9A1 engine into 996 Carrera (Jethro B) - Page 5 - 911/Carrera GT - PistonHeads UK

Just reading through the current issue of evo and my mouth dropped on reaching Jethro Bovingdon's fast fleet update. His long-broken red 996 has just had an engine swap, Litchfield have replaced his broken M96 with a 3.8 9A1 from a 2014 Carrera S. Refabricated engine mounts, adapter for 996 gearbox, 996 Cup electric PAS pump, exhaust, wiring... Apparently it's all up and running well. I actually thought this was a late April fool at first, but on reflection Jethro's TG USA earnings plus Litchfield's enthusiasm and the publicity opportunity all combine to make it possible. Sadly it sounds like the work involved mean it's unlikely to ever become a standard conversion. https://twitter.com/BenJacksonTP/status/1380843512...

Blimey! He’s been on quite the journey with this build, I’m not sure what to think of sticking a 991 3.8 in the back. It probably wouldn’t be mine or many others first choice but then look back at early Pork, not too unusual to see engine swaps?

CocoUK said: Blimey! He’s been on quite the journey with this build, I’m not sure what to think of sticking a 991 3.8 in the back. It probably wouldn’t be mine or many others first choice but then look back at early Pork, not too unusual to see engine swaps? that was my thought as well, quite a few 70s Porsches running 993 or 964 engines, so it is kind of in keeping with the history of hot rodding 911s

I can't see how a bells and whistles Hartech capacity increase build wouldn't have been cheaper, easier and netted similar results. Or surely a crashed GT3 engine could have been sourced and fitted for what's been spent on all the fabrication and shoe horning. While the 9A1 fixes a lot of the m96/7 issues it also loses what someone described "the gravel" of that engine.

Maybe he JWW’d 25 large into the privilege of Litchfield fitting it!

CocoUK said: Maybe he JWW’d 25 large into the privilege of Litchfield fitting it! Owa! Never realise it was him that was behind that scandal. Now my suspicions of him being a are confirmed.

didn't that car already had a rebuilt engine when he got it?! Seriously, 996 has just became literally the most expensive Porsche out there!

ooid said: didn't that car already had a rebuilt engine when he got it?! Seriously, 996 has just became literally the most expensive Porsche out there! Yes. But I believe it had done well over 200k miles before it's first rebuild. It belonged to poppopbangbang (on this forum) who replaced it with another 996 which I believe is over 300k now. You can still pick one up for about 12k wait for it to break or do a future proof rebuild on the engine for c£10k. 997.1 has similar engine issues and a 997.2 will stand you for at least £30k. But don't think that puts you clear of risk as there have been a few reported borescore rebuilds on early ones of those.

nunpuncher said: I can't see how a bells and whistles Hartech capacity increase build wouldn't have been cheaper, easier and netted similar results. Or surely a crashed GT3 engine could have been sourced and fitted for what's been spent on all the fabrication and shoe horning. While the 9A1 fixes a lot of the m96/7 issues it also loses what someone described "the gravel" of that engine. Engine mountings are different for the GT3 engine so that hits the similar snags as fitting the 9A1 engine. The 9A1 has only 5 shafts to spin (crank and cams x4) as opposed to the Metzger six that has 7. Slightly lower CoG as well. I’m getting the impression that Jethro is doing this because he can and afford it.

On the smoking tyre podcast he suggested they did it because in theory it didn't seem that difficult. He suggested Lichfield thought it might be a conversion they could offer customers. However, it's apparently been a total pain in the hole and I think all plans of doing it again are in the bin. He said the main issue has been trying to get all the electronics talking to each other.

Nothing like using customer money for product development, sounds like Litchfield had the perfect project there!

I greatly admire anyone who takes the plunge with a project like this. It's a bit of an unknown whether you'll ultimately be satisfied with the end result but you'll certainly have something quite unique, which in itself is cause for celebration. People often scoff at the monetary side of a project like this whilst ignoring the experiential value!

I think it is great to see such an unusual build, I don't really see a huge benefit though compared to a 3.7 hartech build? I imagine it will be slightly more powerful but the additional (assumed) cost will wipe that away in my eyes. Either way, i hope he does a video/ write up once it is finished.

