cayman brake up grade

Hi guys, tomorrow, i will be taking my front brakes apart to see if it fits in the rear ...just for kicks.... then i'm going to see if this kit fits in the front http://e-partssales.com/Merchant2/m...chant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=P&Product_Code=6Piston&Category_Code=997brakes just for kicks :banana: someone please tell me i'm crazy b/c it'll never work

I tried this last week - the front kit will only fit 19' WHEELS...

Why would you wanna do that?

I didn't have time to do that this weekend...but it WILL be on my list of things to do. ttommason - what do you mean you tried it? Did you actually bought the kit & fitted it? Thanks

need cayman - i drove a friend's 997S with PCCB's and fell in love with it. I'm on a mission to get as close to it as possible

Since the fronts on our cars are the rear's on a 996GT3, I'm sure that something an be done. I'm sure that you can fit those fronts under 18" wheels, just which one's? They will have to have enough back spacing to allow the caliper to clear. Spacers might be needed... Looks like a great kit, keep us involved. You can always use more brakes at the track!

Hi The Cayman front brakes have diffirent part numbers and piston sizes than rears on a 996 GT3. The GT3 have the same piston sizes in the rear as a Cayman rear. The Cayman front calipers have a piston area of 72% more than the rears. This will not be good for the brake biasing. Front to rear piston ratios are important to get optimal braking. Cheers Herman

The best upgrade is pads, then lines, then fluid, then if you experience fade problems, a big brake kit. Have you already updgraded pads, lines, and fluid?

I would put fluid before lines. And in many cases, fluid before upgraded pads. Fluid degrades very quickly (which I sadly know) by absorbing moisture and lowering its boiling point.

I don't get it either...

What's with all the why's? I want to get front GT3 brakes and move the existing front brakes to the rear. If I succeed, the following will be accomplished: front: 4 pistons to 6 pistons, larger GT3 pads, 318mm rotors to 350mm rotors rear: 299mm rotors to 318mm rotors, larger pads from the use of front calipers of course i will also be doing ss lines and fluids in the process. my only question is will it bolt up or will i have to have some custom brackets made? With my luck i'm probably going to have to have some brakets made - but all is well. will post update.

Herman, Do you know what's the difference in contact area (or even better: braking efficiency) for gt3 front vs. cayman front brakes? If ultimately we keep similar brake biasing then we should be okay right? Thanks in advance for the info, Herman.

ringmeister brings up a good point. If you upgrade the brakes you might find yourself in need of a larger capacity master cylinder. Since I have a lot of experience in a 964, I can tell you that the upgrade to the 993TT "Big Red" brakes required you to install a larger master cylinder since you were moving more fluid. If you forge ahead with the upgrade, be sure you get a brake bias control. Willwood has a nice one. It's a very simple valve to adjust the front/rear brake ratio. With so much more clamping force at the front end, the rear of car will be all over the place. You'll have to adjust the bias to the rear a little more to compensate. Once you get it dialed in, make sure you mark the valve so you can set it back to the correct position in the case someone twists it. (ask me why I know!)

Hi Guys I will try to attach a spread sheet with all the brake info. The Cayman master cylinder works fine for 993tt brakes as the pistons are almost the same as stock. I have it on my car. If you do succeed in getting the front brakes in the rear your ABS will activate much sooner and you will have to little pressure to get the front brakes to work. This will reduce you braking capacity a lot. I have had major problems on my 930 with 993tt brakes. This took ages to get sorted out as well as a few nervous scenarios at high speed. Do not change brakes without consulting a specialist as it is complicated and dangerous should they not work when you need it. Speak to Matt Weiss at Stoptech. Cheers Herman

Hi I have attached a excell zip file for the brake info. I hope it work.

Herman, Thank you for the info and the contact. I would think that a bigger master cylinder is necessary because i'm not upgrading to 993tt brakes but rather 997 GT3 brakes. Also, Herman, what does the "s" & "l" stand for under front and rear calipers? Thanks

Hi Dimitri The caliper has two pistons per side, s=small l = large in mm diameter. The Cayman mc will work as during braking you are only displacing a little amount of fluid as the pads are almost touching the discs. You may need 997 gt3 hub carriers as well. Cheers Herman

Herman, Thanks for the info once again. I'm thinking about calling suncoast to have them check the distance between the 2 mounting point for the GT3 calipers. Here's why, and please pardon my ESL tongue: I just inspected the front and rear calipers. The 2 bolts from the caliper to the hub carrier are the same distant apart when measured from center to center: approx 5 inches - or approx 100mm. That's a nice and round number that i'd use if i was a porsche engineer. Moreover, you can see clearly that the front calipers are positioned away from the spindle to accomodate for the larger rotor and vice versa for the rear caliper. This leads me to believe that not only the front calipers will bolt directly to the rear, it will also be positioned perfectly to use the front rotors as if it came from the factory. I must make sometime to scratch this itch this weekend. Now only if i can find someone with a spare GT3 caliper and rotor to test fit that'd be terrific! :cheers:

Hi Chris I use Pagid Orange in the front with 993tt brakes and Pagid Black R14 in the back on stock brakes. The R14's are more aggressive to compensate for the larger fronts. This set up work really well. By fitting the front brakes on the rear you increase the force on the pad by about 40% and with a bigger pad as well you can double the braking force with the same pedal imput. If you have the same percentage increase in the front it could work. Changing front pads are very diffirent from doubling the rear braking force. A Willwood brake biasing valve can be used to balance the brakes if the system does not have pressure reducing valve allready. There is no harm in trying it out. If it works I have a spare set which I have taken of my car. Cheers Herman

with some research on the brembo website, i've found the following about their 380mm front BBK: Part # 1M1.9007A fits 997 C2S and GT3 Part # 1M1.9006A fits 996 C4S, 997 C4S, and 997 Turbo Part # 1M1.9004A fits 996 C2, 997 C2, and Cayman S All of these kits use the same calipers, assembled discs, and pads. That means that the difference lies in the mounting brackets? That also means that the GT3 6-pot system will not bolt on to the cayman without the use of custom brackets. Hm......

GT-3 Brake Conversion Contact Rob or Kip at Farnbacher Loles for a complete upgrade package. [phone removed] farnbacherloles.com

I have been looking for a set of the PCCB on ebay saw a new set sold for $5K recently. I would ge t the calipers painted red though.

As re: front/rear bias questions & issues, http://www.planet-9.com/showthread.php?p=149544#post149544 Still looking for more information etc. on brake modifications.' Cheers :beer:

Herman and 'ringmeister give good advice here. Personally and based on experience, I would stay with what you have. The 6 pistons will be sexy, but anything beyond that you'd be tossing $$$$$ out the window, trust me. The 2405/2406 brake sizes you have on a Cayman S are nice and large, and fully up to the job. Make certain you don't track with stock pads, and and a switch to Motul 600 or Castrol SRF is always a good idea. Brake bias is an important thing here. Overall chances are you'd increase your braking distances. On my 930 - for reference of concept: I have Big Reds on the front, and 944T fronts on the rears - the rear pistons are huge and require the use of a proportioning valve to limit rear brake bias - As it is, I love it - I have found the sweet spot of brake bias (certainly more rear than stock!)