When your pride and joy becomes an "Ornament" - Page 2 - 911/Carrera GT - PistonHeads UK

Due to the recent rise in appreciation for things like the GT3 RS, I now know 2 friends that have effectively retired their cars as they are concerned about damaging what has become a very expensive ornament almost overnight. One is a Gen 2 3RS and the other a gen 1RS. The third mate has just sold his gen 1RS after owning it for 10 months and putting 7k miles on it and generally abusing it! Bought for £75k sold for £110k. Not bad in anyones book ! So , the question is , what to do ? Even if they want to track them the cost of insurance is now prohibitive and they are being quoted £500 per day currently but the rumblings are that this will increase as underwriters are now shying away from trackday cover having caught a cold over it. So , at what point when your car becomes an ornament to polish and leave in the garage for fear of adding miles or damage do you jump ship to enjoy the thrill of driving again ???

Far Cough said: Due to the recent rise in appreciation for things like the GT3 RS, I now know 2 friends that have effectively retired their cars as they are concerned about damaging what has become a very expensive ornament almost overnight. One is a Gen 2 3RS and the other a gen 1RS. The third mate has just sold his gen 1RS after owning it for 10 months and putting 7k miles on it and generally abusing it! Bought for £75k sold for £110k. Not bad in anyones book ! So , the question is , what to do ? Even if they want to track them the cost of insurance is now prohibitive and they are being quoted £500 per day currently but the rumblings are that this will increase as underwriters are now shying away from trackday cover having caught a cold over it. So , at what point when your car becomes an ornament to polish and leave in the garage for fear of adding miles or damage do you jump ship to enjoy the thrill of driving again ??? At what point? The intersection where the "benefit" of driving the car an extra mile is outweighed by the opportunity cost of potential value rise. What you will find is that this is very mileage dependent. E.g. if a car has done 62k miles, driving it an extra 6k miles is unlikely to affect it's value. However, the cost of the next 2k miles will affect the value, as the car will cross the arbitrary 70k mile threshold.

Cars are made to be driven - not looked at. If and when the time comes that you are reluctant to use something because of its value, then the pleasure of ownership is lost imo. A very good friend used to own a genuine Audi Quattro Sport SWB which he purchased for £42,000. He was quite happy doing a few trackdays and using it on the road for jollys as and when the mood took him, but when some six or so years after buying it the value doubled, he elected to sell it because he didn't want to drive it as it was intended with the 'new' value it had acquired.

At the moment my 7.1 RS is worth about 30k more than I paid for it. The way im seeing it is I never bought it with the intention of making money and its never going to be worth less than I paid for it so I might as well drive it. Your a long time dead and a lovely orange GT3 wont be much use when im 6 feet under..

I bought my GT3 to drive first and foremost. I love driving it, tis the reason why I bought It's value has gone up since I bought it (which is nice) but because its worth more it doesn't mean I want to drive it any less......if that makes sense. I thought about selling it and 'cashing in' but the idea of never getting to drive one again scared me out of it! So... 1) I didn't buy it to make money on it. 2) I expected it to be worth less when I sold it. I dont think it will ever drop below £55k which is what I paid for it so I am going to continue to drive it...... unless it gets to a ridiculous value and then I will sell it..... I think..... Oh I don't know!

Trev450 said: Cars are made to be driven - not looked at. If and when the time comes that you are reluctant to use something because of its value, then the pleasure of ownership is lost imo. A very good friend used to own a genuine Audi Quattro Sport SWB which he purchased for £42,000. He was quite happy doing a few trackdays and using it on the road for jollys as and when the mood took him, but when some six or so years after buying it the value doubled, he elected to sell it because he didn't want to drive it as it was intended with the 'new' value it had acquired. Doubled...??? £495,000...!!! I think your friend might wish he sill had it...! http://www.howardwisecars.co.uk/index.php/classic/...

