Porsche UK reneging on finance deals - Page 5 - Porsche General - PistonHeads UK

I currently own a 992 Carrera S. I decided to order as my next car a Carrera 4 GTS I configured the car, agreed & signed a finance deal at 6.9% apr & paid my deposit in April 2022. The build slot was for December 2022. After a one month delay my car was delivered to UK this week, the dealership called to inform me that the deal I had signed would not be honoured & I would now have to pay 10.9% apr if I wanted the car or I could have my deposit back. Porsche UK I have lost all respect. If I had reneged on the deal I would have lost my deposit. Porsche renege on a deal & think there are no consequences. My dealership informed me they have had 10 canceled orders this week. this is not the way to treat customers.

I ordered a GR86 in April '22 and the finance deal was 4.9% at the time, which I opted for. Car was delivered in December, and I had to be reproposed for the finance as since six months has lapsed, but Toyota honoured the orignal rate despite all other new car rates increasing well above 4.9%.

Honouring a deal must mean more to Toyota than Porsche. Thank you for your reply.

Whilst unfair in principle and not exactly the best way to treat customers I suspect there will be something in the small print that will say they can do this with impunity.

David-kf8i2 said: ... Porsche renege on a deal & think there are no consequences. ... With Porsche, there aren't. "Your" car will be sold quickly enough at a profit.

David-kf8i2 said: I currently own a 992 Carrera S. I decided to order as my next car a Carrera 4 GTS I configured the car, agreed & signed a finance deal at 6.9% apr & paid my deposit in April 2022. The build slot was for December 2022. After a one month delay my car was delivered to UK this week, the dealership called to inform me that the deal I had signed would not be honoured & I would now have to pay 10.9% apr if I wanted the car or I could have my deposit back. Porsche UK I have lost all respect. If I had reneged on the deal I would have lost my deposit. Porsche renege on a deal & think there are no consequences. My dealership informed me they have had 10 canceled orders this week. this is not the way to treat customers. It’s just not feasible to expect firms to guarantee finance terms 9+ months into the future.

Porsche Financial Services is actually VW Financial Services. I would have thought the dealership have the finance rates dictated to them by VWFS who are the money lenders, I can’t imagine there’s much they can do. Although you placed an order and a deposit back in April, you only pay for and take ownership upon delivery/collection so your finance rates are only ever going to be the rate at the point you buy the car. It’s just unfortunate for you of what’s happened with interest since then. There will be a lot of people no longer wanting their cars at these rates so perhaps there could be a few cars on the forecourts and a discount to be had again soon!

I believe they only honour the finance deal when you get given an allocation. Not on order.

If rates were high when you ordered and since gone down, would they have kindly reduced the cost or stuck to it

CoolHands said: If rates were high when you ordered and since gone down, would they have kindly reduced the cost or stuck to it You would do a new application

That’s s t. Given that a new car is never going to arrive next week. I signed a mortgage extension and had 2 years to take the money, they didn’t change their mind when I finally took the cash. You could always finance independently.

Are you trading your old one in? What price do you want for it under this new deal?

Sport_Turismo_GTS said: David-kf8i2 said: I currently own a 992 Carrera S. I decided to order as my next car a Carrera 4 GTS I configured the car, agreed & signed a finance deal at 6.9% apr & paid my deposit in April 2022. The build slot was for December 2022. After a one month delay my car was delivered to UK this week, the dealership called to inform me that the deal I had signed would not be honoured & I would now have to pay 10.9% apr if I wanted the car or I could have my deposit back. Porsche UK I have lost all respect. If I had reneged on the deal I would have lost my deposit. Porsche renege on a deal & think there are no consequences. My dealership informed me they have had 10 canceled orders this week. this is not the way to treat customers. It’s just not feasible to expect firms to guarantee finance terms 9+ months into the future. Why not my wife ordered a Toyota Hilux invincible x on 0% about 14 months ago. Picks it up in two weeks. Spoke to the salesman last week, the deal is being honoured. Although I admit it’s not been collected yet but the dealership are adamant Toyota will honour the deal and I haven’t heard of them reneging on any pre approved finance deals yet. If they did we would just go elsewhere for finance. You have the same option for your Porsche.

10.9% on (I’m guessing) a 130k car, blimey. Pretty poor form from Porsche on that. There’s no way in my mind that this won’t cause a hefty correction with everything else going on. Prices are currently being supported by supply issues but that’s improving. I’d base my decision to walk away on that, more than the change in monthlies/poor behaviour from Porsche.

