Crazy market values? - Page 25 - Boxster/Cayman - PistonHeads UK

Currently in the market for a 718 Boxster (don't let the username fool you), but all the used values seem to be insanely high at the moment. I know Spring is peak car market for a convertible but even the Caymans seem really high too. Presume is driven by covid lack of builds/ low stocks and global semiconductors shortages (e.g. JLR closing their plant) ? When do people expect prices to soften ? Dealer spreads seem insanely high too, but presume is usual for the low volumes.

Market is indeed very strong. With the lack of "supply" in the form of new cars because of manufacturing issues combined with some very strong interest in sports cars over the last nine months dealers don't have enough stock and and used prices are incredibly strong. It's amazing how few cars there are for sale of some models. Prices are up somewhere between 5 to 10% depending on the car. I don't see things changing until new cars are coming through in normal volumes and even then I am not sure that will impact some of the more sort after cars. Assets broadly are very well bid...I am currently trying to buy a house which is not easy right now I can tell you !

Yes, certain sectors seem to be enjoying the ‘feel good factor’ at the moment. Combination of reasons, I guess - Lockdown/end of Lockdown, pent-up demand, time of year, limited travel plans, Tax hikes yet to be announced, demise of ICE yet to be felt...... Of course there will be other sectors suffering, or likely to suffer, but for economic recovery, we do need confidence from those with the resources to keep spending. However, for the moment, it is a ‘sellers market’, so still pays to be cautious.

I sold my Cayman back to my local OPC after a year of ownership, because they made me a good offer. They've just sold it on, after advertising it for more than I paid when it was a year and 5000 miles younger. Supply and demand.

Massive shortage of new cars, pent up demand from lockdowns and higher savings from a year of wfh (for many, not all). Things might improve next year if new car production starts to recover. Interested if people disagree!

As I’ve recently said in another thread I just sold my late 2019 718 Boxster to a dealer for £3k more than WBAC were offering and the dealer has it for sale for nearly £5k more than I paid for it nearly 18 months ago. I’ve got a new Boxster 25 on order which I’m hoping will get a confirmed build slot shortly but if we don’t, I don’t think I’d buy another car this year unless prices settle down. In other news we’ve also got a late 2015 Cayman 2.7 PDK with 26k miles on it and we were thinking of selling that as well but that’s gone up £4K in 2 months according to WBAC so I think we going to keep it for a while longer. The world has indeed gone nuts but I don’t think that it’ll last forever.

The stock of AUC Cayman GTS 4.0 has been in excess of 20 for a short while, however, its dropped quite rapidly and is now down to just 7 (it was 8 first thing today but I checked again before posting this reply and a Crayon one at a London OPC has disappeared).

Theres been a shift as people are after used as new cars arent selling , the only make doing well is Mini at the moment. A sign of things aren't doing too well is the 0% offers on at the moment.

tedblog said: Theres been a shift as people are after used as new cars arent selling , the only make doing well is Mini at the moment. A sign of things aren't doing too well is the 0% offers on at the moment. No reason to doubt that but wasn't aware of that at all ! My impression was that dealers were busy ? I thought finance was always cheap at the moment !

Definitely crazy at the moment - went to test drive a used car at my local OPC and the car was sold under me whilst the trade plates were being attached. Friend of mine bought a 911 T in October, cheapest comparable car is 10k more now…. Only 2 used cars in stock at my local OPC and end of the year earliest for a new car (though I think that’s comparable for most new Porsches I’ve bought)

An OPC only has 2 cars used cars in stock ?!

Cheib said: An OPC only has 2 cars used cars in stock ?! Just checked their website - 6 now, if you exclude their demos.....

Just a thought about Porsche’s. Typically Porsche dealers buy these and resell, but they are reluctant to hold the same levels of stock plus New car sales slow so it translates as a smaller supply market. I’m not sure the demand is huge though, but clearly supply affected much more than demand.

That and the fact that we don’t visit dealerships because we can’t / couldn’t so our behaviour is online. It means buyers don’t care where a car is located and makes it more competitive.

Trikster said: Cheib said: An OPC only has 2 cars used cars in stock ?! Just checked their website - 6 now, if you exclude their demos..... Just had a look on the AUC website I see what you mean some dealers have very low stock levels. Looks like the Porsche GB owned dealers in particular are....I guess the used car buyers have decided market is too strong and not to compete for cars. Not great if you’re a used car salesman sat in one of those dealerships.

Voodoo Blue said: As I’ve recently said in another thread I just sold my late 2019 718 Boxster to a dealer for £3k more than WBAC were offering and the dealer has it for sale for nearly £5k more than I paid for it nearly 18 months ago. I’ve got a new Boxster 25 on order which I’m hoping will get a confirmed build slot shortly but if we don’t, I don’t think I’d buy another car this year unless prices settle down. In other news we’ve also got a late 2015 Cayman 2.7 PDK with 26k miles on it and we were thinking of selling that as well but that’s gone up £4K in 2 months according to WBAC so I think we going to keep it for a while longer. The world has indeed gone nuts but I don’t think that it’ll last forever. The Cayman has just gone up another £1k in a week according to WBAC, at this rate we’ll get back what we paid for it when it was new before the end of the year

Voodoo Blue said: Voodoo Blue said: As I’ve recently said in another thread I just sold my late 2019 718 Boxster to a dealer for £3k more than WBAC were offering and the dealer has it for sale for nearly £5k more than I paid for it nearly 18 months ago. I’ve got a new Boxster 25 on order which I’m hoping will get a confirmed build slot shortly but if we don’t, I don’t think I’d buy another car this year unless prices settle down. In other news we’ve also got a late 2015 Cayman 2.7 PDK with 26k miles on it and we were thinking of selling that as well but that’s gone up £4K in 2 months according to WBAC so I think we going to keep it for a while longer. The world has indeed gone nuts but I don’t think that it’ll last forever. The Cayman has just gone up another £1k in a week according to WBAC, at this rate we’ll get back what we paid for it when it was new before the end of the year WBAC valuations are very good at the moment. My 718 base also increased by £1k in the last week. It's getting very difficult to resist these numbers, and I really love the car! How long do people think the high valuations will last?

