981 vs 987 Boxster - Page 3 - Boxster/Cayman - PistonHeads UK

Hi all, Selling my Mustang this week that I've had for the past two years and now considering getting my first Porsche and likely going with a Boxster over a Cayman as I always regretted not getting the soft-top Mustang, despite the crap weather recently! Are there huge differences between the 981 vs the 987? Obviously 987 is a little older so can get it cheaper, plus there seem to be far more of them around. There is a 981 S for a decent price near Liverpool for it's a long train journey up there for me from SE London I go down that route (and if it's even still avaliable come later this week when I get the cash from Motorway). Anything I should look out for in particular specific to these cars? Advice appreciated - thank you!

Should prob say - this is just a weekend car not a daily. So really it's for having fun with.

goes without saying....you need to drive them both to feel the difference as I doubt very much us keyboard warriors will add much over what the stats, spec and other write ups say... 981 is the more grown up car, size and tech....987 the raw-er, more nimble machine looks = subjective as always. Porsche make very well judged incremental improvements as the years pass...but what this also appears to mean is that each generation get more mature and less silly, larger, heavier, more tech, 'better' engineering etc... ....or less feel, less raw, less engagement.... So it depends on what kind of driver you are, what kind of driving you'll do and how much you value each of the measurables...and then put your marker in the sand...budget notwithstanding...

As im sure you are aware the 981 lost the Hydraullic power steering so loses some steering feel, but does have a much more modern interior. Pre-2009 987's are the engines at risk of bore score and IMS woes. That said, failure rates for both are rare, and IMS issues can be prevented if needs be. Personally I went with a 987.2 S as it has the later DFI engine (no bore score or IMS worry) but retains the 'raw' feeling. I'd like a slightly more up-to-date interior, but beggars cant be choosers

Crudeoink said: As im sure you are aware the 981 lost the Hydraullic power steering so loses some steering feel, but does have a much more modern interior. Pre-2009 987's are the engines at risk of bore score and IMS woes. That said, failure rates for both are rare, and IMS issues can be prevented if needs be. Personally I went with a 987.2 S as it has the later DFI engine (no bore score or IMS worry) but retains the 'raw' feeling. I'd like a slightly more up-to-date interior, but beggars cant be choosers I did the same. I've had 2 x 987.2 S Boxsters and 1 x Cayman. The former were a bit more 'fun' in terms of being open to the elements, the Cayman was a touch more 'serious'. A nice 987.2 can be had with PASM, Sports Chrono, PSE etc so that the older style interior becomes less of an issue (especially for a weekend car where creature comforts are less important) but I must admit that if money were no object then i'd trade the 987's hydraulic steering feel for the modernity of the 981's design. But money was an issue for me, and I didn't think a 13/14-plate 981 was £10k more car when I was shopping for my last 987.2 even if they were a few years newer and lower miles. Either way, you might be pleasantly surprised with the pace of the DFI engine despite being quite a lot of BHP down on a Mustang.

Crudeoink said: As im sure you are aware the 981 lost the Hydraullic power steering so loses some steering feel, but does have a much more modern interior. Pre-2009 987's are the engines at risk of bore score and IMS woes. That said, failure rates for both are rare, and IMS issues can be prevented if needs be. Personally I went with a 987.2 S as it has the later DFI engine (no bore score or IMS worry) but retains the 'raw' feeling. I'd like a slightly more up-to-date interior, but beggars cant be choosers True but slightly over reaching: 2.7 and 3.2 987s not a bore score risk. Post 2006 987s not a IMS risk 987.2 2.9 not a DFI engine, although acknowledge you specifically said S meaning 3.4, this is a point of clarity.

Sorry to sound stupud but what's a 987.2 vs the normal 978 (for when I'm searching on AT etc)?

Jlil3wdl said: Sorry to sound stupud but what's a 987.2 vs the normal 978 (for when I'm searching on AT etc)? 987.2 is the facelift one, I think from 2009 onwards. These are a lot more expensive as they don't have explodey engines.

