Would a non OPC service history put you off a GT3? - Page 2 - 911/Carrera GT - PistonHeads UK

Hi all, If you were looking to a buy a secondhand GT3 say a 991.2, circa 5 years old+ and recent maintenance was carried out by a company such as JZM or RPM Technic, would it put you off, or would you be happy, as they are Porsche, and in these cases, GT Porsche specialists? Presume they offer their own warranties if not SoR. Thanks,

TBH I'd be happier to see a good indie service than I would than for certain OPCs - but I'm an enthusiast, I appreciate not everyone is

I think the indies you mentioned are pretty much amongst the best in the business so I would have no hesitation in buying a car serviced by them (subject to the usual buyer checks).

For me it would depend on other things too: Was it serviced on time as per Porsche's schedule? Were all the correct items replaced at the right time? Which specific Indy did the work and I am happy with their reputation? Am I planning on selling the car soon? It will reduce my pool of buyers. This would potentially be hard to work out, but did the previous owner(s) do it to save money? If so, what other cost savings did they do? I don't think I'd be averse to Indy servicing per se, but I'd rather see OPC servicing on such a new car.

A service history from RPM Technik or JZM wouldn't concern me at all. Some would argue that their expertise and throughness is as good or better than most OPCs. So as long as everything was carried at the right times that should be fine. I would however want any 991 GT3 also under a Porsche warranty as I believe some of them have experienced engine issues (I am not an expert on this model and not sure if it affected both generations but I believe it is well documented). The warranties at the independents are good (I have purchased from JZM and they have addressed a couple of warranty items quickly and with no fuss), but they normally have an upper limit on each claim that wouldn't cover a new engine. So if purchasing from an independent this may be worth considering on top.

Answer is absolutely not - no worries with either. Re engine issues mentioned earlier - this was only on the 991.1 not .2 Are you poking for a manual or PDK ?

Depends on the specialist. I'd probably rather buy from RPM than an OPC, especially for an RS. (Also, I did buy from RPM and they service my RS, so my money is where my mouth is).

It might not put off a Porsche enthusiast that knows their stuff and probably has owned multiple Gt cars. But it would I suspect put off the vast majority of owners that are not covered by the above. I bought my first Porsche recently and would not touch a non full Porsche service history car. I bought it privately and have just paid for full warranty,. It’s a 981 GTS so not a GT car but for me that would just magnify the issue if it were. I’ve probably spent way more than necessary. But the seller of my car has probably justified his decisions to keep it fully in house.

It wouldn't put me off, but I'd be sceptical as to why not continue with the Porsche servicing and extending the warranty. Perhaps it got in the hands of someone who thought they could save a penny... Then again it could be because someone has experienced poor service from an OPC and decided it was better for them to go to the indy...

I’d happily buy a car that had been looked after by RPM but unless I wanted to go to the modifying/tuning route I’d want a Porsche warranty as on a GT3 I think at £900 it’s very good value,

The reason for asking is I have a 991.2Gt3 with a Porsche warranty still in effect. Was considering changing a couple of things over time such as lightweight battery, equal length manifolds etc, but this would invalidate the warranty if I did anything whilst in effect and preclude me from renewing (unless changed back to standard), so the question was to gauge if I switched to a recognised indy, the effect on how the car is perceived. I was going to look at a gt3 for sale at JZM (had a JCR exhaust), but it sold before I could get there, so, I don't have an issue personally. I will probably wait until the warranty is nearly expired and make a decision then, but the cash saved re non OPC maintenance and warranty cost from that point could be stuck in the bank and cover any non catastrophic issues. I would get the oil changed more often than Porsche's long intervals - always prefer annually, no matter what the manufacturer says. If the engine blew up, that would be a bit of a pain, but hopefully that is a very, very rare occurrence on well maintained 991.2gt3...........!!

Oh, and thanks for all your replies!!!

It's not just the engine, there are some other quite pricey parts - LED headlights (if you have them), PCM units, PADM adaptive mounts etc. I think your decision should take into account how long you plan on hanging on to your car

MarkM3Evoplus said: I will probably wait until the warranty is nearly expired and make a decision then, but the cash saved re non OPC maintenance and warranty cost from that point could be stuck in the bank and cover any non catastrophic issues. From my experience RPM are priced more competitively than JZM. JZM’s pricing was OPC minus 10% which I didn’t think was that significant to be honest.