I believe the timeline was along the lines of; A long time ago... - Engine borked and initially diagnosed as terminal by RPM - Options mulled over and landed on a new 3.4l X51 block from Porsche Classic - Engine strip down and fault identified as rebuild not required by Porsche Swindon - Everything put back together and used sporadically while work took him over seas with Motortrend and TG-USA - Then as per linked evo update, things took an interesting twist while over at Litchfields! I personally thought a new, super rare, 3.4 X51 Porsche Classic block was a mega solution, although it may have been an impossible dream with little/no available parts. I haven’t read the evo article but pleased JuanPablo has built his 911 hot rod, the overall spec sounds immense, must be a corking drive. It’s a shame Litchfield can’t make the engine swap economical, having thought about it, I’d be tempted... Edited by CocoUK on Wednesday 14th April 21:40

I'd hazard a guess at it being the ancillary parts availability that kiboshed the X51 plan, speaking as someone who tried to order a large number o them a few years ago. The actual block for a 3.4 litre X51 is almost identical to a stock unit, same crank, rods - but different pistons. It's the heads where things get interesting, with the ports reworked and the cams changed (hence the pistons requiring more clearance for the valves). Porsche did re-start production of the aluminium intake manifold for the X51 engine, but that alone isn't going to get you (or Jethro) the higher rev performance that he was after, and (I suspect, I've not read the Evo article) played a part in why he went for the Cayman engine. What he was after (I believe) was an engine that performed like the X51, which was designed by Porsche at a time when they were considering using said engine in the Cup cars - a decision that went in favour of the Mezger in the end of course.

I’m putting 2+2 together here, but for what it’s worth, I believe this may have been the 991 CS scrapper Litchfield pulled the engine from - based on vintage, description, damage and location. Gawd knows how I stumbled across it but thought I’d share for any fellow car-geeks that have followed the rebuild journey!

I spoke to Litchfield a little while ago about engine management for my project, they said that the engine for Jethro’s car came from a Cayman.

in the article they quite clearly show a damaged 991 do they not?

Hmmm Cool idea, but I can imagine the electronics would have been pretty tricky on the basis of my experience (the Cup engine was “relatively simple” in comparison) no FBW throttle, no Variocam, runs Alpha N etc. The trickiest bit was adapting the Motronic ECU to drive the resonance flaps in the correct sequence. Jethro’s car will be a cracking thing to drive, and that 9A1 will have plenty of torque care of its increased capacity, added to which there’s still a fair chunk of additional horsepower on the table (should he decide 400 isn’t enough) Of course, it won’t scream (or thrill) like 997 Cup engined Mk 1 punching out over 460 gee gees http://911uk.com/viewtopic.php?t=135064

shalmaneser said: in the article they quite clearly show a damaged 991 do they not? I've no horse in this race, just repeating what Mr Litchfield said to me.

nunpuncher said: CocoUK said: Maybe he JWW’d 25 large into the privilege of Litchfield fitting it! Owa! Never realise it was him that was behind that scandal. Now my suspicions of him being a are confirmed. In a strongly worded statement earlier today, it was confirmed unequivocally that certain parties relating to the management company of individuals referenced online in numerous tweets and YouTube videos may or may not have had initial exploratory discussions regarding the supply of products and services for promotional purposes. Right, so basically you are saying you did it?

Would this swap be easier in a 996.2 tt or just the same hassle? P.s. I've emailed litchfield to ask them

justk2017 said: Would this swap be easier in a 996.2 tt or just the same hassle? P.s. I've emailed litchfield to ask them Mk2 996 has fly by wire throttle already, so possibly easier from that perspective, but the Mk2 CAN system is more complex than the very basic Mk1 system, so that'll probably make the swap more difficult ...

justk2017 said: Would this swap be easier in a 996.2 tt or just the same hassle? P.s. I've emailed litchfield to ask them If your engine is borked then fair enough. Otherwise why oh why in the name of god would you swap a Mezger for a 9A1. I'm half expecting this car to be finished only for Jethro to discover it's now a completely different car with a very different character from the car he loved.

