996.2 private values vs indy

After the recent thread where a forum member was struggling to sell his 70k mile manual 996.2 C2 for £16k (which he has since sold and needed very little work as I understand it) I am interested to see that similar cars being advertised by respected indies for £22k. Obviously dealers are going to be more expensive, but £6k! Forum members car: http://911uk.com/ads_item.php?id=8319 911 Virgin (with Hartech rebuild/maintenance programme): https://www.pistonheads.com/classif...carrera-996/porsche-911-996-carrera-2/8756134 Steve Bull: https://www.pistonheads.com/classif...years----absolutely-cherished-example/8590230 Seems an increasing disconnect between private and (respected) trade cars - I think the C4S prices show a similar pattern, but not so much the 996.1s. Perhaps this reflects the perceived higher risk of bore scoring/IMS issues with the 996.2 - so people are happy to pay a premium for a recognised dealer warranty/backup? :?:

I think you've hit the nail on the head. Dealers have to factor in the 'potential risk' so ask more. Buyers are prepared to pay a premium for the initial peace of mind.

I now, but £6k? That's an OPC level of mark up!

At £6K it had better have an amazing warranty and have been given a clean bill of health because that is significant contribution to an engine rebuild.

I'd see £4.5k of that being the usual to cover prep'work, advertising, VAT, bought in warranty, overheads and dealer profit with the additional £1.5k being set aside as a contribution to the 'big issue not covered by bought-in warranty' slush fund. Some well regarded specialists won't even take these cars in anymore as the price they have to ask to get a car up-to-scratch and to cover themselves is too high.

Agreed I and do appreciate dealers need to make a profit and cover themselves. Probably why it might be better to get car like this independently inspected (by Hartec ideally) and save the cash towards future maintenance. At least that way you won't have to deal with them trying to wriggle out of any potential claims.

Spot on, Terry - they have to balance risk v reward and if something goes wrong it will be expensive to fix

But if nothing goes wrong then you've saved yourself £6k/over spent by £6k...glass half full/half empty outlook :dont know: I bought private, used my 6th sense and had a PPI...I'd never buy from a dealer but this is a bit like an oil/tyres thread :thumb:

I think there is a lot of hot air around 996s at the moment, especially from the Porsche magazines (whose writers own them :?: ) . Don't forget we've also seen 996.1s sit around too. A few forum members have had nice aero kitted examples that took ages to shift. Ricky hull had a nice silver one which sat and sat at £16k. Gixxer996 was asking about £13k for his. As I always say, great cars when they're working but the engines are crap. I laugh when people say "Ooh yes but all performance engines wear out" and "You have to expect to spend when owning a 911". Performance engines do "wear" out, but these things were blowing up from brand new. And yes we all expect to spend money on them but a £10k rebuild when you're used to buying £50k cars may not be the end of the world. A £10k rebuild on a £10k car is pretty soul destroying. That's why most people just don't bother. The only modern-ish performance engine I can think of that was as shocking as the M96 was the TVR, Six 4.0. I enjoy owning my car and I'm pumping money into it like there's no tomorrow as I enjoying making things just right, but I'm also a realist and can accept that apart from us owners and the Porsche mags that talk every Porsche model up, most people think they're a bit crap. :grin: As T8 says some dealers don't even stock them as they can't be bothered with the hassle. That says it all.

I agree with what you're saying, but would add that the economics of the situation for the dealers would look very different when the supply of these cars is further reduced, and good ones are even rarer. The engine is unfortunate, but I think the specialists and forums have a pretty good handle on what the weaknesses are and how to engineer them out. However, that does make these 40-50k cars, if you take a 10k starting point and then fix everything. You've got to like them to do that.

Actually that's an underestimate, including purchase price of car, parts and servicing but excluding engine parts purchased for the rebuild I'm at 45k for mine now. EDIT £44,210.71 according to my spreadsheet. I'd estimate the engine (conservatively) at 20k. Note - I'm the first to admit that this makes no sense if resale is considered, as I'd lose an absolute fortune.