CRA1G said: Trev450 said: Cars are made to be driven - not looked at. If and when the time comes that you are reluctant to use something because of its value, then the pleasure of ownership is lost imo. A very good friend used to own a genuine Audi Quattro Sport SWB which he purchased for £42,000. He was quite happy doing a few trackdays and using it on the road for jollys as and when the mood took him, but when some six or so years after buying it the value doubled, he elected to sell it because he didn't want to drive it as it was intended with the 'new' value it had acquired. Doubled...??? £495,000...!!! I think your friend might wish he sill had it...! http://www.howardwisecars.co.uk/index.php/classic/... This was about seven years ago and his was no where near as low a mileage as the one advertised. But he was aware that keeping it longer would have resulted in a higher selling price, but wasn't prepared to keep it and not use it.

Rag it habitually .... or sell it. Nothing inbetween.

Inverted said: At the moment my 7.1 RS is worth about 30k more than I paid for it. The way im seeing it is I never bought it with the intention of making money and its never going to be worth less than I paid for it so I might as well drive it. Your a long time dead and a lovely orange GT3 wont be much use when im 6 feet under.. Exactly . I got a new 991 GT3 , 3 weeks ago . All my pals are saying I'm nuts not to sell and make £20k . I say your a long time dead and would I get more enjoyment out of 20k ......No

jackal said: Rag it habitually .... or sell it. Nothing inbetween. STANDARD ! ^ ... but not in this weather

keep it lit said: jackal said: Rag it habitually .... or sell it. Nothing inbetween. STANDARD ! ^ ... but not in this weather Love it. Even looks fantastic without wheels! Almost bought this car but thought it would have been wasted on me.

keep it lit said: STANDARD ! ^ ... but not in this weather True.. Mines sleeping until April. Haven't even seen it since August. 8 months hibernation when I finally get to drive it. Road trip around Northern Scotland booked for then.

keep it lit said: STANDARD ! ^ ... but not in this weather Love the lay up image...even looks nice on stilts

keep it lit said: STANDARD ! ^ ... but not in this weather Tart Oh hold on. 2005, happy days

Inverted said: At the moment my 7.1 RS is worth about 30k more than I paid for it. The way im seeing it is I never bought it with the intention of making money and its never going to be worth less than I paid for it so I might as well drive it. Your a long time dead and a lovely orange GT3 wont be much use when im 6 feet under.. Spot on drive the nuts off it as there are so many saddos now that hide them away without using them for the right reasons. I sold my RS to get a car I can drive regardless of mileage etc. As you say life too short

keep it lit said: STANDARD ! ^ ... but not in this weather Why no wheels? Anti theft device or are you under there with a toothbrush?

keep it lit said: STANDARD ! ^ ... but not in this weather Lol, looks like a sacred temple

ttdan said: Why no wheels? Anti theft device or are you under there with a toothbrush? Correct preening.

keep it lit said: ttdan said: Why no wheels? Anti theft device or are you under there with a toothbrush? Correct preening. Mine has its face off and away getting new lipstick.

jackal said: Lol, looks like a sacred temple ha ha I'll post another picture when it's finished

Trev450 said: Cars are made to be driven - not looked at. If and when the time comes that you are reluctant to use something because of its value, then the pleasure of ownership is lost imo. +1 My guess is that those that start treating their car as an ornament did not expect the windfall of it going up in value. The windfall is hard for some not to think about. Me, I only think about what it cost me to buy in the first place and therefore continue to use it as intended, regardless of what it might be worth now.

boxsey said: +1 My guess is that those that start treating their car as an ornament did not expect the windfall of it going up in value. The windfall is hard for some not to think about. Me, I only think about what it cost me to buy in the first place and therefore continue to use it as intended, regardless of what it might be worth now. Spot on. I think a few getting v bored of cars they cant drive now. I know I did

boxsey said: The windfall is hard for some not to think about. Me, I only think about what it cost me to buy in the first place... So you're pretty rich then. Well done

No hibernation for this one ...... And roll on tomorrow , can't wait :-)

Scooty100 said: Spot on. I think a few getting v bored of cars they cant drive now. I know I did I think I would fall into the same category. Typically I sold my GT3 before they went stupidly stratospheric...so I can only comment from afar on what close friends are doing with theirs that they kept. You must have much wealth to buy a car to only drive it the odd day in the year , a collector for example , but to find that the car you have used for a couple of years for fun and trackdays is now effectively being priced out of those markets as insurance companies shrink away from risk and as an end user of that car suffering higher and higher prices just to run it would get tiresome IMHO

