DIY servicing = unsaleable? - Page 2 - Boxster/Cayman - PistonHeads UK

I just read in another thread that a Cayman without an OPC, or recognised independent service history, is unsaleable. Is that true? I am looking to buy a Cayman next year, a late gen 1 or early gen 2, and I have always done my own servicing. Not because I can save money, but because I believe I do a better job, and I like knowing a car inside and out. All my work to date has been backed up by receipts, service schedules, notes, etc.

If you can write your own check list and maybe even take a few photos as you service then that would be as good if not better than any invoice that merely says "major service". Even better document anything that is over and above the normal schedule too.

interesting one, but like you, i like do all mine own stuff, ive just spend a small fortune on reducing the chance of bore score on mine, millers nanotech oil, at £15 per l, new thermostat, new porsche antifrezze, but people will still whine tho!

It was me that made the comment. A lot of Porsche buyers won't touch them without a warranty, let alone stamps. I suppose there are people who would buy it, but there are an lot who wouldn't because of those stamps (I service my other cars, but not the Porsche). The thinking behind this is (playing devils advocate), I don't know you, I don't know how competent you are or if you've done all the things you've said you have. From an OPC or a specialist, you give the buyer piece of mind that it's been looked after by someone who (in theory) knows the cars. These being expensive cars with expensive parts make people quite wary of them and their history. Just look at the prices of old Cayman's, Boxsters and 996's because of the fears of the chocolate engines. People are quite paranoid about them. It's b ks as you say, there's nothing to say you can't do a better job and there's nothing particularly special about the cars that needs some sort of voodoo to do. Edited by juansolo on Tuesday 7th July 21:12

I bought my last 986 Boxster with nothing in the history file ... You can advertise your car as "full service history". Make an effort with your paperwork ie print it, date it, reg and VIN number, mileage, itemise work done, stick a Porsche crest logo on it and it will look good.

Thanks guys. I always keep receipts for everything, even down to things like wiper blades, when I sell a car and say it has a full history, it really does have a full history. PS: Juan, your old Westfield is still going strong. Gearbox died last year, so I fitted BGH long first in it for him.

Some interesting posts there, I'm amazed there are others out in the Porsche world who also scratch their heads at the need for "full OPC SH". I bought my car just over a year ago and yes, it did have FSH, so was it a deal breaker ? No. The FSH made me more likely to travel to view the car, but it was the car I bought, not a book of stamps. With cars from the 60s & 70s there was quite a bit to do at service time, greasing joints, adjusting brakes, etc. But these days it just seems to be a "check nothing has fallen off and change the oil", and that's not really beyond the average mechanic or enthusiast. So when the drive belts were due for changing this year I bought the Porsche belt (which looks exactly the same as the aftermarket belt only with "Porsche" stamped on the sides) and changed it myself. It took me two days because I'm slow, but so what ? The belt's renewed and working, just as if an OPC had done the job, no difference apart from a receipt in the folder instead of an OPC stamp. Do I care I've dropped the car's value by £XXXX ? Nope, because when I sell it will be a 10yr old car and hopefully in better nick than the average 10yr old. If I was only going to keep it for a year or so then yes, I'd follow the pack with OPC servicing because it would give me a greater market, but that's the only reason for doing so. Brian oh - if you do go DIY, you'll need to buy the software & lead for the diagnostic checks and resetting the service light.....

I recently bought a Cayman Gen II 2.9 - it's the first car I've ever bought where I didn't see the engine! I know it's there somewhere. My car has a full Porsche service history, with lots of receipts, but I'll be continuing the service history by getting work done by an independent - this is really for reasons of accessibility (where is my engine?) and lack of workshop manual (are any workshop manuals available for a Gen II 2.9?). I was put off of some cars that I viewed simply because although OPC serviced their service book showed only minimal servicing, e.g. serviced according to mileage rather than age and sometimes a minor when it should have been major, and no receipts present showing what other work was done. I'd be more confident buying a home serviced car if the car was cheap enough and came with lots or receipts for all work done.

Megaflow said: PS: Juan, your old Westfield is still going strong. Gearbox died last year, so I fitted BGH long first in it for him. Awesome! I assume this is the blue one? If so that's one car that pained me so much to let go. But hey ho, at least it's being used, I wasn't using it enough to justify keeping it. Also it's the only one with a standard box (the previous two had straight cut boxes). I'd planned, had I kept it, to swap that out for a hybrid Tran-X (1st to 4th straight cut, 5th helical) or a BGH had I gone more road oriented. Bloody brilliant car that one. I lost the guy's contact details when I left my job (was on my work's phone when I returned it) as I wanted to ask him if he ever thought of selling it to give me a ring Edited by juansolo on Wednesday 8th July 09:16

On something like a Porsche I would walk away, however on an old Ford/Vauxhall it would not bother me at all.

