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YOUR RESEARCH997 Build - Page 3 - 911/Carrera GT - PistonHeads UK
Reported repair
Repair ride as well with raising ride height by 15mm
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Reported fix · Original poster
Fixed ride as well with raising ride height by 15mm
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Performed · outcome unconfirmed · Original poster
Gearbox will be inspected, LSD, cup cables and short shift put in.
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Performed · outcome unconfirmed · Original poster
Yes I run Magnesium wheels on my race cars and we get everything crack tested.
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Suggestion · Original poster
Will map on our Frau Engine Dyno and then check on rolling road to see losses and load impact.
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Outcome without a verified action link
Still not mapped but so much more mid range than standard.
Building a 997 and had some feedback to start a Thread. So here you are
Found a decent C2S manual in Black and stripped it back.
Will update bits as they get done.
My brief is a nice road car, not after power or super lightweight, I have a 991.2 GT3 and 996 Racecar, so not trying to make a fake.
I want a clean look so no wings or duck tails. Working with my race team and using only proven products. You wont see centre exhausts and cold air intakes that rob power. Taking the engine to 3.9 with new pistons and liners, work on the throttlebody, plenum and some ECU work to bump up mid range torque. We are confident on what will make and have an engine Dyno so will post REAL FIGURES when done. Not going to 4L as discussed with Porsche Motorsport and it takes too much material away. 3.9 has been done a lot in US and cars have well over 100k miles trouble free.
Head will be stripped cleaned and better valve springs put in with valves reseated and replaced as required. Will gas flow but just a clean up not other head work
RSS suspension components as they are amazing and dampers built to our spec.
Gearbox will be inspected, LSD, cup cables and short shift put in. LWFW.
New interior (going Pepita with dark grey)
Colour will be revealed but will be Bentley paint (best quality) and flatted with 2 x clear coat.
Wheels are Tech Art Fomula 2 (I love a deep dish!)
Brakes rebuild calipers, Giro Discs, PF pads, new Master cylinder. we have the ability to change the ABS programming so will see.
Lowered a bit but not too much as the rear roll center on 997 is 3:1 so every 1mm you lower the car you lower the CoG by 3mm. They are better with some rake. The look good slammed but dont drive well
Front end will have new Cup car PU, rear will be standard (Follow a 997 they look great as standard)
New ICE with apple car play, some carbon bits but not too many.
Seats will be Corbeau, LWB, in cloth, keeping rears and re-trimming
Price to all this including car 60k MAX maybe 55 if I am lucky
So far car is great very clean. We need to do a small repair on front subframe or replace thats the only problem.
Engine is filthy, oil pump was leaking.
Lovely! With a pepita interior personally I think Bahama Yellow. Forest Green also nice but a darker green would be better (whats like Irish but darker?).
Currently run a 997.1 and am looking at the suspension. Bit of a newb... Did 4x shocks last year & top mounts, etc. Looking at doing the arms this year.
From the pic posted, which ones are you replacing? I imagine "coffin" and longitudinal, what else?
Edit: Actually Forest quite perfect!
Edited by RiccardoG on Wednesday 10th February 10:06
Edited by RiccardoG on Wednesday 10th February 10:10
chris-e said:
Bahama Yellow- very nice.
Have you seen this site? You could easily lose an evening browsing through...
https://www.colors.rs/colors
Oh s
t, that's a day gone!
Fjord Green for me, and I usually pick a metallic colour, but I cannot see past it now I have seen it, has a touch of class about it!
Edited by Yidwann on Wednesday 10th February 11:03
Thanks for the suggestions
Yes I run Magnesium wheels on my race cars and we get everything crack tested. The front sub-frames have a problem at the suspension mounting points they need strengthening, its an easy fix
On the suspension, most of the multi link parts will be replaced. On the coffin arms we may, but its not really necessary. All new bushes and ball joints.
I am worried Bahama looks good on a period car in California, may look bad on a modern car in the UK in Feb!
Forest Green looks good, there have been a few 991 RS in this colour and they pop. There is also Lago and Jet.
Getting a Gripper Diff made, so working out pre loads.
