The cayman may have met its match - Page 30 - Boxster/Cayman - PistonHeads UK

Check Out the New LOTUS EMIRA! | FIRST LOOK https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zt6kjDGW89s £60K

Sexy….

at £60K its quite something considering what else is on the market

It's a stunning looking car in Nimbus Grey.

a far nicer proposition than the Cayman I feel. the 718 has, like the 911, ballooned too much, whereas this Lotus is really sculptured and svelte...it like a love child of a 987 and a Mclaren

The V6 won't be £60k. Personally I don't think you can beat Porsche at their own game, but best of luck to Lotus. Hopefully some S3 Exige owners will trade in and I can pick one up...

Tempted...

A V6 with a few options won't be dissimilar to a GTS 4.0 in price, and the Porsche will have a full NA engine. The AMG four pot at £60k plus options sounds expensive, especially as some thought £45k 718s were too pricey...

Want.

Looks stunning.

Looks an interesting car at the money. Nice size too. Do wonder about the build quality even on new models. Styling cues from the 458 at the front with hints from the Tributo and F Type at the rear the mix of which is a touch awkward imo. Interior looks its weakest point rather bland imo even though the car in the video is presumably good spec. Road test against its obvious competitor the GT4 will be interesting. Edited by av185 on Tuesday 6th July 23:06

Had three Lotus before I became a Porsche guy (on my third). If anything is going to tempt me back its this! But being rational I love my Boxster S because of its physical integrity. Lotus needs to raise its quality game to get me back. Not expecting 'hewn from granite" but this needs to be the most robust Lotus ever

I wasn’t expecting it to weigh more than a Cayman…

If it at least teaches some Porsche dealers some manners it'll be a good job. The Geely money seems to be working as all reviewers are commenting on perceived build quality. Porsche have had the sub £80k mid engined car space to themselves for too long. Bring it on Lotus. I'd love a go in one

Hydraulic steering too...

Suspect it's a heavily updated Evora. Kershaw keeps talking about improvements to this or that aspect, upgrades to this or that element, with the implied starting point being the Evora. It's all subjective, but personally don't think the Evora drives that well, in part thanks to the top-heavy V6 powertrain which is basically a repurposed FWD package - and you can really feel that. This 'new' car carries that basic issue over. And despite all the breathless YouTube coverage, interior doesn't look that great as far as I can see. Steering wheel is particularly yucky. Elements of it will be excellent. And it's better looking than the slightly limply styled Evora. But I doubt it will come terribly close to being a better overall driver's car and more satisfying ownership proposition than a 4.0-litre Cayman. The Cayman isn't perfect. But it is a bloody polished package at this point. Powertrain in particular is on another level. Would far rather have seen Lotus do one last series of / a heavily updated Exige / Elise. It's what the company does best by far. It ultimately has never managed to deliver a really competitive car in this more premium segment. Not convinced the Emira will change that.

The Boxter 4.0 GTS was weighed on Harry’s garage and the figure was around 1280 Kg. There was no driver and I’m not sure of the fuel level.

julian987R said: a far nicer proposition than the Cayman I feel. the 718 has, like the 911, ballooned too much, whereas this Lotus is really sculptured and svelte...it like a love child of a 987 and a Mclaren Someone quoted it as being 100mm wider than a Cayman, and it's larger than an Evora.

MitchT said: Want. That looks a lot better than the Cayman, in my eyes. It looks more special and has a hint of baby McLaren to me. If this goes as well as it looks then Lotus could have a winner. Perceived quality could be an issue for Lotus, however I find it interesting that a chap I know who has owned a string of Porsches and Lotus' and currently owns one of each tells me he has had more problems with the Porsches and they have cost more to fix too. Re the Harry's Garage weight for the Boxster - that has been questioned and I have to say I would be a bit surprised if it was that light - fair play if it is though.

PaulD86 said: Re the Harry's Garage weight for the Boxster - that has been questioned and I have to say I would be a bit surprised if it was that light - fair play if it is though. IIRC there were a few cars that weighed light, so the scales may have been out of calibration.

