Do cops know your wing up means 75mph+?

I read in a recent thread(can't find); wondering if the police were aware of our spoiler's being up, meant that we are or have been speeding. Is this a "red-flag"? My sister's husband is a helicopter pilot for the sheriff's department, his father is the man under the sheriff, and his uncle is a detective. None of these men were aware of the "sign". All three have a combined career of around 70 yrs experience. So the bottom line is; if a cop is behind you and your wing is up, there is not much cause for concern. Unless of course they are a member of Rennlist or own a Pcar themselves. This was a great Thanksgiving-Table discussion. All of us men were so enthralled in it, and the women could not have cared less. We all went out and checked out the Pcar afterwards, it was great "Male-bonding". They all said it really didn't matter to them, if they see you or radar you going fast you are speeding. They really didn't have time to worry about crap like that. I told them this was the rite attitude to have. Just turn their heads when we passed by them. Hope this is useful information. Have an great weekend!

The fact that you can raise it manually is enough for me to not worry about it.

Hell, most cops don't even know the engine is in the back! I wouldn't sweat it. Chris.

The manual override is an important "fact." I have often thought of this myself (having a cop see the wing up and deduct that I am speeding), and thought I would simply demonstrate that I prefer to manually operate the wing. Do I really do that...of course not...but what the cops don't know, won't hurt me

Around here, at least, it would be a bit paranoid to worry about it. On a clear, dry day, cops won't even look twice if you're doing 120kph in a 100 zone to begin with (120 being the speed the spoiler rises at). If they want citations bad enough, they'll just set up a radar trap. There's about zero chance a cop is going to risk having to spend an evening in traffic court defending his suspicion that the car he ticketed had recently done 120 kph and not less than 60 kph and on that basis had ticketed the driver. Not when traffic courts are already offering reductions to 15 kph over the limit and no points for people who show up to fight tickets, just so they'll go home. I obviously only know my own juristiction, but here, I wouldn't sweat it.

I know that I was not aware of this until I bought my first Porsche just before I retired after 25 years of being a Cop. I am a car guy and before I bought the Porsche I was into BMW's. I would call a driver's bluff driving a "M" that he could not be speeding as it was "only" a 6 cylinder......... I do not know of any of my fellow officers that know what speed the spoiler goes up or even if it is speed dependent in normal operation.

The fact the spoiler is up means nothing....a raised spoiler is not grounds for a ticket....only a successful clock by actually following you from behind, by aircraft, or by radar. A raised spoiler is insufficient grounds for any conviction as it is nothing more than supposition unsupported by any "evidence". You wouldn't even need an attorney to fight that one.

All a raised spoiler means is "I was doing at least 71mph, but I'm not now and you didn't catch me".

Either the Patrolman will realize you were/are speeding or you're a poseur with your wing manually deployed.

OMG, you can get a ticket for being a poseur?!

Okay, so here's my legal opinion on this topic. A traffic citation in the US is a misdemeanor (defined as punishable by a fine of less than $1000, less than 1 year in jail or both) (unless you are traveling at a ridiculously outrageous speed, in which case the crime could be upgraded from a misdeameanor speeding to a felony such as reckless endangerment of others). A basic tenet of criminal law is that the arresting officer is required to actually, personally observe the commission of a MISDEMEANOR, while a felony arrest need not be pursuant to observed conduct, just be based on sufficient probable cause of such felonious conduct. Accordingly, if traveling at 75 mph was a felony (such as exiting a 25 mph school zone with children present with your wing up), then an officer could arrest you for the wing being up, but since traveling 75 mph is almost always going to be a misdemeanor, the police are SOL unless they observe you speeding through the use of radar or by pacing you. Nevertheless, even if you were arrested for having the wing up (either for misdemeanor or felony), there is so much room to create "reasonable doubt" that there is very little chance of a conviction resulting from such a flimsy, BS arrest. Reasonable doubt #1 and probably the only argument you would need to get the prosecutor to nol pros the case, "the wing was placed in the up position manually." Granted, I only practice business, real estate and advanced asset protection/tax law, but this was an interesting thread for which I just had to throw in my $.02.

