Self specced GT4 PDK vs 991.1 GT3 - Page 3 - Porsche General - PistonHeads UK

Price wise they are quite close, maybe .1 GT3 is a tad less to buy and a bit more to run. Want to hear what you guys think or what would you choose? Currently drive a 981 GTS. To be used for weekend drives/summer trips and occasional track days. Thanks

I would take the 991 I think. While it has engine issues I am not sure the GT4 / Spyder don’t also have some given I was at a track day last week where a spyder engine let go Any 911 GT3 is quite a special car and the 991 sounds great imo

MDL111 said: I would take the 991 I think. While it has engine issues I am not sure the GT4 / Spyder don’t also have some given I was at a track day last week where a spyder engine let go Any 911 GT3 is quite a special car and the 991 sounds great imo Yeah, the sounds are definitely far apart. Agree that gen 1 GT3 will have its place along the road, not sure how special a GT4 will be going forward but we never know.

blz06 said: Price wise they are quite close, maybe .1 GT3 is a tad less to buy and a bit more to run. Want to hear what you guys think or what would you choose? Currently drive a 981 GTS. To be used for weekend drives/summer trips and occasional track days. Thanks Engine, gearing, sound, rear vs mid engine layout. 9K RPM, better gearing, better sound, personal preference. If you decide on the GT3, check warranty, some of the last cars had the engine put in directly at factory versus out at dealer and this will impact the warranty which I think was 10 years on the engine replaced cars. I can't remember if it was 10 from recall date or topped up to 10 based on when the car was delivered. But the 992 platform is a relatively new powerplant, particularly the 9A2 iteration in the GT4 so not sure what long term will be like. I feel that Porsche made a dog's dinner of the 718 series or is that the 718 Cayman GT4 or is the 982. The fraudulent links to the original 718 and that 4-pot were the beginning but in fairness, dynamically and pace wise, no issue, but if you buy a Porsche, you want a flat six IMHO. For me, the sound is important. OPF makes everything sound strangled and the sound is very thin. The 981 GT4 felt like a skunkworks project that got let out the gate. There was a sense that they'd taken a risk. 718 feels more cynical, greater numbers, PDK, manual. I think from a residuals perspective, you'll do better in the GT3 if you have a good spec. 718 will feel more modern - not a great deal on from the 981 in design but with PCM4 and Car Play + LED lights, a few more luxury options if that's your thing. Tough choice. Easier on the 991.2 GT3 where it's obvious for me.

Mutema said: Engine, gearing, sound, rear vs mid engine layout. 9K RPM, better gearing, better sound, personal preference. If you decide on the GT3, check warranty, some of the last cars had the engine put in directly at factory versus out at dealer and this will impact the warranty which I think was 10 years on the engine replaced cars. I can't remember if it was 10 from recall date or topped up to 10 based on when the car was delivered. But the 992 platform is a relatively new powerplant, particularly the 9A2 iteration in the GT4 so not sure what long term will be like. I feel that Porsche made a dog's dinner of the 718 series or is that the 718 Cayman GT4 or is the 982. The fraudulent links to the original 718 and that 4-pot were the beginning but in fairness, dynamically and pace wise, no issue, but if you buy a Porsche, you want a flat six IMHO. For me, the sound is important. OPF makes everything sound strangled and the sound is very thin. The 981 GT4 felt like a skunkworks project that got let out the gate. There was a sense that they'd taken a risk. 718 feels more cynical, greater numbers, PDK, manual. I think from a residuals perspective, you'll do better in the GT3 if you have a good spec. 718 will feel more modern - not a great deal on from the 981 in design but with PCM4 and Car Play + LED lights, a few more luxury options if that's your thing. Tough choice. Easier on the 991.2 GT3 where it's obvious for me. haha .2 GT3 would be a no-brainer but the jump in price tag... Thanks a lot for the detailed breakdown

I heard a 981 GT4 on track yesterday but was not sure if it was a club sport (it was in the road car group m, so should have been a normal one) - it did sound amazing and about as loud (and better) than the Performante that followed it

Sounds like you need a test drive. My vote for 991 GT3, epic car and an event to drive. That engine, wow! 991.1 GT3 has 10 yr engine warranty from date of the cars manufacture (plenty info on Rennlist etc). Usual Porsche warranty can be extended beyond 10 yrs (to 15yrs).