Porsche is a huge global brand/company and like any other company or financial institution they could have mitigated the risk . They knew how much exposure they would have lending at those rate its hardly an unknown. Even if the OP and others never actually took that finance they could sell it to other customers or doing what they re doing here and making another 4%

Seen this a lot recently with quite a few manufacturers.

Austin_Metro said: Are you trading your old one in? What price do you want for it under this new deal? I was intending to trade in my current car. The dealer principal informed me that there would be no increase in my car value to compensate for the increased apr.

Corkys said: I believe they only honour the finance deal when you get given an allocation. Not on order. I got my allocation in August, the finance quote is the current apr not what was available in August 2022?

I know a guy ordered a new Porsche getting on for 2 years ago now he has had 3 price increases from the original price of of the car as well.

MB140 said: Why not my wife ordered a Toyota Hilux invincible x on 0% about 14 months ago. Picks it up in two weeks. Spoke to the salesman last week, the deal is being honoured. Although I admit it’s not been collected yet but the dealership are adamant Toyota will honour the deal and I haven’t heard of them reneging on any pre approved finance deals yet. If they did we would just go elsewhere for finance. You have the same option for your Porsche. Same situation exactly for my Ford Ranger Wildtrack 0% deal approved over a year ago. My Ford sales guy told my last August that VW were reneging on all pre-approved low rate finance deals so it seems to be a corporate decision which Porsche have no control over.

Sorry to hear about this OP. So what have you decided regards to the new car?

Same has happened to me. Currently looking in the market for better rates but struggling at the minute to get below 10%!?

Did you ask for your deposit back? Very unlikely the OPC would keep hold of it, if you cancel.

I ordered my car in December 21. Rate at the time was 5.9%. When the car was delivered in Oct 22 they honoured the original rate.

JohnnyUK said: Did you ask for your deposit back? Very unlikely the OPC would keep hold of it, if you cancel. Always worth reading the OP

If you signed the finance deal I was under the impression they had to honour it. Might be worth double checking exactly what occurred at the point of order?

I’m sure that if they have done this then they can it’s more about how you build a long term relationship with customers. What is more annoying is that the PCP margin has gone up massively and has roughly doubled. Interesting that they have commented on other cancellations which perhaps tells a tale of woe to come, more so for the SUVs which I suspect have a higher percentage and numerical rate of financing and, likely, lower deposit rate (just speculation). For the OP, you already have a great car so it’s an easy choice to back out.

David-kf8i2 said: I currently own a 992 Carrera S. I decided to order as my next car a Carrera 4 GTS I configured the car, agreed & signed a finance deal at 6.9% apr & paid my deposit in April 2022. The build slot was for December 2022. After a one month delay my car was delivered to UK this week, the dealership called to inform me that the deal I had signed would not be honoured & I would now have to pay 10.9% apr if I wanted the car or I could have my deposit back. Porsche UK I have lost all respect. If I had reneged on the deal I would have lost my deposit. Porsche renege on a deal & think there are no consequences. My dealership informed me they have had 10 canceled orders this week. this is not the way to treat customers. They currently have more customers than they need. You and your order are clearly expendable.

That is poor form really. Another toyota customer waiting here, yaris ordered with 1.9% back in September, was allowed to change colour for more expensive option a few weeks ago without having to redo the finance at the new 6.9% rate, just paid the difference separately. Car due in March. Another little reason why they continue to be rated highly in customer satisfaction surveys.

"Reneging"? ...Porsche are just actioning their T&C's. It's a big bad world out there....

Andyoz said: "Reneging"? ...Porsche are just actioning their T&C's. It's a big bad world out there.... Not sure we’ve heard what the contract actually says. But I suspect Porsche have covered it off. It’s the first thing OP will have checked … That said, why do a deal at 6.9% if that’s not your intention? I suspect most people would think like the OP on this. As he wants the car, he needs to get finance from elsewhere and pay for it. I would probably seek to sell the trade in elsewhere so that the greedy chaps at the OPC can’t make a massive lump on that.