LOL, I think you guys are taking this a little too serious. Just wanted to see what everyone thought about the idea. The same concept could apply to the mufflers being "cherry-red" that you were speeding too. You cant get a ticket for that either. Great discussion though... Have a great weekend to everyone.

This problem first surfaced in 1988 with the 964 Carrera 4 which was the first Porsche fitted with the automatic rear spoiler. People were being booked for speeding because the rear spoiler was up and the Cops said they must have been going over 80kph (50mph) to get the spoiler up. Porsche solved the problem by installing the centre console manual override switch for both up and down in model year 1990 (calendar year 1989). Every case in 1988 was thrown out of court. For the past 17 years I have not heard of anyone being done for speeding just because the rear spoiler is up. They have to catch and record you speeding. Of course if you are really worried and you are not speeding (cause the spoiler will not go down) just hit the switch and retract the spoiler. Ciao, Adrian.

Since it goes up at 75mph, but stays up until you slow down to 35mph (or thereabouts, it's not like I watch to see it go down), it can still be up as you roll past Mr State Trooper, all perfectly legal, at 55mph or even 45mph. Don't sweat it.

No 996 but with the 986, I'll tell ya this much. Driving a Porsche is a finable expense as far as the Passaic county sheriffs dept is concerned....even if you're 3mph under the limit. 4 bikes and 6 cruisers in the course of 1/4 mile taking turns picking people at random. This was the day before turkey day. It's well known that the sheriff's dept is trying to justify their existence by increasing revenue. The officer came up behind me and I moved over since I figured he was going after someone in front of me. He pulled me over informed me that I was caught at 77mph (radar never went off). I asked if my rear spoiler was up when he pulled behind me. After I showed him by operating it manually, he said that it wasn't. I explained that at 77 it would have been extended and that it wouldn't have retracted until <55. After expressing anger toward the detector on the dash, he said that the "Best he could do for me" was a ticket for careless driving(2pts). I anxiously await my day in court.

See... this thread does have some "sand" to it. Hope that you grind those moron's into the ground. Good luck. Let us know how it goes.

Nasty, nasty, nasty. Guilty of driving a Porsche. Being pulled over does not bother me, but only if it's legitimate. He was being lazy and wanted another mark for his quota. Okay, here are a few thoughts for you. His car will have a video of the traffic stop (it would be highly unusual for it not to have video). The video will have captured your carefless driving - get a copy of the video and have him point out the example of careless driving - use it in court. Another thing - the video should have his speed captioned onto it. By looking at your car relative to him and his speed you will be able to infer your speed - that can go for or against you, use that one wisely, but be cautioned that you should be ready for that to come up. Much as he doesn't like it (funny that, he's not the first cop I've heard of expressing that opinion), radar detectors are not illegal. Use the fact that you have one and that it didn't go off to your favor if you need to. In order to show you were speeding (if it comes up as a contributing factor) he needs ro have measured it some way.... it certainly wasn't by radar, point that out. Good luck! When is your court date? Let us know how it goes. This is weak and he probably will not show up, but go in fighting.

This strech of rt19 is well know as an area that has been "given" to the sheriffs dept by the local and state cops. 99% of the citations they write up are in a space of 4miles on rt 80 and 2miles on rt 19 that intersects rt 80 perpendicularly. Most locals from the area are well aware of this and make sure to keep somewhat below the limit when travelling through. Well, he was on a bike on the side of the road. Nothing covert about it. There were cruisers and bikes everywhere with cars pulled over. At first we assumed there had been an accident and slowed down even more to be cautious. He was sitting on the bike on the shoulder and pulled out after we had passed. Never thought for a minute that he would have been coming after me. I've had discussions with state troopers and town cops about the sheriff's dept and there is a common consensus among them that the sheriffs dept does not need to have a force patrolling the roads, yet no one will address the issue as long as they continue to generate enough revenue to not only pay for their existence, but to also throw a bone to the surrounding towns. I'd say a good number of the citations wouldn't hold up in court, but then again, most of the time the officer will imply that you'll be wasting you're time when they inform you of your right to fight it. Hence, most just pay it and move on.

