I've also tried the setting, I think it's just optimised for the GT3 geometry, I agree that it is slightly better but nothing scientific to back it up. I also noticed a slight change when turning in car parks but there wasn't anything drastically wrong with the steering in the first place. In the wet you just need more wheel time to know and trust the car, I suspect the people generally complaining went for a test drive once after being used to the previous hydraulic system. Edited by testdrive on Thursday 10th August 04:37

Just make sure you dont accidentally upload a US/European map, you don’t want the steering wheel starting up on the passenger side.

MX5, Caterham and Alpine A110 have all been my particular highlights when it came to steering. I find my 981 steering to be much better than the same era BMW electric steering but it still feels muted to me.

CloudStuff said: What would be a good car to seek out to experience benchmark steering feel, hydraulic and assisted?

CloudStuff said: Steering feel has always been an elusive thing for me. I’ve had 3 981 Cayman GTS and I’ve never felt the steering was a let down. Fabulous cars. I’ve also owned a 991.2 manual GT3 and the steering feel didn’t blow me aware there. I know it’s not hydraulic, but still it was a wonderful road car where you felt connected and involved the whole time. What would be a good car to seek out to experience benchmark steering feel, hydraulic and assisted? Unassisted 911 3.2 had the best steering feel I have ever had, Lotus Elise was pretty good also

Steering feel has always been an elusive thing for me. I’ve had 3 981 Cayman GTS and I’ve never felt the steering was a let down. Fabulous cars. I’ve also owned a 991.2 manual GT3 and the steering feel didn’t blow me away there. I know it’s not hydraulic, but still it was a wonderful road car where you felt connected and involved the whole time. What would be a good car to seek out to experience benchmark steering feel, hydraulic and assisted? Edited by CloudStuff on Thursday 10th August 14:41

So I had this done at GT One today. And I'm almost certain it made quite a positive difference for £36 of labour! It's all very subjective and it can be difficult when you go looking for a difference, you may find it even if it's not there but it's better. Even driving through train-strike London traffic, there's more of a ripple of feedback of what's going on at the front wheels. I had one mercifully clear "40" section and there is certainly more feedback in corners - it loads up with weight in a natural way as the front tyres are under load and if you wind off lock or back off, it lightens up. It's a lot like steering feel! But the only way to be sure is to find some nice empty roads so on Friday I'm getting the ferry to Spain and Portugal, just to be sure. For science! I'll provide detailed feedback (mainly about jamon) here: https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...

I remember ten years ago looking for add-on gadgets to enable me to raise and lower my E46 roof remotely. T'internet told me I had to buy a piece of hardware for £300 odd to do this. But I happened on a tuning company 5 miles away who, for £30, re-coded the car to simply do it via the standard key fob. I've never had an issue with my 981 steering and would be sceptical about changing it regardless of how many here have it done and find it to be a revelation. It may feel different, but unless a few well respected drivers do a head to head test how do I know if it's better?

981Boxess said: anonymous said: [redacted] I wouldn't mind betting half the people that moan about steering feel on here wouldn't even know they had a flat tyre if it didn't come up on the dash. But once they have read it on a forum ...............

rawenghey said: 981Boxess said: I wouldn't mind betting half the people that moan about steering feel on here wouldn't even know they had a flat tyre if it didn't come up on the dash. But once they have read it on a forum ............... When I was DD my 996 it had a slow on the front left. One day I attached the pump and it was showing single digits psi. It looked fine. I had been noticing some scrabbling around a bit when braking but had started thinking I needed new tyres. DD puts very little stress on these cars. In fact its probably a waste really.

ATM said: When I was DD my 996 it had a slow on the front left. One day I attached the pump and it was showing single digits psi. It looked fine. I had been noticing some scrabbling around a bit when braking but had started thinking I needed new tyres. DD puts very little stress on these cars. In fact its probably a waste really. DD... Drink driving? Ah... Daily driver... got it! I took my 981 to Porsche when looking for a Macan for my wife last week. Before I knew it they'd looked my car over and made me an offer! Thinking I'd maybe take them up on it I drove home and realised I generally pootle around in it so what's the point... Separation anxiety kicked in and I put my foot down so as to enjoy the last few days before our second car became an Audi A1 or other runabout. Then I came to my senses, thought what a fantastic car it is which little else could eclipse, and realised when we both need a car she'll be in the Macan and I'll be in some crap car. So... I'm keeping the 981. Close call though!

