Financing a (used) Porsche GT3 - Page 2 - 911/Carrera GT - PistonHeads UK

Hi, First post in a long time... I'm hitting the big 5-0 this year and planning on feeding my meno-porsche. I've generally purchased cars outright, but I've never purchased anything over £50K before. I just want it for a bit of weekend fun, but also as somewhere I can park some money without getting too majorly punnished when it comes to moving it on. I'm absolutely not speculating it will appreciate - though I obviously wouldnt mind if it did! Am I best buying outright - or would I be better financing it in some way? Any thoughts or personal experience appreciated Thanks

Which model are you considering?

mark4 said: Hi, First post in a long time... I'm hitting the big 5-0 this year and planning on feeding my meno-porsche. I've generally purchased cars outright, but I've never purchased anything over £50K before. I just want it for a bit of weekend fun, but also as somewhere I can park some money without getting too majorly punnished when it comes to moving it on. I'm absolutely not speculating it will appreciate - though I obviously wouldnt mind if it did! Am I best buying outright - or would I be better financing it in some way? Any thoughts or personal experience appreciated Thanks Great car - definitely do it! How you finance the car won’t affect whether (and how much) it depreciates. However, finance rates have increased a lot in the last 12 months and with a negative economic outlook and a used market still benefitting from a shortage of new car supply, personally I think that there is a significant risk that you end up suffering a fair amount of depreciation on top of any financing charges. However, it’s still worth i!

If you have the means to pay for it outright and aren't planning on using those funds for something else, then it makes sense to pay it in full. Any borrowing in effect adds to the price you are paying, fine on a new car where you can hand it back after x amount of time, knowing almost exactly what it would cost over the anticipated length of ownership. But also tell yourself we only get 1 go at life, so why not - whatever works for you (from an almost 50 year old).

With current rates the only palatable way would be to remortgage imho assuming good ltv

Depends upon which GT3 ... your appetite for the cost of finance (which is now insane to me) ... your appetite for potential loss ... and whether you'll need the money for something else anytime soon. If your a gazillionaire, do what you like :-) Personally, if I were to buy a used GT3 I'd buy a 996 (.. because I like 'em) with cash, or with a top up via a personal bank loan. But I'd also have as much fun in numerous other 911 or Cayster alternatives (for less). YMMV

churchie2856 said: Depends upon which GT3 ... your appetite for the cost of finance (which is now insane to me) ... your appetite for potential loss ... and whether you'll need the money for something else anytime soon. If your a gazillionaire, do what you like :-) Personally, if I were to buy a used GT3 I'd buy a 996 (.. because I like 'em) with cash, or with a top up via a personal bank loan. But I'd also have as much fun in numerous other 911 or Cayster alternatives (for less). YMMV I think many are starting to think like this. The high finance is the known part, the depreciation is the unknown part which could go either way. But if you’re 50 and you have always wanted one and can afford the loss and finance, why not. OP I’m not sure what model GT3 you are thinking of but if it’s a 991.2 winged gt3 have you considered a 600LT as they are starting to look excellent value. I’m sure I read Porsches finance is something like 10.9 %, I’m sure plenty are in for a shock having placed their deposit a year ago for new cars when finance rates were half the price!

Yes correct, it is 10.9% APR, on their finance calculator There's a white 997 GT3 clubsport in the classifieds with 60,000 miles for around £80k. If it's a good car, no over-revs etc, to me that would be where I'd put my cash (+ personal loan to top up, as mentioned). Considering a 997 gt3 comfort with 80,000 miles just sold for £70k (including fees) on Collecting Cars last week, albeit looking particularly nice in Guards Red and solid history with respected indy specialists.