I bought a 996.2 turbo body without a trans and engine. I have a 996.2 turbo Instead of returning this one to stock...along with expensive 996tt engine and trans...I am thinking about doing something more funky: normally aspirated, AWD delete. I could look for a 996.2 gt3 engine and trans. Rare and expensive. Or I could do a hartech 3.6 to 3.8. A 991.1 gts (or s+x51)...has more torque, more hp and revs to 7500 ...not a bad alternative (though no, i know it won't be a gt3 which is a lot more than that engine). You're right it will be a different car...that is actually the goal.

I'd struggle to see past a crate LS3 for a project like that 996TT, to be honest... most (everyone here?) will likely disagree

https://collectingcars.com/for-sale/porsche-911-99... £25k. Bargain if you ask me.

LaurasOtherHalf said: https://collectingcars.com/for-sale/porsche-911-99... £25k. Bargain if you ask me. Hopeless road car engine though, highly strung/cammy, needs rebuilding every 5 minutes and would need some decent exhaust manifolds (and induction system) to make any power. I'd be waiting until a 996 Turbo engine appears on ebay somewhere, they do, and rest assured one will.

Slippydiff said: Hopeless road car engine though, highly strung/cammy, needs rebuilding every 5 minutes and would need some decent exhaust manifolds (and induction system) to make any power. I'd be waiting until a 996 Turbo engine appears on ebay somewhere, they do, and rest assured one will. To be honest they are a very good engine and will produce well over 450 bhp in unrestricted spec. Like the cup engine in the baked bean, If it doesnt live its whole life at max revs you would last a long time between rebuilds, but I think in a road car its real overkill. Bear in mind that Porsche will now relieve you of over £100k a GT3R engine and gearbox. On that basis the engine on CC was an absolute bargain for someone who already runs a 996GT3R/RS race car. The historic boys get a lot more hours out of an engine than pro drivers would so they are fine for 50 hours or a few seasons before they would need a rebuild. Great buy to the right buyer though

I am looking at all of those options. I watched that collecting cars engine...but got too high for me. I am totting up the total cost for all the pieces and labour for an LS swap. Also trying to figure out how important the lower max rpm is versus what I am trying to do here. Lovely torque curve though. Ive seen a 996tt engine...12k gbp with some fruity bits on it. Would need a 6k trans on top. But I have a heavily modded 996tt ...so too samey. So I keep coming back to a revvy na engine: 996 gt3 - rare, expensive and fairly low power 991.1 (gts or s+x51) - complicated F136 - oops...I said it. Cheap, complicated, weird.

what's going on with this fab conversion, Evo has gone very silent on the topic

Why not get a M96, Hartech rebulld and supercharge it.Would give 450 bhp+ without all the electronics hassle.

RichardCHXX said: what's going on with this fab conversion, Evo has gone very silent on the topic https://twitter.com/JethroBovingdon/status/1455485... Jethro B said: Quick 996 update. The car is painted & the 9A1 3.8 engine & the gearbox are back in. Lots of intricate & time-consuming tidying now being undertaken by @Litchfield_UK Latest headache is 996/991 hybrid air con system talking to @syvecs ECU. But it is CLOSE. Mega work as ever.

One of those occasions where you wish Litchfield had a youtube channel and were doing a build series on it!

‘Warning; strong adult language throughout entirety of the show’

in a driveable state yet Jethro ?

Jethro B said: It lives! Now the mapping, tweaking, roadtest phase begins. So far so good. The boys at @Litchfield_UK really have done an amazing job. (And if you're going to reply something about 'could have bought a GT3', please don't. It's very dull and annoying). https://twitter.com/JethroBovingdon/status/1471803...

It is a lovely colour. More excited by the work some of the guys on here are doing on developing the M96 though!

Great to read it’s at the road test phase, thank you for updating here. That paint job is lovely, does the dash look flocked?