Engine bits are here so machining and fitting liners this week, start rebuild next week. Crank is in great shape and still perfectly balanced. Head is 100% as well, will gas flow and replace seats and springs. Will be bumping redline up a touch to 7400
Jeweller70 said:
On the suspension, most of the multi link parts will be replaced. On the coffin arms we may, but its not really necessary. All new bushes and ball joints.
If you get a minute I'd be interested to know why yes to the links but not the coffin arms. Also what you're replacing with.
I'd struggle with choosing a new colour!
Cool project! I would be very tempted to get rid of the PSE though, it's super heavy and easy to lose some weight going with decent aftermarket boxes. Switchable systems available too.
Corners back on with the original mutlilinks but new Dampers and Top Mounts. RSS bits delayed, will change next week. All components lose re bushing has been easy.
Re bushing with Powerflex as we go
Have a problem with the front Bumper as wanted to use a Cup Car Front. These need the hockey stick and wider fender and we cant make it look good easily so will chose a different front end now, anybody who knows where I can get a 997.1 GT3 style?
Some Exhaust porn, this is still 100 DB with all this, in Europe we run it straight piped and its loud.............
Simpson exhausts are amazing, may get one for the 997 build.
I know its similar to the RPM car colour, was not my intent.
Going to some testing on set up at Bicester Heritage. We should be done in 5 weeks.
We are hoping to get the sound right, larger TB and Plenum, will do the Helmholtz hack on standard air box and welded valves open on exhaust. We have some options to tune the induction noise. We want engine noise not exhaust noise.
Left the sound insulation in as without you get lots of tyre noise.
Doing some clever hacks to the front bumper and we have had a splitter made so front will a one off.
We got lucky on the base car, the rads, condenser, water unions were all spot on and cleaned up like new. The car came apart like a dream and a lot of the bushings were still perfectly ok, but I have changed them all anyway.
Jeweller70 said:
Refurbed Caliper
This is great Jeweller, really inspiring me to decide this is the way I want to go. I am probably a little way off starting! But its ideas heaven!
Jeweller70 said:
I know its similar to the RPM car colour, was not my intent.
Yes I was just meaning it as a coincidence (of good taste
) rather than implying any copying etc.
Is the speed of the project benefiting from there being no racing going on? The project is certainly moving along at racing speed.
Race Team found time in between jobs. They got another build now so thinking of charging them comisson.
They reshelled my 991 cup car in 8 days.
The little details will take time like final trimming and set up.
Will be done in 4 to 6 weeks
They have the set up now to run the engines on the in house engine dyno.
There is talk of a boxster next, that could be fun.
Will be a bit quiet for next 2 weeks as car is painted
We have figured the best engine breathing combination and will be interesting to see HP and Torque figures
Torque is what we are after and hope for a good increase and flatter curve.
Using 200 Cell Cats with X pipe and standard manifolds and PSE. Will map on our Frau Engine Dyno and then check on rolling road to see losses and load impact. Larger TB and Plenum as said will be the intake work
Trimming is progressing with lower dash, glove box, hand brake, gear gator and centre cubby in Charcol Alcantara.
Jeweller70 said:
Paint is cracking on, car is primed. Body was good except bonnet
Amazing progress.. Very interesting Project
What was wrong with the Bonnet..? Dent repaired & filled etc.?
Like the way this is heading, no one seems to take these engines apart much unless for repair. Are there no upgraded camshafts to fit 'whilst you're in there'
are you upping compression with pistons or anything or pretty much a standard rebuild in the end?
It'll be interesting to see the results on the plenum/ larger TB too, the fella that mapped my old bmw specialises in Porsches too and categorically says they dont work as marketed and he can do better with the original. He did a big post on his Facebook page a couple of years back with a lot of backlash from people that had bought them.
Love the colour combo and those seats, it'll look cracking.
Don’t want to change the drive ability so leaving Cams. Key with any breathing is to do intake and exhaust. TB and Plenum paired with 200 Cell Cats will improve breathing. Will soon see by how much.