2 GKC said: JohnnyUK said: Did you ask for your deposit back? Very unlikely the OPC would keep hold of it, if you cancel. Always worth reading the OP To be fair, this is quite ambiguous: "After a one month delay my car was delivered to UK this week, the dealership called to inform me that the deal I had signed would not be honoured & I would now have to pay 10.9% apr if I wanted the car or I could have my deposit back. Porsche UK I have lost all respect. If I had reneged on the deal I would have lost my deposit. "

As much as I'd love a nice shiny new 911 I'd walk away, there loss IMO. As we have already seen other brands honour their deals, this would leave a sour taste in my mouth and probably wouldn't enjoy the car, I can only imagine how I'd feel at hand over with the smug salesman.

JohnnyUK said: To be fair, this is quite ambiguous: "After a one month delay my car was delivered to UK this week, the dealership called to inform me that the deal I had signed would not be honoured & I would now have to pay 10.9% apr if I wanted the car or I could have my deposit back. Porsche UK I have lost all respect. If I had reneged on the deal I would have lost my deposit. " There will be terms and conditions attached to the finance quotation, I suggest these are studied. I think it is something along the lines of, The quotation is valid for 30 days, if you take up that quotation within 30 days then you get a period where that rate is fixed, I think 6 months. So if the quotation was made and accepted in April 22 then it was valid until Oct 22 and subject to requote thereafter. Don't hold me to that but there are conditions to work to and I doubt Porsche would just at OPC level take a view, it is as has been already said a VW finance agreement and it will have conditions covering rate changes.

Freakuk said: As much as I'd love a nice shiny new 911 I'd walk away, there loss IMO. As we have already seen other brands honour their deals, this would leave a sour taste in my mouth and probably wouldn't enjoy the car, I can only imagine how I'd feel at hand over with the smug salesman. thats perhaps unfair the salesman is probably only doing what he has been told to.

Wife bought a new Golf at 6.9% - some time before delivery the rate went up to 10.9% but VWFS honoured the lower rate as she’d ordered the car before the rate rise. Can’t see why the same company haven’t done this to the OP.

I’d imagine the dealer is seriously unhappy about it, our manufacturer made us do it in the materials handling industry. Piss poor and exceptionally bad for customers and staff moral but believe me the corporate faceless morons at the top don’t give a toss. It’s all about appeasing shareholders. We’ve lost customers over it and good people have resigned. European manufacturers have really dropped the ball in my opinion they’ve all done it whilst USA and Japan haven’t. I think the war on their doorstep hasn’t helped though it’s been a perfect storm.

Give Oracle Finance a call. A great firm to deal with, certainly worth a 5 min call

I wonder how they convey this news to customers? One of my clients got a new GTS this month, he asked for it to be held for the 1st March for the new plate and was told that either he took the car now or it would be sold to someone else. He did offer to pay the full price in advance but was told no, it was this month or get back in the queue. He said the annoying thing was the take it or leave it attitude, like if the salesman had just lied and said he spoke to management but for reasons beyond their control it has to go out this month etc then he wouldn't be as annoyed about it. This finance issue would have soured the experience for me, very aspirational cars these are for people, I imagine (like my client above) the OP wanted to enjoy the whole experience from ordering to pickup.

Unless the car is registered and delivered I am guessing the salesman doesn’t get his commission and the OPC will have monthly targets to hit. Unfortunately Porsche have a good product and a queue of customers. Might change in a few months….

I would still leave it to the last minute then walk away after f king them about for a bit. Someone else will have to buy a car they haven’t specced.

From what I have heard recently this is starting to happen quite often. I’m sure you’re not the only one not comfortable paying nearly 11% on finance. Cars and allocations are starting to filter through, if you’re not desperate to change I would politely ask for the deposit back instead of getting bent over a barrel and wait it out. Sadly Porsche centre's have changed as a brand, the opc make their main chunk of cash off Macans, Tycans and Cayennes. They have a new customer base and business model, due to this their customer service isn’t at the front anymore. The dealerships will be as sole less as walking into a bmw showroom soon enough. I bet you if you asked most of the sales people nowadays about a spec of a car they wouldn’t have a clue.

