Boxster 4.0 GTS: anyone regret speccing- 20mm? - Page 2 - Boxster/Cayman - PistonHeads UK

I suspect it will be a few months until I get to freeze the spec for my Boxster 4.0 but the biggest decision will be whether to go -10 or -20 on the suspension. I will use the car on the track four or five times a year but mainly for road trips (not a daily driver). Ideally I would prefer - 20 but I had a really bad experience with a Z4 with really harsh suspension which gave me backache, something I’ve never suffered from before or since. I had to get rid of it after 6 months but that wouldn’t be an option with the Boxster. I completely understand that S-PASM is way better than what I had on my Z4 but my risk averse attitude says go for -10 to avoid any possibility of a costly and heart (or back!) breaking mistake. It seems that owners have been very happy with whichever option they have selected (and I guess we all like to believe we have made the right choice). But is there anyone out there who regrets speccing -20mm suspension because it has been too firm? Or anyone in the -10 camp who secretly wishes they’d gone for -20? Go on, be honest - this is a big decision!!

Highly subjective. But if it is that important to you, I’d suggest you ask your dealer for a test drive in -20 spec car, either a used example or a demo. Failing that, ask on here if someone would be kind enough to take you out in their similarly equipped car.

Slippydiff said: Highly subjective. But if it is that important to you, I’d suggest you ask your dealer for a test drive in -20 spec car, either a used example or a demo. Failing that, ask on here if someone would be kind enough to take you out in their similarly equipped car. Agreed, try it before you buy it. Im sure the dealer can sort something.

Cayman rather than boxster but I spec’d the 10mm for worry of firmness. I’m glad I did as I find the 718 firmer than my previous 981 GTS and borderline of what’s acceptable for me for everyday use. But per above, everybody’s different and there are plenty of people who think the opposite!

OPOGTS said: Cayman rather than boxster but I spec’d the 10mm for worry of firmness. I’m glad I did as I find the 718 firmer than my previous 981 GTS and borderline of what’s acceptable for me for everyday use. But per above, everybody’s different and there are plenty of people who think the opposite! Interesting. I currently drive a 981 GTS and for me, the ride is perfect, even in Sport.

Boxsterjon said: Interesting. I currently drive a 981 GTS and for me, the ride is perfect, even in Sport. As I understand it Porsche deliberately made the suspension stiffer on 718 than the 981. Not sure why, I thought they got it just right on the 981 with PASM (-10mm) - great low speed ride in Normal, Sport perfectly useable on decent roads. Ground clearance well judged too - just (but only just) enough not to be a pain over speed humps and the like. So as has been said try before you buy would be a good idea.

Non issue IMHO - factory spec is -20 and its only stiff if you select sports on suspension button. YMMV.

Boxsterjon said: I suspect it will be a few months until I get to freeze the spec for my Boxster 4.0 but the biggest decision will be whether to go -10 or -20 on the suspension. I will use the car on the track four or five times a year but mainly for road trips (not a daily driver). Ideally I would prefer - 20 but I had a really bad experience with a Z4 with really harsh suspension which gave me backache, something I’ve never suffered from before or since. I had to get rid of it after 6 months but that wouldn’t be an option with the Boxster. I completely understand that S-PASM is way better than what I had on my Z4 but my risk averse attitude says go for -10 to avoid any possibility of a costly and heart (or back!) breaking mistake. It seems that owners have been very happy with whichever option they have selected (and I guess we all like to believe we have made the right choice). But is there anyone out there who regrets speccing -20mm suspension because it has been too firm? Or anyone in the -10 camp who secretly wishes they’d gone for -20? Go on, be honest - this is a big decision!! Where do you live John - as Slippy said maybe someone can give you a passenger ride? Personally I’ve liked the PASM -20 on 911’s but haven’t tried it on the 718. I didn’t like the X71 on the 981 GTS though. Felt more harsh and crashy I’ve got a 718 Spyder that is firm but still pretty compliant and not harsh so I think you’d be happy with -20 I have a 718 with -20 arriving in the next week so if you’re not too far away, I’d happily give you the passenger experience to help with your decision.

I have no issues with -20 and would spec it again. It's a very small difference compared to -10

Thanks for the advice so far. I live near Birmingham so if there is anyone within an hour’s drive with - 20 who would be happy to take me for a spin, I would gratefully take you up on it.

I stuck with -20 on my CGTS 4.0 and for me the ride is fine. Did a 1000 mile trip around the Lakes in the summer and no aches, pains or grounding. Just back from a 500 mile trip to Cornwall and again all fine.

Boxsterjon said: Thanks for the advice so far. I live near Birmingham so if there is anyone within an hour’s drive with - 20 who would be happy to take me for a spin, I would gratefully take you up on it. I’m about an hour south of Birmingham.