Very tempted… Even the four cyl AMG unit with 360 brake would be pretty awesome I reckon. Love our S1 and this looks right up my street! With WBAC offering a silly high amount on my GTS a new one of these is quite compelling…

A few of my Porsche owning friends are really excited about this new car. At least it'll trigger a test drive and that's what Lotus need....new people at least trying it. It might not live up to expectations but they've created a stir. Edited by Andyoz on Wednesday 7th July 09:03

Andyoz said: A few of my Porsche owning friends are really excited about this new car. At least it'll trigger a test drive and that's what Lotus need....new people at least trying it. It might not live up to expectations but they've created a stir. Edited by Andyoz on Wednesday 7th July 09:03 Totally agree, subject to availability I know that I'd be more than happy to take a test drive in order to form my own opinion. It's a good looking car, wheelbase looks quite short to me. Hope its a roaring success for them.

not sold on the looks just yet. feels like there's something missing and like they've thrown a load of details into a pot and had a lucky draw of which to use - 458 front, F tyoe front lights, Alpine rear and McLaren profile... not an ugly car by any means though

Does look gorgeous. If it's wide, will it fit in my garage (I don't care about Harry's)? Might have to stick with being a Porsche guy. And I'm betting the luggage capacity is a couple of carrier bags. The Cayster is just so practical. Edited by Maxym on Wednesday 7th July 09:58

JasonSteel said: not sold on the looks just yet. feels like there's something missing and like they've thrown a load of details into a pot and had a lucky draw of which to use - 458 front, F tyoe front lights, Alpine rear and McLaren profile... not an ugly car by any means though At least all the aero vents actually do something...unlike alot of modern cars where they are fake/blanked off behind the fake grille. That's one design trend that I just don't understand.

Good intro review here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NKZwiTQQhmI Interest registered

Grantstown said: The Boxter 4.0 GTS was weighed on Harry’s garage and the figure was around 1280 Kg. There was no driver and I’m not sure of the fuel level. Definitely a weighing error.

The Artura Tributo?

MrVert said: Interest registered Likewise

Does anyone have any more photos of the new Emira...I'm having trouble finding them on Social Media LOL Jesus that car has set the media into a frenzy alright!

my dad who's had nothing but caymans since they first came out rang me to discuss this car today as coincidentially his friend who also is a cayman owner rang him later on in the day they are going to sell lots of these, esp at £60k

I think the V6 will be £70-£80k.

Just goes to show how important styling is. Wheelbase is apparently exactly the same as the Evora. Factor in the price and seems likely this is a tarted up Evora (totally new car would surely have to be more expensive to recoup engineering and development costs). Which doesn't make it a bad car, but the 'excitement' arguably is down to the styling, not the substance. Four pot and V6 positioning will be interesting. Power outputs will surely be pretty similar. V6 probably won't be much if any faster.

swanny71 said: MrVert said: Interest registered Likewise Haha! See you in the queue

F6C said: Just goes to show how important styling is. Wheelbase is apparently exactly the same as the Evora. Factor in the price and seems likely this is a tarted up Evora (totally new car would surely have to be more expensive to recoup engineering and development costs). Which doesn't make it a bad car, but the 'excitement' arguably is down to the styling, not the substance. Four pot and V6 positioning will be interesting. Power outputs will surely be pretty similar. V6 probably won't be much if any faster. Just thinking the same. Oddly, having had a loan 718 S for a few days, there’s not a chance I’d spend £60k + on a 4 pot Porsche….however having driven an A Class AMG 45 with the 2 litre 4….I remember it being pretty immense and seems I’ve gotten over my mental block I think I’d actually go for that option now, should provide some tuning opportunities as well

MrVert said: I think I’d actually go for that option now, should provide some tuning opportunities as well You'd be brave to set about tuning a 2.0-litre engine with 400hp for more power!

360 apparently and could be tweaked for more….although probably enough but hey….I bet you someone will be doing it! Lichfield

The Exige was the Caymans match ages ago although some mags would have you believe otherwise. This however is definitely a 'global' car and you can see where Lotus have set their sights. Thank goodness because it's absolutely lovely.

Hopefully it's a great car. Be nice to have the option to tell a snooty Porsche salesperson...Nah that's fine, give my place on "The List" to someone else. I'm just ducking down to Lotus for a chat!!

Andyoz said: Hopefully it's a great car. Be nice to have the option to tell a snooty Porsche salesperson...Nah that's fine, give my place on "The List" to someone else. I'm just ducking down to Lotus for a chat!! Did that 8 months ago for a Toyota Yaris that’s now on the driveway. It went quiet on the phone!

rossfitz said: Did that 8 months ago for a Toyota Yaris that’s now on the driveway. It went quiet on the phone! Haha...I do love my Porsche but Jeez some of the crap that goes on you'd think they are the only ones that can make a decent car...

Twinfan said: IIRC there were a few cars that weighed light, so the scales may have been out of calibration. HM's scales were definitely under reading weights on cars over a period of time, sometimes quite significantly so take the 1280Kg with a huge dollop of salt.

I love the design both inside and outside and at £60k looks great VFM. I wouldn't be surprised it'll be the AMG 4 cyl which will be the sweet spot with a lighter lower sitting engine and sweeter handling. Would have one over any Cayman.!

Looks stunning but the steering wheel would be whipped out for a Momo piece instantly.

