996: tiptronic gearbox swap for donor box - any pitfalls?

Hi All, I had issues with my ZF tiptronic gearbox. It went through an expensive overhaul and the symptoms have changed, but it still doesn't work as it should. Given I am a bit fed up with this box, I decided to go for a 2nd hand tip box from a donor vehicle. Only challenge - my box is RWD, the box I am going to swap in is AWD 4×4. I just couldn't find anything in my area in RWD. The car is more of a hobby track car rather than a collectible, so not to bothered. know some people disconnect the front drive, so that shouldn't be an issue to leave the front unconnected and working idle. Question is: will I encounter any other trouble? Like gearbox controls, DME or other electronics related issues? Or anv issues with the mount fit for the box? Many thanks for your help

Does anyone has experience in converting your 996 turbo manual transmission to a sequential one? I am interested to instal one from Oakley.

boxes look identical except the front output shaft could there by any issues swapping them?

Why buy it overpriced from unreliable supplier, when you can get it directly from manufacturer: http://www.sssdrive.com/sss_eng.php

plenty of people run the AWD box and disconnect the front drive shaft without issue. The AWD drive system is much just mechanical, without active sensors controlling it. Only drawback I can think of really is that the rear differential in the AWD box is open.

LOL, I thought you meant the real sequential gear box not the bolt on to your stock box one.

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Quote: thanks for the answer. what does that mean that the differential is open? How goes that impact drive ability?

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Quote: So did I. If he did, I could help there. We can do a genuine sequential conversion on your stock box. If all you want is the shifter that makes it feel like it's a sequential box I cannot be of service.

fairly certain that all 2000 and newer 996's had an open diff. Option code 220 was available in 1999. The 40 anniversary may have a limited diff as well but not 100% sure.

Matt, How much torque can the sequential box hold?

Which ones better though open or LSD? I don’t think my current RWD gearbox has LSD

Subscribed

LSD is better....but you won't really notice much difference unless you're consistently driving your car above 90% or like power sliding.

great thread...subscribed as well

Thanks, looks like a second option:-)

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Quote: How much do you want to throw at it? I'll start by reminding members that in the technical forums, there is no discussion of pricing allowed. This is for technical discussion, so if anyone reading this gets serious about purchasing this product, you'll need to email me (preferable to PM since I don't log on here every day) to discuss it further. There's two things we can offer you. Back in the dark ages we were the US distributor for Holinger. It was during that period that the sequential gearbox which eventually became the Cup Car gearbox was developed. We sold a number of them for the 993 chassis, and eventually were also selling a version for the original 996 GT3R that was raced in ALMS. While we no longer distribute Holinger parts, I do happen to have a couple of their conversion kits still in my inventory. While my kits are 4 or 5 years old, they are the same thing that Holinger still sells as the PCS conversion kit. Here's a link to their European distributor's information on the gearbox: http://www.holinger.de/tl_files/prod...FEATURES_E.pdf I'd have to look up what ratios they are if someone was interested, but because we no longer sell this stuff, we'd make a good deal to someone if they wanted one of the two kits we've got left. OR, and this is a big OR, you can wait 3-4 months. We're in the process of developing a proprietary sequential conversion kit in our own factory with our own engineers. Unlike the Holinger kit, which is a derivative of the GT3 gearbox, our unit is going to be all new internals with a more traditional shifting style with respect to sequential design. What I mean is like what is pictured: http://eng.kaps-transmissions.com/pr...al-gearbox.jpg A Hewland or Ricardo sequential gearbox traditionally does not use shift rods like a Porsche street gearbox. The shift forks run directly on a drum that runs the full length of the gearbox. Compare the first picture linked to the second and you'll see the difference. In your street gearbox, every pair of gears (1-2, 3-4, and 5-6) alternates back and forth between the mainshaft and the pinionshaft of the gearbox. On a proper sequential, all the pairs ride on a single shaft. So, all fixed gears in our sequential will be on the mainshaft and all the idler gears will be on the pinion, with the forks on a drum next to the pinion. The advantages here are several, with greater durability and faster shifts being at the root of it. I do want to be clear here that we consider these motorsports parts and they are designed for racing. There are people who drive dog boxes and even sequential gearboxes on the street. It's not something we generally recommend, but if you drive the car properly, you can do it and do it well. But if you aren't a racer, these are probably not the parts for you. If it's a street car that sees a couple of track days a year, keep the functionality and forgiveness of your synchros and just get the sequential shifter kit that makes it feel like it's a sequential gearbox. It does accelerate the wear on your synchros, but it also shifts faster than stock, and in classes that allow it, even some racers use the shifter. But if you want a real sequential gearbox conversion, we are going to offer it shortly. We've finished the Solidworks modelling of it, and have moved on to the blueprint drawings and programming of the CNC machines to actually start prototyping. We intend to have the first prototype in one of Bullet Racing's Cup Cars before the end of the Summer. In closing, I want to be clear on what this is. This is going to be a conversion kit that fits in the factory case. This is key when it comes to racing rules. This makes this kit legal for PCA use and it will likely be approved for Grand Am. I doubt that it will be legal for ALMS GTC and Patron class racing, but we might be able to get it homologated for GT2. It will convert any GT3, Twin Turbo, or 996 GT3 Cup Car synchronized gearbox. It could also be retrofit to a 997 Cup sequential case as well. And while we aren't allowed to talk dollars and cents here, the one thing I will say is that it's going to cost less than going to PMNA and buying a crate sequential gearbox from them. It's going to be real money, but it's not going to be second mortgage money like PMNA parts are. Kind Regards, Matt