You are narrowing the market of buyers, as some won't believe you are capable, but I've never had problems selling any of my cars which have been serviced by myself. Usually I end up selling to someone who will do the same. I keep accurate records and all the receipts. My 996 was maintained by a string of premium specialists and OPCs before I got it, but I do everything myself. Depends on how long you would be keeping it for - 1 year then just get it serviced and stamped, but over 5 years the cost saving will be substantial - which you can pass onto buyers if you have to.

juansolo said: Awesome! I assume this is the blue one? If so that's one car that pained me so much to let go. But hey ho, at least it's being used, I wasn't using it enough to justify keeping it. Also it's the only one with a standard box (the previous two had straight cut boxes). I'd planned, had I kept it, to swap that out for a hybrid Tran-X (1st to 4th straight cut, 5th helical) or a BGH had I gone more road oriented. Bloody brilliant car that one. I lost the guy's contact details when I left my job (was on my work's phone when I returned it) as I wanted to ask him if he ever thought of selling it to give me a ring Yep, the blue one. We used to work together, he has since moved on, if he ever sells, I'll let him know. DarkMatter said: I recently bought a Cayman Gen II 2.9 - it's the first car I've ever bought where I didn't see the engine! I know it's there somewhere. My car has a full Porsche service history, with lots of receipts, but I'll be continuing the service history by getting work done by an independent - this is really for reasons of accessibility (where is my engine?) and lack of workshop manual (are any workshop manuals available for a Gen II 2.9?). I was put off of some cars that I viewed simply because although OPC serviced their service book showed only minimal servicing, e.g. serviced according to mileage rather than age and sometimes a minor when it should have been major, and no receipts present showing what other work was done. I'd be more confident buying a home serviced car if the car was cheap enough and came with lots or receipts for all work done. I'd be servicing annually regardless of mileage. It wouldn't do the full 20k between services, but it would be a good 10k a year. Normally I am a great fan of following manufacturers service intervals on cars, but 20k on something like a Porsche just seems wrong. But, on a normal family wagon I wouldn't think twice about it. tyrrell said: On something like a Porsche I would walk away, however on an old Ford/Vauxhall it would not bother me at all. As you are the first person to really sound against it, why do you believe it is so much more detrimental on a Porsche? After all it is no more complicated to change the oil on a Porsche than a Ford, and aside from a few checks, that's mostly all services are these days. Edited by Megaflow on Wednesday 8th July 12:09 Edited by Megaflow on Wednesday 8th July 12:12

i can see why you would worry without one but then again most cars after three or four years get done by a local garage or diy. just to throw a spanner amongst the pigeons we bought a 100k A4 that had five oil changes in its life i put it on the yearly service did a pela oil change and did it myself. which is the better bet, which is safer? which will sell more easily? im not sure, id rather buy it off an enthusiast all things considered

b2hbm said: Some interesting posts there, I'm amazed there are others out in the Porsche world who also scratch their heads at the need for "full OPC SH". I bought my car just over a year ago and yes, it did have FSH, so was it a deal breaker ? No. The FSH made me more likely to travel to view the car, but it was the car I bought, not a book of stamps. With cars from the 60s & 70s there was quite a bit to do at service time, greasing joints, adjusting brakes, etc. But these days it just seems to be a "check nothing has fallen off and change the oil", and that's not really beyond the average mechanic or enthusiast. So when the drive belts were due for changing this year I bought the Porsche belt (which looks exactly the same as the aftermarket belt only with "Porsche" stamped on the sides) and changed it myself. It took me two days because I'm slow, but so what ? The belt's renewed and working, just as if an OPC had done the job, no difference apart from a receipt in the folder instead of an OPC stamp. Do I care I've dropped the car's value by £XXXX ? Nope, because when I sell it will be a 10yr old car and hopefully in better nick than the average 10yr old. If I was only going to keep it for a year or so then yes, I'd follow the pack with OPC servicing because it would give me a greater market, but that's the only reason for doing so. Brian oh - if you do go DIY, you'll need to buy the software & lead for the diagnostic checks and resetting the service light..... Ive got the software & lead, not cheap, but plan to keep car for a while

Have you got a link to, or the name of this lead and software. I have got full diagnostics for power train, abs, esp, srs, etc but I doubt it will do Porsche service light reset

I'll say it...I too would not contemplate a Porsche that hasn't been professionally serviced. It may be the lesser of two evils but I would trust a paid professional more than a DIYer. Having been in the world of Caterhams which lends itself much more to the DIYer, I have seen enough DIY s te to last me a lifetime! It may be just a personal choice, but DIY servicing will drastically reduce your target audience come resale time. Bert

Megaflow said: Have you got a link to, or the name of this lead and software. I have got full diagnostics for power train, abs, esp, srs, etc but I doubt it will do Porsche service light reset http://www.durametric.com/

BertBert said: I'll say it...I too would not contemplate a Porsche that hasn't been professionally serviced. It may be the lesser of two evils but I would trust a paid professional more than a DIYer. Having been in the world of Caterhams which lends itself much more to the DIYer, I have seen enough DIY s te to last me a lifetime! It may be just a personal choice, but DIY servicing will drastically reduce your target audience come resale time. Bert Completely disagree; how do you think the DIY skills of our very own GTRClive compare to your OPC mech. I wouldn't trust anyone near my cars. If I need a stamp I will not let OPC service my car without me being in attendance. Being a Licenced Aircraft Engineer the tolerances I am use to far exceed that in the automotive industry and as such the levels of finesse and attention to detail of OPC's and the like are not for me.