We had a 981 GTS for 4 years and now have the 718 4.0 GTS - both with the standard -20mm suspension. Didn't even enter my head to spec it otherwise. Its nigh on perfect. I've had a number of GT Porsches (RS/GT3 & GT4) at the same time to compare against - all were definitely firmer

nick28 said: We had a 981 GTS for 4 years and now have the 718 4.0 GTS - both with the standard -20mm suspension. Didn't even enter my head to spec it otherwise. Its nigh on perfect. I've had a number of GT Porsches (RS/GT3 & GT4) at the same time to compare against - all were definitely firmer Not sure I'd attest to that comment, I use my 718 GT4 as a daily, and it's far easier to live with than a .2 RS. I'd certainly spec -20mm if I were in the market for a GTS Edited by Porsche guy on Saturday 6th November 14:02

I’ve got -20 on my 25 edition boxster and it’s perfect imo. I’m 20mile south of Brum

Porsche guy said: nick28 said: We had a 981 GTS for 4 years and now have the 718 4.0 GTS - both with the standard -20mm suspension. Didn't even enter my head to spec it otherwise. Its nigh on perfect. I've had a number of GT Porsches (RS/GT3 & GT4) at the same time to compare against - all were definitely firmer Not sure I'd attest to that comment, I use my 718 GT4 as a daily, and it's far easier to live with than a .2 RS. I'd certainly spec -20mm if I were in the market for a GTS Edited by Porsche guy on Saturday 6th November 14:02 ? My comment was that (all) the GT cars were firmer than the GTS - and I also ran a couple of them as a daily

I'm another one with -20mm on a GTS 4.0 (mine is a Cayman) and I find it fine on the road, both in spirited weekend use and daily urban use. The damping, in particular, is excellent. The ride is a tiny bit firm on a very undulating B-roads but its way better than the 981 GT4 that I sold to buy the GTS. I did have a 987.1 Cayman S with PASM (-10mm) on 18"s for many years and the ride on that was lovely, but the GTS 4.0 is a more serious proposition. I drove the -20mm demonstrator on two separate occasions for about 2.5 hours in total but there wasn't an opportunity to drive a GTS with -10mm. Given that you will be taking it on track occasionally I would definitely spec -20mm in your position.

Had my GTS Boxster for 18 months with 7000 miles mixed between touring in Scotland and Europe and use as a day to day. -20mm isn’t an issue on road at all unless you stiffen suspension via PASM when it is a bit harsh. I have a Gt3RS gen 2 from new which I adore and the Boxster is a fantastic daily and very useable. -20 is fine unless you live in a city with liars is speed bumps. You’ll hear loads about gearing but the reality is the 4.0 is so torquey that unless you want to recline in every gear it isn’t really an issue.

Redline rather than recline.

I’ve done 10,300 miles in my BGTS4.0 and never once thought to regret having the -20mm. The ride is uncannily good, probably one of the most remarkable features of the car is how good the ride is and yet still has such control and flat handling. (My previous Porsche was a 987.2S with standard passive suspension and the GTS4.0 is like a luxury saloon for ride comfort compared the that car) I recently did 1500 miles in a 718S with standard passive suspension and the ride comfort in that car was significantly and noticeably worse than my car, despite my car having much sharper handling. I honestly don’t see what the point of the -10mm option is. Perhaps just for Americans who want a bit of wallow for Boulevard cruising? Even if you were not taking the car on track, the -20mm option is spot on. Porsche engineers have got this one just right.

I’ve done 10,300 miles in my BGTS4.0 and never once thought to regret having the -20mm. The ride is uncannily good, probably one of the most remarkable features of the car is how good the ride is and yet still has such control and flat handling. (My previous Porsche was a 987.2S with standard passive suspension and the GTS4.0 is like a luxury saloon for ride comfort compared the that car) I recently did 1500 miles in a 718S with standard passive suspension and the ride comfort in that car was significantly and noticeably worse than my car, despite my car having much sharper handling. I honestly don’t see what the point of the -10mm option is. Perhaps just for Americans who want a bit of wallow for Boulevard cruising? Even if you were not taking the car on track, the -20mm option is spot on. Porsche engineers have got this one just right.