Twinfan said: It's not just the engine, there are some other quite pricey parts - LED headlights (if you have them), PCM units, PADM adaptive mounts etc. I think your decision should take into account how long you plan on hanging on to your car Indeed! Will give it some thought. Have a place near me that specialises in repairing PCMs if anyone needs that. A few grand is doable, £20K plus repairs, not so much!!!! I used to own an Aston with no warranty.....those were large bills!!

MarkM3Evoplus said: Hi all, If you were looking to a buy a secondhand GT3 say a 991.2, circa 5 years old+ and recent maintenance was carried out by a company such as JZM or RPM Technic, would it put you off, or would you be happy, as they are Porsche, and in these cases, GT Porsche specialists? Presume they offer their own warranties if not SoR. Thanks, I agree with one of the posters below who suggested that if the last owner chose to go to an independent for maintenance, they may have done so to save cost, and then you begin to wonder where else they tried to save money during their ownership. I’m sure many independent dealers are more than capable of performing the basic maintenance (after all, it’s hardly complicated) but if I was buying a used GT3, I would only want to buy one from an OPC with a full Porsche service and maintenance history. After market warranties can be extremely sketchy. They are invariably insurance backed, and have a claim limit and hourly labour rate limit, so if you’re not careful, this could preclude you from getting any warranty repairs done at a main dealer. I know some of the bigger and more reputable independent dealers have their own no quibble warranties which they will stand by,

MarkM3Evoplus said: The reason for asking is I have a 991.2Gt3 with a Porsche warranty still in effect. Was considering changing a couple of things over time such as lightweight battery, equal length manifolds etc, but this would invalidate the warranty if I did anything whilst in effect and preclude me from renewing (unless changed back to standard), so the question was to gauge if I switched to a recognised indy, the effect on how the car is perceived. I It's a bit different for the warranty now. If you have existing warranty the OPC does not need to see the car to renew, so you can leave any mods installed. I had to remove BBS mags and Endless pads each time on my Touring but now there is no need.

IREvans said: I agree with one of the posters below who suggested that if the last owner chose to go to an independent for maintenance, they may have done so to save cost, and then you begin to wonder where else they tried to save money during their ownership. I’m sure many independent dealers are more than capable of performing the basic maintenance (after all, it’s hardly complicated) but if I was buying a used GT3, I would only want to buy one from an OPC with a full Porsche service and maintenance history. After market warranties can be extremely sketchy. They are invariably insurance backed, and have a claim limit and hourly labour rate limit, so if you’re not careful, this could preclude you from getting any warranty repairs done at a main dealer. I know some of the bigger and more reputable independent dealers have their own no quibble warranties which they will stand by, Strictly speaking, I think the Porsche extended warranty is an insurance policy, hence they can dictate the terms of the contract.

Sport_Turismo_GTS said: Strictly speaking, I think the Porsche extended warranty is an insurance policy, hence they can dictate the terms of the contract. Correct, once you exceed the time or distance of the original manufacturer’s warranty, then any follow on dealer warranty will be an insurance product, but they are not all the same. The Porsche approved warranty has no claim or mileage limit, warranty repairs are conducted at a Porsche centre using Porsche original parts, and there is no excess to pay. My experience with aftermarket warranties from independent sellers is they have a claim limit, far more policy exclusions, and you invariably have to negotiate with the warranty provider to authorise repairs.

I always went with indies and had less positive experiences than some of the above posters with two of the so-called best indies, not naming names to keep in with forum policies etc. Particularly, neither had a clue what 6 and 12 year services entail on a pretty popular model, despite some to and fro where I pointed out stuff that was missed and they still didn't get it right. To be fair the issue is more with the people who man the service desks than the mechanics, but I found them barely cheaper than OPC and so it's hard to give them a break. Would it put me off buying any car from either of them? Not one bit - there are plenty of worse stories from OPCs. But perfect neither are to be quite honest.