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corvettedave said: Megaflow said: Have you got a link to, or the name of this lead and software. I have got full diagnostics for power train, abs, esp, srs, etc but I doubt it will do Porsche service light reset http://www.durametric.com/ If you're in the UK, I got mine from Hickleys and bought the enthusiast package #1. Expensive for what it is, but then again it does exactly what it says on the tin. The ability to do a complete check on the car is quite handy IMO, especially if like me you live quite a way from the nearest OPC or independent. https://www.hickleys.com/diagnostics/durametric.ph...

My worst Porsche ownership experience in terms of major faults in the last 20 odd years was the one with the most impeccable OPC history bought from a high end dealer. My worst maintenance experience in terms of poor workmanship was with one of the top independents who many forum posters on various websites seem to believe can do no wrong. I have spent 37 years in the maintenance business in a wide variety of roles from hands on spanner turning to overall responsibility for producing from scratch the complete maintenance schedules, repair procedures, technical manuals, support systems and long term service contracts for some of the largest and most complex machinery in the World costing billions. I appreciate I'm therefore in a better position than most to maintain my own cars and assess cars and the standard to which they've been maintained when I'm buying. I've never had a problem selling my cars or bikes as DIY maintained - in fact I would say the opposite is usually true. I prefer to buy my cars privately, ideally from a DIY owner who I can "buy" into as much as the car. I do understand why the majority of buyers might feel comforted by a fully stamped service book from an OPC or recognised specialist. But I know from both professional and personal experience that this is not as good an indicator of mechanical state or risk as a personal inspection and the opportunity to assess the maintenance history and status with an enthusiastic and competent DIY seller who has kept good records.

I would hazard a guess that at most OPC's the servicing work is being done by the junior mechanics. I know an indy around here where that's certainly the case. The young lad straight of college will no doubt do a decent job, but I'd much rather do the work myself. Depends on the DIY skills, I'm not a trained mechanic but have 15 years experience working as an engineer maintaining machinery far more valuable than your average Porsche. I've only ever had old or low value cars so resale has not worried me with respect DIY maintenance, but I can understand the average punter wanting OPC history for peace of mind. I've heard many a horror story from both sides of the fence over the years, lol!!

Richie200 said: Completely disagree; how do you think the DIY skills of our very own GTRClive compare to your OPC mech. I wouldn't trust anyone near my cars. If I need a stamp I will not let OPC service my car without me being in attendance. Being a Licenced Aircraft Engineer the tolerances I am use to far exceed that in the automotive industry and as such the levels of finesse and attention to detail of OPC's and the like are not for me. Two points... you can't actually disagree with my personal preference as it's mine, mine I tell you Secondly, yes you are right there will be a number of really good, smart, clever guys that will do a good job. However, I come back to my point that in the DIY community there will be a far greater number of utter bodgers. So for me, I'd just bother to go there. Personal buying preference. Bert

BertBert said: Richie200 said: Completely disagree; how do you think the DIY skills of our very own GTRClive compare to your OPC mech. I wouldn't trust anyone near my cars. If I need a stamp I will not let OPC service my car without me being in attendance. Being a Licenced Aircraft Engineer the tolerances I am use to far exceed that in the automotive industry and as such the levels of finesse and attention to detail of OPC's and the like are not for me. Two points... you can't actually disagree with my personal preference as it's mine, mine I tell you Secondly, yes you are right there will be a number of really good, smart, clever guys that will do a good job. However, I come back to my point that in the DIY community there will be a far greater number of utter bodgers. So for me, I'd just bother to go there. Personal buying preference. Bert Agree with you on all the points you make Bert Playing the percentage game, you win. There will however be the odd gem that a DIYer has lovingly tinkered with that you could miss out on by completely closing this door.

I think the reality is that today most buyers looking to spend 15k+ will be expecting to see opc or indy service stamps. As the cars get older and less valuable less so. It is frustrating though, my dad has a mate who is an excellent mechanic who is very meticulous but I never took my cayman to him for its first major service 2 years ago because I wanted the 'correct' stamps. I took my car to a supposed Porsche specialist who made an utter pigs ear of refitting the rear bumper, missing bolts etc etc and also lost some of the trim parts on the car, this I only discovered as I was packing the car to go on holiday. Luckily I was able to get my dads mate to fix the issues but we were quite shocked how shoddy the work was done by the supposed specialist.