The road reviews will be interesting. If it's any good, I think if I was in the market I'd be tempted to get one over any Cayman other than a GT4.

Twinfan said: The road reviews will be interesting. If it's any good, I think if I was in the market I'd be tempted to get one over any Cayman other than a GT4. Agree. This new Lotus looks great but looks are just one aspect and whether it will also deliver in the important areas over and above the sublime GT4 with its brilliant GT3 chassis engine and drivetrain remains to be seen.....I doubt it very much but await the quality journos appraisals. As ever with a Lotus depreciation ££ and build quality remains a concern and here again is where the GT4 wins hands down.

i really hope the build quality is good. I'm a porsche fanboy but this is the most exciting car i've seen in a long time given the price.

I suspect it won't be £60k once you add in the Sports suspension pack and the V6 engine...

Feel that, along with Alpine, this is the sort of car all manufacturers should be making. I'd want to see Ferrari have a go, £100k sale price, manual, NA V8, LSD, almost zero electronics, hydraulic steering, well-damped. Imagine Lancia having a go! Or Lamborghini.

V6 might be more fun but i'm hoping the AMG will be great. With turbo torq i'm not sure you need more than 360bhp on the road to have fun if you have a great chassis

Twinfan said: A V6 with a few options won't be dissimilar to a GTS 4.0 in price, and the Porsche will have a full NA engine. The AMG four pot at £60k plus options sounds expensive, especially as some thought £45k 718s were too pricey... No chance you can get a 718 Boxster base for £45K, I specced mine holding back such as Guards Red paint (0 cost option), xenons instead of LEDs, PDK, PASM, Sport Chrono, extended leather, contrast stitching Guards Red, Guards Red seat belts, Guards red Sport Chrono stop-watch £63K, crests on headrests. £63k for a four-pot laggy turbo car, the PDK match was horrendous, due to the lag it would drop down a couple of gears then it would lurch off like a bat out of hell. I would have rather it just said to hell with fuel consumption and kept the turbo up and spinning and made smooth progress instead. The four pot sound track sealed it, put down the deposit and bought a 2009 987.2 Boxster 49K miles on the clock PASM with DSC V1, PDK, Sport Chrono retrofit, PSE retrofit, 19 inch Sport Design alloys, Sat-Nav, enhanced audio, blue-tooth and Sport Seat Plus. Now I understand why they went from 987 to 718...

As and ex 981 GTS owner, currently tooling around in a 2018 TTRS as a daily I put my deposit in. It all makes sense, I'll be going manual which means the 3.5ltr V6 charged engine, not really a fan of the 2ltr Merc engine didn't find it very exciting. On a call today I was told i'll get price and options list in September, 3.5v6 will be launch car and that would be 70K, hardly any options availalble. Now when I get that through hopefully there is a demo that i can try and compare to the 718 Cayman 4.0 and decide between the two. If the 60K model was the 3.5v6 it would be a no brainer for me, but at 70K the Porsche is solid competition imo. Edited by JayK12 on Wednesday 7th July 17:44

JayK12 said: As and ex 981 GTS owner, currently tooling around in a 2018 TTRS as a daily I put my deposit in. Edited by JayK12 on Wednesday 7th July 17:44 congrats ! tons of people here on PH placing deposits today!

The fact there is an active discussion here about a Lotus tells me alot,

Lovely looking thing. Go Lotus. Got to be the V6 though, just couldn't spend that kind of money for a 4 cylinder!

Andyoz said: A few of my Porsche owning friends are really excited about this new car. At least it'll trigger a test drive and that's what Lotus need....new people at least trying it. It might not live up to expectations but they've created a stir. Edited by Andyoz on Wednesday 7th July 09:03 Wow the lotus looks stunning and a mini supercar whilst the cockster looks meh IMHO

Fezzamania said: Wow the lotus looks stunning and a mini supercar whilst the cockster looks meh IMHO Who else is doing the mini supercar 'thing' anymore. The mainstream manufacturers have run a mile as sports car sales in general are dying. Maybe there is a niche for Lotus. Not the lightweight track focused niche they have pushed for decades, but a different market...

YoungFireOldFlame said: No chance you can get a 718 Boxster base for £45K, I specced mine holding back such as Guards Red paint (0 cost option), xenons instead of LEDs, PDK, PASM, Sport Chrono, extended leather, contrast stitching Guards Red, Guards Red seat belts, Guards red Sport Chrono stop-watch £63K, crests on headrests. £63k for a four-pot laggy turbo car, the PDK match was horrendous, due to the lag it would drop down a couple of gears then it would lurch off like a bat out of hell. I would have rather it just said to hell with fuel consumption and kept the turbo up and spinning and made smooth progress instead. The four pot sound track sealed it, put down the deposit and bought a 2009 987.2 Boxster 49K miles on the clock PASM with DSC V1, PDK, Sport Chrono retrofit, PSE retrofit, 19 inch Sport Design alloys, Sat-Nav, enhanced audio, blue-tooth and Sport Seat Plus. Now I understand why they went from 987 to 718... I specced a new 718 Cayman pdk back in 2016 for £43,500. Same again now would be £47k, or £45k for the manual. That Lotus does looks good. But build and depreciation would concern me, if I was in the market.