Mankers said: Sounds like you need a test drive. My vote for 991 GT3, epic car and an event to drive. That engine, wow! 991.1 GT3 has 10 yr engine warranty from date of the cars manufacture (plenty info on Rennlist etc). Usual Porsche warranty can be extended beyond 10 yrs (to 15yrs). Not sure how to go about and ask for a test drive on 718 GT4. My OPC doesn't have a demo. My PDK GT4 spec is already with them and freezing period starts in a week.. I have driven the GT3, btb with some other random cars - it was addictive and easily the best motor on that day. Hence the hesitation now....

MDL111 said: I heard a 981 GT4 on track yesterday but was not sure if it was a club sport (it was in the road car group m, so should have been a normal one) - it did sound amazing and about as loud (and better) than the Performante that followed it No doubt about that. 981s are in general great sounding, my GTS screems sensationally not to mention GT4. Never saw or heard a 718 GT4 in flesh, but enough said on web

blz06 said: No doubt about that. 981s are in general great sounding, my GTS screems sensationally not to mention GT4. Never saw or heard a 718 GT4 in flesh, but enough said on web 718s do get louder as the filters wear in. Most people go for after market exhausts.

blz06 said: Mankers said: Sounds like you need a test drive. My vote for 991 GT3, epic car and an event to drive. That engine, wow! 991.1 GT3 has 10 yr engine warranty from date of the cars manufacture (plenty info on Rennlist etc). Usual Porsche warranty can be extended beyond 10 yrs (to 15yrs). Not sure how to go about and ask for a test drive on 718 GT4. My OPC doesn't have a demo. My PDK GT4 spec is already with them and freezing period starts in a week.. I have driven the GT3, btb with some other random cars - it was addictive and easily the best motor on that day. Hence the hesitation now.... The GT3 is a fantastic car - amazing value for money. As much as I like the GT4 - and it's truly brilliant, the GT3 is a very different experience. Personally, i'd go GT3 (for the 1.1 with appropriate warranty) any day of the week if I could stretch to it

Quite clear most hearts here are with GT3 So what sort of things we should look out for when sourcing a .1 GT3?

Have people driven both cars in order to comment?

I'm glad you've made this topic - saw a GT4 yesterday on the road and thought it looked smart. Have casually been looking for a GT3 beforehand. Got to admit though, all these numbers confuse me... So 991 is the current Carrera with .1 being first gen and .2 being current? And the GT4... the 718 is previous model and 981 current?

AndyC_123 said: I'm glad you've made this topic - saw a GT4 yesterday on the road and thought it looked smart. Have casually been looking for a GT3 beforehand. Got to admit though, all these numbers confuse me... So 991 is the current Carrera with .1 being first gen and .2 being current? And the GT4... the 718 is previous model and 981 current? 718 or 982 is the current GT4.

MannyLon said: Have people driven both cars in order to comment? Maybe not many. More likely ppl have driven the 991.1 GT3 since it's been around for quite a while. I haven't even see a 718 GT4 in flesh before placing an order. Supposedly you shouldn't expect to go through the process of test drive - spec the car on a big screen? With these cars you do it when you are told you can

MannyLon said: Have people driven both cars in order to comment? I own a 991.1 GT3 now and previously owned a GT4. I did near 10k miles in the GT4 and have done about 3k thus far in the GT3. Without going into the intricacies of each car too much, the GT3 is a full-fat car compared to the diet GT4. You may think that they drive similar but that couldn't be less true - the GT3 is hardcore in comparison with its characteristic clunks and rattles, 9k redline and full-GT screamer engine. Absolutely no contest for me - go for the GT3. They seem like great value at the moment as stated.

You haven't driven the 718 GT4 though, the OP will need someone who's driven one to make a like-for-like comparison. The engine and chassis tweaks make a difference, although I suspect the GT3's engine and 911-ness would be preferably if you're going for a PDK car.