We had a 987 Boxster for 8 years and in that time the only problems we had were coil packs which decided to fail in the south of France and a rear coil spring that had snapped during a Sunday morning drive in the Cotswolds a couple of years later. Both covered under warranty (extended) and fixed without drama. We've had our 981 Cayman for nearly 8 years and in that time we've had a heater fan failure (common problem), a replacement drivers side speaker as it started to crackle if the volume was turned up and a fault with the drivers side window not winding up to the top. Again, all fixed under warranty (again extended) without drama. As far as which one to go for, the only person that can decide that is you so as others have said you need to go and drive a few to find out. Personally I'd have the 981 as I think the interior is more modern, it looks better and it feels much better to drive (although the steering is probably not quite as good as the 987). Oh, and if you can find one with PSE the noise out the back probably beats all the others hands down. Edited by Voodoo Blue on Monday 27th March 15:20

Yes 987.2 was made between 2009 and 2012. Different engines, a host of other tweaks underneath as well, better styling (imho - others will disagree !) and a better quality interior compared with the 987.1. Had ours for two years (3.4S) and absolutely love it, retains the more tactile nature of the 987.1 combined with the mechanical improvements of the 981 (though happily not the non hydraulic steering !) . Have seen them described as a 981 in a 987 body, which is not strictly entirely accurate as there are certainly differences, but a decent summary in lots of ways

Oh and if you want a two pedal variant , the PDK gearbox that first made its appearance in Boxsters in the 987.2 is much better than the old Tiptronic system of previous versions. 981 PDK better again thanks to further development.

deebs said: True but slightly over reaching: 2.7 and 3.2 987s not a bore score risk. Post 2006 987s not a IMS risk 987.2 2.9 not a DFI engine, although acknowledge you specifically said S meaning 3.4, this is a point of clarity. Fair points, assumed he would be after an S if coming from a Mustang! Only 'issue' i found with shopping for a 987.2 S over a 981 S is there aren't many 987.2's for sale, so finding one with the desired spec / options list may be a bit more difficult!

Crudeoink said: Fair points, assumed he would be after an S if coming from a Mustang! Only 'issue' i found with shopping for a 987.2 S over a 981 S is there aren't many 987.2's for sale, so finding one with the desired spec / options list may be a bit more difficult! Hahah, yes - certainly want an S model! Also agreed that there are not many around - and certainly not near me, so going to have to have a further think about what to do but this thread has been super helpful, thanks all!

Long time lurker. Minimal poster, but. I've a 2014 981 Cayman GTS (PDK) and a 2005 987.1 Boxster 3.2 S (manual). I've had 2 of the latter. Both are well specified but standard. GTS is on 40k, Boxster on 100k. Two very different cars imo. Obvs each are mid engined so both great to drive. The GTS feels like I'm in a proper modern sports car though. Apart from no apple car play on the pcm youd be forgiven for thinking it was a brand new car. I've retro fitted an android head unit in the boxster. It had pcm with nav but it was a bit naff. The 987 still looks quite modern from the inside (I much prefer it over a 9X6), but then you sit in the 981. The latter is bigger too, leg room wise. Performance wise, GTS has it. Naturally. But that's porsche evolution. However, the 987 isn't a slouch. Exhaust note. Both flat 6 but the GTS has it hands down. I love driving both. Boxster for the local A & B roads to the country pub on a sunny Sunday afternoon. I've done the odd north wales mountain blast in it too. The 981 is a proper GT car though. I'd take this on track over the boxster too. Not that the boxster isn't good for it mind. I'm doing a European Road trip to the alps and riviera this summer. Still undecided on which to take. Probably the GTS. The boxster can go next year. Both cost as much to maintain / repair. £35k difference in value though. You won't be disappointed with either choice. Edited by SapperD on Tuesday 28th March 21:06

