718S manual transmission -any criticisms from current owners - Page 3 - Boxster/Cayman - PistonHeads UK

Can't decide between manual & pdk before put down my deposit. Rather than starting another non-ending debate, wonder if any current owners ( who has been driving the car for a fair while) with the manual transmission, found anything to comment / critique / criticise on the lever feel / lever position / gear box in general / clutch / manageability at high speed cornering etc etc Really appreciate your comments cheers

Have you been to the PEC? I tried both before ordering. My car has the PDK but each to their own. The PDK suited my style of driving and use. The PEC day covered all kinds of driving with lots of gear changes - I just felt the PDK was better for me and I drove better with it.

Pretty sure it will be the same box as the 981 series, which no-one ever complains about!

The 718 has quite a lot of turbo lag. Some don't seem to notice it either because they subconsciously drive around it or because PDK masks it. How much it irritates seems to be a very personal thing - but if you think it will be an issue to you (probably when you are driving gently rather than razzing it) then PDK may well be a better choice. But as has been said, try both at the PEC - and drive gently as well as fast.

I have a 718 Cayman S with a 6 speed and I absolutely love it. I get that the PDK will shift faster. I get that my 0-100 time would be a few tenths quicker. I know that resale will be better etc. However, there is something visceral about being engaged with the car. Like most people here, I have a lazy car (Mercedes CLS350) which I would never dream of getting in a manual. However, these are sports cars that are designed to engage and excite you. For me personally, I love it. Each to their own but even the fact that you are thinking about it should tell you what to do.

Yep, Adam's sentiments there reflect my own. I have a manual 6-speed 718CS coming my way in 2 week's time. I want to engage with the car to a greater degree; have that level of clutch control and separation of the drive and power trains missing with PDK, and most importantly the ability to jump selectively across ratios, which you can't do with PDK. The level of control and engagement with the manual is more important to me than the efficiency and speed of the auto-shifter. Others care much less about the former attributes and prefer the latter which the PDK offers. Only you can decide which of the two better suits your style of driving. In terms of 'how good is the manual 'box' in the 718, well, reviews generally have it as about as good as a manual 'box can be. Quick and short, slots into gears efficiently and intuitively. Test drive has reflected that. Edited by Tim bo on Tuesday 14th February 13:10

Driven the Boxter at PEC. Main complaint with manual is ratios as it was equally quick and thanks to torque equally driveable that you could easily be in second or third for the majority of driving. You didn't have to pick the right gear to drive hard out of corners or heel toe to slow down. They put it in the mode where auto blip was off and it was very intuitive still. I personally found the manual slightly at odds with the feel and control weights of the car overall. So im the end we went PDK. (NB But our other cars are all manual) Edited by shost on Tuesday 14th February 13:21

Ah yes, the long ratios - 80mph in second gear ... Something else to be aware of on the manual 'box. (not sure if the ratios are long on the PDK too - but given that you get an extra gear on PDK the ratios would be at least slightly shorter than the manual)

I test drove a manual 718 - just could not get on with it - also when I am driving in a spirited manner I like to have both hands on the steering wheel all the time.

Tim bo said: Yep, Adam's sentiments there reflect my own. and most importantly the ability to jump selectively across ratios, which you can't do with PDK. Edited by Tim bo on Tuesday 14th February 13:10 I get why many prefer a manual, but since you can make at least 3 ratio changes with PDK in the time you can make 1 with a manual, I don't think the ability to skip ratios is really an argument in favour of a manual. Even in manual mode PDK won't let the engine labour and will change down as you slow - going into first when you come to a stop. Edited by bcr5784 on Tuesday 14th February 13:50

