GT3

Does anyone in Europe yet have the GT3? My DM has told me my car's build completion is April 25 2003. Then it should take 4-6 weeks to be sent to PCNA. Just curious if anyone else has any delivery date info?

I'm not in Europe but I have a build completion date of April 21. The car was in the paint shop as of last Friday, so I'm thinking it may even beat that date. I'll call tomorrow to see what's up (no chance the salesman will call me). My guy says I should have the car by mid-May, meaning 3-4 weeks delivery but who knows? I'm on the east coast if that makes a difference. Karl

Yeah, Im on the east coast too. Sounds like your car is right next to mine on the line, or very close.

Karl, Please post as soon as you drive it!!! my build is not til july. thx

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">Originally posted by RR: <strong>Does anyone in Europe yet have the GT3? My DM has told me my car's build completion is April 25 2003. Then it should take 4-6 weeks to be sent to PCNA. Just curious if anyone else has any delivery date info?</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">Received mine 3 weeks ago.

Congrats on getting your GT3....so what are your impressions of the car (as much details as you can provide - trust me it will not bore me). Thanks

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">Originally posted by ericvf: Received mine 3 weeks ago. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">Congrats! Now I think pictures are in order...

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">Originally posted by Z0650th: <strong>Congrats on getting your GT3....so what are your impressions of the car (as much details as you can provide - trust me it will not bore me). Thanks </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">Fabulous engine. Better than a 2001 GT3 Cup car or 00GT3. Much better than a 993RS. Exceptional braking power (no PCCB)to the point it is difficult to dose on the track with PZero Corsa and Pagids. I have done around 3000km with about 500km on track. Suspension is way too soft compared to 993RS and obviously 964RS, I would say comparable to 993TT. All "Eurospecs" and all cars I own or have owned. This is way too soft on the track and the car feels heavy and rolls. I have difficulties believing that it is stiffer than the 00/01 GT3 as claimed by the factory. We exchanged cars on the track with a friend who has a 01 GT3 of the last batch, his car has Cup shock absorbers but standard springs, both are adjusted for track by the same Porsche center and both with a new set of PZero Corsa. His car was much better in handling and I do not believe the shock absorbers only could make such a difference. He was jealous of the engine and brakes though. A problem of oil leak between engine and clutch developed due to the factory mounting the part between engine and gear box (don't know the name in English) the wrong way around. Apparently another car in this country has the same problem, also developed on a race track. So the GT3 is now apart and being repaired under warranty. No damage but a lost track day.

The softer suspension may not be too surprising if you read the EVO article. Walter Rohrl states: "We do a lot of work at the Ring because it is such a great test of every element of the car, but then we take it to the road. If it hits the bump-stops or the wheels are leaving the ground, we soften the suspension until it works."

That's what the adjustable suspension is for. According to what I read, you're not supposed to use street settings for the track and vice versa. Even Porsche states that you are supposed to use different settings. Did the '00/01 GT3 use an adjustable suspension? I can't recall... I think you will find a big difference if you readjust your settings and corner balance the car for the track!

Everyone who've took deliver of their GT3 pls post pix, I still have a long long list to wait <img border="0" alt="[crying]" title="" src="graemlins/crying.gif" />

Hamann - The suspension is not adjustable as far as the springs and shocks go (just ride height). The sway bars can be changed though. Ericvf - where do you have your sway bars set (soft or firm in front and rear)?

you can also adjust camber and toe-in also. the ride height affects handling quite a bit. after all, when you lower the car, you are compressing the springs, making the whole car firmer. it's a coilover suspension after all.

Hamann - Lowering the car with coil-overs does not compress the springs. It's mounted on threaded spring perches, so the mounting point on the car changes relative to the spring, but there is no compression of the spring.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">Originally posted by Hamann7: <strong>you can also adjust camber and toe-in also. the ride height affects handling quite a bit. after all, when you lower the car, you are compressing the springs, making the whole car firmer. it's a coilover suspension after all.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">After 1500km of running in the 03/GT3 was adjusted with the same settings as a 00/01 GT3 who won the national "FFSA GT de s�rie" championship (this is the national GT championship for street legal cars). Incidentally this is the car I exchanged for testing mentioned in my earlier post. I do not have the details but I can guarantee the car was definitely at minimum possible height at front with rear adjusted for overall equilibrium. Corner balanced and with visibly a lot of front camber. Sway bars at the hardest position front and rear. Overall very soft end result compared to my friend's 00GT3 and my former heavily track prepared 993RS. This is not overly worrying, regulations here allow us free choice of shock absorbers and Cup shock absorbers are fitted to a large majority of track going 00GT3's, it would become more worrying if after fitting the Cup shock absorbers ,which arrived last week, we found that the 03GT3 is still softer than the 00GT3 which is already too soft. This would imply springs and sway bar modifications which are forbidden, although many do cheat. The stock 03GT3 is fantastic for the road though, this is only a concern for the track.