SapperD said: Long time lurker. Minimal poster, but. I've a 2014 981 Cayman GTS (PDK) and a 2005 987.1 Boxster 3.2 S (manual). I've had 2 of the latter. Both are well specified but standard. GTS is on 40k, Boxster on 100k. Two very different cars imo. Obvs each are mid engined so both great to drive. The GTS feels like I'm in a proper modern sports car though. Apart from no apple car play on the pcm youd be forgiven for thinking it was a brand new car. I've retro fitted an android head unit in the boxster. It had pcm with nav but it was a bit naff. The 987 still looks quite modern from the inside (I much prefer it over a 9X6), but then you sit in the 981. The latter is bigger too, leg room wise. Performance wise, GTS has it. Naturally. But that's porsche evolution. However, the 987 isn't a slouch. Exhaust note. Both flat 6 but the GTS has it hands down. I love driving both. Boxster for the local A & B roads to the country pub on a sunny Sunday afternoon. I've done the odd north wales mountain blast in it too. The 981 is a proper GT car though. I'd take this on track over the boxster too. Not that the boxster isn't good for it mind. I'm doing a European Road trip to the alps and riviera this summer. Still undecided on which to take. Probably the GTS. The boxster can go next year. Both cost as much to maintain / repair. £35k difference in value though. You won't be disappointed with either choice. Edited by SapperD on Tuesday 28th March 21:06 Long time lurker same as you - great post though. Have a 987 S and wondered how much better (or different) a 981 is.

981 epas is truly horrendous if you’ve ever driven hydraulic in a 987. Thankfully they Improved it in the later 718 epas versions.

Good summaries above, agree with almost everything previously said. Had 987.2 Boxster S, 987.2 Cayman R, 981 Boxster GTS and a 987 Spyder. If you're after a superb modern convertible GT type sports car the 981 is about as good as you'll get. X73 lowered suspension is a great option if you can find one with it. Plus in my opinion it needs PSE (sports exhaust), cracking sound! Yes, in isolation, the electronic steering (EPS) isn't as feelsome as the 987's hydraulic system, but overall for me it didn't spoil the car (981 GTS) as a whole for what it is. Porsche make superb drivers cars, full stop. The 987 is a bit sharper, but you may want to balance a way older style cabin and more possible age related problems against that. Overall for me, as a pure weekend toy / drivers car, the 987 shades it. Hence I still have the 987 Spyder... If you can run to one of those, even a higher mileage one, you'll have one hell of a weekend toy One of the most fun cars I've owned, incl a couple of Fezza's and a GT3...if that's not high praise...I don't know what is!

Lightningt said: 981 epas is truly horrendous if you’ve ever driven hydraulic in a 987. Thankfully they Improved it in the later 718 epas versions. this, the 987 every time, had an S and the dealer gave me a 981 for the weekend, hated the steering so much that i'd never ever consider one. looked nice though

Just been out in the sunshine for a drive in my 987.2. Basic 2.9, manual, teeny 17” wheels. It’s brilliant. Not the fastest thing isn’t the world; not really fast enough to get you in trouble. But you can wring it out with gusto. It’s my first Porsche and I’ve had it 4 years. It’s a keeper. The only accessory I crave for it… is a 981 Cayman S for euro road trips to replace the SL So to answer the question “987 or 981”, for me the answer is.. yes.

981 steering is not as horrendous as many make out. I've owned a 964, 996 C2 and turbo, and 981 CS. Have also tested a Cayman R before settling on the 981. Whilst the 981 won't ultimately match a 987 on steering, the 987 is also nowhere near a 964. Does that make a 987 a bad car? No, just like 981's aren't bad, just different. Having also driven numerous 718's the difference between them and 981's is that the newer car has more direct steering rather more feel. Of all the cars I've had (for 6 years) it's the 981 I miss most overall. Try both and decide for yourself.

Lightningt said: 981 epas is truly horrendous if you’ve ever driven hydraulic in a 987. Utter rubbish.

I'd go for the 981 as I find it has more space if you are taller.

I currently own a 981, my second. Both are great cars. I've also previously owned numerous 987 variants including 2 987.2 spyders. All are great cars just different in different ways. The steering isn't that bad at all, yes not quite as sharp as the spyder but the 981 is a much more comfortable car in size and ride. PSE on 981 is better than 987 imo too

I've not driven a 987, but the hydraulic steering in the Emira I test drove was fantastic, is night and day different to electric. I didn't believe it until I'd actually experienced it. Would imagine most would find coming from that to the early edition EPAS in a 981 pretty noticeable.