My opinion is wrong ? What ???? Because I don’t sing to your tune I’m wrong and you’re right ! 😂
You sound like one of the 996 experts off the 911 U.K. forum 😂😳
You’re obviously quite well respected by some posters on here, no doubt giving Kudos to “Slippy” gives your loyal band of minions some presence ! My views are entirely my own ! I don’t need you to tell me how I should be thinking. If I did I’d be messaging you direct asking what I should and shouldn’t post ! Throwing your toys out of the pram over something so passionately I had wrongly assumed you were defending a purchase...... I didn’t for one minute think you were taking umbridge on some one else’s behalf ! Reminds me of the people who post about 997.1 bore scoring on other people’s behalf ? this is the internet tho wise guy and out in the real world where I can quite openly air my views and say what I like without being moderated by the thought Police for taking a different view to their own.
You’re right though, I don’t like ducktails on modern Porsche cars or Fuchs wheels. Irrespective of size or weight ! Throwing details at something still doesn’t make you right or me wrong as I said ! I’m not looking thro your eyes or thinking in your head ! Other people’s opinions can and will differ from your own even if you decide to decide to argue over some one else’s purchase, quoting a price and the place of purchase !
😂
It’s laughable !
Just for the record I am a fan of Houndstooth cloth ! So why don’t you now tell me how I’m wrong about that because some one who you do t know did t Buy a car with it and doesn’t have it because they don’t like it and you defend their thoughts by the medium of sheer lunacy.
The yellow NONE Water Cooled Duck tail on that RS looks ❤️ Mainly because “I think” it is period correct !
Other people’s views may vary !
ArchiesDad said:
Just for the record I am a fan of Houndstooth cloth ! So why don’t you now tell me how I’m wrong about that because some one who you do t know did t Buy a car with it and doesn’t have it because they don’t like it and you defend their thoughts by the medium of sheer lunacy.
You’re wrong.
Also, have you been on the beers. If so, I’m jealous.
ArchiesDad said:
My opinion is wrong ? What ???? Because I don’t sing to your tune I’m wrong and you’re right ! ??
You sound like one of the 996 experts off the 911 U.K. forum ????
You’re obviously quite well respected by some posters on here, no doubt giving Kudos to “Slippy” gives your loyal band of minions some presence ! My views are entirely my own ! I don’t need you to tell me how I should be thinking. If I did I’d be messaging you direct asking what I should and shouldn’t post ! Throwing your toys out of the pram over something so passionately I had wrongly assumed you were defending a purchase...... I didn’t for one minute think you were taking umbridge on some one else’s behalf ! Reminds me of the people who post about 997.1 bore scoring on other people’s behalf ? this is the internet tho wise guy and out in the real world where I can quite openly air my views and say what I like without being moderated by the thought Police for taking a different view to their own.
You’re right though, I don’t like ducktails on modern Porsche cars or Fuchs wheels. Irrespective of size or weight ! Throwing details at something still doesn’t make you right or me wrong as I said ! I’m not looking thro your eyes or thinking in your head ! Other people’s opinions can and will differ from your own even if you decide to decide to argue over some one else’s purchase, quoting a price and the place of purchase !
??
It’s laughable !
Just for the record I am a fan of Houndstooth cloth ! So why don’t you now tell me how I’m wrong about that because some one who you do t know did t Buy a car with it and doesn’t have it because they don’t like it and you defend their thoughts by the medium of sheer lunacy.
The yellow NONE Water Cooled Duck tail on that RS looks ?? Mainly because “I think” it is period correct !
Other people’s views may vary !
It is period correct but not a rs,come on you to kiss and make up,it aint worth it.
I really like what the OP has done with this. I've found it quite inspiring.
I'd love to have a go at something similar but would have to start with a more modest base car. 996 or 987 could be a great starting point for developing something personal.
Ducktail and Fuchs falls into 'should be wrong but it's right' territory for me
oddman said:
I really like what the OP has done with this. I've found it quite inspiring.
I'd love to have a go at something similar but would have to start with a more modest base car. 996 or 987 could be a great starting point for developing something personal.
Ducktail and Fuchs falls into 'should be wrong but it's right' territory for me
I don't think the mid engine cars work well with these larger capacity engines as they seem to struggle to get rid of the heat as well as the rear engine layout.