If it was a bank loan, you could have paid a commitment fee from the time of approval to the time of the money being paid out to secure the rate. Guess that option does not exist for private individuals. I can understand it to a degree from a companies perspective as they would need to refinance their exposure at time of commitment, still not great from a customer retention perspective

MDL111 said: If it was a bank loan, you could have paid a commitment fee from the time of approval to the time of the money being paid out to secure the rate. Guess that option does not exist for private individuals. I can understand it to a degree from a companies perspective as they would need to refinance their exposure at time of commitment, still not great from a customer retention perspective Not necessarily. As a business VW FS will have arranged finance forward based on their expected needs for the next year or so...or should have. However, looking at how much they have increased the margin I suspect they are quite uncovered so are having to clawback. As global interest rate rises top out and, in the UK, likely reverse later in the year then PCP rates might be a few points lower this time next year especially if waiting lists start to materially shorten. Edited by EC2 on Saturday 28th January 09:51

Just greedy profiteering. VW finance are a major player who will hedge their exposures well in advance. They will know every day what they have to fund. Toyota clearly value their customers Porsche it seems just want to take your trousers down. As an aside who is mad enough to fund cars at 10% !! That’s painful

Imagine this will be a common story, in a prior era of cheap financing and supply chain issues artificially bolstering residuals, sure PCP me up. Cooking spec models going for wads over list. Fast forward to a more gloomy outlook, and higher lending costs. Cancelled orders being picked up by those who don't want to wait for the lead times, why buy that used model at list when you can have a new one. Throw in the odd fixed rate ending on the mortgage, and it's easy to see the feeding frenzy abating.

TheMuu said: Imagine this will be a common story, in a prior era of cheap financing and supply chain issues artificially bolstering residuals, sure PCP me up. Cooking spec models going for wads over list. Fast forward to a more gloomy outlook, and higher lending costs. Cancelled orders being picked up by those who don't want to wait for the lead times, why buy that used model at list when you can have a new one. Throw in the odd fixed rate ending on the mortgage, and it's easy to see the feeding frenzy abating. Absolutely, swathes of PCP renters hanging on the coat tails of cheap tick and artificially inflated values will be waking up and smelling the coffee.

EC2 said: Not necessarily. As a business VW FS will have arranged finance forward based on their expected needs for the next year or so...or should have. However, looking at how much they have increased the margin I suspect they are quite uncovered so are having to clawback. As global interest rate rises top out and, in the UK, likely reverse later in the year then PCP rates might be a few points lower this time next year especially if waiting lists start to materially shorten. Edited by EC2 on Saturday 28th January 09:51 I suspect rates got away from them given the significant shift over a very short timeframe (and the fact that they were basically negative for a very long time beforehand)

Ive spoke to my local jct500 dealer who says no cancelled orders to date which I find surprising especially with the cost of borrowing for these vehicles going up

I have a new Macan scheduled for delivery in April. On the various VWFS deals I’ve had in the past their rates are typically about 5.5% above BoE rate of the day. At the moment their margin is 7.4% & they insist on lending far more money than I need. So I’m going the personal loan route this time & have £20k promised at 6.9% over four years.

No affiliation, but Oracle Finance PCP "representative APR" is quoted at 8.49%

I ordered an Audi in Nov 21, still not here but finance all unchanged whenever it arrives. Apologies to the 99% of PH who are either cash buyers or driving s tboxes. TX.

Terminator X said: I ordered an Audi in Nov 21, still not here but finance all unchanged whenever it arrives. Apologies to the 99% of PH who are either cash buyers or driving s tboxes. TX. LOL, I think something like 90% of new cars are bought with finance - that leaves 10% driving s tboxes or laundering cash....

I have a 992S on order from jun 22 but am still awaiting allocation. I was going to buy it cash so the APR rates aren’t a huge concern but given the state of the market I won’t be taking the order unless it now fits with the release of the 992.2. Prices are softening and I don’t want to be paying over the odds for a 992.1 when there are good ones now appearing sub £95k.

andyglos said: I have a 992S on order from jun 22 but am still awaiting allocation. I was going to buy it cash so the APR rates aren’t a huge concern but given the state of the market I won’t be taking the order unless it now fits with the release of the 992.2. Prices are softening and I don’t want to be paying over the odds for a 992.1 when there are good ones now appearing sub £95k. I'd do the same

andyglos said: I have a 992S on order from jun 22 but am still awaiting allocation. I was going to buy it cash so the APR rates aren’t a huge concern but given the state of the market I won’t be taking the order unless it now fits with the release of the 992.2. Prices are softening and I don’t want to be paying over the odds for a 992.1 when there are good ones now appearing sub £95k. Not seen any at 95? What year 2022?

Not 2022 but a few 2021 and many more 2020 and 2019. The supply of used and new cars will undoubtedly increase further as we move through 2023 and thus soften prices further.

Just had a look and all 911 prices have softened quite a bit. There’s a lot of cars out there and limited buyers.