Have to say I am tempted by this. I’d actually consider the AMG I4 and DCT and the car seems like it’s primarily design for that power train. The V6 is a lovely sounding unit, but heavy and that weight high up in the chassis… tough decision. Interesting comments with the styling… it’s got cues from a lot different cars… Evija 488/F8 Artura MC20 It does have a little whiff of warmed over Evora, but ultimately I suspect it will look even better in the metal than some of it camera shots where it can be a little awkward from some angles. No doubt it will drive beautifully.

Twinfan said: Really? It just shows me that if you boot it in the wet on Cup2s the back end steps out. I think I could have worked that out myself I'm sure it's a fine car, I just think from Chris's piece on Top Gear you can tell pretty much naff all about the finer points of it. I got the impression he was hampered by the weather so just showboated it for TV. Just my opinion, obviously, for the benefit of discussion and YMMV etc etc. I think he wanted to say nice things about it but was struggling to articulate them and I think he looked a bit disengaged if I’m honest. It could have been the weather as well of course. He could single-handedly make or break Lotus on national TV so I think he went with saying nothing in a positive sounding tone which was a decent thing to do. Absolutely nobody wants Lotus to fail.

DMZ said: Twinfan said: Really? It just shows me that if you boot it in the wet on Cup2s the back end steps out. I think I could have worked that out myself I'm sure it's a fine car, I just think from Chris's piece on Top Gear you can tell pretty much naff all about the finer points of it. I got the impression he was hampered by the weather so just showboated it for TV. Just my opinion, obviously, for the benefit of discussion and YMMV etc etc. I think he wanted to say nice things about it but was struggling to articulate them and I think he looked a bit disengaged if I’m honest. It could have been the weather as well of course. He could single-handedly make or break Lotus on national TV so I think he went with saying nothing in a positive sounding tone which was a decent thing to do. Absolutely nobody wants Lotus to fail. Do we know how long he had the car? Perhaps he was trying to articulate what he had gleaned from his time with it whilst punting it around in the wet not really feeling the things he was trying to say. Maybe making it seem a bit disengaged and out of step.

Demhcs said: Much longer review from our favourite YouTuber . Now I want a manual v6, damn you Jethro! I have to admit I I actually enjoyed this review, the review seemed a lot more in depth than his usual just talking about himself, he actually really delved deep into the car and gave some great feedback on how it drives on the road, seems even the sport chassis with cup 2 tyres has great ride quality on the road as well, but that is typical Lotus that they drive well on a British road.

Gibbo205 said: I have to admit I I actually enjoyed this review, the review seemed a lot more in depth than his usual just talking about himself, he actually really delved deep into the car and gave some great feedback on how it drives on the road, seems even the sport chassis with cup 2 tyres has great ride quality on the road as well, but that is typical Lotus that they drive well on a British road. Likewise. I tend to turn off after a few seconds usually but I've quite enjoyed both his Lotus Emira videos. Do the Cup 2s have a hard sidewall? Could they explain why the Sports suspension option in that car is so firm and jiggly on the road? Would the Goodyear option be a softer solution?

as7920 said: Likewise. I tend to turn off after a few seconds usually but I've quite enjoyed both his Lotus Emira videos. Do the Cup 2s have a hard sidewall? Could they explain why the Sports suspension option in that car is so firm and jiggly on the road? Would the Goodyear option be a softer solution? Cup 2 tyres do have a firmer sidewall yes, I ordered my Emira with sports chassis but selected the Goodyear tyres, as my driving will be 99% road in all weather, hence the Cup 2 just don't seem suitable. I'd also not really be buying an Emira if I was planning a lot of track work, I know it is not fair to compared new with used but anyone planning a lot of track days would be better off in a GT4. As a road car to enjoy I think an Emira with sports and Goodyear will have a firm well damped ride that is sporty feeling and fun, certainly won't be harsh, but that said the Touring suspension is ideal for those who want a sports car that soaks everything up. I suspect the Emira Sports chassis with cup tyres will ride very similar to a Porsche with the fixed damper sports option that was available as an option on some cars or similar to say a Cayman R which I find has great ride. I am fortunate I get to have both Lotus and Porsche together but if I had to have say a 4.0 GTS or an Emira and its sole use was road driving based on reviews and seeing both in the flesh I'd take the Emira every time, it somehow makes the Cayman look dull and boring which is crazy as the Cayman is such a good looking car, but looks wise the Emira is more a GT4 and supercar rival, just can't compare with those for track work, but as a road car the Emira seems spot on. Lets not forget the Evora 410 drives out of this world on the road, it just had a rubbish interior and the looks did not do much for me, Emira fixes those looks and has a superb interior and mod cons, I think it will do very well with more and more demand as customers start to get their cars.