IREvans said: I agree with one of the posters below who suggested that if the last owner chose to go to an independent for maintenance, they may have done so to save cost, and then you begin to wonder where else they tried to save money during their ownership. I’m sure many independent dealers are more than capable of performing the basic maintenance (after all, it’s hardly complicated) but if I was buying a used GT3, I would only want to buy one from an OPC with a full Porsche service and maintenance history. After market warranties can be extremely sketchy. They are invariably insurance backed, and have a claim limit and hourly labour rate limit, so if you’re not careful, this could preclude you from getting any warranty repairs done at a main dealer. I know some of the bigger and more reputable independent dealers have their own no quibble warranties which they will stand by, This…

Robbo66 said: IREvans said: I agree with one of the posters below who suggested that if the last owner chose to go to an independent for maintenance, they may have done so to save cost, and then you begin to wonder where else they tried to save money during their ownership. I’m sure many independent dealers are more than capable of performing the basic maintenance (after all, it’s hardly complicated) but if I was buying a used GT3, I would only want to buy one from an OPC with a full Porsche service and maintenance history. After market warranties can be extremely sketchy. They are invariably insurance backed, and have a claim limit and hourly labour rate limit, so if you’re not careful, this could preclude you from getting any warranty repairs done at a main dealer. I know some of the bigger and more reputable independent dealers have their own no quibble warranties which they will stand by, This… Not necessarily. I use RPM because a) my car has Manthey suspension and Surface Transform brakes and b) I use it exclusively for the track. I doubt Porsche would warrant it if I asked them; I certainly don't think I'm saving any money, but I am getting a track specialist maintenance model rather than an OPC's checklist.

While personally more than happy to go outside the OPC network without bothering with the necessity of 'full Porsche service history', I think it's pretty clear that no OPC servicing will put off some people and that's pretty much completely separate to the relative merits or otherwise of servicing via an independent and/or whether it shows any lack of willingness to keep up to date/spending with servicing. There definitely will be people who will refuse to look at a car later if it's lacking the requisite dealer stamps. There isn't going to be anywhere near as many who will refuse to consider a car unless it's got 'known' independent stamps regardless of age of model. Edited by isaldiri on Tuesday 14th February 00:05

964Cup said: Not necessarily. I use RPM because a) my car has Manthey suspension and Surface Transform brakes and b) I use it exclusively for the track. I doubt Porsche would warrant it if I asked them; I certainly don't think I'm saving any money, but I am getting a track specialist maintenance model rather than an OPC's checklist. Yes, but the poster at the top of this thread wishes to buy a ~5 year old 991.2 GT3, likely to be a standard unmodified car. My opinion and advice would be different if he wanted a modified car, and wanted to do predominantly track driving.

OPCs are an absolute shambles. If I had a reputable indy close to me I would ALWAYS go there first. I can't even get a call back about my broken Taycan heater.

DMC2 said: OPCs are an absolute shambles. If I had a reputable indy close to me I would ALWAYS go there first. I can't even get a call back about my broken Taycan heater. You’re the second person recently that’s mentioned a broken Taycan heater - wonder if that’s a reoccurring issue ?

IREvans said: 964Cup said: Not necessarily. I use RPM because a) my car has Manthey suspension and Surface Transform brakes and b) I use it exclusively for the track. I doubt Porsche would warrant it if I asked them; I certainly don't think I'm saving any money, but I am getting a track specialist maintenance model rather than an OPC's checklist. Yes, but the poster at the top of this thread wishes to buy a ~5 year old 991.2 GT3, likely to be a standard unmodified car. My opinion and advice would be different if he wanted a modified car, and wanted to do predominantly track driving. I have got a standard 991.2gt3 currently, with 2 service stamps from OPCs. My next service is due in 3 months and I will be using another OPC. I will track the car maybe once of twice a year, but would like to do a couple of mods (exhaust to equal length manifolds, etc), which would invalidate the warranty (about 2 years left of the extended warranty) or preclude renewal if I waited. I suppose I could swap back an exhaust to standard before a service, as doubt the ecu would be any the wiser, but wonder if it would be all worth the faff. Maintenance wise, I've always gone beyond manufacturer servicing requirements