86 said: Just had a look and all 911 prices have softened quite a bit. There’s a lot of cars out there and limited buyers. Maybe I should wait a little longer

86 said: Just greedy profiteering. VW finance are a major player who will hedge their exposures well in advance. They will know every day what they have to fund. Toyota clearly value their customers Porsche it seems just want to take your trousers down. As an aside who is mad enough to fund cars at 10% !! That’s painful You don't hedge an exposure when the customer is not guaranteed to take out the finance!

Sport_Turismo_GTS said: 86 said: Just greedy profiteering. VW finance are a major player who will hedge their exposures well in advance. They will know every day what they have to fund. Toyota clearly value their customers Porsche it seems just want to take your trousers down. As an aside who is mad enough to fund cars at 10% !! That’s painful You don't hedge an exposure when the customer is not guaranteed to take out the finance! Indeed, because you are not hedging deal by deal but you do hedge a certain (high) percentage of your budgeted business to protect yourself and increase your chance of hitting unit volume forecasts. Given how financially aware most Porsche buyers are likely to be I find it strange that of all the VW FS offers Porsche seems to have some of the highest rates. On a slightly related topic, the news that the Alpine sportscar will probably go offsale in Europe from July next year due to regulations on various safety systems does raise the question of whether the electric Macan/Cayman/Boxster might be released early with bugs galore as the existing cars will not warrant investment in new systems (hopefully someone can confirm if these cars already meet the changes?).

I may have missed something in the replies to date, but the OP said he 'signed a finance deal' at time of ordering the Porsche. I find that very odd, as have never signed a finance agreement until the car is physically available for delivery. Yes, finance may have been gone through and approved, but surely the formal paperwork wasn't signed. As such, its just life. Bank rates have changed in the period between placing the order and the car becoming available, so these increases are being passed on. I'd be annoyed also, but would have been expecting it to be honest.

Hobo said: I may have missed something in the replies to date, but the OP said he 'signed a finance deal' at time of ordering the Porsche. I find that very odd, as have never signed a finance agreement until the car is physically available for delivery. Yes, finance may have been gone through and approved, but surely the formal paperwork wasn't signed. As such, its just life. Bank rates have changed in the period between placing the order and the car becoming available, so these increases are being passed on. I'd be annoyed also, but would have been expecting it to be honest. Im afraid I read the same.If you have signed a deal they cannot renege on it. More likely that was what they were offering at the time and the sands have shifted. Thats how it is Im afraid. If you have signed a deal then you have grounds for action. Would be clearer if you could be specific. Have you signed a deal?

Sport_Turismo_GTS said: 86 said: Just greedy profiteering. VW finance are a major player who will hedge their exposures well in advance. They will know every day what they have to fund. Toyota clearly value their customers Porsche it seems just want to take your trousers down. As an aside who is mad enough to fund cars at 10% !! That’s painful You don't hedge an exposure when the customer is not guaranteed to take out the finance! You don’t hedge deal by deal but like all finance houses they know what percentage of deals come to fruition. People like Toyota are still honouring 4.9% and will be for rest of 23 if you ordered last year VW Finance have been raising money at low rates. You have to be pretty desperate to pay 11% on finance for a car. https://www.vwfs.com/en/media/press-releases/2022/...

Looking back at an email my wife had when she bought her Golf (via VWFS) - she hadn’t actually signed a finance agreement but as she was accepted for finance before the rates went up, they honoured the lower rate.

I hope they are paying 10% interest on any returned deposits!

Square Leg said: Looking back at an email my wife had when she bought her Golf (via VWFS) - she hadn’t actually signed a finance agreement but as she was accepted for finance before the rates went up, they honoured the lower rate. Correct. You get accepted for finance, but don't sign anything until the car turns up. This is what the OP said though, he said he signed the finance agreement, and I struggle to see that happening. As for VWFS, that is no doubt their (or in this case the OPC's) choice. In this case, the OPC (or VWFS) decided they they were to increase the APR in line with the market increases, probably in the knowledge they had a massive waiting list for people wanting cars and could sell it on without issue. Clearly it is going to annoy people, as will significantly increase monthly payments, but not really the fault of VWFS. The world has changed in the past 12 months and credit is no longer as cheap as it was. Go try getting a mortgage now on an offer made 12 months ago. In one way it may be good. There will no doubt be less buyers around due to the costs, so less cars, better residuals, better exclusivity, and potentially more chance of getting the cars previously out of reach.

