Engine is dead

So, last week I was driving my '99 C2 with 31,000 miles through a school zone going about 12-13 MPH when I heard a loud bang and the engine immediately lost all compression. I pulled off the side and had it towed in. The local dealership (and an independent shop) have told me I blew a hole in the engine and it's not repairable. I need a new engine that should set me back about $14.5k. Luckily I had an aftermarket warranty through a place called "Exotic Car Warranty". Crooks. The FL Dept of Insurance shut them down in April. No warranty. So, besides just venting I'm trying to figure out what to do with the car now. I know that I'm done with it regardless (I think I'm going back to BMWs). Is there any remedy from Porsche USA that I could get? I mean this is a 911 with 31,000 miles. And the engine blows while going through a school zone? Come on. Should I throw $15k at the car and then hope to be able to immediately sell it for $25-$30k or should I just try to trade it in to a dealer and get whatever I can? This sucks. Any suggestions would be good.

i think if you look around you can do better than 14.5....i am so sorry to hear about your problem..good luck,joey

Sorry to hear about what happened to you. If you don't mind me asking, what is your driving style like? Specically: 1) At what RPMs do you shift at? 2) Do you drive the car easy, moderate or hard? 3) How many miles do you put on the car during the week? 4) Was this a daily driver? Thanks.

Ouch! A 1999 car... must have been one with the defective engine cases. I agree with JoeyC, you should be able to do better than 14.5K for a replacement engine, that sounds high.

Never ceases to amaze me that somebody has a rare occurence like this and then without question 2 things ALWAYS comeup. (1) The owner states they are DONE with Porsche and (2) Want to know if a 8 year old car will get any coverage from PCNA. FYI...You can get a new engine for LESS than $10K and has been discussed at length on this board. Further, your car will be fantastic once that new engine is put in--and it's not just the engine, it is EVERTHING else that attaches to it. Why in the world would you get rid of it after that? So, your logic is, fix it out of pocket and then let somebody else reap the benefit of a sweet new ride? You do realize that your new motor will be under a 2 year warranty right? One more thing. You have NO IDEA what the previous owner(s) did when they were in posession of the car since you have only had it for just over a year (didn't you buy it last August?). IMHO, this is a worthless fight unless you are the original owner which we (and PCNA know) you are not. Find the best deal you can and move on.

what did the mechanic say caused the hole ? RMS issues ? cylinder sleeve slipping ? these are issues i've heard about.

where are you? $14.5k is too high, unless it's CA$. my advise to you is get the engine replaced in a p-car dealer, so you can have 2 year warranty on the engine. last time i called my local dealer, the price is $8000 for the engine, 12 hours labor for put it in. you may also try to get a old engine from ebay/junk yard, but unless it's VERY low-prices(<$3000), i wouldn't mess with it.

it must be the cylinder sleeve, same as bob's 99 996

Well Dell I wish I could say I agree with you here, but it is not just older cars having these issues. My car with 5k miles on it that is a daily driver blew its engine too. I got a new one under warranty, but it seems that this happens fairly frequently that engines are being replaced due to some failure. I am fortunate I still have 5 years of warranty left on my car so if the new one blows too I will get another one. However I can say for sure I will not keep this thing past the warranty period. There are simply too many examples of trouble. I would think a car maker that is the most profitable and is asking for 80-150k for their cars could make a reliable engine in addition I would think they could also make the interior build of better quality. Mine is yet again in the shop for the 10th time because of excessive interior rattles. Damn thing sounds like someone has clipped a baseball card to a bicycle spoke it rattles so much. All this in a car I bought new 1 year ago.

The problem is you think it is frequent when I would be willing to bet that engine replacement is less that 1% of all 996's sold. You see here, we have this great forum but when people come here to vent it is taken WAY out of proportion since the threads generate so much interest. I have a 996 that has had ZERO problems (daily driver and track *****!) and a Cayenne that has had ZERO problems. I don't consider myself lucky to not have problems. I call it the status quo on these cars.