Gibbo205 said: Cup 2 tyres do have a firmer sidewall yes, I ordered my Emira with sports chassis but selected the Goodyear tyres, as my driving will be 99% road in all weather, hence the Cup 2 just don't seem suitable. I'd also not really be buying an Emira if I was planning a lot of track work, I know it is not fair to compared new with used but anyone planning a lot of track days would be better off in a GT4. As a road car to enjoy I think an Emira with sports and Goodyear will have a firm well damped ride that is sporty feeling and fun, certainly won't be harsh, but that said the Touring suspension is ideal for those who want a sports car that soaks everything up. I suspect the Emira Sports chassis with cup tyres will ride very similar to a Porsche with the fixed damper sports option that was available as an option on some cars or similar to say a Cayman R which I find has great ride. I am fortunate I get to have both Lotus and Porsche together but if I had to have say a 4.0 GTS or an Emira and its sole use was road driving based on reviews and seeing both in the flesh I'd take the Emira every time, it somehow makes the Cayman look dull and boring which is crazy as the Cayman is such a good looking car, but looks wise the Emira is more a GT4 and supercar rival, just can't compare with those for track work, but as a road car the Emira seems spot on. Lets not forget the Evora 410 drives out of this world on the road, it just had a rubbish interior and the looks did not do much for me, Emira fixes those looks and has a superb interior and mod cons, I think it will do very well with more and more demand as customers start to get their cars. Thanks. Never owned a Lotus and my only Porsche is a Macan T I picked up 2 weeks ago. The looks and decent interior immediately drew me to the Emira and it was a spur of the moment impulse. It will be a daily drive hence why I'd never considered a Lotus before, even an Evora. I'm not afraid of a firm suspension, had a few M's but don't want something crashy.

as7920 said: Thanks. Never owned a Lotus and my only Porsche is a Macan T I picked up 2 weeks ago. The looks and decent interior immediately drew me to the Emira and it was a spur of the moment impulse. It will be a daily drive hence why I'd never considered a Lotus before, even an Evora. I'm not afraid of a firm suspension, had a few M's but don't want something crashy. Sports with cup tyres will still be like a limousine compared to BMW M suspension.

Am I correct that the frunk on the lotus isn't actually a frunk at all - therefore, whilst it seems to have some good interior spaces for bits and pieces, considering the rear boot is tiny, is it even fit for travelling to the track with helmets and stuff?...let alone a road trip.

julian987R said: Am I correct that the frunk on the lotus isn't actually a frunk at all - therefore, whilst it seems to have some good interior spaces for bits and pieces, considering the rear boot is tiny, is it even fit for travelling to the track with helmets and stuff?...let alone a road trip. There was loads of space in the Evora. Boot is bigger than it looks. Emira is not materially different from Evora by that measure.

blueg33 said: There was loads of space in the Evora. Boot is bigger than it looks. Emira is not materially different from Evora by that measure. Boot is same size as the Exige and in my Exige I can fit two helmets, tyre pump, ruck sack with snacks, torque wrench and other necessary tools plus coats and umbrella. The Emira also has a large space behind the seats which can also accommodate helmets or large soft bags if required so it’s perfectly fine for track days or long road trips. Of course nothing can rival a Boxster or Cayman when it comes to having two boot spaces but the Emira has plenty of space for road trips / track days.

I’ve done 10 day European road trips in the Evora with no issue, I also managed to fit in a whole set of wheels and tyres. You cannot do the latter in a cayman. I thought the boot was bigger than the Exige/Elise?

blueg33 said: I’ve done 10 day European road trips in the Evora with no issue, I also managed to fit in a whole set of wheels and tyres. You cannot do the latter in a cayman. I thought the boot was bigger than the Exige/Elise? It is very similar, having looked inside the boot of a final Emira and my Exige the space looks similar but of course has a lot more room behind the seats compared to an Exige.