Having just spunked a fortune on a 981 Spyder...I will actively avoid driving a 987 or Emira thanks all for the heads up. Thankfully I moved on from an S2000, so the 981 feels amazing

mr pg said: 981 steering is not as horrendous as many make out. I've owned a 964, 996 C2 and turbo, and 981 CS. Have also tested a Cayman R before settling on the 981. Whilst the 981 won't ultimately match a 987 on steering, the 987 is also nowhere near a 964. Does that make a 987 a bad car? No, just like 981's aren't bad, just different. Having also driven numerous 718's the difference between them and 981's is that the newer car has more direct steering rather more feel. Of all the cars I've had (for 6 years) it's the 981 I miss most overall. Try both and decide for yourself. Surely people can make their own comments on the 981 steering, there have been enough criticisms about it in various threads. I had a 987.2 for a few months and liked it enough to trade it in with my C Class Coupe for a 981 PDK. Despite doing around 15k miles in the 981, mostly long journeys, I never really warmed to it, the steering seemed heavy and unresponsive and the car felt a lot bigger and bulkier than the 987 although better spec’d. Luckily prices were strong when I sold it and I hardly lost anything. I should have kept the 987.2 with hindsight.

Yes they can make their own comments. All I was doing was standing up for 981's which seem to be portrayed as having awful steering (which they don't) by some, whereas the 987 is the be all and end all (which it isn't). 981's may not have the best steering on a Porsche, but (imo) neither do 987's. My last comment was that the OP should drive both and decide for himself rather than listen to fans of either model. Now if you want a car with truly awful steering you should try the original Merc SLK (wife had a 320 for a few years)!

anonymous said: [redacted] I wouldn’t mind betting that half the Lewis Hamiltons (in their dreams) that bang on about the 981 steering wouldn’t even notice they had a flat tyre if the light didn’t come up on the dash. No car is perfect, drive one, make your own mind up.

anonymous said: [redacted] This. Given that time and time again people conflate steering feel with steering accuracy/response, they make it fairly obvious that they don’t have the foggiest clue about whatever internet chum they’re pedalling. If your 981 has unresponsive steering or lacks accuracy, then you need a good geo. Mine is very responsive and I can put it exactly where I want it - and I’m sure I’m utterly mediocre.

To add a couple of thoughts. I never owned a boxster but I tried a few years back but i did something else in the end. The 987.2 was thin on the ground due to low sales after the financial crisis so I waited quite a while to see the right cars but both had issues when I viewed including rust behind the front wheel, so keep an eye on that. The main point is it may take a while to find the right car. The gear ratios are quite tall, maxing second i don't know the speeds exactly but it's above the limit, I presume this happens on a lot of cars, but if I come to get one at some point I'd seriously consider a non S so I can drive it more without mad speeds if that makes any sense. Someone above mentioned that, I think its a really good point depending on how you want to drive it.

anonymous said: [redacted] Have any of the 981 steering apologists actually driven a car with a hydraulic system? If not why not go and actually try one rather than insulting people and then tell us if it's any different. If you honestly can't tell them apart and still favour the 981 steering then people can draw their own conclusions about your objectivity.

Lightningt said: Have any of the 981 steering apologists actually driven a car with a hydraulic system? If not why not go and actually try one rather than insulting people and then tell us if it's any different. If you honestly can't tell them apart and still favour the 981 steering then people can draw their own conclusions about your objectivity. This ^ . Hydraulic is miles superior in feel end of .Yes A N Other dare I say it woman driver can tell , never mind a car guy or 1/2 a car guy .The wheel is what you hold it the first tactile connection you have .Your hands / arms feed a significant portion of the senses into your brain . Dumbing it down as , it’s not important by the leccy brigade is nonsense . It’s a backwards step a big step @ that . I run a bit of everything. A sprite @ 600 kgs with none power just a simple cam gears rack on 155/70/13s = it’s as direct the most direct with a huge steering wheel . A Ferrari ( Bertone) GT4 with the same Birmingham based cam gears rack ( Yes Enzo imported racks from the U.K. in the 70 s ) .Mid engined 1100kg …wonderful light direct steering feel with a tiny momo wheel .Niki Lauder developed its handling and feel = bless him . 987.2 = deliberately sought out for the analogue feel .Hydraulic PAS , again mid engined = as good a steering feel in every day use ( parking etc ) as you would hope to get with a PAS set up . Using the other two as benchmarks . A Macan with PS plus .Electric .The plus weights it up ( only a software thingy ) under 25 mph .Sure it’s 80/20 rear front and sure you can on bends / slippy surfaces get the rear to squirm .But it’s not a sports car never was , not because of its 2000 kg the whole thing is a nibble at every thing inc the electric PAS . I would HATE a car pro porting to be a sports car with E PAS . Previous experience, F 360 hydraulic, Testarossa, non PAS a cam gears rack , Ren sports spyder un PAS E PAS kills the feel end of !