This is so cool imo

Jethro B said: And here's a contender for eCOTY 2022. My 996 restomod by @Litchfield_UK fitted with a 991 Carrera S 3.8-litre engine. I have now driven this car! Final tweaks, new exhaust etc to come. But already feels fantastic. And cheaper than a Singer. https://twitter.com/JethroBovingdon/status/1476519... (includes vid of car idling which I can't see how to include here)

Nice. Will be interesting to see what will be done with exhaust. Looks like it’s currently wearing 991.1 PSE

TDT said: Nice. Will be interesting to see what will be done with exhaust. Looks like it’s currently wearing 991.1 PSE Which looks rather low, or is that the camera angle?

samoht said: Jethro B said: And here's a contender for eCOTY 2022. My 996 restomod by @Litchfield_UK fitted with a 991 Carrera S 3.8-litre engine. I have now driven this car! Final tweaks, new exhaust etc to come. But already feels fantastic. And cheaper than a Singer . Well, that's not a really fair comparison. Is it?

Looks absolutely awesome imho. https://twitter.com/JethroBovingdon/status/1588545...

hooneybadger said: Looks absolutely awesome imho. https://twitter.com/JethroBovingdon/status/1588545... Looks much better with the silver wheels although I'm not so sure about the colour of the car. But the colour is largely irrelevant with this car. Surely someone else will go down this road at some point or will that person have to be Me?

Lol, would love to see it, although Litchfield themselves have said they’ll never do this again. Major ball-ache. Lol.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=5lLDmCwCvIU

hooneybadger said: Looks absolutely awesome imho. https://twitter.com/JethroBovingdon/status/1588545... I concur! The .2 side skirts look much better than the .1 to these eyes. Think that's the route I'll go down - .1 Aero front bumper, .2 skirts and either duck or RS-esque wing on the back. RE: cost for the 991 conversion - considering there is a market for £15k 3.7 and 3.9 conversions, I'd happily stick £20k into a 991 swap and flog the 3.4 for £5k. However, I have a feeling it would be significantly more than that! Edited by WojaWabbit on Saturday 12th November 16:24

WojaWabbit said: I concur! The .2 side skirts look much better than the .1 to these eyes. Think that's the route I'll go down - .1 Aero front bumper, .2 skirts and either duck or RS-esque wing on the back. RE: cost for the 991 conversion - considering there is a market for £15k 3.7 and 3.9 conversions, I'd happily stick £20k into a 991 swap and flog the 3.4 for £5k. However, I have a feeling it would be significantly more than that! Edited by WojaWabbit on Saturday 12th November 16:16 A decent engine and transmission would cost you £12-14k. A stand-alone ECU and engine loom another £2k minimum. An exhaust, clutch, countless hoses, pipes, clips, a DFi primary and secondary fuel pump, air con pipes, coolant pipes, fuel pipes, connectors for all the above, another few grand. Then you get onto the labour ... (a huge part of which would be making the DFi work in a chassis not designed for it) then making the stand alone engine ECU work with/talk to, the car’s canbus system so that the dash works correctly. A day (minimum, but probably more like two or three) on the rolling road mapping everything, and you’re good to go. Not much change from £25k I reckon...

Slippydiff said: WojaWabbit said: I concur! The .2 side skirts look much better than the .1 to these eyes. Think that's the route I'll go down - .1 Aero front bumper, .2 skirts and either duck or RS-esque wing on the back. RE: cost for the 991 conversion - considering there is a market for £15k 3.7 and 3.9 conversions, I'd happily stick £20k into a 991 swap and flog the 3.4 for £5k. However, I have a feeling it would be significantly more than that! Edited by WojaWabbit on Saturday 12th November 16:16 A decent engine and transmission would cost you £12-14k. A stand-alone ECU and engine loom another £2k minimum. An exhaust, clutch, countless hoses, pipes, clips, a DFi primary and secondary fuel pump, air con pipes, coolant pipes, fuel pipes, connectors for all the above, another few grand. Then you get onto the labour ... (a huge part of which would be making the DFi work in a chassis not designed for it) then making the stand alone engine ECU work with/talk to, the car’s canbus system so that the dash works correctly. A day (minimum, but probably more like two or three) on the rolling road mapping everything, and you’re good to go. Not much change from £25k I reckon... Yep, a good summary of whats required there. I reckon you'd likely end up at closer to £30k if going down the OEM-look install. If you were prepared to have a digital dash, lose the a/c etc. you could chop a wee chunk off but the bill would still sting a tad. The £20k reference was what I'd consider to be a price that a reasonable number of people would be prepared to put into a 996 conversion, however at ~£30k it's not something I see being commercially viable unless a company found significant cost and time efficiencies when scaling up the quantities. Litchfield certainly don't seem to think its worth their effort! £10k-15k 996 base car; £30k engine conversion; £5k-10k suspension, brakes, wheels, tyres etc... just isn't worth it for most of us, considering the alternatives at the price point. We've seen what happens to used CSR prices, the same would apply to a £60k 996.991.