For the same money, 991.1 GT3 is ALOT of car, performance and experience..... I’d say probably still more than a PDK 718 GT4... but GT4 will be much easier to extract that performance from more of the time. Question is if you prefer mid-engine v rear engine. Then it’s the ages of the cars and warranty etc. Also 718 is just a newer car. 8k vs full fat 9k...but bear in mind all the performance is delivered by about 8300 anyway. I think I’d probably just about edged to go PDK 718 GT4, put some KW Clubsports 3-way and maybe rear silencer( this wouldn’t not a priority really for me). Just because Cayman platform is a traditional sport car layout, and no centre-Locks car is newer. But only just. Edited by TDT on Wednesday 16th September 13:25

Xyphox said: MannyLon said: Have people driven both cars in order to comment? I own a 991.1 GT3 now and previously owned a GT4. I did near 10k miles in the GT4 and have done about 3k thus far in the GT3. Without going into the intricacies of each car too much, the GT3 is a full-fat car compared to the diet GT4. You may think that they drive similar but that couldn't be less true - the GT3 is hardcore in comparison with its characteristic clunks and rattles, 9k redline and full-GT screamer engine. Absolutely no contest for me - go for the GT3. They seem like great value at the moment as stated. I had a 981 GTS (twice) that I specced from new and tried two 981 GT4's (how stupid is that), then settled on a 991.2 GT3. So not exactly as per the OP choices and how each of us enjoy or dislike certain cars is very much individual of course. However I found the GT4 too harsh and the clutch too stiff for me to enjoy it on the road. The additional noise from the engine directly behind you and the short top gear meant that my wife and I didn't really use it for road trips. The clutch on the 718 GT4 that I tried is just like a shopping car so that wouldn't be an issue now and it only was on the 981 because I have a bike injury with a stiff weak left ankle. My .2 GT3 has PDK and with the engine further back we can use it for road trips, even though it has the same low top gear, just a small difference but for us it makes a big change in how we use it. I tracked the CGTS once at Spa and it was great fun but didn't leave me wanting to do it again. Never tracked the GT4's as I knew I wouldn't be able to change gear so frequently without being left in pain. I've tracked the GT3 twice with more to come and it's completely addictive, the car is just epic on a track and huge fun. So much so that a friend who races F3 tried my car at Donnington and went straight out and bought one. In summary and a very, very personal opinion; Unless you intend to track the GT3 I'd consider sticking with the 981 GTS. I've never driven anything that was such a sweet spot for road use, it does it all and let's you really enjoy it without going 200 leptons as Dr911R might say. (Although he'd also point out I am a w@**+r for having a PDK) Then you can cruise along the motorway when you have to and have a conversation in it! Apparently the .1 GT3 is slightly more comfy on the road though, some extra sound deadening that was removed on the .2 to compensate for some weight addition to the body? Good luck!

robj4 said: I had a 981 GTS (twice) that I specced from new and tried two 981 GT4's (how stupid is that), then settled on a 991.2 GT3. So not exactly as per the OP choices and how each of us enjoy or dislike certain cars is very much individual of course. However I found the GT4 too harsh and the clutch too stiff for me to enjoy it on the road. The additional noise from the engine directly behind you and the short top gear meant that my wife and I didn't really use it for road trips. The clutch on the 718 GT4 that I tried is just like a shopping car so that wouldn't be an issue now and it only was on the 981 because I have a bike injury with a stiff weak left ankle. My .2 GT3 has PDK and with the engine further back we can use it for road trips, even though it has the same low top gear, just a small difference but for us it makes a big change in how we use it. I tracked the CGTS once at Spa and it was great fun but didn't leave me wanting to do it again. Never tracked the GT4's as I knew I wouldn't be able to change gear so frequently without being left in pain. I've tracked the GT3 twice with more to come and it's completely addictive, the car is just epic on a track and huge fun. So much so that a friend who races F3 tried my car at Donnington and went straight out and bought one. In summary and a very, very personal opinion; Unless you intend to track the GT3 I'd consider sticking with the 981 GTS. I've never driven anything that was such a sweet spot for road use, it does it all and let's you really enjoy it without going 200 leptons as Dr911R might say. (Although he'd also point out I am a w@**+r for having a PDK) Then you can cruise along the motorway when you have to and have a conversation in it! Apparently the .1 GT3 is slightly more comfy on the road though, some extra sound deadening that was removed on the .2 to compensate for some weight addition to the body? Good luck! Thanks! That's what I feared to hear re. sticking to the 981 GTS... It can walk over speed bumps almost like normal cars, and sound per money is up there.. I do want a more forcused and shaper car though (and I fall for Porsche rear wings, can't help it ). I'm hoping the PDK'd GT4 would complete the car in a way and being new it's almost carefree. But then I know the GT3s have holy engines.. This is not going well Edited by blz06 on Wednesday 16th September 16:16