MarkM3Evoplus said: I have got a standard 991.2gt3 currently, with 2 service stamps from OPCs. My next service is due in 3 months and I will be using another OPC. I will track the car maybe once of twice a year, but would like to do a couple of mods (exhaust to equal length manifolds, etc), which would invalidate the warranty (about 2 years left of the extended warranty) or preclude renewal if I waited. I suppose I could swap back an exhaust to standard before a service, as doubt the ecu would be any the wiser, but wonder if it would be all worth the faff. Maintenance wise, I've always gone beyond manufacturer servicing requirements It will be a minor faff, but I would just convert the car back to standard for the service to ensure you get the warranty extended. I tell you what would be a faff, not having a Porsche approved warranty, but having an aftermarket one instead, and spending weeks negotiating with them to fix a major engine or gearbox issue..!

IREvans said: MarkM3Evoplus said: I have got a standard 991.2gt3 currently, with 2 service stamps from OPCs. My next service is due in 3 months and I will be using another OPC. I will track the car maybe once of twice a year, but would like to do a couple of mods (exhaust to equal length manifolds, etc), which would invalidate the warranty (about 2 years left of the extended warranty) or preclude renewal if I waited. I suppose I could swap back an exhaust to standard before a service, as doubt the ecu would be any the wiser, but wonder if it would be all worth the faff. Maintenance wise, I've always gone beyond manufacturer servicing requirements It will be a minor faff, but I would just convert the car back to standard for the service to ensure you get the warranty extended. I tell you what would be a faff, not having a Porsche approved warranty, but having an aftermarket one instead, and spending weeks negotiating with them to fix a major engine or gearbox issue..! Porsche GB’ s warranty underwriter won’t just roll over, they will require all the same due diligence and have similar amounts of aggravation. The dealer will distance themselves from the decision process and act as a mouthpiece for the insurer. You will feel pain. Then after several infuriating attempts to question their arbitrary decision you may get a gesture “contribution” to the already inflated cost of repair as they wouldn’t want to go anywhere near admitting fault or setting any precedents….They don’t want to pay out anymore than the aftermarket does. Mind you the breakdown policy is reasonable value, :-)

IREvans said: It will be a minor faff, but I would just convert the car back to standard for the service to ensure you get the warranty extended. I tell you what would be a faff, not having a Porsche approved warranty, but having an aftermarket one instead, and spending weeks negotiating with them to fix a major engine or gearbox issue..! As long as you renew before the warranty expires they don't need to see the car to renew now. I had the same hassle on my Touring with BBS mags and Endless pads, swapping out each time, now it's no longer an issue.

993rsr said: As long as you renew before the warranty expires they don't need to see the car to renew now. I had the same hassle on my Touring with BBS mags and Endless pads, swapping out each time, now it's no longer an issue. Good information, thanks

993rsr said: As long as you renew before the warranty expires they don't need to see the car to renew now. I had the same hassle on my Touring with BBS mags and Endless pads, swapping out each time, now it's no longer an issue. I thought this was common knowledge. I always keep my Porsches under extended warranty when the factory one has elapsed. Just phone my OPC up a couple of weeks before and pay them for the extended warranty. No need to pay for the 118 point point check. If you wait until the factory warranty has elapsed even by a couple of days the car needs to be delivered to the OPC to undertake the mandatory 118 point check and returned to 100% OEM spec when new, even the floor mats.

A lot of Porsches go to OPCs for the first couple of services then go to good independent who know the cars well so you get a good service repairs at a realist price. Both my GT3s had history's like this, no it would not bother me better to be serviced than non at all. Edited by tracydeedance on Wednesday 15th February 07:51