returning to the title of the thread, i don't think the Cayman has met its match with the Emira. actually i think the cars that the Emira replaces were much closer to the Cayman because they were designed as sports cars, whereas the Emira aspires to be a 'baby' or 'entry level' supercar, as most are putting it the Cayman OTOH was and is a sports car by design and is most certainly a Porsche, and all the more discrete for it. I use mine as a daily and am happy to turn up to the odd client meeting, something i would never do in an Emira. ultimately i think the A110 is more of a match that the Emira because like the Cayman, it was designed from the ground up as a sports car and stays true to its heritage the Emira OTOH may be similar from a mechanical and driving POV, but in terms of styling because the Emira has borrowed so much from other cars of the last decade or so, it seems to have lost its identity and it won't be long before it starts looking a bit dated (in fact it's barely been released and i think the ageing process is already well on its way) ultimately i think you either like the Cayman, or you like the Emira but i don't think there will be many agonising over whether to get one or the other

It is of course perfectly possible to like both the Cayman and Emira. The 718 GT4 both drives and looks superb receiving more good attention than even my 991.2 GT3 CS and whilst the Emira is clearly far less driver focused than the GT4 it is more of a usable daily and has drop dead looks very similar to the 458 which remarkably hasn't aged one bit in 12 years and nor will the Emira. The fantastic styling of the Emira makes most Lotus of old look very crude and dated and together with the bargain price effectively gives buyers a very usable supercar bettering current Mclaren and Ferrari looks for a third of the price which is the most important factor for a large proportion of buyers hence the increasingly long lead times for new Emira orders. Reckon on the first few FE Emiras retailing at around £100k+.

Returning to the title of the thread, i don't think the Cayman and the Emira will be comparable until Lotus have a decade of design and development plus a few billion spent. I think the cars that the Emira replaces were roughly equal to the Cayman because they were designed as sports cars . To some the Emira aspires to be a 'baby' or 'entry level' supercar, difficult to say as they haven't even rolled off the production line yet. The Cayman was and is a sports car by design and is most certainly a Porsche. Just thought I'd state the bleeding obvious there. Apparently, some like to turn up to client meetings in their Porsche. Maybe it makes them feel like they've 'made it'. Congratulations. Equally, some might choose not to turn up to client meetings in an Emira. Maybe they will take the Bentley instead, who knows. Ultimately i think the A110 is like the Cayman and the Emira, all were designed from the ground up as a sports car and stay true to its heritage of Renault/Alpine, Lotus and Porsche heritage. The Porsche, however, may be similar from a mechanical and driving POV to almost all the last dozen variants, in terms of styling because it's borrowed so much from other cars of the last decade or so, it seems to have lost its identity and it won't be long before it starts looking a bit dated, bland, dull and meaningless and stand by to wait at junctions because nobody wants to let you out. But ultimately i think you either like the Cayman, the A110 or the Emira and I don't think there will be many agonising over whether to get one of the three. I would like an Emira please. In yellow. Edited by Oilchange on Wednesday 22 June 13:19

Gibbo205 said: blueg33 said: I’ve done 10 day European road trips in the Evora with no issue, I also managed to fit in a whole set of wheels and tyres. You cannot do the latter in a cayman. I thought the boot was bigger than the Exige/Elise? It is very similar, having looked inside the boot of a final Emira and my Exige the space looks similar but of course has a lot more room behind the seats compared to an Exige. Exige 3 and Evora are 160 lites, Emira is 151 with 208 behind the seats Emira total is 359 Cayman is 130 in the from and 275 in the rear. Cayman total is 405 Cayman is a bit bigger but not enough IMO to impact usage.

Oilchange said: Apparently, some like to turn up to client meetings in their Porsche. Maybe it makes them feel like they've 'made it'. Congratulations. Equally, some might choose not to turn up to client meetings in an Emira. Maybe they will take the Bentley instead, who knows. Edited by Oilchange on Wednesday 22 June 13:19 Would think turning up to a client meeting in a Porsche makes far more of a statement than a Lotus, something like an Elise would blend in anywhere and not put peoples' noses out of joint, would see the Emira being similarly non confrontational even in bright yellow. Porsches OTOH are a bit more abrasive and 'in your face' in my view, kind of like a Rolex. As for the A110, well, I'd be worried they think I'd had to downgrade... What with the ugly Renault design and all those Clio parts...