Fiammetta said: A Macan with PS plus .Electric .The plus weights it up ( only a software thingy ) under 25 mph .Sure it’s 80/20 rear front and sure you can on bends / slippy surfaces get the rear to squirm .But it’s not a sports car never was , not because of its 2000 kg the whole thing is a nibble at every thing inc the electric PAS . There is something strangely satisfying about hustling a 2 tonne SUV at pace along some decent B roads though (mine doesn't have PS plus but I still love driving it).

In the end don't think it makes sense to ask broad 'this car versus that car' questions. You just get owners of each explaining why theirs is best. Little of value comes out even if some fair points are made. Query more specific attributes or features and you might tease out some worthwhile info. But in the end you have to drive them to know. They're quite different cars, even though the 987.2 and 981 essentially share powertrains. Different enough that there are good reasons to fairly dramatically prefer one over the other in both directions. A quick go in each would be enough for most people to have a pretty clear preference, I reckon, and render all third party discussion entirely moot.

Lightningt said: Have any of the 981 steering apologists actually driven a car with a hydraulic system? If not why not go and actually try one rather than insulting people and then tell us if it's any different. If you honestly can't tell them apart and still favour the 981 steering then people can draw their own conclusions about your objectivity. Speaking only for myself here, what makes you think any 981 owner needs to justify their choice of car purchase to some random nobody on the net? If you don’t like EPAS and prefer hydraulic, great, buy a car that is hydraulic and enjoy. If all you want is steering feel/feedback from a car buy a Caterham, it is better than any Porsche I have ever driven. Would I run down your choice of car because I think mine is better, why would I insult something that someone else chooses to spend their hard earned cash on? A car like anything else comes as a complete package, you either take it as a whole or you buy something else if that suits you better, no car is perfect. In a weeks time I will be driving around mountain roads in Switzerland/Italy with the roof down, do you seriously think I will be worried about if my car has EPAS or hydraulic PS? Er, no, what I will be doing is enjoying what I choose to drive and own, a 981. As you are a relative newbie on here I will cut you some slack on the suggestion you might be one of the few that has driven a car with hydraulic steering, I suspect most people on here will find that a little amusing, this is PH, not mumsnet.

Yeah its a discussion that just goes round and round, like the steering wheel. Hydraulic better than epas, I can get on board with. in that singular regard 987 > 981 I can get on board with Better steering cars than a 987...I can get on board with that too. If you're chasing JUST steering feel, then yeah something like a Caterham perhaps. I would imagine there are very few car nuts who buy a car based solely on one pre-requisite, to the detriment of alllll others. There's almost limitless aspects of your personal transport to prioritise over each other, combined with almost limitless needs of the individual. Can you imagine if one car was the "best" and we all had one... what a dull world. All the "if you can't tell the difference then you're clearly not an enthusiast" and the "mine is 'better' than yours" stuff is so endlessly pointless and boring.

It is fun to note that some folks would chose a road car with hydraulic steering purely for feel, which is worse in literally every other regard talk about tail wagging the dog. Most of these wouldn’t know how to utilise the benefits of steering feel if their life depended on it. I know what I’d rather be driving round Switzerland in.