Just pay cash/finance it independently- 10.9% is ludicrous

Anyone had any luck with more competitive PCP offers? Majority of the big name companies I know of are all around the 10% APR mark.

If more normal depreciation returns, ie 10%, combined with 10% apr it’ll make these very expensive fun if financed.

ags11 said: If more normal depreciation returns, ie 10%, combined with 10% apr it’ll make these very expensive fun if financed. Dealers will have to discount haha

ags11 said: If more normal depreciation returns, ie 10%, combined with 10% apr it’ll make these very expensive fun if financed. Indeed, change in market dynamics is coming.

AJAYE2015 said: Dealers will have to discount haha Hard with the inflationary pressures on their input costs. They are a bit screwed...was bound to happen as economies are an emergent system (even though central bankers seem to think otherwise and that they can 'control' them)

86 said: Sport_Turismo_GTS said: 86 said: Just greedy profiteering. VW finance are a major player who will hedge their exposures well in advance. They will know every day what they have to fund. Toyota clearly value their customers Porsche it seems just want to take your trousers down. As an aside who is mad enough to fund cars at 10% !! That’s painful You don't hedge an exposure when the customer is not guaranteed to take out the finance! You don’t hedge deal by deal but like all finance houses they know what percentage of deals come to fruition. People like Toyota are still honouring 4.9% and will be for rest of 23 if you ordered last year VW Finance have been raising money at low rates. You have to be pretty desperate to pay 11% on finance for a car. https://www.vwfs.com/en/media/press-releases/2022/... Those bond deals were issued a year ago, that money will have long since been spoken for.

I’ve been looking at GTS models for the past couple of months and three vehicles that I was following have all dropped 5k and are still up for sale. The entire network seems to be reducing prices so I just can’t see how dealers can carry on saying order books are still full with two year waiting lists. If the waiting lists are that strong dealers would be still fighting to get used car stock not dropping their prices.

Chipper said: I’ve been looking at GTS models for the past couple of months and three vehicles that I was following have all dropped 5k and are still up for sale. The entire network seems to be reducing prices so I just can’t see how dealers can carry on saying order books are still full with two year waiting lists. If the waiting lists are that strong dealers would be still fighting to get used car stock not dropping their prices. But waiting lists are still strong, as I took delivery of my 992 Targa GTS back in May 2022 and placed an order at the same time for another one, and having chased it earlier this week, and still many months away from delivery. I fully suspect my delivery to come forward as people baulk over finance rates, but how many... who knows. I'm wanting the next one to be a Gen 2 anyway.

I think all the prestige car brands are softening at the moment. Mclaren have def, porsche have, some ferrari but not all and some of the Aston cars. Higher interest rates can lock you into paying several hundred a month more than a year or 2 back for the same car. This WILL curb demand and WILL lead to cancelled orders resulting in new cancelled cars being available on the forecourt which then makes the used ones on the forecourt being less attractive and so a reduced price is applied. The time to have bought was early 2021 with hindsight. Lots of new cars still available in fields , cheap interest, dealers realising the pipeline of new cars coming through was emptying so offering higher part ex prices. Win win. Today not quite the same. Supply getting better from the factories Interest rates up Falling part ex prices Inflation upping the cost of the new car Lose lose now. I wouldn't be accepting 11% interest rates in the current dynamics of the market. As disappointed as I woukd be having waited many months for the new car I think I would walk and see how it plays out in the coming year

I switched my deposit/allocation from the new T to a 992.2 C2S last week and they were very keen to make an offer on my T. I’m sure the market is changing but suppose no one truly knows how it’s going to pan out.

Offers will just be a function of the stock they’re holding. Very few 991 Ts in the network. Loads of 992 GTSs and Turbos.

I enquired about a VW for the wife today and was offered 6.9% APR, so it's more down to how much Porsche choose to load the rate than it is the cost of funds to the VW group.

If they fear a crash in demand for lux toys then the way they can show confidence and hold the residuals is by charging a premium on interest to create a buffer against the buy back price being too high. I appreciate that Porsche is probably maximising its profit post IPO but what has happened to residuals.

I am (maybe was!) in the market for a new Macan GTS - I asked my dealer about the "stickiness" of the APR - here's the response: "That is our national rate which is the same for all Porsche centres and competitive with the current automotive market at present. The rate can change and move up or down as you stated and our quotations are valid for 30 days. Once you are proposed and approved with the finance they have a pay out window, so the rate is fixed for a little longer - up to 90 days. I will attempt to make sure you have an approval much closer to the delivery of your car so you have as much clarity as we can offer."