bcr5784 said: I get why many prefer a manual, but since you can make at least 3 ratio changes with PDK in the time you can make 1 with a manual, I don't think the ability to skip ratios is really an argument in favour of a manual. Even in manual mode PDK won't let the engine labour and will change down as you slow - going into first when you come to a stop. Ah but therein lies the rub, and you've pointed out exactly why I prefer manual over auto. Speed of getting to a particular gear is of little consequence to me. I don't care that an auto can get from 2nd to 5th through the gears quicker than I can manually jump straight from 2nd to 5th. The point is that I don't want to go through the gears, and I don't have an option to skip them in the auto. Let's say I want to accelerate hard in 2nd gear up to cruising speed NSL 60mph for a bit of blast. At 60 I'll want to then ponderously ease in the clutch, and move over to cruising in 5th or 6th. Can't do that with an auto - I don't want to go through 3rd and 4th - I want to skip them entirely. Or while going from cruising and approaching a red light or roundabout. I may possibly want to notch out of 5th and straight into 2nd, easing in the clutch, and balancing engine braking with actual braking. Can't do that with an auto either - you have no choice but to go through the gears. Just two examples from the top of my head out of many as to why I prefer manual, and why I've specced a manual on my impending 718CS. It really boils down to having the choice to select any gear, at any time. That element of control is missing in an auto. I'm coming out of an M235i with the excellent ZF 8 speed auto. It's while driving that over the last 2 years that I've established the above, and just how much the auto or the semi-auto flappy paddle irritates me, and just how much the manual gives me what I need. An auto just does not suit my driving style and what I require from a car. A manual does. Others will read the above, wonder what the hell I'm on about, and blat away happy to be flapping through all the gears in semi-auto or just leaving the auto to do its thing. As always, different horses for different courses. Edited by Tim bo on Tuesday 14th February 14:42

Even as a manual fan I don't fully see where you are coming from. The main argument for selecting manual is that you are more engaged in actually driving the car, operating the clutch, rev matching and shifting gear manually is something you can do badly or well and that's what makes it more involving. The ability to block shift isn't really anything to be getting excited about. PDK is so smooth that shifting through from 2nd to 5th is easy and no longer becomes a chore. The trouble with manual in the 981 and 718 by the sound of it is that the ratios are overly long meaning you reduce the number of opportunities to actually change gear where and when I really wanted to. This for me outweighed the perceived benefit of the additional involvement provided by the manual.

Tim bo said: Speed of getting to a particular gear is of little consequence to me. I don't care that an auto can get from 2nd to 5th through the gears quicker than I can manually jump straight from 2nd to 5th. The point is that I don't have an option to skip gears in the auto. So it should be clear that an auto just does not suit my driving style and what I require from a car. Edited by Tim bo on Tuesday 14th February 14:24 I accept entirely that you (and many others) prefer manual for perfectly understandable reasons - I just can't see how that is one of them. In a manual gearbox to get from 2nd to 5th you have to move the gear lever forward, right and forward - 3 separate moves. To get from 2nd to 5th with PDK you have to pull the right hand lever 3 times in quick succession. I can accept you might find it physically more pleasant stirring a manual box (I do) but it's not as if you are actually aware of all the intermediate gears being engaged with PDK in that circumstance. In fact I'm not even sure all the intermediate gears are engaged at all if you do it that quickly. (There's no reason why the software can't skip gears, in some circumstances, - it's not like a motobike - it does in kickdown and often seems to if you brake to a stop). So for all practical purposes you can skip gears just as readily (arguably more so) with PDK as with a manual - though you may well find it more pleasant with a manual.

daz05 said: Even as a manual fan I don't fully see where you are coming from. The main argument for selecting manual is that you are more engaged in actually driving the car, operating the clutch, rev matching and shifting gear manually is something you can do badly or well and that's what makes it more involving. The ability to block shift isn't really anything to be getting excited about. Indeed, and agree absolutely. Block shift was simply one aspect I pulled out of bcr's post. All the rest of your points regarding engagement I already referred to in my previous post as reasons why I prefer manual, so already covered.

The 981 clutch seems very heavy to me (coming from a 2015 S3 which - it turned out- was like stepping in ice cream by comparison) so if the 718 is the same, you really should try both and see what you could live with. Ditto the stiffness of 1st/2nd on cold mornings, it really is a completely different 'living with' experience to the PDK. It's most definitely NOT just a case of 'Oh, real drivers have manual' or 'Manual is so much more engaging'. I genuinely think that the manual box could sully the ownership experience for you if you plan on daily driving the car and are used to an easier life. For the sake of your own sanity, try both and decide - nobody's advice is going to tell you what YOU prefer. note - I f'ing love every inch of my manual 981 but even I spend time in traffic and think, "Yeah - I'd have PDK for this bit...".