[worth saying I have no connection to the car/seller or dealer...am just lusting after one!]

n12maser said: Yes correct, it is 10.9% APR, on their finance calculator There's a white 997 GT3 clubsport in the classifieds with 60,000 miles for around £80k. If it's a good car, no over-revs etc, to me that would be where I'd put my cash (+ personal loan to top up, as mentioned). Considering a 997 gt3 comfort with 80,000 miles just sold for £70k (including fees) on Collecting Cars last week, albeit looking particularly nice in Guards Red and solid history with respected indy specialists. FYI if its this one - https://www.pistonheads.com/buy/listing/14008160 It was for sale a year or two ago and listed correctly as a comfort. Its got the wrong seats for a clubsport (should be nomex material) and the cage was a different one and never painted. I was also told by the old dealer it had a lot of paintwork to bring it up to standard (not necessarily a bad thing but you would want to understand what/where/when and why a little more...)

Great knowledge, not things I spotted!

Gianluca Vialli died a week or so ago - 59 I think. 9 years older than the OP. Live your life while you can.

Finance made some sense when rates were cheap, but they're not now. If you want to think of it another way, if you financed the car would you use the cash pot that you didn't use for an outright purchase for an alternative investment? Would you take a punt on a stocks/shares ISA returning more than 10.9% over the same term? Whatever you do, make sure you enjoy the car. Don't be in a position worrying about depreciation or future values. Life's too short for that.

Totally agree with the above statement. I bought my GT3 997.2 in earlier last year. Its the best purchase I've ever made - I've written the entire lot of now as I know unless I can get into an RS I will not sell the car. And if I can get into an RS I figured most the prices would be relative anyway.

Great choice but hold back just a little bit longer. Dealers are already expecting price to drop and are now pricing that in. A lot of the stock showing is over priced.

Yes this has been the speculation for the last 4/6 months… Then an 80k mile gen1 comfort sold for 70k It’s getting tiring everyone holding out for a drop in prices and the same conversation over and over. My local dealer just sold their 992 touring for 240k and have took a deposit on their shark blue GT3 992 after it being with them for less than a day.

There aren't many 997 GT3's either so they're always going to be a relatively safe bet. Hell if you want a manual 997 GTS, they're more than .1 GT3's.

Wow, thank you for all the good replies. I successfully floated the idea to the missus, so it’s a tossup ATM between a 997.1 or 991.1. Would love a 991.2 manual, but can’t justify the 50%+ premium. Have looked at other models (incuding MC12C + 991 turbo which both seem relatively good value by comparison), but honestly only considering the GT3. I currently drive a C63 507, which is a wonderful thing but not that engaging to drive. I’m leaning to the manual 997 for that reason. It's just something for the weekend, but I have a strong propensity towards tangible things at the moment as cash gets a kicking. And, yes, I'm only too aware I'm not getting any younger as funeral invitations become more common than weddings (or second marriages). I did wonder about the lending costs since the base rate rises, though didn’t realise they had shot up to as much as 10%. It seems everyone and his dog has been buying new cars on finance until now, which is why I didn’t know if I was missing something. I guess not!

mark4 said: Wow, thank you for all the good replies. I successfully floated the idea to the missus, so it’s a tossup ATM between a 997.1 or 991.1. Would love a 991.2 manual, but can’t justify the 50%+ premium. Have looked at other models (incuding MC12C + 991 turbo which both seem relatively good value by comparison), but honestly only considering the GT3. I currently drive a C63 507, which is a wonderful thing but not that engaging to drive. I’m leaning to the manual 997 for that reason. It's just something for the weekend, but I have a strong propensity towards tangible things at the moment as cash gets a kicking. And, yes, I'm only too aware I'm not getting any younger as funeral invitations become more common than weddings (or second marriages). I did wonder about the lending costs since the base rate rises, though didn’t realise they had shot up to as much as 10%. It seems everyone and his dog has been buying new cars on finance until now, which is why I didn’t know if I was missing something. I guess not! I really wanted a 997.1 GT3 and they are spectacular things, that drive train is so visceral, at the budget I had though it seemed to be a bit of a minefield of some cars with some undocumented chequered pasts, always worth posting cars here. Always worth going independent for finance if you need it, there are some good people out there. Not sure I can make recommendations here mind.