I am in the market for another Porsche been looking for a while at manual 911T , Gts , gt4 , Spyder, etc and IMHO prices are riding about 10% higher than where they were heading and what they should be! This is most likely down to coming out of lock down and consumers having a bit of a spend up also a lack of new cars(which by the way is nothing new for Porsche) So I am not buying now am going to wait for the effects of furlough ending we reality kicks in and government policy to pay for the past years jolly for some!Maybe wrong but I am not risking throwing £10k down the drain over the course of the next 6 months just to satisfy want over need

GT4P said: I am not risking throwing £10k down the drain over the course of the next 6 months just to satisfy want over need Surely buying any Porsche is want over need though. If you just have a mobility 'need' you can always buy a Dacia...

To give you an idea, 992 C2S, 18 months old, 4k miles, £102k car, WBAC offering £87k, OPC £89k and had an Indie at £90k. Very happy with that, had priced in double that loss. Not selling it, did occur to me, but ended up an EV Polestar through the company scheme as a daily, life is too short Should make a nice combo, but note to self: DRIVE THE 911 MORE!!!! Edited by dgswk on Thursday 29th April 18:22

~£650 a month ownership cost for new £100k 992 (excluding running costs) is pretty great!

n12maser said: ~£650 a month ownership cost for new £100k 992 (excluding running costs) is pretty great! Yup, I've budgeted £750 for its first service in Aug/Sep and aside from road tax and insurance (another £100 a month) thats about it really. Must try harder to burn through the rears before they need changing due to age!!!!! Happy boy here anyway

Ferrari-F355 said: Currently in the market for a 718 Boxster (don't let the username fool you), but all the used values seem to be insanely high at the moment. I know Spring is peak car market for a convertible but even the Caymans seem really high too. Presume is driven by covid lack of builds/ low stocks and global semiconductors shortages (e.g. JLR closing their plant) ? When do people expect prices to soften ? Dealer spreads seem insanely high too, but presume is usual for the low volumes. I was in a similar boat and took the plunge a couple of weeks ago, buying a 17 plate (18MY) 718 Boxster from Porsche Kendal. I think I had a little bit of luck in the timing as they had actually "sold" the car a week or so earlier but the buyer did not show up on the collection day, he had paid in full apparently but requested his money back as entitled to do so under the Distance Selling rules. I think this had increased their motivation to get the car out of the door, also it was while shops were still closed to customers so no footfall through the showroom for those impulse purchases. It is silver and has quite a good spec including pdk, 20" carrera S alloys in platinum, switchable PSE, reversing camera, heated seats & heated mfsw etc. It was on at £38,950 and I paid £38,250 which, unusually, included a years road tax as they had bought this in anticipation of the previous "buyer" collecting the car. It also came with the usual OPC 2 years warranty and had just had the 4 year service (it was reg in July 2017 so a bit earlier than strictly necessary) and MoT. It was more than I wanted to pay and I expected to pay a premium for an OPC car, looking around now it seems I didn't pay massively over the odds as there is not much available and prices seem to have firmed up, even in the last 2 weeks... As an aside, the PSE (standard on 19MY cars onwards) is definitely worth having, the difference it makes in Sport mode is quite surprising.... Edited by philcray on Friday 30th April 17:30

Voodoo Blue said: Voodoo Blue said: As I’ve recently said in another thread I just sold my late 2019 718 Boxster to a dealer for £3k more than WBAC were offering and the dealer has it for sale for nearly £5k more than I paid for it nearly 18 months ago. I’ve got a new Boxster 25 on order which I’m hoping will get a confirmed build slot shortly but if we don’t, I don’t think I’d buy another car this year unless prices settle down. In other news we’ve also got a late 2015 Cayman 2.7 PDK with 26k miles on it and we were thinking of selling that as well but that’s gone up £4K in 2 months according to WBAC so I think we going to keep it for a while longer. The world has indeed gone nuts but I don’t think that it’ll last forever. The Cayman has just gone up another £1k in a week according to WBAC, at this rate we’ll get back what we paid for it when it was new before the end of the year Take the money now if you're thinking of selling. A bit of pent up demand can't last forever. Once the nutters have paid these silly prices the sensible buyers will return and prices will return to normality.

ATM said: Take the money now if you're thinking of selling. A bit of pent up demand can't last forever. Once the nutters have paid these silly prices the sensible buyers will return and prices will return to normality. It's tempting but I think the Cayman is a keeper. Its not the fastest or the flashiest but it sounds great (with PSE on it sounds spectacular) and the way todays roads and traffic is you can have a great deal of fun without risking other road users or your licence.

2017 (67) 718 Cayman S. 16800 miles. Crayon with a good spread of extras. Bought for £45k March 2020 with 7800 miles. WBAC today £42.5k. Gone up £5.5k in 12 weeks. Madness.

Do WBAC factor in all extras, my recollection was other than sat nav, leather and maybe a couple of others spec seemed irrelevant?

STE VR said: 2017 (67) 718 Cayman S. 16800 miles. Crayon with a good spread of extras. Bought for £45k March 2020 with 7800 miles. WBAC today £42.5k. Gone up £5.5k in 12 weeks. Madness. My old 981 Cayman S up 3.5k in a few weeks on WBAC.

ATM said: Voodoo Blue said: Voodoo Blue said: As I’ve recently said in another thread I just sold my late 2019 718 Boxster to a dealer for £3k more than WBAC were offering and the dealer has it for sale for nearly £5k more than I paid for it nearly 18 months ago. I’ve got a new Boxster 25 on order which I’m hoping will get a confirmed build slot shortly but if we don’t, I don’t think I’d buy another car this year unless prices settle down. In other news we’ve also got a late 2015 Cayman 2.7 PDK with 26k miles on it and we were thinking of selling that as well but that’s gone up £4K in 2 months according to WBAC so I think we going to keep it for a while longer. The world has indeed gone nuts but I don’t think that it’ll last forever. The Cayman has just gone up another £1k in a week according to WBAC, at this rate we’ll get back what we paid for it when it was new before the end of the year Take the money now if you're thinking of selling. A bit of pent up demand can't last forever. Once the nutters have paid these silly prices the sensible buyers will return and prices will return to normality. I'd also add that'll be interesting in the next year or so when the YOLO ones who decided they want a Porsche get their first serious repair bill quote from an OPC....(unless they're handy with a spanner and know that Porsche isn't the only source of spares). It might take the shine off a few recent impulse purchases.

