Non-start when cold

Anybody not have their car start instantly when the key is turned when cold? Usually the engine fires....now, when key is released it falls on its face. Even on second and third try. Give it a little gas pedal and it fires. Cold weather have anything to do with this? NOT a battery issue. Car is in garage and it rarely drops below 50* in there. Also, the rpms climb upon starting and then drop after 30 seconds or so.....now, it sits at 600. Have a service appt. tomorrow morning to check for codes. No warning light on dash. Any thoughts?

Looking at your avatar, it looks like you have a 2009? Cayman S? This means a DFI engine. I've heard that some of the 997.2 DFI engines with high pressure fuel pump issues will exhibit these symptoms. I can't imagine the pump parts on the 987.2 DFI engine would be different. Do a search on the 997 section on ********.com for more details but get it to the dealer!

Look at post #38 describing the symptoms: '09 engines fuel pump failure? - ******** Discussion Forums

It's a 2.9 liter non PDI engine. Owner's manual says not to touch the accelerator pedal when starting. Gas cap is clicking, almost 3000 miles on the odo and premium, non-ethanol fuel in the tank. Hoping it isn't a serious issue, and they don't stick me in a GT3 loaner.

:hilarious: Remember, for the price of a new GT3 you could have 2 Caymans (Caymen?) - one to drive while the other is in the shop.

I don't think Jackie Cooper Tulsa has ever HAD a GT3. Imagine they'll put me in an old Boxster. Not that there is anything wrong with that! From what I can glean from the threads and posts, it look like it may very well be a fuel pump going toes up.....but I don't think my car has a HPFP.

I maybe loosing my mind, but the 2.9 is NOT DFI. Has this been happening longer than a single tank of gas? I would fill up, and add some techron or similar gas additive, injector cleaner, water remover. Sounds to me like you just got some water in your gas.

Update: Just got back from dealer. May have picked up some bad gas...but there was also a campaign on a remap of the ECU they performed. Technician says to run straight gasoline whenever possible and not to use any ethanol% fuel. I buy 100% gasoline 91 octane Phillips. Was forced to buy a 10% ethanol blend on the road.....and that may have been the start of my issue. Someone says that Midgrade is better in the Winter.....I'd question that. Anybody out there running ethanol blend and having starting issues in cold weather? Alcohol is hydroscopic....i.e. attracts water or condensation. We are lucky enough here in Oklahoma to be able to find 100% gasoline.....if you look hard.

Is the problem solved now? Sounds to me like a fuel pressure valve. There is a one-way valve that is designed to keep fuel pressure levels up in the injector lines when the engine is not running,....this is to facilitate a quick restart after a shutdown. If the valve is not working correctly fuel pressure in the injector lines is allowed to bleed down to a level where the engine will not start unless the fuel pump runs for an extended period of time,.....hence the engine will start after 2 or 3 attemps as the fuel pump then has enough time to build the required pressure for the injectors back again. Common problem on older fuel injected Porsches, but can happen on newer also. Usually this valve is located very near the fuel pump or even attached to it. It usually can be replaced on its own, but if part of the fuel pump it may mean its replacement. The RPM climb and fall you see on starting is normal.

Problem seems to be solved, but I merely fired it up at the dealership and drove home into the garage. I'm optimistic that all is cured. BTW, I was very disappointed that I did not get a Porsche as a loaner car....they stuck me in a Nissan Altima that had 55K on the clock. Better than nothing, but also made me appreciate my lot in Life.

In WA state I am forced to buy gas with 10% ethanol. Still no startup issues. I do add stuff to my gas from time to time. Either injector cleaers or octane boosters. I would say every 10 fillups. In winter with lower intake temperatures many can get away with running 89 Octane instead of 92. I even considered doing that with my wife's 3.6 Passat. I DO NOT recommend that for our cars. Our cars are really designed to run on 93 Octane, and anything bellow that is a compromise. Our cars do not run well on 91 at all - maybe when its very cold. I would love to find an octane booster that really works, short of filling up with a gallon of race gas every time I put 92 in... T

It happened again yesterday.....dang it! 91 octane pure gasoline (no ethanol) in the tank as usual. Very cold out, car had not been started for 24 hours. Had to give it some pedal on the 4th attempt to start. Anybody else have this issue or is it just me? Again, my model is a 2.9.

Any additional news on the problem?

Mine has to crank quite a while to start whenit is cold. I have an '06 CS with Tip and it has been that way since I got it in September. It's kind of embarrassing sometimes having to have it crank for so long.