I test drove this a good few years ago : https://www.evo.co.uk/porsche/cayman/21772/rpm-tec... No crazy 20" diameter wheels, some grippy, sensible profile tyres, a set of decent passive dampers (Ohlins R&T or KW V3's, I can't remember) and few well chosen upgraded suspension bushes allied to a decent geo set up. The steering was absolutely superb and the car both drove and handled like a real sportscar rather than the over-wheeled, ridiculously low-profile tyred car that it left the factory as ... Retreats to a safe distance having lit the blue touch paper ...

Don't start them off about the shorter gearing, they're already in denial about the crap early EPAS... All I'll say is if you've actually driven a car with a proper hydraulic rack it is night and day vs the 981 EPAS. No amount of remapping is going to get close.

tommy87912 said: Don't start them off about the shorter gearing, they're already in denial about the crap early EPAS... All I'll say is if you've actually driven a car with a proper hydraulic rack it is night and day vs the 981 EPAS. No amount of remapping is going to get close. All I'll add is that if you've ever driven a car with proper, manual steering, it's night and day compared to the numbness of a power-assisted setup. No amount of parroting magazine road-testers' opinions is going to change that.

OP said: I don't want to start a fight here about if it's an issue or not.. Any thoughts on this one? rawenghey said: 981Boxess said: I wouldn't mind betting half the people that moan about steering feel on here wouldn't even know they had a flat tyre if it didn't come up on the dash. But once they have read it on a forum ............... Exactly, right? The OP has probably only ever driven to the shops and never round a corner! I once had my car on a genuine Porsche Experience but the rest of time my car is polished and kept in the garage (to protect residuals). Doesn't the OP know that every time they question the amazingness of the perfect Porsche automobile, they're impacting our residuals?!? Every Porsche is an investment piece (just like a ROLEX when I finally get the call from my AD). Porsche engineered this car with a team of amazing engineers to be literally amazing in every way (just like ROLEX, the only watch brand)! You can't improve on perfection - amazing to think otherwise! How the OP could think they wouldn't start a fight by asking a simple question in the Porsche sub-forum is beyond me!

I've said it before but one of the best things you can do is maintain the car properly, the angle sensor must be calibrated if there is a change from when it was last set, it's amazing how crap they can feel when it's not quite right. But have to say I'm a fan of this mod but I'll say it was fine before. My old 958 Cayenne still steers better than it !

YMMV, but… I’ve owned a Caterham Roadsport, Elise SC (Mk 2.5), 987.2 Boxster S and a 997.2 Carrera S. All with hydraulic racks. The first two unassisted. I presently own a 981 Boxster GTS. The steering isn’t particularly chatty >compared to the above< but my goodness it’s accurate, linear and confidence-inspiring. It’s way better than my 2012-era BMW F30 (3 Series) daily - also EPS. The internet told me the steering was rubbish and the gearing too long. (It’s a manual.) I’m rather enjoying both, as it happens. The car is stunning to drive. And, I’d wager, 95% owners of any 98/91 model don’t have any complaints about steering feel. As I said, YMMV.

(Ahem. The perils of posting when half-awake. The Caterham and Elise steering racks are, of course, unassisted. The Boxster and 911 have hydraulic power steering.)

ATM said: rawenghey said: 981Boxess said: I wouldn't mind betting half the people that moan about steering feel on here wouldn't even know they had a flat tyre if it didn't come up on the dash. But once they have read it on a forum ............... When I was DD my 996 it had a slow on the front left. One day I attached the pump and it was showing single digits psi. It looked fine. I had been noticing some scrabbling around a bit when braking but had started thinking I needed new tyres. DD puts very little stress on these cars. In fact its probably a waste really. This is true. I track my 981 GTS and it is truly remarkable, even on a road-focused car, how high the limits are. It re-calibrated my mind that even on "going for it" speeds down an empty A/B road you're absolutely nowhere near what the car can do. Regarding the steering, I know what people mean. I can feel the car approaching the limits almost more through my arse, the weight transfer and the scrubbing feeling of the tyres more than directly through the steering. Whereas, and this was a long time ago, when I drove a 996 on track, I recall powering out of a tighter corner, feeling that traditional 911 bobbing, then feeling directly what was happening to the front tyres through the steering wheel. I drove a few cars that day, but the 996 left me smiling the most. Anyway, on the 981, ignoring all the feel thing, if I were being picky I'd like the steering to be bit lighter. The 981 can feel like you're wrestling a car far heavier than it actually is, as a result of the overly heavy steering. In some senses it can feel like quite a physical car to track. However, it's just a characteristic of the car for me, it's not something that reduces the experience.