Andyoz said: ATM said: Voodoo Blue said: Voodoo Blue said: As I’ve recently said in another thread I just sold my late 2019 718 Boxster to a dealer for £3k more than WBAC were offering and the dealer has it for sale for nearly £5k more than I paid for it nearly 18 months ago. I’ve got a new Boxster 25 on order which I’m hoping will get a confirmed build slot shortly but if we don’t, I don’t think I’d buy another car this year unless prices settle down. In other news we’ve also got a late 2015 Cayman 2.7 PDK with 26k miles on it and we were thinking of selling that as well but that’s gone up £4K in 2 months according to WBAC so I think we going to keep it for a while longer. The world has indeed gone nuts but I don’t think that it’ll last forever. The Cayman has just gone up another £1k in a week according to WBAC, at this rate we’ll get back what we paid for it when it was new before the end of the year Take the money now if you're thinking of selling. A bit of pent up demand can't last forever. Once the nutters have paid these silly prices the sensible buyers will return and prices will return to normality. I'd also add that'll be interesting in the next year or so when the YOLO ones who decided they want a Porsche get their first serious repair bill quote from an OPC....(unless they're handy with a spanner and know that Porsche isn't the only source of spares). It might take the shine off a few recent impulse purchases. Thats the only way OPC can make any money. They need a steady stream of bright faced and bushy tailed new entrants to the brand to bend over good style. They'll be buying the £12 bottles of Porsche screen wash and paying to have the drilled holes in their brake discs cleaned. That was me in 2005 so its probably £25 for the screen wash now.

PugGti106 said: Do WBAC factor in all extras, my recollection was other than sat nav, leather and maybe a couple of others spec seemed irrelevant? No they don’t. That’s why they gave me a good price over OPC and indies - my 718 had alcantara and 18 inch wheels. Had I forked out for must have 20s and full leather (as my OPC suggest I do when I ordered it) I’d have taken a massive hit. Only thing WBAC factors on was PDK.

ATM said: Thats the only way OPC can make any money. They need a steady stream of bright faced and bushy tailed new entrants to the brand to bend over good style. They'll be buying the £12 bottles of Porsche screen wash and paying to have the drilled holes in their brake discs cleaned. That was me in 2005 so its probably £25 for the screen wash now. I can't knock the Porsche screen wash though... 40k miles on as a daily driver, I've only ever had to fill the screen wash bottle once. And how does such a tiny amount of screen wash stop the washer reservoir freezing in all weathers? Good value I say.

DJMC said: ATM said: Thats the only way OPC can make any money. They need a steady stream of bright faced and bushy tailed new entrants to the brand to bend over good style. They'll be buying the £12 bottles of Porsche screen wash and paying to have the drilled holes in their brake discs cleaned. That was me in 2005 so its probably £25 for the screen wash now. I can't knock the Porsche screen wash though... 40k miles on as a daily driver, I've only ever had to fill the screen wash bottle once. And how does such a tiny amount of screen wash stop the washer reservoir freezing in all weathers? Good value I say. Cant decide if this is sarcasm. Best thing for windscreen is water repellent type products. Back in the day [20 years plus] I used Rain X on the glass. Wipers and screen wash then unnecessary as visibility always excellent. Nowadays I think you can get this stuff added into the wiper rubbers themselves during manufacture. PIAA is it? Porsche stuff only let me down here. Temps down to -7C in places. It froze and wouldn't spray out. Some swiss bloke poured a bottle of -25C type stuff into my car neat - never had a problem after that. Not sure if thats good for paint etc but didnt give it a second thought as frozen screen not an option if you want to see where you are going.

churchie2856 said: PugGti106 said: Do WBAC factor in all extras, my recollection was other than sat nav, leather and maybe a couple of others spec seemed irrelevant? No they don’t. That’s why they gave me a good price over OPC and indies - my 718 had alcantara and 18 inch wheels. Had I forked out for must have 20s and full leather (as my OPC suggest I do when I ordered it) I’d have taken a massive hit. Only thing WBAC factors on was PDK. I do think, maybe outside of the rarest cars, the spec argument is a bit of a misnomer. PDK is the only thing that seems to change the finance calculation and residual values, and you don't ever seem to get money back on other options. Sure some may make it easier to sell faster, but spending 10k+ on spec is rarely recoverable. I couldnt live without some of the basic options though, but these (e.g. parking sensors, now standard) are fairly cheap in comparison.

MPorsche said: My old 981 Cayman S up 3.5k in a few weeks on WBAC. Browsing the approved used earlier there is a 981 2.7 on for 40k! No PASM, PSE, SC and has a marmite red leather interior.

7184c said: MPorsche said: My old 981 Cayman S up 3.5k in a few weeks on WBAC. Browsing the approved used earlier there is a 981 2.7 on for 40k! No PASM, PSE, SC and has a marmite red leather interior. Crazy! One on there for 47k! (981S)

The strong market won't last forever, if you're going to sell you couldn't ask for a better time. https://digg.com/money/link/used-cars-are-selling-...

WBAC just quoted me £300 less than I bought my 987.1 for (privately) 14 months and 2.5K miles ago. Early 987s seem to be up roughly £1k on prices this time last year.

Lexington59 said: The strong market won't last forever, if you're going to sell you couldn't ask for a better time. https://digg.com/money/link/used-cars-are-selling-... Lot of this is American but similar story here you could argue. I think a lot of people are not talking about the mass move to EV which makes anything ICE and interesting more and more valuable. That's kind of been happening for a while because most used cars have been strong in terms of price for a while now. My big BMW estate I paid 8500 over 5 years ago. Tidy examples today selling for around the same price. Mine is not tidy but was tidier when I bought it. So basically the same price after 5 years makes no sense in the traditional sense of cars depreciating.