So, Erivf, does the car feel heavy on the street? Were you able to compare the weight of your 03 to your friend's 00?

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">Originally posted by GrantG: <strong>So, Erivf, does the car feel heavy on the street? Were you able to compare the weight of your 03 to your friend's 00?</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">It feels beautiful on the street, it is just perfect for that. On the street it "feels" lighter than a 993RS and you do not feel the weight as it is very well balanced. I think the weight itself is not more of an issue than on the 00, just the weight with regards to suspension stiffness for track use. My feeling is that the suspension is softer than on the 00/01 despite the factory's claims. We will check if the springs refs are different in parts lists. The 03GT3 is very similar to my friend's 01GT3 except I have the airbags in the doors and he removed the AC and the dual mass flywheel. Both are clubsport but the side airbags are now fitted on the clubsports as well. The official around 30kg additional weight over 00GT3 could not make such a difference as this is less than 1.5% additional weight on an operational car with fuel and driver. It just makes no sense when Porsche announces a 20% or 30% (I don't remember the official figure) stiffer suspension on the new GT3. GT3s 00 otr 03 are heavy cars anyway, much heavier than 964RS (1220 kg) or 993RS (1270kg), GT3s compensate with engine power over both and handling over 964RS. On the track a 993RS even with a very good driver cannot be in front of a GT3 with a reasonable driver. GT3 and 993RS do not gain that much from heavy preparation being already well developed. Very heavily prepared 964RS can sometimes be quite a match as the base weight is significantly lower and large engine gains are possible but these are difficult beasts.

Eric, I have a '99 GT3 Clubsport, and have a new one for delivery in September. Can you confirm whether the new model has the single mass flywheel ? I heard that it does not need it, and is not fitted.

Ericvf - Did you have a chance to take any lap times of your new car compared to some of the others you have driven there?

GrantG, You are right about the spring perches. My bad. Well I guess it's time to swap out the suspension too then... I have been looking at the Quantum adjustable suspension from Japan.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">Originally posted by beaver: <strong>Eric, I have a '99 GT3 Clubsport, and have a new one for delivery in September. Can you confirm whether the new model has the single mass flywheel ? I heard that it does not need it, and is not fitted.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">99GT3CS was delivered with dual mass flywheel. Same with 03GT3CS. Easy to change though and we are doing just that, taking the "opportunity" of everything being taken apart under warranty for the oil leak problem I mentioned in my first post. I am pretty sure that : On 993RS dual mass, on 993RSClubsport no dual mass. My 993RS was updated to no dual mass when a clutch change was necessary. On 964RS and 964RSCS no dual mass on either.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">Originally posted by GrantG: <strong>Ericvf - Did you have a chance to take any lap times of your new car compared to some of the others you have driven there?</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">Grant Yes we did some but we were finishing breaking in the engine so 7000/7500 RPM Max with engine not fully free. My teammate who is fast lapped 1:57 while going easy as mentioned. During the race, in which we did not participate as the car was too new, the best 00GT3 (2nd in last year GT de s�rie season, heavily prepared) lapped around 1:54 on the same P0Corsa tires. My teammate estimated that with full revs and being more agressive he could have improved at least 2 seconds which would have put the car in the 1:54 1:55 region. With stiffer shocks and springs it would definitely be faster than the 00GT3. Track "Val de Vienne" is very technical but heavy on brakes. Two years ago a Caterham made 2nd place on the dry behind a GT3 but in front of many other GT3s so the track is not very favourable to heavy powerful cars. On other tracks Caterhams usually never make better than 6th or 7th. On this track last year qualifying pole was a GT3 in P0 Corsa in 1:53:94, best race lap 1:55:26. Eric

Thanks for the updates!