RMS DOES NOT LEAD TO ENGINE FAILURE, ENAGINES ARE REPLACED FOR CRONIC OIL LEAS FROM THE RMS BUT RMS CANNOT CAUSE THE MOTOR TO FAIL

Boswell, Listen, I'm sorry to hear your dilema. I don't know where you are but in Los Angeles I know a Specialist Porsche salvage. You can get a low mileage engine for about 7K +labor. If you interest PM me or call me @[phone removed]. Hope I can help!

7K+ labor for a salvage engine? Are you F'in nuts? You can have a motor installed at the dealer for under 10K and that includes a 2 yr warranty. Please do tell who this "specialist Porsche salvage" is. Are you talking about LAD?

Thanks for the replies. I have no idea why they are quoting so high but if I can get it done for under $10k then that makes it a little easier to swallow. Right now it's at North Scottsdale (AZ) Porsche. LVDell, where in my post did I say I was done with Porsche? I said I was done with this car. I haven't been completely happy with the car since I purchased it a year ago and I just want to walk away from THIS car. The only reason I asked about PCNA was because it was suggested by my local independent shop that they may do something. I thought I sounded like an extreme long shot, but wouldn't it have been stupid NOT to ask that question? Regarding some of the other questions, I have only put about 4,000 miles on it in the year that I've owned it. When I do drive it it's generally, and unfortunately, just around town so it's nothing extreme. I've only had the opportunity to take it out of town and really open up a few times. That being said, I'm obviously not the first owner so...

I live near a very reasonable Porsche dealer in the northwest. They said a new engine for a 996 was $8.5k installed two years ago. Today, the same engine is $14k installed. They said it was something to do with catching up with exchange rate. While this is no indication of the general problem, they said they've seen more 996 engine failures in four years that the entire past 20 years of air-cooled cars. I've seen a used 996 engine sell on Ebay for around $4k with no guarantee and it had oil weeping from it. Intallation is about $1k from an independent.

you said it in your first post! So saying you are done with and going to BMW doesn't mean you are done with Porsche??? Anyway, I wish you the best ofl uck getting this resolved. Personally I would put in a Porsche warranted motor and LOVE IT ALL OVER AGAIN!!!

BOSWELL, DEFINITLEY CALL PNA. I HAD AN INSTRUCTOR WHO'S ENGINE WENT EARLY AND PORSCHE HELPED HIM OUT. THEY DIDN'T GIVE HIM A NEW ENGINE BUT I THINK THEY PAID FOR ABOUT HALF. ( MY BELIEF IS THEY SOLD HIM THE ENGINE AT COST AND HE PAID THE DEALER LABOR ) NOW HIS WAS AN 02 I BELIEVE, THAT HAD JUST COME OFF FACTORY WARRANTY BUT HAD ABOUT 25K MILES. IT'S WORTH A SHOT.

blk on blk: Rattles! Mine too. Annoying as hell. Which dealer are you using? Momentum did not seem to attack the rattle I complained about at all (and created a new one).

Try calling sunset Porsche Audi, cost plus 15% starting out. I agree w/ dell should not pay `15K and this forum is a haven for the "half empty" crowd

i don't know where you live, but my dealer in NE told me last month, the motor itself is $8000. so the dealer in fact understands FX now, and use it as an execuse, amazing.

Bos, I am with you on this situation. Would not blame you one bit for leaving the 'p' world with a sour taste. Driving a car til the wheels fall off shoud not translate to 'hole in the motor at 31k miles and screwed on any warrantee'. Heck, I am a happy 'p' car owner but .. I am happy - due to the fact that I have driven my car for some 7-8k miles over the past 2.5 years and it has only needed the typical repairs (res. tank crack,airbag light/seatbelt fix) and did not die on me. When I should think - hey i drive one of the sweetest cars on earth and it handles like nothin' else you could drive and that is why I am happy. Not the case though. ps. I would not spend a dime on it, salvage it out. If you put 10-12k in it, it still may not bring you more than 20k wholesale/true trade in. I would think salvage could be as much as 10 or 15k. Take the 10-15k along with the 10k you did not spend and get what works for ya. I just had mine appraised by 3 different shops and it's an '00 (cab + tons of options) with 48k miles - best wholesale offer 25k. RB

That really sucks. However, look into the big bore motors and make it worthwhile. Good luck.