Oilchange said: The Cayman was and is a sports car by design and is most certainly a Porsche. Just thought I'd state the bleeding obvious there. actually if you think that's obvious then you've missed the point. you can tell as soon as you see the Cayman that it's a Porsche. but if someone had shown you a photo of Lotus and not told you which car maker designed it would you be able to tell it's a Lotus? looking at the car it's not necessarily a Lotus, more the baby Ferrari/Lambo/McLaren wannabe that it is Oilchange said: Apparently, some like to turn up to client meetings in their Porsche. Maybe it makes them feel like they've 'made it'. Congratulations. sometimes i need to go see clients at their homes and as they are very well off clients the Cayman is, for me, the perfect car to turn up in not because i feel like i've "made it" but because - like i said in my post - the Cayman is a discrete car i wouldn't turn up in a GT4 for obvious reasons, and for the same reasons i wouldn't turn up in an Emira Oilchange said: The Porsche, however, may be similar from a mechanical and driving POV to almost all the last dozen variants, in terms of styling because it's borrowed so much from other cars of the last decade or so, it seems to have lost its identity and it won't be long before it starts looking a bit dated, bland, dull and meaningless and stand by to wait at junctions because nobody wants to let you out. you seem to have got your knickers in a twist over nothing but i think your comments confirm my thoughts - that you either want one or the other Oilchange said: I would like an Emira please. In yellow. good for you

I'm simply responding to your snooty post that seems to rate Porsche as some sort of level above. Complete load of arrogant tosh.

julian987R said: Am I correct that the frunk on the lotus isn't actually a frunk at all - therefore, whilst it seems to have some good interior spaces for bits and pieces, considering the rear boot is tiny, is it even fit for travelling to the track with helmets and stuff?...let alone a road trip. There isn't a frunk, I don't think anyone has said there is one. As others have said there is space behind the seats as well as the boot. It's not as big as the Evora though (which obviously had enough space for seats).

Emira GT4 sounding rather fruity at Goodwood this morning… Gives a hint at what’s to come with future versions…fingers crossed

MrVert said: Emira GT4 sounding rather fruity at Goodwood this morning… Gives a hint at what’s to come with future versions…fingers crossed Comparing an Emira GT4 to the GT4 would seem a bit fairer than Jethro's initial review...

I wonder are any of these fruity sounding Emiras including those used in all the tests in European street legal spec, as in with particulate filters in place? It would certainly be one reason to supply pre-production cars to the tests if they were run without the filters as the cars would minimally sound a lot better and maybe also have better performance. Obviously a show car on a track doesn't need them either.

Demhcs said: Comparing an Emira GT4 to the GT4 would seem a bit fairer than Jethro's initial review... The Emira GT4 isn't road legal, it's a race car. The Porsche equivalent is the GT4 Clubsport

DMZ said: I wonder are any of these fruity sounding Emiras including those used in all the tests in European street legal spec, as in with particulate filters in place? It would certainly be one reason to supply pre-production cars to the tests if they were run without the filters as the cars would minimally sound a lot better and maybe also have better performance. Obviously a show car on a track doesn't need them either. Emira does not run or need a particulate filter, they run three catalyst instead. The customer cars will sound same as the cars at Goodwood today.

Still torn between the V6 and i4. If you think about it if you cost in the effective £2k cost extra of the dct gearbox on the i4 it effectively makes the i4 FE only £69995. Which makes it a whole £6k cheaper than the V6.

av185 said: Still torn between the V6 and i4. If you think about it if you cost in the effective £2k cost extra of the dct gearbox on the i4 it effectively makes the i4 FE only £69995. Which makes it a whole £6k cheaper than the V6. More than that I think It'll be the better Emira with a lower CoG and DSG box.

Taffy66 said: av185 said: Still torn between the V6 and i4. If you think about it if you cost in the effective £2k cost extra of the dct gearbox on the i4 it effectively makes the i4 FE only £69995. Which makes it a whole £6k cheaper than the V6. More than that I think It'll be the better Emira with a lower CoG and DSG box. Good point Taffy I hadn't considered the lower cog of the i4. Engine will be lighter than the V6 but the gearbox no doubt heavier although overall the i4 will be lighter. I received an e mail confirming the original quoted prices are being held because of the delays and Lotus are absorbing increasing componentry costs themselves. Quite remarkable. Fully expect the prices of the option packs on the base models to rise into next year though and tend to think even a few extras specced on a base model yo make it medium spec will inevitably take the overall price above the FE with all the spec.

Old Camry V6 or new AMG four? For me is a no brainer. That said Porschophiles mistakenly seem to have an issue with anything other than a flat six.

Demhcs said: Old Camry V6 or new AMG four? For me is a no brainer. That said Porschophiles mistakenly seem to have an issue with anything other than a flat six. Mistakenly? Hmmm.. People make their own decisions on what they like. It’s called preference. Like your preference for the AMG four.

HighwayStar said: Demhcs said: Old Camry V6 or new AMG four? For me is a no brainer. That said Porschophiles mistakenly seem to have an issue with anything other than a flat six. Mistakenly? Hmmm.. People make their own decisions on what they like. It’s called preference. Like your preference for the AMG four. Quite. Though it has to be said any car enthusiast thinking a capable but rather farty 4 pot can in anyway compete with one of Porsches finest flat sixes needs to have a serious word with themselves.