The CSR is a well done 'standard' hotrod 996. If you got a Hartech rebuilt car you're 80% of the way, maybe 90% of the driving experience.

WojaWabbit said: Yep, a good summary of whats required there. I reckon you'd likely end up at closer to £30k if going down the OEM-look install. If you were prepared to have a digital dash, lose the a/c etc. you could chop a wee chunk off but the bill would still sting a tad. The £20k reference was what I'd consider to be a price that a reasonable number of people would be prepared to put into a 996 conversion, however at ~£30k it's not something I see being commercially viable unless a company found significant cost and time efficiencies when scaling up the quantities. Litchfield certainly don't seem to think its worth their effort! £10k-15k 996 base car; £30k engine conversion; £5k-10k suspension, brakes, wheels, tyres etc... just isn't worth it for most of us, considering the alternatives at the price point. We've seen what happens to used CSR prices, the same would apply to a £60k 996.991. Jethro said: if you're going to reply something about 'could have bought a GT3', please don't. It's very dull and annoying I'm inferring from this that it is in fact true that Jethro could have bought a GT3 for the same money as he's spent on his car. If you say he could have sold his car for £20k as-was (?), and a 996 GT3 starts around £75k, I'm inferring he's put circa £50k+ into this car in total, presumably most of that in the engine swap. Which might go some way to explaining why Litchfield aren't expecting this to be the first of many conversions.

samoht said: I'm inferring from this that it is in fact true that Jethro could have bought a GT3 for the same money as he's spent on his car. If you say he could have sold his car for £20k as-was (?), and a 996 GT3 starts around £75k, I'm inferring he's put circa £50k+ into this car in total, presumably most of that in the engine swap. Which might go some way to explaining why Litchfield aren't expecting this to be the first of many conversions. Paint job, wheels, suspension and engine/‘box swap would have to be around the £40k mark. No doubt Litchfield would’ve done JB a mate’s rates deal (and worked on the car when they were slack (if they’re ever slack !! ) hence why it’s taken ??? years to complete the project.

Slippydiff said: Paint job, wheels, suspension and engine/‘box swap would have to be around the £40k mark. Can't you just keep the old box?

There's also outliers like this GT3 that not many want to take on. It didn't meet reserve on CC but appears to have sold later on eBay for £56k. Lots of money spent in the oily bits on that one.

Slippydiff said: A decent engine and transmission would cost you £12-14k. A stand-alone ECU and engine loom another £2k minimum. An exhaust, clutch, countless hoses, pipes, clips, a DFi primary and secondary fuel pump, air con pipes, coolant pipes, fuel pipes, connectors for all the above, another few grand. Then you get onto the labour ... (a huge part of which would be making the DFi work in a chassis not designed for it) then making the stand alone engine ECU work with/talk to, the car’s canbus system so that the dash works correctly. A day (minimum, but probably more like two or three) on the rolling road mapping everything, and you’re good to go. Not much change from £25k I reckon... Easier/cheaper to start with a whole accident-damaged 991 isn't it (like Litchfield did)? Could you use the 991 loom, clocks, etc if you were prepared to hack the 996 about a bit?

It's very interesting to me that this 991 engine: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/175431818684 is £750 less than this 996.2 engine: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/265694721284 Hmmmm. Does anyone have a 996 with a bad motor?

shalmaneser said: It's very interesting to me that this 991 engine: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/175431818684 is £750 less than this 996.2 engine: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/265694721284 Hmmmm. Does anyone have a 996 with a bad motor? Exactly Its all about supply and demand. Clearly there is no demand for the newer engine. So any supply available is priced cheap because there are no buyers.