Eric, My '99 GT3CS definitely has the single mass flywheel, as did all of the UK Clubsport cars. What about battery cut-off loop and switch, does the new car have these ?

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">Originally posted by beaver: <strong>Eric, My '99 GT3CS definitely has the single mass flywheel, as did all of the UK Clubsport cars. What about battery cut-off loop and switch, does the new car have these ?</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">Strange as I am sure all the 99GT3CS in France were delivered with dual. Cutoff loop is there but not the switch, we put the switch in last week. Another difference with 99GT3 is the roll cage, the top front bar has been moved forward and now prevents operation of the "pare soleils" (sun visors?) although you can leave them on and they will be always fully forward. Engine sound is also quite different to 00GT3, nicer. Gear shift is also nicer although less good in my opinion than 993RS or 964RS. The 00GT3 gear shift is not highly rated at all. Brake pedal feel and ABS seem better as well.

Eric, How is the e-gas? Are you getting good throttle responsiveness in the corners?

Eric since you are running the P0 Corsas have you driven the Michellin Pilot Sport Cups? If so how do these tires compare?

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">Originally posted by mds: <strong>Eric, How is the e-gas? Are you getting good throttle responsiveness in the corners?</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">mds I did not notice any strangeness with the accelerator pedal on the contrary. I only learned a couple of days ago that it was electronic so it proves that it works very well from a blind unbiased test. Eric

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">Originally posted by DJF1: <strong>Eric since you are running the P0 Corsas have you driven the Michellin Pilot Sport Cups? If so how do these tires compare?</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">DJF1 Although Michelin is a French company the Pilot Sport Cups are not available in France. Most customers for this type of tires are Porsche users (more than 80% in France). The "Club Porsche de France" and the "FFSA GT de s�rie" are both sponsored by Pirelli so for "politics & finance" reasons there is no market for the tire in the country and Michelin refuse to supply it. The Michelin has the reputation of being around 1 sec/lap faster , more constant performance and last longer than the Pirelli .This "legend" may be due to the fact that anything you cannot get is usually perceived as better. There was a test a year or two ago with a GT3 in the German magazine Auto Motor und Sport with the previous GT3 comparing three types of street legal racing tires and the Michelin was the fastest. It you search the web you will find the test in German, use a translation tool. Eric

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">Originally posted by beaver: <strong>Eric, My '99 GT3CS definitely has the single mass flywheel, as did all of the UK Clubsport cars. What about battery cut-off loop and switch, does the new car have these ?</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">Just read the latest Christophorus factory mag and again they state for the clubsport single mass flywheel which I do not have and no side airbags which I have. Having ordered a Clubsport I suspect that as the differences are not massive compared to 964/993 where the roll cage was soldered the factory may be playing little games here and there to adjust supply and demand. I am going to ask the side airbags to be removed and the single mass flywheel to be supplied under warranty. Eric

Here's a GT3 seal grey delivered in Switzerland. Tks to Pierre. <img border="0" alt="[cheers]" title="" src="graemlins/beerchug.gif" /> <a href="http://www.flat-6.net/phpBB/viewtopic.php?mode=viewtopic&topic=3684&forum=10&start=0" target="_blank">GT 3 </a> That GT3 is stunning

It looks very nice in Seal Grey. Are those yellow brake pads stock or Pagid? I don't remember Porsche offering yellow pads before. Karl

I don't want it.I just need it. To breathe, To feel, to know I'm alive. lifted from arixok on flat-six... and so right for the gt3

Watt, When is your dealer telling you to expect delivery of your GT3? I am #1 on the list at my dealer and they gave me an August-September delivery timeframe. Also, I was told (by my dealer) my car would be 2003 MY. I have heard conflicting information on whether GT3's built before the factory break will be '03 MY vs. cars built after the break being '04 MY. Others say all GT3's will be '04 MY. Can you shed any light on this? I watch the GT3 videos on the UK website daily....I strap on my headphones and turn up the volume! I am really looking forward to getting this car.

Eric.... From the UK website : "Key features include a bolt - in rollover bar which can be easily upgra- ded to a full racing roll cage for circuit use. All necessary components are included with the Clubsport package. The bucket seats are finished in flame - retardant fabric. Other on - board features include the prepa- ration for a battery master switch, a red six - point racing harness for the driver's side and a fire extinguisher with mounting bracket." No mention of the single flywheel or deletion of side airbags. But, I also read in both Christophorous and 911& Porsche World that the CS has these features, which is why I asked if you have them. I don't think we will get these in the UK, my car is due in September. Presumably the battery switch is supplied but not fitted ? As for the Michelin Pilot Cups, I have them fitted and must say they are definitely an improvement over the standard Pirellis. Very soft though, don't expect to get many miles out of them. The UK GT3 will be offered with Pilot Sports.