I've just sold my GT3, it did 1500 miles the first year I had it, 500 the next and 600 this year. I bought it to enjoy a 911 and I did but it was not really suitable for me, nor did I want to use it as a daily driver. The increase in value was a nice bonus but I did fear ending up with something that you didn't want to drive hard. I've replaced it with a 997 GTS and have driven a 911 nearly as much in the last two weeks as I have the rest of the year. Regards Fred

GT3cs said: No hibernation for this one ...... And roll on tomorrow , can't wait :-) Good man never thought id see your garage with a dirty car in there BUT I like it!

Far Cough said: I think I would fall into the same category. Typically I sold my GT3 before they went stupidly stratospheric...so I can only comment from afar on what close friends are doing with theirs that they kept. You must have much wealth to buy a car to only drive it the odd day in the year , a collector for example , but to find that the car you have used for a couple of years for fun and trackdays is now effectively being priced out of those markets as insurance companies shrink away from risk and as an end user of that car suffering higher and higher prices just to run it would get tiresome IMHO I found the talking about it and not driving it v dull in the end. I now got two well sorted cars and can enjoy and don't stress over.

Insurance is potentially going up a bit but insurance for track days is still very gettable, except for maybe the Nordschliefe and even that isn't impossible. Yes it can all cost a bit more, car has risen in value, still a net gain at the end of the day. Keep driving it is what I'd suggest.

FredBasset said: I've just sold my GT3, it did 1500 miles the first year I had it, 500 the next and 600 this year. 500 miles in one whole year !! I`d want way "more" enjoyment out of it than that. To drive to a trackday , complete the day and drive home again would see off 500 miles. Not sure I could justify or want a car I used once a year but your post does make the thread point beautifully.

supermono said: boxsey said: The windfall is hard for some not to think about. Me, I only think about what it cost me to buy in the first place... So you're pretty rich then. Well done Nope. I think I'm probably poor compared to the average Porsche owner. I count my self lucky that I bought a great car at the right time and simply use it without thinking about what it might be worth now.

boxsey said: supermono said: boxsey said: The windfall is hard for some not to think about. Me, I only think about what it cost me to buy in the first place... So you're pretty rich then. Well done Nope. I think I'm probably poor compared to the average Porsche owner. I count my self lucky that I bought a great car at the right time and simply use it without thinking about what it might be worth now. +1 I think at current prices, sensible head would have taken over and I would buy what I did. I just count myself very lucky I bought when I did.

Just reading the other thread about Steve Rance who has just bought a 7.1 GT3 where he comments on how much the RS`s have shot up in price making tracking them a bit more of a risky proposition....

Far Cough said: Just reading the other thread about Steve Rance who has just bought a 7.1 GT3 where he comments on how much the RS`s have shot up in price making tracking them a bit more of a risky proposition.... Yes good example and one of the reasons he went for a 7.1 clubsport. Not cheap but still exellent value when you compare what little difference there is between them and the 7.1 RS.

Far Cough said: 500 miles in one whole year !! I`d want way "more" enjoyment out of it than that. To drive to a trackday , complete the day and drive home again would see off 500 miles. Not sure I could justify or want a car I used once a year but your post does make the thread point beautifully. Indeed, hence why I've sold it and got a 997 GTS. I had every intention of using the GT3 for track days and fun, unfortunately work got really busy and as my daughter got older I was getting less and less chance to use it. That said I've got an Evo VI that did even less miles! Regards Fred

FredBasset said: That said I've got an Evo VI that did even less miles! Regards Fred Me too, but mine averages about 2000 miles a year. Which model have you got?

I'll PM you to avoid derailing the thread. Regards Fred

FredBasset said: I'll PM you to avoid derailing the thread. Regards Fred Received and replied.

Oh dear... Put on 10k miles on my 997.2 GT3 this year. Only 8 track days... I feel bad! Should have done at least 20.