That's a bunch of crap. I'd go and fight this one, but if no video; it's your word against his. We have a stretch of road like this one, 640 Bypass & Pellissippi Parkway. They will hide in the bushes or on the overpass with a motorcycle and have "chasers" around the corner. A bad point that my police-officer in-laws had was, WE stick out anyway. They said they have all pulled over cars just to talk car's to them. Meanwhile, we are crapin' our pants; and they are just passing time. If you at least show up to court, you might get away with only court-cost. Good luck!

This is slightly off topic...........but can anyone tell me how to manually raise the wing in a 996? Gary

Gary, there is a toggle switch down by your left foot in an opening on the fuse panel cover that raises and retracts the rear spoiler. ps. here is a great hack: http://www.renntech.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=7071

Dell: Thanks!! Gary

Very welcome ps. I PM'd you a link for a sweet spoiler hack!

Dave, this sounds like a BS pull-over from everything you've said. Do you know what speed you were doing and what was the posted limit? Fight it. If you're lucky he'll not show, but get a good lawyer and fight it hard.

The limit is 65 in the area and I was under 60 while going through the area. Had I been going any faster, He would have been able to catch me and pull me over until I had entered rt 80. I could really care less about the 2pts or the $$ for the fine. It would be considerably easier to pay it and forget it but I feel obliged to fight it on principle alone. I consider court costs to be my fee for stating my case. At the very least, it should be interesting once I inquire as to how many citations were issued 1hr+ & - of the time I received mine and how many were written during the rest of the day. One other thing is that alot of cops seem rather humbled when called into court. They are totally different from when they pull you over. People are people and when placed in an environment where a higher authority presides, bull**** becomes easy to spot regardless of which side attempts to spew it. I've a similar situation where I was pulled over and cited for 90mph in a 55. I had entered the free and begun accelerating when I was immediately pulled over. The spot where my car came to rest was less that 1/4 of a mile from where I enter the freeway. In court, the cop testified that he had seen me enter the freeway and paced me at 90 mph. He also confirmed that a picture I had taken was the area he had pulled me over. When presented with the laws of physics and how an early 944na differs from a top fuel dragster, the judge dismissed the case and was obviously perturbed with the officer(23 yr old rookie). Justice, although expected, cannot be guaranteed when you're pulled over...but it can be sought in court(yet also not guaranteed). I find that the state troopers are the most reasonable. They give you a bit more leeway and truly avoiding pulling someone over unless they are really doing something careless/dangerous/stupid. Local town cops are hit or miss. It really seems as though their attitude is highly dependent on what they've been told when they come on duty. It seems that the sheriffs have been told, "write as many as you can. When uncertain, ticket and deal with it in court later." When you consider that police are there to serve and protect, the funny thing is that aside from supervising road work on county roads, and writing citations, they serve no other purpose...but the new black and white dodge chargers do look cool.

Yeah, I'd fight this one on principle too. As i said, a fair ticket, then you pay it, but this seems to be a little unfair. it will be interesting to get (in advance of the court date) what he thought was "careless driving". Get the info, then request a copy of the video from his car.

Last time I had a ticket the cop was right behind me as a roared off the line, hitting well past the local speed limit of 40mph. Suffice it to say I didn't realize the SUV with the headlights in my mirror was the K-9 unit when I did this. The cop claimed it was foggy and wet. He said I went 75mph (it was more like 60, I did not tromp the pedal hehe). He said he paced me, in his K-9 carrying Ford SUV. How you pace me off the line in an SUV, while claiming that I did 75mph in a quarter mile is beyond me. More than that, he didn't write me up for prima facie speed. He wrote me up for basic speed law -- unsafe for conditions. This pissed me off. I may have been 20 over the limit, but the traffic survey says the 85% speed there is 57mph. Besides it was late and night there was no traffic. So I fought the ticket. I had a nice notarized National Weather Service document that cost me $65 to get, showing no fog and no rain in the hour by hour report. But I didn't get to use it, because the cop didn't show . . . Morale: even when you blast off the line right in front of the cop -- fight the ticket. His whole premise was that you didn't feel like investing in a good traffic ticket book and are intimidated by the legal system.

Or just get a fixed wing and forget about it.