blz06 said: Thanks! That's what I feared to hear re. sticking to the 981 GTS... It can walk over speed bumps almost like normal cars, and sound per money is up there.. I do want a more forcused and shaper car though (and I fall for Porsche rear wings, can't help it ). I'm hoping the PDK'd GT4 would complete the car in a way and being new it's almost carefree. But then I know the GT3s have holy engines.. This is not going well Edited by blz06 on Wednesday 16th September 16:16 Problem solved. GT4 as it’s mid engined. Newer car so less to go wrong.

I get that we’re talking PDK, but a 997.2 GT3 would be my choice. Similar money and real character.

Xyphox said: I own a 991.1 GT3 now and previously owned a GT4. I did near 10k miles in the GT4 and have done about 3k thus far in the GT3. Without going into the intricacies of each car too much, the GT3 is a full-fat car compared to the diet GT4. You may think that they drive similar but that couldn't be less true - the GT3 is hardcore in comparison with its characteristic clunks and rattles, 9k redline and full-GT screamer engine. Absolutely no contest for me - go for the GT3. They seem like great value at the moment as stated. Quoting this for emphasis. I ran a gen 1 GT3 as a daily for 15k miles. The engine is a masterpiece. You just can't compare it to a GT4. Keep your Porsche warranty and try and not worry too much. If the worst happens you'll be well taken care of by possibly the most supportive manufacturer out there. Don't forget that the 991.2 GT3 everyone lauds as the high point for Porsche is an updated 991.1. Yes, its a better car but the gen 1 is an absolute beast in its own right and is a steal at this pricepoint.

Tough choice which I had during the summer myself. Went to buy two different GT3s but couldn’t Quite agree a price with the sellers. Drove one of them and the more I reflected on it decided I really didn’t want a PDK. Managed to get a manual GT4 slot and am now waiting delivery. If I had loved the PDK I’d possibly have pushed through with GT3 but it was a close run thing - brand new in my spec and colour V 6 year old, 15K miles and two owners. You pays your money and takes your choice.....

blz06 said: Thanks! That's what I feared to hear re. sticking to the 981 GTS... It can walk over speed bumps almost like normal cars, and sound per money is up there.. I do want a more forcused and shaper car though (and I fall for Porsche rear wings, can't help it ). I'm hoping the PDK'd GT4 would complete the car in a way and being new it's almost carefree. But then I know the GT3s have holy engines.. This is not going well Edited by blz06 on Wednesday 16th September 16:16 Yup, I can see that.. But then do you consider the GTS4.0 in PDK? Because that extra 'sharpness' of the pure GT car really doesn't add much on public roads, it just makes you whince more with the pot holes and drains. On a track absolutely, but on the road my personal findings are that you can push a well suspended sports car like the GTS harder and therefore smile more. The GT3 gives you enjoyment with the laugh out loud engine, as long as you are really careful where to rev it out. It's perhaps far too quick to really get on it through the twisties but who cares when that engine spins up. I'd like to try the 718 GT4 and new GTS4.0 in PDK, if I were in your shoes I'd pay for the time at Porsche Silverstone to try them as I think you can get a drive on road as well? It's a really big decision and I've lost thousands discovering what works for me.