Jeweller70 said:
Got the lighting correct
I'll be honest and say that I wasn't totally convinced by the earlier photos but in the above shot the car looks absolutely fantastic. The colour scheme works really well and it looks very retro in an unfussy modern way.
Done about 600 miles now.
Gearbox is now great and brake feel spot on.
Handling is as I want it but ride is too firm we are going to drop the spring rate about 10 to 20%.
Car has settled a bit so will raise 5mm or so as well.
Clutch is too aggressive so we will replace paddle clutch. Still not mapped but so much more mid range than standard. We backed to backed with a standard C2S and in gear the car is much stronger.
The more I see it the happier I am. It’s the right amount of HP and involvement for the road.
I enjoyed doing it and the feedback has been very positive.
Signing off for now unless I build another one😀
Jeweller70 said:
Done about 600 miles now.
Gearbox is now great and brake feel spot on.
Handling is as I want it but ride is too firm we are going to drop the spring rate about 10 to 20%.
Car has settled a bit so will raise 5mm or so as well.
Clutch is too aggressive so we will replace paddle clutch. Still not mapped but so much more mid range than standard. We backed to backed with a standard C2S and in gear the car is much stronger.
The more I see it the happier I am. It’s the right amount of HP and involvement for the road.
I enjoyed doing it and the feedback has been very positive.
Signing off for now unless I build another one??
Thank you for sharing via the thread. Enjoy the car.
ArchiesDad said:
My opinion is wrong ? What ???? Because I don’t sing to your tune I’m wrong and you’re right ! ??
You sound like one of the 996 experts off the 911 U.K. forum ????
You’re obviously quite well respected by some posters on here, no doubt giving Kudos to “Slippy” gives your loyal band of minions some presence ! My views are entirely my own ! I don’t need you to tell me how I should be thinking. If I did I’d be messaging you direct asking what I should and shouldn’t post ! Throwing your toys out of the pram over something so passionately I had wrongly assumed you were defending a purchase...... I didn’t for one minute think you were taking umbridge on some one else’s behalf ! Reminds me of the people who post about 997.1 bore scoring on other people’s behalf ? this is the internet tho wise guy and out in the real world where I can quite openly air my views and say what I like without being moderated by the thought Police for taking a different view to their own.
You’re right though, I don’t like ducktails on modern Porsche cars or Fuchs wheels. Irrespective of size or weight ! Throwing details at something still doesn’t make you right or me wrong as I said ! I’m not looking thro your eyes or thinking in your head ! Other people’s opinions can and will differ from your own even if you decide to decide to argue over some one else’s purchase, quoting a price and the place of purchase !
??
It’s laughable !
Just for the record I am a fan of Houndstooth cloth ! So why don’t you now tell me how I’m wrong about that because some one who you do t know did t Buy a car with it and doesn’t have it because they don’t like it and you defend their thoughts by the medium of sheer lunacy.
The yellow NONE Water Cooled Duck tail on that RS looks ?? Mainly because “I think” it is period correct !
Other people’s views may vary !
I think you are taking this too seriously.
Try switching to decaf perhaps?
And using fewer exclamation marks
Jeweller70 said:
Looks fantastic a really nice custom build.
My only dislike is that rear badge which looks cluttered like the newer 911s.
Personally I'd declutter with a 911 badge. Perhaps in the same gold colour would finish it off well?
Looks retro a little like this.
Anyway still stunning in it's own right!
Jeweller70 said:
Congratulations to your new toy! This was a speedy process
The dark green with gold looks the dogs! Whilst I am a sucker for R stripes on 991s (I mean, just look at Cheib's Lava GT3 with them and don't be blown away), I'd have your car without them.
I may have missed it: Which suspension did you go with?
Jeweller70 said:
My team have been offered a tractive set to test I may put that on
"To test" ? Your team needs geeing up, they are about 5 years behind the curve
Edited by TB993tt on Tuesday 8th June 09:33
Ahh the joys of Pistonheads
I didnt want active suspension. Having raced many cars for many years and tries every kind of suspenion I do have a understanding of what works.