L.Len said: I’ve got -20 on my 25 edition boxster and it’s perfect imo. I’m 20mile south of Brum Hi L.Len I would love to fix a passenger ride in your lovely new car to get a feel for the suspension (and also see the GT Silver/Red combo as it is one I am considering). Your account doesn’t currently allow emails and I wondered if you could change the settings so I can drop you a line. Many thanks

i suspect 999 out of 1000 people wouldn't notice if their own car's suspension was raised or lowered by 1 centimeter. Edited by hueyhoolihan on Sunday 7th November 13:17

Boxsterjon said: L.Len said: I’ve got -20 on my 25 edition boxster and it’s perfect imo. I’m 20mile south of Brum Hi L.Len I would love to fix a passenger ride in your lovely new car to get a feel for the suspension (and also see the GT Silver/Red combo as it is one I am considering). Your account doesn’t currently allow emails and I wondered if you could change the settings so I can drop you a line. Many thanks Done

L.Len said: Done Thanks - message sent

hueyhoolihan said: i suspect 999 out of 1000 people wouldn't notice if their own car's suspension was raised or lowered by 1 centimeter. Edited by hueyhoolihan on Sunday 7th November 13:17 The actual height isn’t the issue. The settings on the two cars are quite different. I’ve had two 718 CGTS, with one on each type. 2.5 was on -20. The standard mode was brilliant at almost everything I ever did, so was happy. The sport mode was pretty pointless though, as it all but locked out all suspension movement! No bumps are absorbed at all. Any imperfections just propel the whole car violently upwards. It’s essentially a one mode car on road. The 4.0 was a dealer spec car on -10mm. This car has two very comfortable and usable modes. One is just slightly firmer than the other. Neither mode locks out travel. I red lined the car in 6th recently in the comfort mode and it was still supremely planted. For my UK road use, I’d ideally like the following…. -20mm ride height as it looks better, with the standard mode, set as the firmer sport. Then a softer mode, akin to the comfort on a -10mm car.

I just use the rotary device thingy on the wheel and set my individual mode as normal suspension mode but with the throttle on its sharpest setting, the exhaust on its louder setting and the stability control on its most relaxed setting (but still on, rather than off). And when it goes on track, the suspension will go into sport mode. Unless it's wet and it's a track like Oulton Park - in which case it will probably stay in normal mode.

The demo I drove had -10 and it was excellent on the crappy roads where I live. I’m not planning on taking the car on track either. Therefore I ordered a -10 car. I found the sport setting on that was starting to get a bit much on the local roads. If it is a track toy and your local roads are decent, -20 is probably fine, but I’ve never driven a -20. It may or may not be worth noting that the U.K. press CGTS (the green car) is a -10 car.

For a given car generally the lower the suspension option the stiffer the springs will be in order to reduce the chances of the suspension bottoming out. BTW how do the 718 GTS 4.0 suspension options compare to the X73 option on the 981?

AW10 said: For a given car generally the lower the suspension option the stiffer the springs will be in order to reduce the chances of the suspension bottoming out. BTW how do the 718 GTS 4.0 suspension options compare to the X73 option on the 981? They don’t compare at all. The X73 gives great handling, especially on smooth road surfaces but it is really quite firm and unyielding, so quite a hard ride. The GTS4.0 options are both adaptive PASM systems and in -20mm form seems to pull off the impossible by having great handling and roadholding, and very flat cornering but with a very smooth and comfortable ride. A remarkable achievement by Porsche’s suspension engineers. The -10mm option gives a softer ride with more body movement and is a little less sharp and direct.

Wollemi said: They don’t compare at all. The X73 gives great handling, especially on smooth road surfaces but it is really quite firm and unyielding, so quite a hard ride. The GTS4.0 options are both adaptive PASM systems and in -20mm form seems to pull off the impossible by having great handling and roadholding, and very flat cornering but with a very smooth and comfortable ride. A remarkable achievement by Porsche’s suspension engineers. The -10mm option gives a softer ride with more body movement and is a little less sharp and direct. The main difference is that with the -10mm the Sport setting is eminenantly useable on decent roads,l. As another contributor has pointed out the -20 Sport setting is really too stiff for the road. Seems to me the -10 gives you the best of both worlds unless you intend to track the car a lot or are prepared to sacrifice a some breadth of ability for the look of the lower car. The image below (from 981 but I'd be surprized if the 718 was significantly different) shows how the damping varies depending on driving conditions (road/speed/driver behaviour). In Normal the damping varies between much softer (at low speeds) than the non-adaptive setup and quite a bit stiffer. In Sport the damping is almost always stiffer than than the non-adaptive system and MUCH stiffer at speed. Note that the springs and AR bars on the PASM car are also a bit stiffer than the non-adaptive cars. Clearly the -20 will be stiffer again. Edited by bcr5784 on Sunday 14th November 10:51