@blz06 Interesting dilemma with a few considerations.... Is your GTS manual/pdk? Are you planning OPC finance? I’ve been fortunate enough to have experience of the recent crop of GT products. I currently daily a 718 GT4, just approaching 2000 miles and getting louder by the day. Clearly the recent announcement of PDK availability, as usual creates a degree of excitement and anticipation. Tricky bit is that no one is going to get the opportunity to try before you buy. Well done on getting what will be one of the first PDK slots. My main observation would be how suited the new 4.0 engine is to pdk. Undoubtedly it will be a good product, but in my mind the high revving engine in GT3 cars is more suited to pdk, where - when you change gear as you approach the redline you get that thrown back in the seat feeling. I’m not quite convinced the current 4.0 engine will provide that feeling and may detract from the sporting character of the car. Manual offers connectivity to the driving experience and the ability to play around significantly more than the pdk gearbox. However GT4 RS, that may be a completely different beast suited to pdk! Best of luck.

giles panizzi said: @blz06 Interesting dilemma with a few considerations.... Is your GTS manual/pdk? Are you planning OPC finance? I’ve been fortunate enough to have experience of the recent crop of GT products. I currently daily a 718 GT4, just approaching 2000 miles and getting louder by the day. Clearly the recent announcement of PDK availability, as usual creates a degree of excitement and anticipation. Tricky bit is that no one is going to get the opportunity to try before you buy. Well done on getting what will be one of the first PDK slots. My main observation would be how suited the new 4.0 engine is to pdk. Undoubtedly it will be a good product, but in my mind the high revving engine in GT3 cars is more suited to pdk, where - when you change gear as you approach the redline you get that thrown back in the seat feeling. I’m not quite convinced the current 4.0 engine will provide that feeling and may detract from the sporting character of the car. Manual offers connectivity to the driving experience and the ability to play around significantly more than the pdk gearbox. However GT4 RS, that may be a completely different beast suited to pdk! Best of luck. Cheers My 981 GTS is also PDK, basically I'm not allowed a manual car for the reason you can probably guess. Personally I think either box will bring joy albeit in rather different ways. It's well possible Porsche is being conservative with the engine limit to not repeat history. Glad to hear yours is getting louder by day though, just like you tend to get better performance from official numbers, Porsche bonus..

perhaps I would go for a lightly used 718 GT4.

DK7 said: perhaps I would go for a lightly used 718 GT4. Plenty of those around.

I had a 991.2 GT3 manual and a 981 Spyder. Honestly... the 981 Spyder was more fun, more of the time. No doubt that when you drive the GT3 hard, it’s incredible and the engine from 6000-9000 rpm is a must have life experience... but and it’s a big but for me... below that it’s dare I say it a bit boring.... and that’s the conundrum because if you are in the fun zone for revs you are into licence losing territory very very quickly. The 981 on the other hand had me smiling driving at 10 mph with its pops and bangs. Downside on that car was the long gearing but I really loved it. The question I don’t have the answer to is whether with an aftermarket exhaust you can make either a GT3 or a 718 GT4/Spyder fun in the lower rev range in the way the 981 is from the factory.

AndySurrey said: I had a 991.2 GT3 manual and a 981 Spyder. Honestly... the 981 Spyder was more fun, more of the time. No doubt that when you drive the GT3 hard, it’s incredible and the engine from 6000-9000 rpm is a must have life experience... but and it’s a big but for me... below that it’s dare I say it a bit boring.... and that’s the conundrum because if you are in the fun zone for revs you are into licence losing territory very very quickly. The 981 on the other hand had me smiling driving at 10 mph with its pops and bangs. Downside on that car was the long gearing but I really loved it. The question I don’t have the answer to is whether with an aftermarket exhaust you can make either a GT3 or a 718 GT4/Spyder fun in the lower rev range in the way the 981 is from the factory. Porsche did a fantastic job on the 981GT/Spyder exhaust. I’ve not heard anything better, love the sound. Don’t think after market applications will be able to match that, especially with all the filters on the 718.

You'll get the volume and tone, but not the overrun pops and crackles with an exhaust on a 718 GT4. Different, and just as good in its own way. Some will prefer it to a 981 I suspect. I like both, but I also like the car as standard

Twinfan said: You'll get the volume and tone, but not the overrun pops and crackles with an exhaust on a 718 GT4. Different, and just as good in its own way. Some will prefer it to a 981 I suspect. I like both, but I also like the car as standard May I ask which exhaust you put on your GT4? Was it JCR? If JCR did you go silenced or non silenced? Have a Spyder arriving early ‘21 so am starting to do some research.