ATM said: Exactly Its all about supply and demand. Clearly there is no demand for the newer engine. So any supply available is priced cheap because there are no buyers. This, and demand is low because the DFi lumps don’t grenade like the M97/M97 units ... But also they’re not easily fitted into other 911 chassis due to the differing can-bus architecture. I spoke to Jens at Ehresmann about fitting a 991.1 GTS/X51 motor into a Gen 2 997 3.6. He said don’t bother, it’s waaaay too complex a job to convert the Gen 2 997 electrics to work with the later 991.2 DFi motor.

Slippydiff said: ATM said: Exactly Its all about supply and demand. Clearly there is no demand for the newer engine. So any supply available is priced cheap because there are no buyers. This, and demand is low because the DFi lumps don’t grenade like the M97/M97 units ... But also they’re not easily fitted into other 911 chassis due to the differing can-bus architecture. I spoke to Jens at Ehresmann about fitting a 991.1 GTS/X51 motor into a Gen 2 997 3.6. He said don’t bother, it’s waaaay too complex a job to convert the Gen 2 997 electrics to work with the later 991.2 DFi motor. I'm sure it would be doable in an early car. The 3.4 is basically CAN free, if you can get the motor running you're basically there. Mounting points look the same - are there changes to from the 997.1 chassis to the 997.2? Using the ECU from the 991 is a no-go I would have though, much better on standalone management but I'm not sure if Link etc plays nicely with direct injection.

shalmaneser said: I'm sure it would be doable in an early car. The 3.4 is basically CAN free, if you can get the motor running you're basically there. Mounting points look the same - are there changes to from the 997.1 chassis to the 997.2? Using the ECU from the 991 is a no-go I would have though, much better on standalone management but I'm not sure if Link etc plays nicely with direct injection. Exactly I've been thinking about getting someone to play with my 981 with a view to making a standalone management system work with it so I can then lift this over to a simple early 996.

Without wishing to belittle the effort and achievement, why wouldn't you simply buy the end result required ? A GT3 / C2 Gen2 DFI / etc ?

As you know... its the journey, not just the end result.... and then the world would be boring... lol.

ChrisW. said: Without wishing to belittle the effort and achievement, why wouldn't you simply buy the end result required ? A GT3 / C2 Gen2 DFI / etc ? I like the way the early cars drive so for me it would have to be an early gt3 and they cost 60 plus right?

Certainly a good one would be around that ... and a bad one could "cost" that

ATM said: ChrisW. said: Without wishing to belittle the effort and achievement, why wouldn't you simply buy the end result required ? A GT3 / C2 Gen2 DFI / etc ? I like the way the early cars drive so for me it would have to be an early gt3 and they cost 60 plus right? Who wouldn't want a 996 with 350bhp (using the above motor)? In the early cars the engine ECU is completely separate to the body control stuff so that shouldn't be an issue. Dash is trivial, the 3.4 has two sensors in one for example of the water temp, one output goes to the ECU the other to the temp gauge. Oil pressure again straight to dash. I've been looking at going standalone and it's not that hard. Who's that chap who's fitted the Audi v6 biturbonto his boxster? I had a chat with him and he's got it running very nicely. There's a guy on YouTube fitting a Audi v8 with a Link ECU to his boxster, none of them are running into huge issues. Running the dfi motor might be tough I'll give you.

991 3.8 GTS 430 bhp 12 grand https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/313596077013

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And who would be able to easily resolve any future problems that may arise ?

Maybe JB bought a warranty from Lichfield as per a Hartech build.

Probably has some arrangement, but the hard part of integration has been done. If PU were to have a problem… can pick up another one pretty easily as 9A1 seem to be readily available on eBay. I’m glad he did it… labour of love. Wonderful project.

ChrisW. said: And who would be able to easily resolve any future problems that may arise ? Fair to assume Litchfield will be looking after it for the foreseeable.

My 3.8L 997.2 engine installation into a PDK 981 Cayman S by Ehresmann 7+ years ago was a lot easier but that was same generation engine and chassis. Jens said it took 3 days at MTO to get the Powerkit plenum aspect of his car's 3.8 GTS to work satisfactorily.

Yep 7 flaps in total to program, with that GTS Powerkit plenum, and it’s not just open or closed! Jethro has the standard 9A1 3.8.. so just the normal plenum to manage.

At the last Sunday Scramble….

The man himself talking about the car: https://podcasts.google.com/feed/aHR0cHM6Ly9mZWVkc...