I just took delivery of a 992 gts (similar money to a 991.1 GT3) I paid half and financed the other half at 7.3% apr which i thought was ok in the current climate. I could have paid for it in full in cash biut wanted to keep some for emergencies / opportunities in our business Yes Porsche are 10.9% but you can get finance outside Porsche for less

At least on their calculator, for PCP route, Lloyds are offering 6.3% APR. If anyone has used them for PCP before, do you know what the max age of the car is at start of PCP...5 years perhaps?

fistenburger said: Finance made some sense when rates were cheap, but they're not now. If you want to think of it another way, if you financed the car would you use the cash pot that you didn't use for an outright purchase for an alternative investment? Would you take a punt on a stocks/shares ISA returning more than 10.9% over the same term? . Fair comment although the OP is 50. Between finance at say 6.5% and pension tax relief at 20% or 40%?

mark4 said: Wow, thank you for all the good replies. I successfully floated the idea to the missus, so it’s a tossup ATM between a 997.1 or 991.1. Would love a 991.2 manual, but can’t justify the 50%+ premium. Have looked at other models (incuding MC12C + 991 turbo which both seem relatively good value by comparison), but honestly only considering the GT3. I currently drive a C63 507, which is a wonderful thing but not that engaging to drive. I’m leaning to the manual 997 for that reason. It's just something for the weekend, but I have a strong propensity towards tangible things at the moment as cash gets a kicking. And, yes, I'm only too aware I'm not getting any younger as funeral invitations become more common than weddings (or second marriages). I did wonder about the lending costs since the base rate rises, though didn’t realise they had shot up to as much as 10%. It seems everyone and his dog has been buying new cars on finance until now, which is why I didn’t know if I was missing something. I guess not! I've had two 507's and I dearly miss both of them (the last one I had before by 997.2GT3. They are fantastic cars, beautiful engine note and I found the steering so well weighted. All round under 50k best car you can buy. I'd love an estate... were you on the Merc forum and visited the register?

n12maser said: At least on their calculator, for PCP route, Lloyds are offering 6.3% APR. If anyone has used them for PCP before, do you know what the max age of the car is at start of PCP...5 years perhaps? They offered me an unsecured loan at 6.X%, it’s got me looking at mclarens again

Puzzles said: n12maser said: At least on their calculator, for PCP route, Lloyds are offering 6.3% APR. If anyone has used them for PCP before, do you know what the max age of the car is at start of PCP...5 years perhaps? They offered me an unsecured loan at 6.X%, it’s got me looking at mclarens again Same, 570s to be precise...or 718 GT4. Although not sure I can bring myself to sell 993 Carrera for a 2-seater as my 2 kids love going in it..might have to wait a few years till neither fit in the back. Sorry if a bit off-topic!

Puzzles said: n12maser said: At least on their calculator, for PCP route, Lloyds are offering 6.3% APR. If anyone has used them for PCP before, do you know what the max age of the car is at start of PCP...5 years perhaps? They offered me an unsecured loan at 6.X%, it’s got me looking at mclarens again Have rates even changed that much? When I was looking- at used finance deals through main dealers (Mercedes/Porsche) a year or so ago they rates were 7.9-10.9%...

Porsche is now 10.9% on used for sure. You'd think they'd be more competitive being that VWFS are on of the biggest banks in Europe now. Perhaps they have two swim lanes of customer now though. Those who don't care/do the diligence and just sign up to anything and those who are switched on and get their finance elsewhere. To be honest just give Darren Gibson a ring, never had anything less than excellent advice from him. Edited by Brisvegas 997C2S on Thursday 12th January 09:51

Brisvegas 997C2S said: Porsche is now 10.9% on used for sure. You'd think they'd be more competitive being that VWFS are on of the biggest banks in Europe now. Perhaps they have two swim lanes of customer now though. Those who don't care/do the diligence and just sign up to anything and those who are switched on and get their finance elsewhere. To be honest just give Darren Gibson a ring, never had anything less than excellent advice from him. I dunno, l think they’re pretty fixed now. There used to be negotiation, the last new car l bought there wasn’t any movement. Think l financed around 40% of it, had to go elsewhere. Which doesn’t earn any brownie points for the latest and greatest! Edited by Brisvegas 997C2S on Thursday 12th January 09:51

I wouldn't finance.