Tim bo said: Ah yes, the long ratios - 80mph in second gear ... Something else to be aware of on the manual 'box. (not sure if the ratios are long on the PDK too - but given that you get an extra gear on PDK the ratios would be at least slightly shorter than the manual) On paper a 718 might fare better than a 981 for this. A manual 981 will do 84mph in 2nd gear which was for me a deal breaker because as much as I love manuals and didn't want to fork out an extra £2k+ in principle for PDK, I saw little point in buying a car with a rev-happy engine that I could only redline in 2 gears without losing my licence. PDK gearing is about 10% or more shorter for the first 6 ratios. With a 718 however, assuming the manual and PDK in gear speeds are similar to the 981, the nature of the engine is that there's not a great deal of point in taking it all the way to the redline, ergo a manual might be fine. And if the PDK is anything like the unit in the 991.2S I test drove, it'd kick down if you even looked at the pedal a bit too hard (presumably to hide the turbo lag) which got irritating after a while. All that said, you'd have to weigh up the uber sensitive kick down of PDK against the more noticeable turbo lag of the manual and decide which one annoyed you least all other things being equal.

Mario149 said: With a 718 however, assuming the manual and PDK in gear speeds are similar to the 981, the nature of the engine is that there's not a great deal of point in taking it all the way to the redline, ergo a manual might be fine. The 718 PDK has (allegedly) a longer diff than before, (3.62 vs 3.89) so no longer has such a gearing "advantage" over the manual. On the other hand a PDK can mask the lag of the turbo better than the manual. It's something only a buyer can decide. (But I would add that I've never been entirely convinced my 981 PDK has a 3.89 diff - speedo, rev counter and GPs figures have never quite tallied and I could actually believe it too has a 3.62 diff.) Edited by bcr5784 on Tuesday 14th February 19:58

I have a 981 CS with the 6 speed manual. Much prefer it to PDK, which I have test driven a couple of times. My only slight niggle with the set-up is that I find the pedal layout a little sub-optimal for heel-and-toe, with the brake pedal significantly higher than the throttle. The pedals in the 987 series were better in this regard. The actual shift is lovely though.

Tim bo said: Ah yes, the long ratios - 80mph in second gear ... Something else to be aware of on the manual 'box. (not sure if the ratios are long on the PDK too - but given that you get an extra gear on PDK the ratios would be at least slightly shorter than the manual) PDK cars have 7 gears 1-6 are on a sports ratio 7th gear is purely for the fuel consumption when you are wafting If you enable Sports mode then 7th gear is disabled No idea about the ratios for PDK vs manual. I'd have assumed the same (as 0-60, 0-100 times are often explained as 'slower to change gear in the manuals')

SV_WDC said: If you enable Sports mode then 7th gear is disabled Not on my car - it is much more reluctant to use 7th but it does use it at a constant cruise at highish speeds.

bcr5784 said: SV_WDC said: If you enable Sports mode then 7th gear is disabled Not on my car - it is much more reluctant to use 7th but it does use it at a constant cruise at highish speeds. On the 981, 7th is disabled in Sports+ only

I have a manual 718 S and have had it for just over 3 months now. I chose it for exactly the reasons that adamishome says - driver engagement fully knowing it might not be quite as quick or convenient. The gear lever position / action is excellent as is the clutch feel so I am entirely happy with my choice. I didn't go for sportschrono and having experienced it on the PEC day with a manual would probably have gone for that purely because of the auto blip for entertainment reasons. The manual clutch/gearbox is a fair bit heavier action than in my other car (Golf R)which I always felt was a good weight but now feels quite (too) light to drive in comparison

Only driven the 2.0 manual, but have to say it's a lovely sweet shift. I might be imagining things, but the clutch feels fractionally lighter than the 981 I drove a while ago, although its still heavier than most cars on the road of similar power (am thinking manual M135is, Golf Rs etc.). One thing to think of though (which almost single handed my put me off ordering manual) is the manual parking brake. Feels really unintuitive to use having to reach forward with right hand to use on hills and alike, how I wish it was just a normal handbrake! I'm sure you'd probably get used to it after a while, but still felt annoying on the day I borrowed the 718.

1964 said: I have a manual 718 S and have had it for just over 3 months now. I chose it for exactly the reasons that adamishome says - driver engagement fully knowing it might not be quite as quick or convenient. The gear lever position / action is excellent as is the clutch feel so I am entirely happy with my choice. I didn't go for sportschrono and having experienced it on the PEC day with a manual would probably have gone for that purely because of the auto blip for entertainment reasons. Only reason I went for the sport chrono was the auto blip. A ridiculous amount to pay just for that really, but I wanted a complete car and knew that I'd miss out if I didn't. Want all the possible magic. It's good to hear from someone who has run a 718 manual for 3 months and is still happy with the choice.

ikonic said: One thing to think of though (which almost single handed my put me off ordering manual) is the manual parking brake. Feels really unintuitive to use having to reach forward with right hand to use on hills and alike, how I wish it was just a normal handbrake! I'm sure you'd probably get used to it after a while, but still felt annoying on the day I borrowed the 718. I've not got used to it in over 2 years... It's a PITA with PDK, but have to agree it would be significantly more annoying with a manual.