And article in the new Evo...

How about this for an engine swap...! https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/285398600233?hash=item4... this engine has nothing to do with me. If funds allowed I am sure I could find a use for it...

Bargain......

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thegreenhell said: Great car he's built, 186mph GPS is pretty impressive. Ok sure there's more to come too, hope they follow the vid up with another! Obviously paying someone to do the work will result in a better job and be more expensive but I smiled at the 'Porsche cup car PS pump' also available in the Vauxhall Zafira... Interesting as a diy project. The main challenge is the direct injection, not a lot of aftermarket stuff that will support that.

shalmaneser said: Great car he's built, 186mph GPS is pretty impressive. Ok sure there's more to come too, hope they follow the vid up with another! Obviously paying someone to do the work will result in a better job and be more expensive but I smiled at the 'Porsche cup car PS pump' also available in the Vauxhall Zafira... Interesting as a diy project. The main challenge is the direct injection, not a lot of aftermarket stuff that will support that. There’s one ECU (notSyvecs) that will work/ integrate specifically with the Mk 1‘s ageing canbus infrastructure and enable the dash/HVAC and security systems to work as intended, but when I looked into it in 2017-18, it was ridiculously expensive. Fortunately Hartech have moved (and are still moving) M96 engine development on to the point whereby decent, reliable horsepower can be extracted from them for “reasonable cost” (note I didn’t use the words “cheaply” or “cost effectively” !!) which makes the fitting of the DFi engines into the 996 chassis (and all that entails) look less and less appealing. Edited by Slippydiff on Thursday 21st December 09:25

Slippydiff said: Fortunately Hartech have moved (and are still moving) M96 engine development on to the point whereby decent, reliable horsepower can be extracted from them for “reasonable cost” (note I didn’t use the words “cheaply” or “cost effectively” !!) which makes the fitting of the DFi engines into the 996 chassis (and all that entails) look less and less appealing. This. I love a bonkers project as much as the next PH, the time and energy that went into getting this is a great project, but I can simply not see a "real world" application for this. Waaaaaay to much hustle for the end result. Give me a 3.9l rebuilt M96 engine any day. If you must, throw in a X51 pack at it for good measurement and with the right exhaust and map you have a car that does everything just as well as Jethros wonderful car. And manifold injected cars sound better too

Obviously Iain Litchfied has done this for Jethro at mates rates to showcase Litchfield's "in house" capabilities and the project has grown arms and legs but well worth it the 9A1 at full chat is much more exciting than a M96/M97. The way a 9A1 revs to top end is quite something. M96/M97 more torque focussed on mid range for road use. They've created a very special car there. I bet its as quick or quicker than a 996 GT3 RS when they firm the suspension up and set a lap. Cool project and cool car.

IMI A said: Obviously Iain Litchfied has done this for Jethro at mates rates to showcase Litchfield's "in house" capabilities and the project has grown arms and legs but well worth it the 9A1 at full chat is much more exciting than a M96/M97. The way a 9A1 revs to top end is quite something. M96/M97 more torque focussed on mid range for road use. They've created a very special car there. I bet its as quick or quicker than a 996 GT3 RS when they firm the suspension up and set a lap. Cool project and cool car. Yep. Wasn't the reason Jethro went this route was he wanted a strong top end and felt that other conversions e.g. Hartech focused more on mid range torque?

IMI A said: Obviously Iain Litchfied has done this for Jethro at mates rates to showcase Litchfield's "in house" capabilities and the project has grown arms and legs but well worth it the 9A1 at full chat is much more exciting than a M96/M97. The way a 9A1 revs to top end is quite something. M96/M97 more torque focussed on mid range for road use. They've created a very special car there. I bet its as quick or quicker than a 996 GT3 RS when they firm the suspension up and set a lap. Cool project and cool car. It's got KW Clubsport so it's already properly firm. I can't imagine how firm they want it.

Yeah, Jethro was saying he wanted something like the 3.4, but stepped up a bit. Also Ian Litchfield thought it could be a good business idea offering drive in/drive out conversions on 996s and 7s. Most of the expense probably comes from Jethro wanting OEM like usability rather than using ITBs and a tablet for a dashboard.