Demhcs said: Old Camry V6 or new AMG four? For me is a no brainer. That said Porschophiles mistakenly seem to have an issue with anything other than a flat six. Odd to choose an engine based only on snobby. It's not like they literally pull the engine out of an old Camry. I'd choose the engine based on noise, performance and gearbox choice.

av185 said: HighwayStar said: Demhcs said: Old Camry V6 or new AMG four? For me is a no brainer. That said Porschophiles mistakenly seem to have an issue with anything other than a flat six. Mistakenly? Hmmm.. People make their own decisions on what they like. It’s called preference. Like your preference for the AMG four. Quite. Though it has to be said any car enthusiast thinking a capable but rather farty 4 pot can in anyway compete with one of Porsches finest flat sixes needs to have a serious word with themselves. Don't think we've seen it in action yet, well perhaps other than in the A45S... With a 400+ HP map already indicated for the Chinese market, that i4 DCT will have no difficulty blowing Highway's aging 981 GT4 into the weeds...

HighwayStar said: Oh dear… Indeed. He seems to like trolling.

Demhcs said: av185 said: HighwayStar said: Demhcs said: Old Camry V6 or new AMG four? For me is a no brainer. That said Porschophiles mistakenly seem to have an issue with anything other than a flat six. Mistakenly? Hmmm.. People make their own decisions on what they like. It’s called preference. Like your preference for the AMG four. Quite. Though it has to be said any car enthusiast thinking a capable but rather farty 4 pot can in anyway compete with one of Porsches finest flat sixes needs to have a serious word with themselves. Don't think we've seen it in action yet, well perhaps other than in the A45S... With a 400+ HP map already indicated for the Chinese market, that i4 DCT will have no difficulty blowing Highway's aging 981 GT4 into the weeds... Oh dear… I purposely avoided saying anything about the flat 4, some love it, others don’t. As for my ageing GT4, checked my garage before responding didn’t you Anyway, worrying about other cars that can blow it into the weeds. Seriously! How old are you? I’m not that guy. There are Mclarens, Lamborghinis… other Porsches etc that are faster than my car and guess what… I can live with that. Edited by HighwayStar on Friday 24th June 11:58

braddo said: HighwayStar said: Oh dear… Indeed. He seems to like trolling. Hmm. Trolling - classic PH definition : holding a viewpoint you don't agree with ? And Highway whatever you say as long as it makes you feel better...

av185 said: Quite. Though it has to be said any car enthusiast thinking a capable but rather farty 4 pot can in anyway compete with one of Porsches finest flat sixes needs to have a serious word with themselves. I'm curious, how many Camry engines have had shagged cylinder liners? Or leaky seals requiring engine out? Maybe not the entire range but still, great German engineering... I am in no doubt Porsche build some great engines but I'd take a Lotus engineered Camry engine in an Evora/Exige.Emira without too much worry. Or a Merc i4. Without having any serious 'words' with myself.

Demhcs said: Hmm. Trolling - classic PH definition : holding a viewpoint you don't agree with ? And Highway whatever you say as long as it makes you feel better... No it's more the manner of posting from what I've seen you post about Porsche/Lotus/Alpine.

Oilchange said: av185 said: Quite. Though it has to be said any car enthusiast thinking a capable but rather farty 4 pot can in anyway compete with one of Porsches finest flat sixes needs to have a serious word with themselves. I'm curious, how many Camry engines have had shagged cylinder liners? Or leaky seals requiring engine out? Maybe not the entire range but still, great German engineering... I am in no doubt Porsche build some great engines but I'd take a Lotus engineered Camry engine in an Evora/Exige.Emira without too much worry. Or a Merc i4. Without having any serious 'words' with myself. Rather think broadly any Porsche engine issues are a thing of the past unlike many other manufacturers including German ones. Despite owning most model 911s and Porsche GT cars over the years the only issue I had apart from the 991.1 GT3 (which had a new engine on the stop production line as mine was a later May 2014 car registered Sept 14) was a whole 13years ago with my 2007 Carrera S cab which had piston slap but received a new engine under warranty. Apart from that, no issues whatsoever.

So 2 new engines but apart from that nothing? Great.

Demhcs said: braddo said: HighwayStar said: Oh dear… Indeed. He seems to like trolling. Hmm. Trolling - classic PH definition : holding a viewpoint you don't agree with ? And Highway whatever you say as long as it makes you feel better... I’m feeling wonderful…. Why do some PHers believe they know how others feel? Someone I know (or don’t know) having a faster car than mine does not bother me. It appears to be important to you though Move on fella… you literally know nothing about me. Now, can you resist having the last word? You’ll get no response from me again. Edited by HighwayStar on Friday 24th June 17:56 Edited by HighwayStar on Saturday 25th June 08:32