This works if you are trading down ... if trading up the gap is simply widening ... like house pricer inflation ? As for petrol ... it must be available to 2050 at least ... there will be plenty of reasons to change a car other than fuel well before then.

dgswk said: To give you an idea, 992 C2S, 18 months old, 4k miles, £102k car, WBAC offering £87k, OPC £89k and had an Indie at £90k. Very happy with that, had priced in double that loss. Not selling it, did occur to me, but ended up an EV Polestar through the company scheme as a daily, life is too short Should make a nice combo, but note to self: DRIVE THE 911 MORE!!!! Edited by dgswk on Thursday 29th April 18:22 WBAC +£1k today. Not that I'm looking or anything, but it is nice to watch a normally depreciating asset go up in value! Jeepers, I'll have to think about paying cash for it next time rather than finance it!!!!!

WBAC is offering £113k on '17 991GT3CS atm ...

I've been keeping an eye on WBAC prices - just out of interest - this is for a late 2017 718 base with 35k 15/12/2020 - £27,615 04/01/2021 - £28,500 11/02/2021 - £28,740 27/02/2021 - £29,560 10/03/2021 - £29,000 19/03/2021 - £29,845 24/03/2021 - £29,845 31/03/2021 - £30,270 12/04/2021 - £30,270 28/04/2021 - £30,270 02/05/2021 - £31,330

Thought I’d got a reasonable price for my Sep19 2.5T Cayman GTS but see that Leicester OPC have it up for £66k which is more than £10k above the price I received…. Prices have definitely gone mad! BtW - I’ve also advertised a set of pristine, hardly used 18in Boxster winter wheels (£1500 ONO) if anyone is interested- currently being stored at Solihull OPC.

Persicm said: BtW - I’ve also advertised a set of pristine, hardly used 18in Boxster winter wheels (£1500 ONO) if anyone is interested- currently being stored at Solihull OPC. Last set I saw sell via auction on ebay only managed about £450.

My .2 has just gone up to just short of 115k with 9.5k Miles on the clock. A pity they don’t give quote with spec options , could well cut a few greedy OPCs out if they did.

I've also been checking WBAC as they keep emailing to say there's been an increase in valuation. 2011 987.2 CS 48k miles 09/12/20 - £17,000 22/03/21 - £18,110 06/04/21 - £19,890 15/04/21 - £20,675 06/05/21 - £22,000 £5k increase in 5 months.. I'm actually starting to get tempted (although think it would sell privately for around £25-27k).

T1547 said: I've also been checking WBAC as they keep emailing to say there's been an increase in valuation. 2011 987.2 CS 48k miles 09/12/20 - £17,000 22/03/21 - £18,110 06/04/21 - £19,890 15/04/21 - £20,675 06/05/21 - £22,000 £5k increase in 5 months.. I'm actually starting to get tempted (although think it would sell privately for around £25-27k). Haha. The exact spot I’m in same year and model. Although mine is at £22,750 today maybe another increase? 49.5k 11 plate CS - I’m very tempted to let it go.

If you are thinking of selling, I would be tempted to do so. Different car but about 20 years ago I had an MB CLK230 which I bought privately for £27k, 18 months and 10k miles later later I was offered £24k by a main MB dealer (to buy, not as a trade in), I decided to hang on for a few more months.... 6 months later I struggled to get £18k privately, still not got over it....

Depends on your outlook. If they're going to be churning out hybrid variants by the dozen and moving to full electrification over the next few years traditional powered performance cars are going to become far less numerous. How that translates to valuations going forward we can only speculate, but I'd be fairly confident we're unlikely to see these crash anytime soon. Quite the reverse I'd argue...

Just looking at 981 Cayman S in the OPC network. Totally crazy... more than what I paid for mine (similar spec) 4 years ago. All now ~£45/£48k!

Schmed said: Depends on your outlook. If they're going to be churning out hybrid variants by the dozen and moving to full electrification over the next few years traditional powered performance cars are going to become far less numerous. How that translates to valuations going forward we can only speculate, but I'd be fairly confident we're unlikely to see these crash anytime soon. Quite the reverse I'd argue... Indeed, especially if the new cars will very shortly be delivered with EU mandated speed limiting capabilities. We’ve left the EU, but obviously Carrie has decreed that we need to adopt these rules too.

CloudStuff said: Indeed, especially if the new cars will very shortly be delivered with EU mandated speed limiting capabilities. We’ve left the EU, but obviously Carrie has decreed that we need to adopt these rules too. No need to blame Carrie. Even if the UK made the stupid move of reverting to a separate UK homologation standard (ultimately it would be reducing choice and increasing costs for UK consumers), which happened to not require the EU speed limiting rules, every car imported from the EU (and probably Japan) is going to have the feature anyway. UK homologation would never require that such a thing is obligatory to remove!

braddo said: CloudStuff said: Indeed, especially if the new cars will very shortly be delivered with EU mandated speed limiting capabilities. We’ve left the EU, but obviously Carrie has decreed that we need to adopt these rules too. No need to blame Carrie. Even if the UK made the stupid move of reverting to a separate UK homologation standard (ultimately it would be reducing choice and increasing costs for UK consumers), which happened to not require the EU speed limiting rules, every car imported from the EU (and probably Japan) is going to have the feature anyway. UK homologation would never require that such a thing is obligatory to remove! Sure I had read somewhere that plenty of cars since around 2013-14 had this stuff onboard anyway, it was just disabled. From what I've read, from 2022, it will effectively be switched on from ignition, but you will be able to manually override - I guess like you can start-stop. I presume that if you do though, then drive above prescribed limit and have an accident, if the Police / Insurers investigate there will be implications. Could it be that a pre-2022 992.1 sans Hybridisation is the last of its kind?

braddo said: CloudStuff said: Indeed, especially if the new cars will very shortly be delivered with EU mandated speed limiting capabilities. We’ve left the EU, but obviously Carrie has decreed that we need to adopt these rules too. No need to blame Carrie. Even if the UK made the stupid move of reverting to a separate UK homologation standard (ultimately it would be reducing choice and increasing costs for UK consumers), which happened to not require the EU speed limiting rules, every car imported from the EU (and probably Japan) is going to have the feature anyway. UK homologation would never require that such a thing is obligatory to remove! I know, and my reply was t-i-c. I do think though, that this 'feature', will become de-facto unavoidable. Notionally, it will be possible to disable it but for how long? It does really 'take a dump' directly onto the business model of all manufacturers who sell 'performance' cars. What will be the point?