Most of applications dont need active and as we can get bespoke builds from Moton and Ohlins to our damper curves there is no need.
I am sure tractive are good but on a road car in the UK a good passive set up with the correct springs will be fine for me
Jeweller70 said:
Ahh the joys of Pistonheads
I didnt want active suspension. Having raced many cars for many years and tries every kind of suspenion I do have a understanding of what works.
Most of applications dont need active and as we can get bespoke builds from Moton and Ohlins to our damper curves there is no need.
I am sure tractive are good but on a road car in the UK a good passive set up with the correct springs will be fine for me
Tractive's active is particularly good for a road 997, one can have extremely soft springing for low speed crappy roads with the damping giving extra assistance and control when needed and multiple damper curves which are selected on the fly, it is revolutionary for road cars hence why they all have some form of it from the factory now.
TB993tt said:
Tractive's active is particularly good for a road 997, one can have extremely soft springing for low speed crappy roads with the damping giving extra assistance and control when needed and multiple damper curves which are selected on the fly, it is revolutionary for road cars hence why they all have some form of it from the factory now.
Think that's a subjective call.
The sort of solution you talk about is certainly in vogue at the moment. But personally, really, really dislike setups with soft springs and increased damping to compensate. For the road, I much prefer firmer springs and just enough damping to control the them. The opposite, in other words. Hence, don't much like PASM and similar active setups. Current have a 9x7 gen 2 car with PASM, and tbh I think it's pretty crap. 9x1 cars are a bit better, but still don't like them.
Personally don't think you need soft springs for a reasonable ride on UK roads. It's damping that causes most of the ride issues, in my view and experience. Not springs.
Which isn't to say that's the 'right' way to go, just that there are alternatives.
Jeweller70 said:
Ahh the joys of Pistonheads
I didnt want active suspension. Having raced many cars for many years and tries every kind of suspenion I do have a understanding of what works.
Most of applications dont need active and as we can get bespoke builds from Moton and Ohlins to our damper curves there is no need.
I am sure tractive are good
but on a road car in the UK a good passive set up with the correct springs will be fine for me
Well said sir, a good set of passives will transform it
Hopefully not teaching you to suck eggs :
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
Ohlins or Nitrons would be my choices.
And please accept my apologies for having briefly derailed your thread earlier on
Hi Jeweller70
Just wanted to chime in and say how stunning your 997 build is… colour choice is perfect. Obviously I’m massively biased, as I’m extremely local to you, running a 996 Turbo (I think 1 in 4 ever made in UK in that exact green colour). Yours looks flawless in the metal though… makes me want to re-spray mine (added to project list!)
By chance did you ever settle on your seat choice? I saw you mentioned Pole Positions as a consideration. I’m sure with your racing exploits you’ve done some seat time in Recaros finest, but if you ever wanted to wiggle into a set of Pole’s, I’ve got a set in one of my 996’s and I’m literally 50ft round the corner mate (how’s that for online stalking taking to new levels!) lol Seriously just message me anytime if it helps you.
Anyhow my friend, genuinely lovely project… keeps my Porsche Project passion alive whilst I’m committed to house refurb and banned from any Stuttgart based thoughts!
Best wishes, Nath
Jeweller70 said:
Nath went for Corbeau as I know the MD and don’t want to much bucket for the road.
Pop round you can have a drive....
Hi Marcus,
You’re too kind.
I would definitely love to pop round soon for a chin wag and admire the project. Really interested in a few points as they’ve been on my ‘project list’ and it’d be great to get your thoughts on what you’ve achieved.
Speak soon (in person!)
Best wishes, Nath
Initial Dyno reports in after run in.
Fully aware all dynos are different. They key is the difference not the absolute number
We are comparing to a base run an standard low mileage C2S 3.8 (standard 27k miles)
The 3.8 gave 330 hp
Our 3.9 gave 351
Torque is the biggest gain with 30hp more from 3k and 35hp more from 5k.
There is more to come as pre cat lambdas need to be renewed as not reading well.
We feel 370 will be possible and 40hp up in the mid range
Will post the charts when we do final runs.