IREvans said: 993rsr said: As long as you renew before the warranty expires they don't need to see the car to renew now. I had the same hassle on my Touring with BBS mags and Endless pads, swapping out each time, now it's no longer an issue. Good information, thanks LIke 993 RSR I’ve got BBS wheels (sadly not the Mags!!) on my 991.2. The only issue with modifications is that if you do have a warranty claim the OPC is the “gate keeper” for your warranty claim….so a good relationship and a sensible outlook from them as to the impact of having non factory wheels on the functioning of your car is helpful

ttdan said: IREvans said: MarkM3Evoplus said: I have got a standard 991.2gt3 currently, with 2 service stamps from OPCs. My next service is due in 3 months and I will be using another OPC. I will track the car maybe once of twice a year, but would like to do a couple of mods (exhaust to equal length manifolds, etc), which would invalidate the warranty (about 2 years left of the extended warranty) or preclude renewal if I waited. I suppose I could swap back an exhaust to standard before a service, as doubt the ecu would be any the wiser, but wonder if it would be all worth the faff. Maintenance wise, I've always gone beyond manufacturer servicing requirements It will be a minor faff, but I would just convert the car back to standard for the service to ensure you get the warranty extended. I tell you what would be a faff, not having a Porsche approved warranty, but having an aftermarket one instead, and spending weeks negotiating with them to fix a major engine or gearbox issue..! Porsche GB’ s warranty underwriter won’t just roll over, they will require all the same due diligence and have similar amounts of aggravation. The dealer will distance themselves from the decision process and act as a mouthpiece for the insurer. You will feel pain. Then after several infuriating attempts to question their arbitrary decision you may get a gesture “contribution” to the already inflated cost of repair as they wouldn’t want to go anywhere near admitting fault or setting any precedents….They don’t want to pay out anymore than the aftermarket does. Mind you the breakdown policy is reasonable value, :-) That's not been my experience in multiple warranty claims. Leave the car with the OPC listing your concerns and they deal with Porsche directly and just reply with what is covered and what is not. On a 7 year old GT3 bonnet gas struts, illuminating carbon door sill, rear view auto dimming mirror, then later a complete new engine, all replaced with no hassle at all. No need to deal with any insurer. There's been more on other Porsche's I've owned, can't remember them all. For what the service and warranty extension costs my experience is it is well worth it. Oh, puncture on centre locks and recovery for engine fault with 'executive' hire car delivered to my door, all relatively painless and gratis. When I bought the car from an OPC in Dec. 2021 it came with a warranty to Sept 2024, not just the extended engine warranty but the normal full used car warranty. To add the car is tracked a few times a year as well and all the dealer has ever said to me is "good, that's what they're meant for". Other people will have had different experiences I'm sure, maybe the next fault will be a nightmare but touch wood so far so good.

So sounds like it is how good your relationship is with the OPC you use and their warranty manager!

MarkM3Evoplus said: So sounds like it is how good your relationship is with the OPC you use and their warranty manager! I'm really not trying to be contradictory for the sake of it, but just to point out my warranty issues have been addressed at three different dealers, non of whom I bought the car in question from. My buying history is very low down the pecking order for Porsche, I doubt very much any of them would remember me in the slightest. You pay for all this of course, I'm not trying to sound like a porker fanboy, far from it. I'm just too lazy so will cough up more to reduce risk, again touch wood.

robj4 said: That's not been my experience in multiple warranty claims. Leave the car with the OPC listing your concerns and they deal with Porsche directly and just reply with what is covered and what is not. On a 7 year old GT3 bonnet gas struts, illuminating carbon door sill, rear view auto dimming mirror, then later a complete new engine, all replaced with no hassle at all. No need to deal with any insurer. There's been more on other Porsche's I've owned, can't remember them all. For what the service and warranty extension costs my experience is it is well worth it. Oh, puncture on centre locks and recovery for engine fault with 'executive' hire car delivered to my door, all relatively painless and gratis. When I bought the car from an OPC in Dec. 2021 it came with a warranty to Sept 2024, not just the extended engine warranty but the normal full used car warranty. To add the car is tracked a few times a year as well and all the dealer has ever said to me is "good, that's what they're meant for". Other people will have had different experiences I'm sure, maybe the next fault will be a nightmare but touch wood so far so good. What this appears to demonstrate, is that if you behave reasonably and politely with your dealer, then they’ll behave likewise with you. Conversely, rolling the dice and buying from an independent with their sketchy warranties is of no interest to me.

I have never and will not run any Porsche without OEM warranty. This also means I would never consider any independant third party warranty extension. I have the same policy for my Ferraris which is even more important to maintain OEM warranty. Same goes for all service work even MOTs for both makes.