Saxmaster said: Haha. The exact spot I’m in same year and model. Although mine is at £22,750 today maybe another increase? 49.5k 11 plate CS - I’m very tempted to let it go. So true. I've noticed that prices for 987.2's in BS and CS forms have really firmed up right across the market in the last 12 months. I bought a low miles 09 BS for less than £19k 4 years ago, and a 51k 09 CS for less than £18k early last year. The latter needed a fair amount of work doing inc a clutch and flywheel, so I sold it on during lockdown for what I paid, but in hindsight I could have done £2k's worth of remedial work and still maybe made a small profit on it. It seems that the market has finally woken up to how good they are. The likes of Sytner are selling them £2k - £3k more than they were even 12 months ago and they're overlapping with prices of slightly-older 997.1s

KPB1973 said: So true. I've noticed that prices for 987.2's in BS and CS forms have really firmed up right across the market in the last 12 months. I bought a low miles 09 BS for less than £19k 4 years ago, and a 51k 09 CS for less than £18k early last year. The latter needed a fair amount of work doing inc a clutch and flywheel, so I sold it on during lockdown for what I paid, but in hindsight I could have done £2k's worth of remedial work and still maybe made a small profit on it. It seems that the market has finally woken up to how good they are. The likes of Sytner are selling them £2k - £3k more than they were even 12 months ago and they're overlapping with prices of slightly-older 997.1s The market is definitely realizing what a great crossover point the 987 platform is between the new and old era Porsches. I think alot of 987 buyers are new to Porsche and don't give a toss about the whole 911 legacy...they probably actually test drive them all and take the one that gives the max bang for the buck

Not just happening in the UK either, general used car prices in the US have just jumped 10% in a month so this is a widespread phenomenon. However there is a bit more at play I feel. Andyoz said: The market is definitely realizing what a great crossover point the 987 platform is between the new and old era Porsches. I think alot of 987 buyers are new to Porsche and don't give a toss about the whole 911 legacy...they probably actually test drive them all and take the one that gives the max bang for the buck Agree with your first point but not sure on the second. I love 911s, especially air cooled ones but have missed the boat there and have just picked up a 987.1 Cayman. I wasn't really cross shopping against anything in the Porsche stable apart from maybe a Boxster of similar vintage - or a ropey and much older 996. But I'm undoubtedly influenced by 911s of yore. As far as Porkers go it is (even now after gains in the last year) good bang for buck in value terms, but if I wanted bang for buck in power and acceleration terms there is plenty more out there. A Golf R or Audi TT RS perhaps? Why buy a 987 now at seemingly peaky prices? Well, I've fancied one for a while, been searching for ages, and decided it is now or never. All the usual cliches, time running out for petrol cars, anything with a flat 6 has surely bottomed out, we could all be dead from Covid-22 next year. Plus I remember when 964s were less loved and could be bought for 16 grand, the 996 for 12, 944s could be had for 3 or 4k, , 968s etc.. IMO the 987 Cayman is a surefire near-future classic, a great looking, driving and perfectly sized Porsche without breaking the bank. So there was a sense of urgency and not wanting to put off buying one any further. I'm probably not alone there. Who knows, they may drop back a little, but I decided I didn't want to wait any longer. Anyone else looking to buy one this summer?

I had been flirting with the idea of a 987.2 base Cayman since back end of last year. Now I'm actively looking and prices are up quite significantly, and good one's are coming and barely lasting a day or 2 on auto trader before being sold, frustrating. They are also very few on the market, I'm starting to consider a 987.1 S now instead that I had previously discounted. There is a nice looking blue one up for £16,750 which is not far short of some 987.2 that were available when I first started looking last year.

I wouldn't get too excited. I'm in the trade and have just been in a pricing meeting - currently dealers are widespread increasing prices of all sorts of cars. The reality is demand is far exceeding supply at the moment. We have had crazy amount of enquiries cars that are pretty mundane which are simply competitively priced. It is a seller's market; I would discourage anyone buying a used car if they're hoping for a deal. Edited by thelostboy on Thursday 13th May 13:44

av185 said: diffstar said: There's a fair few 718 GT4 sat at £90k now, none are moving at minute. Maybe the first PDK high spec cars will go over £100k not sure the others will. Nothing at c£90k in the OPC network apart from early run 2019 comfort/weird/poverty spec multi owned and or relatively high 10k milers. Most OPCs are sitting on stock now awaiting higher prices in the New Year when peak buying season commences. So they may as well put prices up now which is what we are seeing. 90k gets you a free spec paint car, 3 owner, more miles with sofa seats in the OPC network. Very few higher spec cars available in the opc network at the moment and the ones which are will be already above list.