Fixed ride as well with raising ride height by 15mm
Jeweller70 said:
Initial Dyno reports in after run in.
Fully aware all dynos are different. They key is the difference not the absolute number
We are comparing to a base run an standard low mileage C2S 3.8 (standard 27k miles)
The 3.8 gave 330 hp
Our 3.9 gave 351
Torque is the biggest gain with 30hp more from 3k and 35hp more from 5k.
There is more to come as pre cat lambdas need to be renewed as not reading well.
We feel 370 will be possible and 40hp up in the mid range
Will post the charts when we do final runs.
For comparison, this is my Hartech 3.6 to 3.9 increase (after mapping by Wayne at Chipwizards):
peterg1955 said:
For comparison, this is my Hartech 3.6 to 3.9 increase (after mapping by Wayne at Chipwizards):
Sorry for the thread hijack....
Peter,
What was the power like pre mapping? I am unsure if I am getting the best out of my 3.9 hartech. I have designtek manifolds and switchable exhausts with standard cats I believe. I heard that it might be worth putting 3.8 injectors in. Would like to take it to chipwizards but I am in Surrey and they are in Manchester....
markh1 said:
peterg1955 said:
For comparison, this is my Hartech 3.6 to 3.9 increase (after mapping by Wayne at Chipwizards):
Sorry for the thread hijack....
Peter,
What was the power like pre mapping? I am unsure if I am getting the best out of my 3.9 hartech. I have designtek manifolds and switchable exhausts with standard cats I believe. I heard that it might be worth putting 3.8 injectors in. Would like to take it to chipwizards but I am in Surrey and they are in Manchester....
The mapping was done when the engine was finished at Hartech then I went to collect it so I can't say what the new capacity made before Wayne got hold of it. I have Topgear manifolds and a 997 airbox with resonator delete on mine.
I'd give Grant at Hartech a ring and ask him what he suggests
OP, Just wanted to say I absolutely love it, congratulations on an epic car. I think the colour combinations of the exterior and wheels with the retro interior are really classy.
Looking forward to future updates.
peterg1955 said:
The mapping was done when the engine was finished at Hartech then I went to collect it so I can't say what the new capacity made before Wayne got hold of it. I have Topgear manifolds and a 997 airbox with resonator delete on mine.
I'd give Grant at Hartech a ring and ask him what he suggests
I have been looking at the resonator delete, are you able to comment on it in isolation from a sound perspective or was it all done at the same time so it's difficult to identify?
olv said:
peterg1955 said:
The mapping was done when the engine was finished at Hartech then I went to collect it so I can't say what the new capacity made before Wayne got hold of it. I have Topgear manifolds and a 997 airbox with resonator delete on mine.
I'd give Grant at Hartech a ring and ask him what he suggests
I have been looking at the resonator delete, are you able to comment on it in isolation from a sound perspective or was it all done at the same time so it's difficult to identify?
I did it on the 996 airbox first and it improved the sound for almost no outlay, the 997 is about the same I would say but I also had a 3.9 engine which makes a slightly deeper note anyway
Back with some updates
Fitted Tractive and had more dyno time, suspension is very good and we have another 20bhp at the top end with new O2 sensors and a remap
Going to redo the interior sold mine and have a back dash and new black carpet set to go in.
Got some new retro bucket seat frames and looking at Cognac with black accents, and retrim the whole car
Jeweller70 said:
Back with some updates
Fitted Tractive and had more dyno time, suspension is very good and we have another 20bhp at the top end with new O2 sensors and a remap
Going to redo the interior sold mine and have a back dash and new black carpet set to go in.
Got some new retro bucket seat frames and looking at Cognac with black accents, and retrim the whole car
Sounds interesting look forward to seeing some pics.
ATM said:
I'm definitely copying this brake caliper and wheel colour combo.
Been looking for this thread to update on my projects. As promised wheels now done.
Current dilemma is choosing which green to paint my 981. Current favourite is Porsche Lime Green as seen here.
IMI A said:
some fab ideas on this thread hence resurrection - certainly helped make me go mad and spec my perfect 997
its stunning, but you need to take some new pics!
This is a source reference. Confirm exact model applicability in the original material.