Pricey, I'm sure. How much?

I'm not the vendor who is going to get warned for breaking the tech forum rules. Sorry.

Matt you guys at Guard are going above and beyond for us. Thank you so much for thinking of cost effective ways to help folks with trans, diffs, linkages and those parts that spook me (and maybe some others) out and are kinda considered a black art in terms of what works and how things are engineered ...

Can you PM me the price of the Holinger kit?

Matt, YGM

What are the issues with driving a sequential gearbox on the street?

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Quote: The issue is really the fact that all sequential gearboxes are dog engagement without any synchros. As such, you've got to be deliberate and commited to every shift. Ask any noobie 997 Cup Car owner about their first weekend at the track and their experience in getting used to the gearbox. With a synchronized box you smoothly and gradually pull the shifter into gear while the synchros do their job of matching the speed of the idling gear and the fixed gear as it engages it. In a sequential, those gears aren't speed matched until the dog teeth slip into place and the gear engages. It's not something you can pussyfoot around with. It requires a solid pull into gear in one smooth fluid movement. And it's something that even the professionals can mess up in a racing environment. Do you know what took our car out of the 24 Hours of Daytona this year? It was a downshift into 4th that wasn't fully committed. We know this because of the telemetry on the car. The strain gauge says that the shifter wasn't pushed down hard enough. So what happened is the edge of the dog tooth contacted partially and it kicked it back into 5th gear. It kicked it so hard and instantaneously that it ripped a tooth right off the 5th gear, which proceeded to punch a whole in the side of the gearbox, draining it of gear oil. 12 hours in, running 5th place in class, and 1 bad shift ended the night.

^^ Matt your story brings tears to my eyes...one simple move and it's all done that's all it takes, sorry to hear brother and best of luck next time around ...

It was a real shame but sometimes that's racing. There's been talk about how the new Cup Cars practically drive themselves, but there's always going to be the human element. Races are won and lost most times at the hands of the driver.

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Quote: another thing that would bring tears to my eyes is the bill afterwards

An option from Quaife: http://www.motorsport-sales.com/inde...oducts_id=1697

so when downshifting it is not necessary to blip the throttle?

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Quote: Well that was the final deciding factor on whether to go on or not. PMNA had a replacement gearbox in their trailer that would have taken half an hour to get into the car. There were 4 drivers, each with a damage deposit placed with the team. They took a vote whether or not it was worth it to them to finish, but finish as a backmarker, and spend the damage deposit money, or pull out. It was democratic and 3-1 they decided to call it a night.

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Quote: When driving a dog box, sequential or not, rev-matching strongly encouraged. If I were to daily drive one of these boxes on the street, I would personally rev-match and double clutch most every shift. I have street driven a Subaru dog box and that's exactly what I did. Like I said above, it requires a driver who is willing to be 100% attentive at all times. Driving a full sequential is actually a bit easier than driving an H-pattern dog box, but it's still a situation where proper driver involvement is necessary.

I noticed the quiafe unit only recommends 500 bhp maximum. I am looking to rebuild my transmission or convert on my 993 TT proto car. Anyone have any suggestions or recommended routes as far as the 993 cars go? I know this is 996TT forum but there wasnt any sequential talk on my homeland forum.

how about the oakley shifter system instead. Feel of sequential without drawbacks on the street. Evoms did that setup with their built 996GT2 up here in denver and it was one fast shifting *****. AT 6000 FT!!! You Tube

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Quote: Gearbox is near enough the same.996 model on is cable instead of rod shift mechanism-- but easy enough to change(yes-it does cost$).993 TT box could be converted to sequential .That may be the cheapest option in fact-as to change to 996/7 box(bell housing is different-same size) would mean other changes. Forget the Quaife box-- I am yet to hear anyone say anything nice about it-- and that is on minus 500hp engines.My recommendation-- speak to Matt.Second choice-- speak to Matt 3rd choice-- you guessed it!!

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Quote: Could you PM me info on this and price? Very interested! Thank You

So did I. If he did, I could help there. We can do a genuine sequential conversion on your stock box. Hello sir do you have a contact number I can speak with you about my car. Thank you

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Quote: holy thread 🧵 resurrection!