Melvynr said: Prices are making Macs look great value, especially 570S and more so the 570GT Most stuff has risen ££ though including Mclarens. Incredible to think when Covid first hit there was a blue 1 owner 2018 720S Perf 5k miler which sold on Collecting Cars March 2020 for £127k plus fees also a black 1 owner 2019 600LT 3k miler sold at similar money. Buy on the bullets springs to mind.

av185 said: Melvynr said: av185 said: Nice PDK 1 owner car only 2k miles. As previously posted £170k beckons....... Jesus, look for the GT4RS flipping at 250 then Said before I think the first few GT4 RS will be flipped at c£300k. Meanwhile this has evidently sold. Surely a latter day record for a 991.1 GT3 Can’t believe that sold for anything near asking price, looks about £20k over top of market!….makes my late 2014, £96k, G6 engined, 8k miler look stupidly cheap…..

av185 said: Most stuff has risen ££ though including Mclarens. Incredible to think when Covid first hit there was a blue 1 owner 2018 720S Perf 5k miler which sold on Collecting Cars March 2020 for £127k plus fees also a black 1 owner 2019 600LT 3k miler sold at similar money. Buy on the bullets springs to mind. Am tempted with a 570GT, excellent value at 115 , just turned 2 year old with 3k on the clock.But when you look at the 159 sticker price and options knocking it up to around 180k , something tells me not to touch it, or throw my money down the drain hole.Depreciation is horrendous on them for such a stunning motor.Little glitches with them doesn't help, like car cannot find the bloody key.

That black GT3 is a nice spec though assuming c16 and clubsport with ceramics too probably the lowest mileage 991.1 in the UK and one of the last 991.1 on 65 plate so quite a rare car especially as only 332 UK cars.

Melvynr said: av185 said: Most stuff has risen ££ though including Mclarens. Incredible to think when Covid first hit there was a blue 1 owner 2018 720S Perf 5k miler which sold on Collecting Cars March 2020 for £127k plus fees also a black 1 owner 2019 600LT 3k miler sold at similar money. Buy on the bullets springs to mind. Am tempted with a 570GT, excellent value at 115 , just turned 2 year old with 3k on the clock.But when you look at the 159 sticker price and options knocking it up to around 180k , something tells me not to touch it, or throw my money down the drain hole.Depreciation is horrendous on them for such a stunning motor.Little glitches with them doesn't help, like car cannot find the bloody key. Yes the 570 is a great package but its the usual Mclaren glitches that hits these cars depreciation wise. There is a long running thread on PH re owners 720 who has just discovered bubbling on both wings amongst other faults including cracked screen etc although the Mc dealer is sorting the issues apparantly.

Melvynr said: Beat that https://www.pistonheads.com/buy/listing/12565895 that has been on sale for over a year. It is a wonderful specced car and when compared to others of similar spec/milage it is fairly priced, but none of these Gt3s sell. I reckon in the course of a year you could count on one hand how many change hands now.

This is becoming hilarious this thread The same usernames every other message telling you how these cars are only going up. The actual buyers watching these cars and laughing as they don't ever sell My money is on these cars falling in value.....

julian987R said: that has been on sale for over a year. It is a wonderful specced car and when compared to others of similar spec/milage it is fairly priced, but none of these Gt3s sell. I reckon in the course of a year you could count on one hand how many change hands now. Ah right , didnt realise that.Was thinking one would have to assume that if you bought it , it would lose money as soon as you jumped into it off the forecourt.

This appeared to sell quickly. Over £200k for a 997.2 GT3RS

jjr1 said: This is becoming hilarious this thread The same usernames every other message telling you how these cars are only going up. The actual buyers watching these cars and laughing as they don't ever sell My money is on these cars falling in value..... Yes, agreed. Of the 18 OPC cars currently for sale, 7 have had prices reduced. Clearly PDK cars demand a premium but TBH there is little consistency in the pricing. White PDK at Swindon, seriously boring spec at £105k (22k over OTR price!!) but you see other cars like the GT silver Oct 20 car at Teeside (if you like GT silver w/aurum) that is pretty much bang on list price & has full PPF, shame it has the std interior. Other cars have sat in the showroom for a few months now. A couple of ambitious prices for PDK cars does not mean the market is going up, I’d say it’s softening but still buoyant for well spec’d cars. All now irrelevant (to me) as thankfully mine is in build this coming week, should see it at the end of the month but I suspect it will be into January. It’s been a long wait!

julian987R said: Melvynr said: Beat that https://www.pistonheads.com/buy/listing/12565895 that has been on sale for over a year. It is a wonderful specced car and when compared to others of similar spec/milage it is fairly priced, but none of these Gt3s sell. I reckon in the course of a year you could count on one hand how many change hands now. You forgot to mention this car which very recently sold for £151500 on Collecting Cars. As we all know auction prices truly reflact the market and this is clearly indicative of the current strong market even approaching Xmas. Early run 2017 multi owned car with a sketchy history too. As ever history proves the best spec 1 owner cars will always sell at the highest prices especially manual GT3s of which fewer and fewer come to market. In fact to confirm this there is only 1 991.2 GT3 in the OPC network atm. :

GRD_72 said: jjr1 said: This is becoming hilarious this thread The same usernames every other message telling you how these cars are only going up. The actual buyers watching these cars and laughing as they don't ever sell My money is on these cars falling in value..... Yes, agreed. Of the 18 OPC cars currently for sale, 7 have had prices reduced. Clearly PDK cars demand a premium but TBH there is little consistency in the pricing. White PDK at Swindon, seriously boring spec at £105k (22k over OTR price!!) but you see other cars like the GT silver Oct 20 car at Teeside (if you like GT silver w/aurum) that is pretty much bang on list price & has full PPF, shame it has the std interior. Other cars have sat in the showroom for a few months now. A couple of ambitious prices for PDK cars does not mean the market is going up, I’d say it’s softening but still buoyant for well spec’d cars. All now irrelevant (to me) as thankfully mine is in build this coming week, should see it at the end of the month but I suspect it will be into January. It’s been a long wait! It’s winter and gt prices are still creeping up, this is unusual. As new GT cars become more expensive this will only drive up the prices of used GT product, this can already be seen with the 997 gt3 and 981 GT4 cars. In my opinion a nearly new nicely specified 718 GT4 is a bargain at the moment around 100k.