Wollemi said: AW10 said: For a given car generally the lower the suspension option the stiffer the springs will be in order to reduce the chances of the suspension bottoming out. BTW how do the 718 GTS 4.0 suspension options compare to the X73 option on the 981? They don’t compare at all. The X73 gives great handling, especially on smooth road surfaces but it is really quite firm and unyielding, so quite a hard ride. The GTS4.0 options are both adaptive PASM systems and in -20mm form seems to pull off the impossible by having great handling and roadholding, and very flat cornering but with a very smooth and comfortable ride. A remarkable achievement by Porsche’s suspension engineers. The -10mm option gives a softer ride with more body movement and is a little less sharp and direct. I found the X73 fantastic and comfortable on UK roads. It felt expensive and well resolved, which was mirrored by all that drove it, even my Mum as a passenger didn’t have an issue with it. The only time I found any issue, was on back roads with severe vertical humps, where a little more travel would have been ideal. -20mm in sport would see you in the hedge on the same road. If you hit a 5cm ridge in sport mode, the car is flung hard from the top of it, with no contact patch available for a moment. The body is essentially rammed 5cm upwards as all travel is locked out. Only the normal mode is usable, but that’s all I ever needed anyway. It’s not as good as X73, but with the faster steering and other 718 chassis changes, it still feels overall a little better. The sport mode was also not usable on the Autobahn. I was hoping for even better body control at very high speeds, but it still caused the car to skip across the road on even tiny bumps and ridges. Again, the normal mode was brilliant. The car was planed securely all the way up to v-max. I never took the car on track, but can ony assume the sport mode was suitable for track use, where there are ZERO surface imperfections. I can see why some of these cars (and the GT4) crack their chassis on track, if the drivers decide to take to the curbs. I find the -10mm sharper and more direct most of the time. Either mode is great on bumpy fast B-roads. The chassis is alway ready to react to input, without having to wait for it to settle after crests/ridges etc. I wish it was a little lower, as the X73 looked way better to me. I’m not a fan of this whole -10 -20mm thing. Better suspension just works better at everything! No need for the car to be lifted for some versions. If you’ve ever driven a standard car, then fitted expensive dampers to it, you’ll know. Better suspension is normally more comfortable AND more controlled. Porsche could just set the cars at the correct ride height / geometry, then fit various grades of damper quality to make the cars more comfortable / pointy. I do think it’s a marketing, not engineering decision ultimately.

Red 5 said: The actual height isn’t the issue. The settings on the two cars are quite different. I’ve had two 718 CGTS, with one on each type. 2.5 was on -20. The standard mode was brilliant at almost everything I ever did, so was happy. The sport mode was pretty pointless though, as it all but locked out all suspension movement! No bumps are absorbed at all. Any imperfections just propel the whole car violently upwards. It’s essentially a one mode car on road. The 4.0 was a dealer spec car on -10mm. This car has two very comfortable and usable modes. One is just slightly firmer than the other. Neither mode locks out travel. I red lined the car in 6th recently in the comfort mode and it was still supremely planted. For my UK road use, I’d ideally like the following…. -20mm ride height as it looks better, with the standard mode, set as the firmer sport. Then a softer mode, akin to the comfort on a -10mm car. Your experience and observations are very interesting. I am wondering if the suspension settings have been altered for the GTS4.0 compared to your 2.5T GTS. you description of the behaviour of your GTS4.0on -10mm could just as easily be applied to my GTS4.0 on -20mm. Certainly your description on the behaviour I sport mode (of your -20 GTS2.5) is not something I recognise from my car. On my car engaging sport mode merely makes the car very slightly firmer with a hint of jigglyness. You can easily engage sports suspension and not be that aware that you have done so. The only explanation that I can think of is that the suspension settings and calibration is different between the 2.5 and 4.0 models.

Wollemi said: Your experience and observations are very interesting. I am wondering if the suspension settings have been altered for the GTS4.0 compared to your 2.5T GTS. you description of the behaviour of your GTS4.0on -10mm could just as easily be applied to my GTS4.0 on -20mm. Certainly your description on the behaviour I sport mode (of your -20 GTS2.5) is not something I recognise from my car. On my car engaging sport mode merely makes the car very slightly firmer with a hint of jigglyness. You can easily engage sports suspension and not be that aware that you have done so. The only explanation that I can think of is that the suspension settings and calibration is different between the 2.5 and 4.0 models. I do know the suspension was modified for the change back to NA. How much of this was recalibrated PASM settings, it’s hard to know. What we have now is great though, so I’m not going to be worrying about it

Now up to 4.5k miles in PDK 25th over past 9 months, its one of the best fun driving road cars I have ever owned. My car has the lower -20mm option not once on any road have I felt that its to firm when left in normal settings, In fact i would say it feels about perfect. Not surprised the 718 4.0 GTS PDK gets the reviews that it does