IbanezDan said: I've had two 507's and I dearly miss both of them (the last one I had before by 997.2GT3. They are fantastic cars, beautiful engine note and I found the steering so well weighted. All round under 50k best car you can buy. I'd love an estate... were you on the Merc forum and visited the register? Mmmm, nice one. A 997.2 GT3 would be awesome, but there is a still a big premium on them over the 997.1 +991.1. Yeah, I was lucky enough to find an estate (well not so much luck as single minded focus) and did visit the register on the Merc forum. I'll probably put a classified on there as well when the time comes. It's very cool and I've never seen another in the 6 or so years I've had mine with ownership being extremely straight forward with the service plan. I had a 'we want to buy your car' leaflet when I last took it for it's service at the Mercedes dealership but they then said it was too rare to value and they would have to get in the specialist. I hope this bodes well come sale time. I rarely use it to lug stuff, so the capacity seems to be a bit of a waste and as a second car only use it 2-3K miles a year. The primary factor that has drawn me to the GT3 now is getting a rear seat conversion - which suddenly makes it a (slightly more) practical option for those with small children. The investment market is such a minefield ATM. With so many big changes, nobody can really predict which way things are going. Many equity based investments that look likely to give good ROI, I have ethical issues supporting. So back to dropping cash into an iconic and desirable used car that should retain some intrinsic value during ownership. Well thats my justification anyway.

Chemical Ali said: Gianluca Vialli died a week or so ago - 59 I think. 9 years older than the OP. Live your life while you can. He was 58 and completely agree with your sentiment. Life really is too short. Add on top of that our government trying to force us into unproven EV technology (full soup to nuts cost & green credentials), do it while you can!

mark4 said: IbanezDan said: I've had two 507's and I dearly miss both of them (the last one I had before by 997.2GT3. They are fantastic cars, beautiful engine note and I found the steering so well weighted. All round under 50k best car you can buy. I'd love an estate... were you on the Merc forum and visited the register? Mmmm, nice one. A 997.2 GT3 would be awesome, but there is a still a big premium on them over the 997.1 +991.1. Yeah, I was lucky enough to find an estate (well not so much luck as single minded focus) and did visit the register on the Merc forum. I'll probably put a classified on there as well when the time comes. It's very cool and I've never seen another in the 6 or so years I've had mine with ownership being extremely straight forward with the service plan. I had a 'we want to buy your car' leaflet when I last took it for it's service at the Mercedes dealership but they then said it was too rare to value and they would have to get in the specialist. I hope this bodes well come sale time. I rarely use it to lug stuff, so the capacity seems to be a bit of a waste and as a second car only use it 2-3K miles a year. The primary factor that has drawn me to the GT3 now is getting a rear seat conversion - which suddenly makes it a (slightly more) practical option for those with small children. The investment market is such a minefield ATM. With so many big changes, nobody can really predict which way things are going. Many equity based investments that look likely to give good ROI, I have ethical issues supporting. So back to dropping cash into an iconic and desirable used car that should retain some intrinsic value during ownership. Well thats my justification anyway. Its not a black estate is it? Did you come and buy some wheels from me? Sorry may be getting confused with someone else! 997.1's are easier to put rear seats in I believe as they already have the anchor points.

I would only finance if you plan on keeping long term.

If the OP is considering a 997 GT3 thought worth asking if he has driven one - I haven't but various reviews have mentioned, particularly 997.1, that the clutch can be hard work. Not a problem unless earlier years injuries are popping up in middle age ie knee or lower back ailments! That aside, I think the 3.6 is considerably more affordable at the moment and by all accounts that engine is a gem. When the markets inevitably (IMO) go through a significant correction, I suspect that it is the 997.1 GT3 which will have the least adjustment imposed on it. Slightly off target perhaps, but for slightly less outlay, a 991.1 GTS could make for a great alternative, complete with naturally aspirated 3.8 and rear seats. I'm well outside my knowledge zone on this point but if my foggy memory serves correct, the potential for rear seat installation was possible on the 997.1 only, which included the mounting points in the bodyshell - this was omitted on 997.2 - I think!! Good luck with decision making - I've been tormenting myself for months and got nowhere! Peter