Wife has a 981 PDK, she loves it. We were given a manual Boxster when in went in for service last summer, I presume to try to encourage me to buy one. Sorry but the clutch was far too heavy - 50yr+ with bit of OA in hip, not exactly unusual for owner profile I'd think. Really became too much in traffic for either of us. Spoilt it entirely, could not see it as any joy in traffic. Compared to our other manuals it was a real no-no

Tim bo said: Want all the possible magic. the real magic is in blipping the throttle yourself ikonic said: One thing to think of though (which almost single handed my put me off ordering manual) is the manual parking brake. Feels really unintuitive to use having to reach forward with right hand to use on hills and alike, how I wish it was just a normal handbrake! have you tried Autohold? i've only had my car a couple of months and don't have any complaints to date (though i was a bit concerned before i found out about this feature). foot on brake, put car in first, let go of brake, car holds itself automatically, drive off, handbrake disengages automatically. EDIT: regarding the manual 'box, i tried PDK a couple of times and liked it to start with, but got bored pretty quickly and TBH i kept hitting the indicator stick instead of the flappy paddle :/ over the moon with the manual box (GTS though not 718, but i think they're pretty much the same?) Edited by JasonSteel on Wednesday 15th February 17:37

JasonSteel said: have you tried Autohold? i've only had my car a couple of months and don't have any complaints to date (though i was a bit concerned before i found out about this feature). foot on brake, put car in first, let go of brake, car holds itself automatically, drive off, handbrake disengages automatically. Edited by JasonSteel on Wednesday 15th February 17:37 It does work - but I could do a smoother, slicker job with a conventional handbrake, and the fact that I don't have a 6 inch hand growing out of my right kneecap does make operation of the handbrake rather inconvenient. If it was that difficult to make a mechanical handbrake work (it genuinely is with rear discs on a heavy car) - couldn't they have put the "switch" in the conventional position?

Honestly can't say I've ever been bothered/annoyed by the electronic handbrake. Only ever gets used when I park up. Yes it's a bit unusual but it declutters the centre console area a bit so seems a "price" worth paying.

Mario149 said: Honestly can't say I've ever been bothered/annoyed by the electronic handbrake. Only ever gets used when I park up. Yes it's a bit unusual but it declutters the centre console area a bit so seems a "price" worth paying. But don't you then rely on the hill hold function? If that did as a good a job as I can, I wouldn't have a beef - unfortunately it doesn't.

bcr5784 said: Mario149 said: Honestly can't say I've ever been bothered/annoyed by the electronic handbrake. Only ever gets used when I park up. Yes it's a bit unusual but it declutters the centre console area a bit so seems a "price" worth paying. But don't you then rely on the hill hold function? If that did as a good a job as I can, I wouldn't have a beef - unfortunately it doesn't. Honestly can't remember the last time I started on a hill! I def have done on road trips about 18 months ago though, and I don't recall any issue with hill hold. Or not a big enough one that I remember. It could be that it's not as smooth as you'd like, but given that for me it's so infrequent it's just a non-issue. Also, I drive an E60 M5 SMG which feels like you're being minorly rear-ended (oo er matron) at least twice every time you pull away even on the flat, so it's all relative

bcr5784 said: couldn't they have put the "switch" in the conventional position? i get what you're saying but maybe if they put the switch in a more accessible position it could get knocked by accident when you least want it, say going round a corner at highish speed? that could be a disaster. do you use/need the electronic brake a lot? i'm with Mario on this in that i don't use it enough (a handful of times a week maybe?) for it to be an issue.

JasonSteel said: i get what you're saying but maybe if they put the switch in a more accessible position it could get knocked by accident when you least want it, say going round a corner at highish speed? that could be a disaster. do you use/need the electronic brake a lot? i'm with Mario on this in that i don't use it enough (a handful of times a week maybe?) for it to be an issue. If the switch was recessed (as it on some other cars - audi?) there is no danger of accidental operation. The point is that if you stop at (say) traffic lights etc you have to either hold your foot on the brake, due to PDK creep (wears the clutch, sloppy and blinds the guy behind in the dark) or slip into neutral and apply the handbrake (and don't mention auto-stop/start!). I prefer to slip into neutral (pull both paddles). So I'd like either a conventional handbrake - or at very least a switch in a sensible position. Switchgear positioning is pretty poor on the 981 - and this is the worst example.