AndySurrey said: May I ask which exhaust you put on your GT4? Was it JCR? If JCR did you go silenced or non silenced? Have a Spyder arriving early ‘21 so am starting to do some research. I'm waiting on a new product from Ninemesiter - a silenced version in inconel. Should have it in a couple of weeks.

Twinfan said: I'm waiting on a new product from Ninemesiter - a silenced version in inconel. Should have it in a couple of weeks. Be very interested to see what you think once you have it.

DK7 said: perhaps I would go for a lightly used 718 GT4. I firmly want a PDK , curious to find out what the car will be like.

AndySurrey said: Be very interested to see what you think once you have it. Sure, I'm planning on sticking a post up on here

robj4 said: Because that extra 'sharpness' of the pure GT car really doesn't add much on public roads, it just makes you whince more with the pot holes and drains. On a track absolutely, but on the road my personal findings are that you can push a well suspended sports car like the GTS harder and therefore smile more. I have extensive experience of both 718 GTS & GT4. This is spot on - if you're not tracking don't bother with the GT4

Xfe said: I have extensive experience of both 718 GTS & GT4. This is spot on - if you're not tracking don't bother with the GT4 981 GTS gone.. no way back now.

I've had a 718 Spyder for almost a year now and it was used as a semi-daily, tourer and trackday car. It suits all 3 areas very well. It is comfortable and enjoyable on road and no issues with pot holes or speed bumps for that matter which is an improvement over the 981 GT4 front splitterc. On track it gives you a a rewarding and engaging experience whilst letting you drive within your limits. Also managed a 5 day, 1500 mile into Europe with the better half and its was comfortable and practical. As people have mentioned before, the more you drive these cars, the better they sound however I understand why others choose an after market exhaust. I've only heard the JCR one in person and that's what I would choose personally as they are a professional outfit.

23wn_4f2 said: I've had a 718 Spyder for almost a year now and it was used as a semi-daily, tourer and trackday car. It suits all 3 areas very well. It is comfortable and enjoyable on road and no issues with pot holes or speed bumps for that matter which is an improvement over the 981 GT4 front splitterc. On track it gives you a a rewarding and engaging experience whilst letting you drive within your limits. Also managed a 5 day, 1500 mile into Europe with the better half and its was comfortable and practical. As people have mentioned before, the more you drive these cars, the better they sound however I understand why others choose an after market exhaust. I've only heard the JCR one in person and that's what I would choose personally as they are a professional outfit. Thanks for sharing your thoughts on your Spyder. I'm very much looking forward to the delivery. Do you remember your freeze, build and delivery dates? How far apart are they from each other? My spec freeze date just got postponed for 2 weeks, very annoyed..

Spec freeze is usually around 2 months prior to build. Delivery is usually around 4-6 weeks after build.

Nice Spyder with 200 miles on the clock at Ashgoods.

My spec freeze date just got postponed for 2 weeks, very annoyed.. [/quote] Twinfan's times are about right. Hopefully there won't be any more delay on yours and you get to enjoy some decent weather... Also, I've had some cars arrive alot sooner than expected.

Twinfan said: Spec freeze is usually around 2 months prior to build. Delivery is usually around 4-6 weeks after build. Got told my build is currently on 10th Dec. Not looking good for crossing the line before year end, Will be so gutted if the brexit tarrff gets slapped on becaused of the delay.

Nope. I'd say you won't get the car delivered, PDI'd and registered prior to the end of the year.

Twinfan said: Nope. I'd say you won't get the car delivered, PDI'd and registered prior to the end of the year. As import duty concerned, the key is to get cleared at the custom ontime? Although chaos is the first thing we should expect if WTO rules resume

blz06 said: Price wise they are quite close, maybe .1 GT3 is a tad less to buy and a bit more to run. Want to hear what you guys think or what would you choose? Currently drive a 981 GTS. To be used for weekend drives/summer trips and occasional track days. Thanks So I’m pretty much in an identical situation in tens of usage and currently in a 981 GTS and looking to move on to a used 718 GT4 PDK or 991.1 GT3. What did you go for in the end and are you hair with your choice?