Royal Jelly said: It is fun to note that some folks would chose a road car with hydraulic steering purely for feel, which is worse in literally every other regard talk about tail wagging the dog. Doubt anyone has done that, not least because there are more reasons than just the steering to choose the 987. Personally, I went 987 for broader feedback and feel reasons. I do much prefer the 981 interior. Styling wise, I'm not sure, the 981 looks more upmarket, but to my eye the 987 is more "Porsche". I could go either way on the styling. But to drive, on balance, prefer the 987. Steering is part of that but not the only aspect. So, I wouldn't personally characterise the 987 as worse in every other regard. It's all subjective, but I prefer and the chassis feel and pedal feel of the 987 (shift on the 981 is better) and the increased overall feedback levels on the 987. It was a tough call, but not one dictated by budget for me personally.

anonymous said: [redacted] Sadly I am UK based but have family in both Switzerland and Italy so have been to both quite a few times, there are no bad places to drive in either. That said I cannot think of two countries with such opposing views on cars, the Swiss hate them, the Italians love them. I had a little misunderstanding with an unmarked Italian Police car, if that had happened in Switzerland I probably would still be banged up. Thinking about it that TVR had hydraulic PS, that extra feel didn't help me spot the Police car at all, maybe if I had had EPAS I would have

I've kept up with some pretty serious cars (R8, 981 GTS, 996 turbo etc.) in my 987.2 down A and B roads. There is only so fast you can go. The car is so confidence-inspiring and nimble you can send it harder than you think. Fast cars only pull on you if the roads get really straight. I've done 45,000 miles in mine in about 4 years and it never fails to put a smile on my face. It's never let me down, although has cost me a few quid in servicing. They also get airborne quite nicely. The only car I'd change it for is a newer one. Never driven a 981 or 718 but can highly recommend a 987.

Jlil3wdl said: Hi all, Selling my Mustang this week that I've had for the past two years and now considering getting my first Porsche and likely going with a Boxster over a Cayman as I always regretted not getting the soft-top Mustang, despite the crap weather recently! Are there huge differences between the 981 vs the 987? Obviously 987 is a little older so can get it cheaper, plus there seem to be far more of them around. There is a 981 S for a decent price near Liverpool for it's a long train journey up there for me from SE London I go down that route (and if it's even still avaliable come later this week when I get the cash from Motorway). Anything I should look out for in particular specific to these cars? Advice appreciated - thank you! Take a look at the buyers guides, buy on condition. Unless you are in a position to inspect mechanically, consider a pre-purchase inspection from a Porsche specialist. This may not be needed if buying from a reputable indy that supplies their own warranty. RE: major differences - no. More subtle updates. As discussed endlessly there's a change in steering from hydraulic to electronic. Porsche have done a great job on the latter but yes, there's a difference. Do a test drive in both & make your own mind up. Both fantastic cars.

As a long term 987.1 2.7 owner was keen to try a 981 with a view to buying so when Porsche lent me a 981 2.7 for a day was really interesting to compare.. First thing that stuck me upon climbing into the 981 was the better ergonomics and more spacious airy feel to the cabin,after a few miles was also obvious the 981 bodyshell is alot stiffer than the 987's with the way the car conducted itself over rough and cambered roads and a more solid feeling to the shell.Rode brilliantly on 20's with PASM compared to my 987 on 18" S wheels,much prefered the 981 ride quality.The 981 steering never bothered me tbh after the 987's hydraulic setup,was'nt as talkative as the 987 steering but was able to place the car perfectly and accurately and felt pretty decent to me,certainly did'nt think,wow this car has poor steering compared to a 987! Engine noise and vibration coming through into the cabin is more supressed in the 981 and felt generally like a more refined place to be than the 987 which has a more raw feeling to it.I did feel that my 987's 2.7 engine felt a bit more lively,perhaps the 981's 2.7 being virtually new just needed a few miles under its belt to loosen up.. Overall the 981 felt like a more grown up Boxster than my 987 and a very accomplished car,was'nt sure if I was going to gel with it or not,would of needed more time for that,ultimately I did'nt trade up and getting back into the 987 at the end of the day really highlighted the differences and advances made with the 981 for better or worse.I decided to stick with the 987 as it's more old school raw which is my bag in sports cars and I prefer the looks although again that's just a personal thing.

I have a well fettled 997 and a 981 GTS, both are pretty much the same dimensions, weight, hp and performance and both have the same Porsche dna running through them. The 997 is more analogue with its hydraulic steering and feels somehow more alive, but the 981’s chassis and exhaust note is sublime and it feels much quicker, although it’s not on paper. Both are a hoot to drive, but if I had to pick one to drive forever I’d go for a 981 over a 9*7.