Not an owner, but I have driven a few manual 718 Boxsters and Caymans now. Only PDK for the S. On the road, it's about as good a manual shift as I've ever experienced in a mid engine car. I also find the ratios to be really well chosen. Taller than you'd expect, but there's so much torque for the weight of the car that a 70 mph plus second gear is great when you get used to it. The funny thing is that much though I like the manual, the ratios are really inconvenient on the slower of the two handling circuits at the PEC. Loads of second gear corners, but at least one straight where you just want to be slipping into 3rd, but for not very long. I'm getting a manual because I prefer it, but if I was driving at the PEC regularly it would have to be PDK. I tend to drive more within my limits on the road, so a manual is more engaging and suits me better. Liam

I agree the electronic handbrake is in an awkward position and doesn't really work that well - the one on my Golf R is in the centre console just behind the gearlever, recessed so not accidental catching and works really well - given the VW and Porsche are part of the same empire it is slighly irritating that my £30k Golf works better in this respect than my £50k Porsche ! Having said that you get used to it but it is still not very intuitive

LiamH66 said: Not an owner, but I have driven a few manual 718 Boxsters and Caymans now. Only PDK for the S. On the road, it's about as good a manual shift as I've ever experienced in a mid engine car. I also find the ratios to be really well chosen. Taller than you'd expect, but there's so much torque for the weight of the car that a 70 mph plus second gear is great when you get used to it. The funny thing is that much though I like the manual, the ratios are really inconvenient on the slower of the two handling circuits at the PEC. Loads of second gear corners, but at least one straight where you just want to be slipping into 3rd, but for not very long. I'm getting a manual because I prefer it, but if I was driving at the PEC regularly it would have to be PDK. I tend to drive more within my limits on the road, so a manual is more engaging and suits me better. Liam Interesting you mention PEC, that was where my choice of PDK was cemented for my 981 BGTS. In the manual car, I'd only get to spend a couple of seconds in 3rd every lap (on either track), in the PDK it was significantly more. Given that the original track at PEC is supposed to mimic a fun B-road, it did a good job of highlighting the manual's long ratio problem

bcr5784 said: If the switch was recessed (as it on some other cars - audi?) there is no danger of accidental operation. The point is that if you stop at (say) traffic lights etc you have to either hold your foot on the brake, due to PDK creep (wears the clutch, sloppy and blinds the guy behind in the dark) or slip into neutral and apply the handbrake (and don't mention auto-stop/start!). I prefer to slip into neutral (pull both paddles). So I'd like either a conventional handbrake - or at very least a switch in a sensible position. Switchgear positioning is pretty poor on the 981 - and this is the worst example. The handbrake switch is definitely a stretch so a bit of a pain in the arse. In my Audi it was a much smaller switch in the centre console...but that caused my strange paranoia - kinda like a big red button that says, "Don't press this button" making you want to do exactly that. I was petrified of giving in to the devil on my shoulder and flicking the switch whilst driving, just to see what happened. (Yes, I am fully aware that sounds mental...!!). I cannot think of a reason why the electronic parking brake on ANY car, is not just disabled once you go over (say) 5mph. That way it could be anywhere and the risk of accidental (or mildly psychotic) operation, is not an issue. You could drive along flicking your switch as often as you like!

PhantomPH said: I cannot think of a reason why the electronic parking brake on ANY car, is not just disabled once you go over (say) 5mph. That way it could be anywhere and the risk of accidental (or mildly psychotic) operation, is not an issue. You could drive along flicking your switch as often as you like! On the Porsche if you pull and hold the switch all 4 brakes are applied and (at speed) the car does an emergency stop all on its own, so to speak. Not sure whether that will reassure you in case your brake pedal breaks or give you more cause for paranoia. Would never have guessed had it not been demonstrated at the PEC. I haven't seen it in the manual.