The mortgage market is once again moving fast, for the better. Folk sitting it out or successfully shopping elsewhere for their hard earned drip will mean only one thing. OPC arranged funding will have to follow suit

jonny finance said: The mortgage market is once again moving fast, for the better. Folk sitting it out or successfully shopping elsewhere for their hard earned drip will mean only one thing. OPC arranged funding will have to follow suit Yup, I think you're right. I have a call tomoz with Oracle Finance to see what they will offer

My 2019 Macan is all paid for so needed another £25k to pay for new one coming in April so searched market for personal loans over 48months. I started with M&S, where I funded current car, they offered £15k at 8.9%, but Nationwide were better offering £20k at 6.9%. Their money is in my bank.

N111BJG said: My 2019 Macan is all paid for so needed another £25k to pay for new one coming in April so searched market for personal loans over 48months. I started with M&S, where I funded current car, they offered £15k at 8.9%, but Nationwide were better offering £20k at 6.9%. Their money is in my bank. Definitely worth shopping around and not hard to beat Porsche APR!

Yes personal loan rates are still reasonable value for many. The issue that will distort the direction of the market is pcp finance which I understand to be by far the most popular way to buy a new car especially the high end stuff. As has Been mentioned already there are 2 issues at play, the higher interest rates (almost certainly about to go higher today!) And the finance companies having to try and work out what the future value and hence balloon payment should be in 3 or 4 years time. Will used values still be relatively high or are they going to slide back to more tradional levels? So if pcp becomes less attractive then I can only see new car sales slumping.

Longy00000 said: Yes personal loan rates are still reasonable value for many. The issue that will distort the direction of the market is pcp finance which I understand to be by far the most popular way to buy a new car especially the high end stuff. As has Been mentioned already there are 2 issues at play, the higher interest rates (almost certainly about to go higher today!) And the finance companies having to try and work out what the future value and hence balloon payment should be in 3 or 4 years time. Will used values still be relatively high or are they going to slide back to more tradional levels? So if pcp becomes less attractive then I can only see new car sales slumping. Agreed

I know of several people who have come to the end of their current 3 Yr deal and have negotiated extensions or taken out personal loans to pay the balloon off as to get a new deal for similar car would be several hundred pounds a month more or in one case to keep the payments about the same it was a case of dropping from a well specced 5 series to less specced 3 series. He kept his 5 for now. More and more people are to come in for a shock when they expect to just change cars as they have done in the past.

AJAYE2015 said: Longy00000 said: So if pcp becomes less attractive then I can only see new car sales slumping. Agreed Yes, I'm likely to delay this purchase - maybe the Macan EV will be a better buy anyway?

Longy00000 said: I know of several people who have come to the end of their current 3 Yr deal and have negotiated extensions or taken out personal loans to pay the balloon off as to get a new deal for similar car would be several hundred pounds a month more or in one case to keep the payments about the same it was a case of dropping from a well specced 5 series to less specced 3 series. He kept his 5 for now. More and more people are to come in for a shock when they expect to just change cars as they have done in the past. What you could get you cant have now unless you pay more money for it. For the ones who stretched to get into certain cars to 'look the part' a bit of a reality shock is pending

Hobo said: Correct. You get accepted for finance, but don't sign anything until the car turns up. This is what the OP said though, he said he signed the finance agreement, and I struggle to see that happening. As for VWFS, that is no doubt their (or in this case the OPC's) choice. In this case, the OPC (or VWFS) decided they they were to increase the APR in line with the market increases, probably in the knowledge they had a massive waiting list for people wanting cars and could sell it on without issue. Clearly it is going to annoy people, as will significantly increase monthly payments, but not really the fault of VWFS. The world has changed in the past 12 months and credit is no longer as cheap as it was. Go try getting a mortgage now on an offer made 12 months ago. In one way it may be good. There will no doubt be less buyers around due to the costs, so less cars, better residuals, better exclusivity, and potentially more chance of getting the cars previously out of reach. It's very good IMO. It's annoying paying full whack for a car only to be seen in the same bracket by onlookers as someone renting it for a bag of sand a month. Cheap finance devalues the brand.