I had a similar issue this past weekend when the outside temp dropped to 6°f. My car was in a garage but it was still below 20°f inside. It took several attempts to get my for the engine to start. It seemed as if my car was out of gas even though it had half a tank of 93 Shell gasoline and I just had the battery replaced last month. My only guess for this happening is because from the bitter cold temperature.

Sometimes mine takes a good 4 or 5 seconds to crank over, but I've never had a non-start.

I only start the Cayman once a week and haven't had a problem. Only gas available is 10% and 90 octane at this altitude. For what it is worth, rather than going straight to start, I give the fuel pump a few seconds to build pressure and then start. Watch how much oil you have and then try to fire.

I'll be doing that today........makes good sense.....thanks for the thought.

Interesting, I always hear various noises during startup when I'm checking the oil but never realized the fuel pump being primed is part of this process. Is this true for all modern cars?

I do it with my 2002 S2000. I can actually hear it priming.

Silverback, I have a 2.9 that has sat outside under snow and at low temperatures (at least for the UK) of below -10C. Started first time and almost immediately after sitting for over two weeks unused - no need to touch the accelerator peddle.

As an update to the thread, I turned the ignition on for a few seconds to energize the fuel pump and bumped the starter and it didn't catch....3 times in succession. Then it fires. Sometimes it'll fire right up when stone cold with no hesitation....so it is an ongoing intermittent issue. I'm baffled. One more instance like this and it goes back to Jackie Cooper (dealer) for a look-see......

In the instances when it doesn't start, can you hear the fuel pump running? That's the key to identifying an intermittent fuel pump problem.

I can't hear the fuel pump running in my car. I did have a phone conversation with the service manager, and he suggested I fill the fuel tank with mid-grade unleaded instead of the 91 octane pure gasoline I always buy. That may cure the non-start issue. He says by giving the accelerator pedal a slight push, one is adding air to the air/fuel mixture, curing a rich condition. Our US fuel formulation isn't close to the same as Europe....he says we have poor quality fuel in comparison. I don't know about that, but the Owner's Manual says to run premium unleaded and nothing greater than 10% ethanol by volume. I figured I was getting the best fuel I could buy if I used the 91 octane PU gasoline without ethanol. Manual also states that if any driveability issues occur to change fuels. Seems like I'm going in the wrong direction, but we'll have to see. If it keeps up after this effort on fuel, it is definitely going in.

i agree or at least this is the starting place.....if it goes back to the dealer they may/should have a fuel psi tester hooked up so they can look at the psi on a cold start...next i would have a scan tool looking at certain data at cold start up eg...idle air bypass position...if app cold start valve % etc..good luck...p/s they only get one look per day at data so it may take more than a few days to diagnose

No offense, but that sounds just plain silly to me - how many Porsches does he see with the same problem as yours? Of the 500+ people who have read your thread, no one else seems to have been afflicted with the same issue, which to my mind, makes it pretty uncommon. If "poor quality fuel" were the issue (and why would mid-grade be better than premium?!?), then why isn't everyone else in the country reporting the same problem? Honestly, it sounds like he is just talking out of his a$$ because he doesn't have a clue! End Rant.

Ex-tanker, Atlas Croc: I've made a note of your post on the fuel pressure valve....makes a lot of sense. KC-CS: I know! Makes no sense to me either, but I filled it up, 3/4 tank, with unleaded mid-grade and we'll soon see how it performs over the weekend. Stay tuned.........

i want to add..if ya go to the dealer ..save.. your paper work

Issue has vastly improved.....the last 7 starts have been immediate, as normal. Inexplicable but the only thought I have on the mid-grade with a % ethanol fill up cure would be that I might have picked up a little bit of water in a previous fill up along the way. Water goes to the bottom of the fuel tank. Maybe the ethanol in the mid grade is absorbing what little is in there and it is being burned? Any fuel/chemist experts out there that might chime in? :banana:

Silverback, ethanol in the fuel will act to increase the solubility of water in the fuel mixture. To complicate things slightly, the presence of a (significant) water layer will act to pull some of the ethanol out of the fuel into the water but unlikely to be significant. Depending on the temperature and the volume of water present, it may take a time or several fills of fuel to clear the water.

:banana:Starting issue is cured. Fires immediately, cold or warm. Doesn't that beat all? Mid grade unleaded fuel. We have 2 gasoline refineries here in Tulsa, so it doesn't get a whole lot fresher than that, and I buy fuel from a high volume location. So, anyway, case closed...thank Heavens.

thanks for the get back

So how do you make the fuel pump start working without actually getting the car to start cranking over? Do you only turn the key to the right one click or something?