That is a valid point UNLESS you have no idea how all the previous owners drove the car. If you bought it new, broke it in properly, and took care of it the entire time with no TypeII over-revs, etc., then I could understand.

The way I interpreted it was, he's done with that Porsche regardless of who pays for the engine.

I agree. Also, only 25k on a '00 CAB!

LV, It is a gamble on any used car. Maybe even more so on the 'p' cars since they are made to be driven - and some drive them to the extreme. PPI is your only semi piece of mind. Doubt it woulda/coulda saved Bos in the beginning. Carfax is nearly useless, if not even a false piece of mind. I made the gamble and feel lucky so far. I have an extended, running to 100k or 07/2010 - and best I know they are still in business. I do feel though, in Bos's shoes, I would be extemely bitter towards all parties involved (prior owner/ seller, builder, and the fact they yanked down the warrant. company with no recourse). Interesting though, the aircooled world has a somewhat different set of worries, but the same potential outcome (love em or hate em). But the aircooled may have been a better investment back a couple years ago for me. Probably part of my swallowed pride - too. Hindsight is a *****-**cka. RB

no PPI can detect cylinder sleeve slipping, you can't see it unless you open the engine. neither the crank shaft problem.

My question to you, boswell, is: Were there any symptoms before the failure? Noises, stuttering, losing power, etc? Engine failures are getting more and more common on this board. Just stresses the importance of getting a warranty or CPO.

I presume engine prices have risen lately... In the Dec/2006 issue of "911 & Porsche World" it says on p.118 regarding Boxster engine failures in the UK market: "In July 2006 a new engine cost GBP 6167 + VAT.... engine prices have since risen to GBP 8000 + VAT, for reasons best known to Porsche".

I agree it's a gamble, but not so much about why. The cars to fear the most, regardless of make, are the ones that have barely been driven. You see it all the time especially with more 'exotic' iron, cars that people buy as toys or status symbols, can barely afford and are thus afraid to drive. This same conversation goes on on Land Rover boards, for example, where you get guys saying, "100,000 miles and no problems," and other guys saying, "It's only got 30,000 on it and it already needs an RMS! WTF!". Honestly, I'm NOT saying that some folks got screwed or unlucky with their cars and I'm NOT letting Porsche off the hook. But, without prejudice to this particular case, I'd take a well maintained car with some miles on it that had been driven hard over a garage queen any day.

I agree. Both of my cars have performed flawlessly.

Chevy V8 conversion?

The MSRP price range is $8k-14k for a rebuilt engine from Porsche, depending on the model year and options. If you chart the EURO and USA exchange rate and do the same for Porsche's part pricing I don't think you will see any correlation. At least for rebuilt engines the pricing strategy is following the same used on the 964 and 993. Those engines were also available for $6-8k about 8 years into production and then the price shot up to $15k.

hahaha 15k for a an air cooled, try again 40k+ for a new one. 996 motors are about 8k for a reman engine same 2 yr warrenty as a new one + labor labor is about 15-20 hours on anerage at the shops hourly rate

The MSRP for a rebuilt engine on the PCNA November 2006 price list is $21204.91USD, dealer cost is closer to $10K and anyone can buy one for ~$15K. A brand-new engine is a different story, the MSRP is $45354.32USD but half of that is dealer markup.

I am truly sorry that you had to go through this, and i for one would not blame you for looking elsewhere after this experience. I have a Benz that seems to blow a different sensor every 6-12 months and I can deal with that, but losing an engine @31,000....thats just crazy. The fact that this has happened more than a few times on here has stopped me from buying a 996 used, and it is definitely a cause for their drop in value out of warranty. Good luck to you whatever you choose to do.

i am assuming he needs a 3.4 NA engine. not GT3, not TT. hence the $8000 quoto. so the porsche rebuild engine price will going up as time goes by? if history is any indication? can u put a forward contract with my dealer for my 01 996?

They may have accidentally quoted him for a MY99 C4 engine (M96.02) which has an MSRP of $12399.91USD but you're right it should only be $8K maximum (and that is paying full retail). You and me both! When I first started paying attention to Porsche parts pricing in 2003 the air-cooled 964/993 engines were available for $7800, all of 3 years ago.

how long can u "keep" an un-used engine?