It looks so much better in seal gray than yellow. That car just makes me salivate. I can't wait. Wilber confirmed my spot last weekend...

The suspension looks exactly like H&R coilovers!!! <img border="0" alt="[hiha]" title="" src="graemlins/roflmao.gif" /> <img src="http://www.flat-6.net/phpBB/uploads/43301654.jpg" alt=" - " />

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">Originally posted by beaver: <strong> As for the Michelin Pilot Cups, I have them fitted and must say they are definitely an improvement over the standard Pirellis. Very soft though, don't expect to get many miles out of them. The UK GT3 will be offered with Pilot Sports.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">beaver I never use the car on the road except sometimes to drive to track events. The Pirelli P0Corsa are street legal racing tires like the Pilot Sport Cups not standard Pirellis. They only last two maybe three track days or one only if raced hard. You can use them beyond that but they would not be street legal anymore and not useable if it rains, even on the track as aquaplaning would come very quickly. Forget about mileage. I did the FFSA GT de s�rie in 2000 and 2001 and used probably 8 sets per year for 6 races per year plus some training days. For club racing you would be lucky with 4 sets per year for 6 club racing days plus some training days. Get yourself another set of wheels for the Sport Cups and forget about using them on the road except to go to the track. Too expensive, too soft and dangerous if you drive fast under heavy rain which is common in your country. Eric Eric Eric

tngt3, my build is july so late august/sept delivery. my order in the porsche computer says: 2003 GT3...

For those interested this a test of four street legal racing tires with a GT3 at Hockenheim last year. It is in German but although funny it is understandable when translated with Google language tools. First Michelin Pilot Sport Cup 1:17.7 (2428 Euro) Second Pirelli P0 Corsa 1:18.1 (1538 Euro) Third Yokohama Advan 048 1:18.5 (1874 Euro) Fourth Dunlop Super Sport Race 1:18.8 (1410 Euro) We get the set of Pirellis for about 1300/1400 Euro including 19.6%VAT. Seems like the Michelins are horrendously expensive. All in all Pirellis are not a bad deal. <a href="http://www.motorvision.de/cache/template/motorvision/129/3475.html" target="_blank">http://www.motorvision.de/cache/template/motorvision/129/3475.html</a>

Excellent pictures! Looks great in Seal Grey, but kinda makes it look like a regular 996. I still prefer Speed Yellow.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">Originally posted by ericvf: <strong> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">Originally posted by beaver: <strong> As for the Michelin Pilot Cups, I have them fitted and must say they are definitely an improvement over the standard Pirellis. Very soft though, don't expect to get many miles out of them. The UK GT3 will be offered with Pilot Sports.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">beaver I never use the car on the road except sometimes to drive to track events. The Pirelli P0Corsa are street legal racing tires like the Pilot Sport Cups not standard Pirellis. They only last two maybe three track days or one only if raced hard. You can use them beyond that but they would not be street legal anymore and not useable if it rains, even on the track as aquaplaning would come very quickly. Forget about mileage. I did the FFSA GT de s�rie in 2000 and 2001 and used probably 8 sets per year for 6 races per year plus some training days. For club racing you would be lucky with 4 sets per year for 6 club racing days plus some training days. Get yourself another set of wheels for the Sport Cups and forget about using them on the road except to go to the track. Too expensive, too soft and dangerous if you drive fast under heavy rain which is common in your country. Eric Eric Eric</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">Eric this is really odd that the Michellins are so expensive in your neck of the woods! In the USA they are not that expensive and the Corsas which just came here are more expensive!!! No wonder when I was in France two years ago and I went to Loheac at the Porsche club meet most of you guys were on C's... I can tell you the Michellins are holding up very well and they are a far cry from the Corsas from what you describe. I have done on them 3 track weekends and 1 club racing weekend and the tires have at least as much to go on them... I figure 3-4 more club racing weekends on the same set! This actually has been the general concent on the club racing circles here in the States which make them a great value over anything else... BTW these pics of the GT3 have me drooling...