GT4RS said: It’s winter and gt prices are still creeping up, this is unusual. As new GT cars become more expensive this will only drive up the prices of used GT product, this can already be seen with the 997 gt3 and 981 GT4 cars. In my opinion a nearly new nicely specified 718 GT4 is a bargain at the moment around 100k. Correct, in fact Ashgoods have just listed a 981 GT4 at £90k. If folks think these cars are expensive now wait until next year. A repeat of 2021 awaits and due to the continued severe restrictions on new car supplies across the board and semi conductor supply chain problems also new car price rises this will continue driving prices in a repeat of 2021. Porsche have just increased new car prices incl the GT4 and further rises are predicted soon and for obvious reasons. It is no coincidence that CAP Clean trade used car prices have continued to rise into December which is almost unheard of at this time of year. Those maintaining prices will fall are obviously trying to talk the market down but perhaps they want to buy fair enough but the advice is to buy now not next year when most in the know correctly anticipate prices which be much higher exactly as they were in 2021.

av185 said: GT4RS said: It’s winter and gt prices are still creeping up, this is unusual. As new GT cars become more expensive this will only drive up the prices of used GT product, this can already be seen with the 997 gt3 and 981 GT4 cars. In my opinion a nearly new nicely specified 718 GT4 is a bargain at the moment around 100k. Correct, in fact Ashgoods have just listed a 981 GT4 at £90k. If folks think these cars are expensive now wait until next year. A repeat of 2021 awaits and due to the continued severe restrictions on new car supplies across the board and semi conductor supply chain problems also new car price rises this will continue driving prices in a repeat of 2021. Porsche have just increased new car prices incl the GT4 and further rises are predicted soon and for obvious reasons. It is no coincidence that CAP Clean trade used car prices have continued to rise into December which is almost unheard of at this time of year. Those maintaining prices will fall are obviously trying to talk the market down but perhaps they want to buy fair enough but the advice is to buy now not next year when most in the know correctly anticipate prices which be much higher exactly as they were in 2021. And let’s be honest Ashgoods are none for price them cheap sell them fast, so if they have a 981 Gt4 the market is clearly changed.

jjr1 said: This is becoming hilarious this thread The same usernames every other message telling you how these cars are only going up. The actual buyers watching these cars and laughing as they don't ever sell My money is on these cars falling in value..... it's all pretty irrelevant to anyone that already owns a car, prices could go up and down like stocks and shares only the price only matters on the day you sell up. What I have seen is plenty cars advertised at strong money with a lack of movement at the higher end, a lot of cars have been advertised for months now. human nature we all like a bargain and no one wants to feel ripped off so these cars advertised way over list are always gonna be a tough sale as you are getting nothing extra for your money just profiteering by the seller. I am looking for a particular car and would pay a premium to get one but I would rather do without than pay some of the premiums I have seen there are other cars when you move up to this price bracket that come into play and there are a lot of pretty poor spec cars that the sellers are taking the p*ss with and I think when you are spending this type of money very few buyers are gonna just wave the white flag and pay the money, you can see a £10k difference in price for pretty much the same car, we all have access to the internet and know what else is out there for the money . I would imagine a majority of people buy this type of car as a toy / second car and a lot will be unused for the next 4 months, 4 weeks time everything will become a year older, couple that with the uncertainty of what is going on in the world short term I struggle to see why prices would rise.

JeffC said: jjr1 said: This is becoming hilarious this thread The same usernames every other message telling you how these cars are only going up. The actual buyers watching these cars and laughing as they don't ever sell My money is on these cars falling in value..... it's all pretty irrelevant to anyone that already owns a car, prices could go up and down like stocks and shares only the price only matters on the day you sell up. What I have seen is plenty cars advertised at strong money with a lack of movement at the higher end, a lot of cars have been advertised for months now. human nature we all like a bargain and no one wants to feel ripped off so these cars advertised way over list are always gonna be a tough sale as you are getting nothing extra for your money just profiteering by the seller. I am looking for a particular car and would pay a premium to get one but I would rather do without than pay some of the premiums I have seen there are other cars when you move up to this price bracket that come into play and there are a lot of pretty poor spec cars that the sellers are taking the p*ss with and I think when you are spending this type of money very few buyers are gonna just wave the white flag and pay the money, you can see a £10k difference in price for pretty much the same car, we all have access to the internet and know what else is out there for the money . I would imagine a majority of people buy this type of car as a toy / second car and a lot will be unused for the next 4 months, 4 weeks time everything will become a year older, couple that with the uncertainty of what is going on in the world short term I struggle to see why prices would rise. I’m also in a the market for a new fun car having sold two of my other cars during COVID for very strong money, both went back to dealers who then sold them for a premium in a matter of weeks! What I have noticed since I started looking for a new car is the lack of stock out there in general and the crazy lead times on new , when you speak to these OPC centres on a car you like there not willing to move on the sticker price as then have had to pay so much for the car in the first place! I can’t see how the market can now drop with such limited stock going to the dealers and when the cost of new cars keep increasing at a fast pace. It would be lovely to think prices are coming down as I’m trying to buy but I just can’t see it happening. Edited by GT4RS on Friday 3rd December 10:10

GT4RS said: And let’s be honest Ashgoods are none for price them cheap sell them fast, so if they have a 981 Gt4 the market is clearly changed. He means JZM rather than Ashgoods

GT4RS said: In my opinion a nearly new nicely specified 718 GT4 is a bargain at the moment around 100k. That’s about right, a nicely spec’d car with a list of low 90’s, 8-10k over with not too many miles is probably spot on, maybe another 6-8k if it has a PDK. But the cars that are listed at 20-22k over….. I guess there are always folk out there with an odd combination of brains, patience & money! I see the decently spec’d PDK at Gravelwood cars ain’t shifted in 3 months.

GRD_72 said: decently spec’d PDK at Gravelwood Badly/oddly specced IMO, not decently specced... Plastic dash, no chrono, black PCCB's, Xenon PDLS rather than LED, no 12'o clock marker, standard black belts, CS pack but with the PCCB's. For a dealer of his savviness I'm amazed he got the speccing 'detail' so off. Edited by kmpowell on Friday 3rd December 12:28

kmpowell said: GRD_72 said: decently spec’d PDK at Gravelwood Badly/oddly specced IMO, not decently specced... Plastic dash, no chrono, black PCCB's, Xenon PDLS rather than LED, no 12'o clock marker, standard black belts, CS pack but with the PCCB's. For a dealer of his savviness I'm amazed he got the speccing 'detail' so off. Edited by kmpowell on Friday 3rd December 12:28 Yup classic case of how not to spec a car if your intention is to flip. Quite clear why it hasn't sold but typically and as ever folks are using this weird spec car as an perfect example of the overall market lol.