rawenghey said: Hobo said: Clearly it is going to annoy people, as will significantly increase monthly payments, but not really the fault of VWFS. The world has changed in the past 12 months and credit is no longer as cheap as it was. Go try getting a mortgage now on an offer made 12 months ago. In one way it may be good. There will no doubt be less buyers around due to the costs, so less cars, better residuals, better exclusivity, and potentially more chance of getting the cars previously out of reach. It's very good IMO. It's annoying paying full whack for a car only to be seen in the same bracket by onlookers as someone renting it for a bag of sand a month. Cheap finance devalues the brand. Surely these have got to be parody comments, I find it hard to believe that you'd actually think fewer buyers would lead to better residuals - you're aware of how supply and demand works right? Additionally, if you think there would be fewer cars around then you're assuming Porsche doesn't have any sales targets to hit to keep shareholders happy Regarding cheap finance devaluing the brand - ignoring any snobbery concerns of the comment assuming you meant finance allowed the "wrong kind of people to buy Porsches" - Take a look at Porsche's growth as a brand in the era of cheap finance from circa 2008 to early 2022. It's clear which version was more valuable in any single objective measure e.g. total company valuation, consumer demand, total sales/revenue, oversubscription of waiting lists for events, trackdays, build slots and the list goes on

jonny finance said: The mortgage market is once again moving fast, for the better. Folk sitting it out or successfully shopping elsewhere for their hard earned drip will mean only one thing. OPC arranged funding will have to follow suit Then an increase today of half a percent means 2 steps back?

For what it’s worth, I think it depends on whether you requested a finance quote when you placed your order and your dealership. By sheer dumb luck, I requested a finance quote when I ordered my Macan GTS last January and was offered 6.4% APR, which at the time felt pricey. Apparently that locked it in and when the car recently finally arrived, they honoured it, thankfully. I did have to sign the finance paperwork a couple of weeks early, because they said Porsche wouldn’t honour the old rate past the end of 2022, but that was not a hard decision to take versus going up to 10.9%!!

Where will this end? if the rate is nearly 11% and many people pull out of the pre orders, these cars will sit in the dealers and they will want to shift them, if they start reducing prices this will effect the 2nd hand car market?? Maybe i need to rub my crystal ball harder....

garypotter said: Where will this end? if the rate is nearly 11% and many people pull out of the pre orders, these cars will sit in the dealers and they will want to shift them, if they start reducing prices this will effect the 2nd hand car market?? Maybe i need to rub my crystal ball harder.... There are increasing numbers of new cars (albeit not particularly inspiring ones) being listed on the AUC site - from my experience these are not all the new cars an OPC has either. I imagine that those who have got used to changing or upgrading cars regularly will be thinking twice in the current climate? Or perhaps the vehicles previously being bought regularly to support future halo purchases are now being reconsidered? Good time to buy a high spec Taycan or Panemera it seems - not for me at £170k for the top spec ones :-(

Though Tacans currently have a problem with a heater module failure for which they are producing a modification and recommending in the meantime that the cars should not be driven .. ?

rawenghey said: It's very good IMO. It's annoying paying full whack for a car only to be seen in the same bracket by onlookers as someone renting it for a bag of sand a month. Cheap finance devalues the brand. Surely this is a joke? Nobody actually thinks like that, do they!? Do you honestly care how much someone else thinks you are paying for a car?

Do we know what the OP ended up doing? Did they accept the 11% deal? It was interesting to hear that VW dealers are offering 6.9%. Porsche seem to be profiteering. Feels like time for a windfall tax!

belfry said: Do we know what the OP ended up doing? Did they accept the 11% deal? It was interesting to hear that VW dealers are offering 6.9%. Porsche seem to be profiteering. Feels like time for a windfall tax! Porsche are charging the maximum they can whilst still selling new cars. Is that profiteering or are they just doing what most people who run a business would do ? There are frequently posts on here from people asking for suggestion for third party fiancé co’s because the OPC rate isn’t competitive….no it sure I have seen many saying OPC finance is competitive/matches a VW dealer. I think it is business as normal to be honest.

Cheib said: Porsche are charging the maximum they can whilst still selling new cars. Is that profiteering or are they just doing what most people who run a business would do ? There are frequently posts on here from people asking for suggestion for third party fiancé co’s because the OPC rate isn’t competitive….no it sure I have seen many saying OPC finance is competitive/matches a VW dealer. I think it is business as normal to be honest. Agreed. If purchasing dealer finance was a condition of getting the allocation, then you could argue it was profiteering. However, as has always been the case, you can shop around and get the best deal for your circumstances (which has rarely been direct through Porsche)!