Not many .2 GT3s left now with under 5-6k miles, anyone paying big money now will get shafted on resale and all coming to warranty end this summer, unless bought from an OPC, a 2k service this summer or before as well. What is the gospel on this thread, 10k miles heavy mileage.

kmpowell said: Badly/oddly specced IMO, not decently specced... Plastic dash, no chrono, black PCCB's, Xenon PDLS rather than LED, no 12'o clock marker, standard black belts, CS pack but with the PCCB's. For a dealer of his savviness I'm amazed he got the speccing 'detail' so off. Edited by kmpowell on Friday 3rd December 12:28 Apart from the lights those options would all be positives for me. Especially the black belts.

GRD_72 said: kmpowell said: Badly/oddly specced IMO, not decently specced... Plastic dash, no chrono, black PCCB's, Xenon PDLS rather than LED, no 12'o clock marker, standard black belts, CS pack but with the PCCB's. For a dealer of his savviness I'm amazed he got the speccing 'detail' so off. Oh dear. Some like red cars, some like black cars…… LED lights…… most GT4s are hardly driven during the day, never might after dark. No 12 o’clock marker, oh that’s a sin & black seatbelts to tie in with the stealthed out look , Tony is heading straight to hell for that one All black inside & out ain’t my cup of tea either. You're missing the point. I meant it's badly specced for 'flipping', not badly specced per se.

That’s a fair enough comment the stealth look is a bit marmite (just realised I replied to you and not AV, who eluded to the same point).

GRD_72 said: Yes, agreed. Of the 18 OPC cars currently for sale, 7 have had prices reduced. Clearly PDK cars demand a premium but TBH there is little consistency in the pricing. White PDK at Swindon, seriously boring spec at £105k (22k over OTR price!!) but you see other cars like the GT silver Oct 20 car at Teeside (if you like GT silver w/aurum) that is pretty much bang on list price & has full PPF, shame it has the std interior. Other cars have sat in the showroom for a few months now. A couple of ambitious prices for PDK cars does not mean the market is going up, I’d say it’s softening but still buoyant for well spec’d cars. All now irrelevant (to me) as thankfully mine is in build this coming week, should see it at the end of the month but I suspect it will be into January. It’s been a long wait! The pricing's all over the place. I just bought one of them yesterday (Wolverhampton) - Nov 20 manual, GT silver, satin black wheels, clubsport pack, buckets/harnesses, steel brakes. One owner, 2200 miles, full PPF, carbon interior, Bose. Dealer pretty hard nosed and no movement on price but compared to the others in the network £94k seems a pretty good price. Not sure why it's cheaper than higher mileage cars, the only change to the spec I would have made if ordering new would be to spec the climate rather than manual aircon, and probably the colour, but not going to lose sleep over either of those.

BobM said: GRD_72 said: Yes, agreed. Of the 18 OPC cars currently for sale, 7 have had prices reduced. Clearly PDK cars demand a premium but TBH there is little consistency in the pricing. White PDK at Swindon, seriously boring spec at £105k (22k over OTR price!!) but you see other cars like the GT silver Oct 20 car at Teeside (if you like GT silver w/aurum) that is pretty much bang on list price & has full PPF, shame it has the std interior. Other cars have sat in the showroom for a few months now. A couple of ambitious prices for PDK cars does not mean the market is going up, I’d say it’s softening but still buoyant for well spec’d cars. All now irrelevant (to me) as thankfully mine is in build this coming week, should see it at the end of the month but I suspect it will be into January. It’s been a long wait! The pricing's all over the place. I just bought one of them yesterday (Wolverhampton) - Nov 20 manual, GT silver, satin black wheels, clubsport pack, buckets/harnesses, steel brakes. One owner, 2200 miles, full PPF, carbon interior, Bose. Dealer pretty hard nosed and no movement on price but compared to the others in the network £94k seems a pretty good price. Not sure why it's cheaper than higher mileage cars, the only change to the spec I would have made if ordering new would be to spec the climate rather than manual aircon, and probably the colour, but not going to lose sleep over either of those. Sounds like you have had a good buy looking at the specification you mention for 94k. Congratulations

BobM said: The pricing's all over the place. I just bought one of them yesterday (Wolverhampton) - Nov 20 manual, GT silver, satin black wheels, clubsport pack, buckets/harnesses, steel brakes. One owner, 2200 miles, full PPF, carbon interior, Bose. Dealer pretty hard nosed and no movement on price but compared to the others in the network £94k seems a pretty good price. Not sure why it's cheaper than higher mileage cars, the only change to the spec I would have made if ordering new would be to spec the climate rather than manual aircon, and probably the colour, but not going to lose sleep over either of those. Congratulations on the car My local OPC, are you from around the Midlands?

KyloRen said: Congratulations on the car My local OPC, are you from around the Midlands? Thank you! No, Swansea. But not many cars around that met my key requirements - manual, clubsport, steel brakes. Bonus that this one was low miles and one owner. Will head up on the train next week to collect.

BobM said: The pricing's all over the place. I just bought one of them yesterday (Wolverhampton) - Nov 20 manual, GT silver, satin black wheels, clubsport pack, buckets/harnesses, steel brakes. One owner, 2200 miles, full PPF, carbon interior, Bose. Dealer pretty hard nosed and no movement on price but compared to the others in the network £94k seems a pretty good price. Not sure why it's cheaper than higher mileage cars, the only change to the spec I would have made if ordering new would be to spec the climate rather than manual aircon, and probably the colour, but not going to lose sleep over either of those. I think you got a very nice car at a decent price, congratulations. I really like the GT silver, but I know it can split opinion. Enjoy.