bcr5784 said: PhantomPH said: I cannot think of a reason why the electronic parking brake on ANY car, is not just disabled once you go over (say) 5mph. That way it could be anywhere and the risk of accidental (or mildly psychotic) operation, is not an issue. You could drive along flicking your switch as often as you like! On the Porsche if you pull and hold the switch all 4 brakes are applied and (at speed) the car does an emergency stop all on its own, so to speak. Not sure whether that will reassure you in case your brake pedal breaks or give you more cause for paranoia. Would never have guessed had it not been demonstrated at the PEC. I haven't seen it in the manual. So not a complete locking of the wheels but more a controlled stop? 'Paranoia' is perhaps the wrong word....it's that part of the brain that is the devil on your shoulder. As I said, the bit that makes you push a button labelled, "Do not push". That bit of you that stands at the edge of a tall building and thinks, "Wonder what would happen if I jumped?"...just me?? Oh....ok....

PhantomPH said: So not a complete locking of the wheels but more a controlled stop? 'Paranoia' is perhaps the wrong word....it's that part of the brain that is the devil on your shoulder. As I said, the bit that makes you push a button labelled, "Do not push". That bit of you that stands at the edge of a tall building and thinks, "Wonder what would happen if I jumped?"...just me?? Oh....ok.... Controlled yes - ABS is active so it's a balls out stop.

yeah ... but ... no but yeah how the heck are we supposed to pull off handbrake turns with this electronic malarkey

bcr5784 said: Controlled yes - ABS is active so it's a balls out stop. And a balls out stop in a Cayman is pretty impressive, especially with the carbon brakes. I was stunned doing emergency stops from 80mph at the PEC last visit. Would feel very weird ding that with the handbrake button.

Regarding Tim Bo's comment on 2nd to 5th and vice versa in manual. I never thought about this point during my cayman s test drive with the pdk. What i found was my fingers of both hands were very busy all the time， much more frequent gear change than I would have with the manual （though the latter requires left leg &shoulder muscles）. Now trying to recall the rapid shifts from 6-5-4-3-2 ，was so frantically busy with my fingers i didnt take note if there were a total of 5 autoblips， or 5 consecutive exhaust pops（？） on the same matter. Suspect that might become quite annoying after a while. Can this be one of the factors making the manual more enjoyable？Achieving one satisfying heel toe from 5th to 2 with a single nice blip & pop rather then 5- 4（rummm～crackle）-3（rummm～crackle）-2（rummm～crackle）！！！Or it is the other way round a more exciting experience？！

Bubbledragon said: Regarding Tim Bo's comment on 2nd to 5th and vice versa in manual. I never thought about this point during my cayman s test drive with the pdk. What i found was my fingers of both hands were very busy all the time? much more frequent gear change than I would have with the manual ?though the latter requires left leg &shoulder muscles?. Now trying to recall the rapid shifts from 6-5-4-3-2 ?was so frantically busy with my fingers i didnt take note if there were a total of 5 autoblips? or 5 consecutive exhaust pops??? on the same matter. Suspect that might become quite annoying after a while. Can this be one of the factors making the manual more enjoyable?Achieving one satisfying heel toe from 5th to 2 with a single nice blip & pop rather then 5- 4?rummm?crackle?-3?rummm?crackle?-2?rummm?crackle????Or it is the other way round a more exciting experience?? I suspect that to those of us brought up on motobikes - which all have sequential boxes - it's perfectly natural to shift down through all the gears - and they do actually all engage on the way down. And I do agree that I do change gear a lot more with PDK than I would with a manual, but actually I enjoy that - because it's so quick and smooth I can change gear in places where I simply couldn't (or couldn't smoothly) with a manual box. Depending on your perspective you can view the differences as a negative or positive. I like both manual and PDK, but don't drive them in the same way.

ok....well I have a 718 Manual and I don't have any complaints at all -but some of these questions re manuals really go to the bottom of how you like to drive. if you do track days - get a pdk if you like to feel more involved with driving a car - get a manual. if you just want to talk about how wonderful the pdk is and launch control is .....get the pdk. if you just want a sporty automatic - get a pdk. times change, you cannot drive fast on the road without risking prison and just not worth the effort. Changing gear is one of the last pleasures left in driving a car ! ..and as for Lag , well i reckon that will be worse in the PDK as I can just drive round it.

markst said: ..and as for Lag , well i reckon that will be worse in the PDK as I can just drive round it. Yes you can drive around it - but PDK can do it far easier - either select Sport+ (revs never drop below 3500 once on the go, so no lag for practical purposes) or drive Pdk manually and use the fact that PDK changes gear much quicker than anyone (however good) can. I really don't want to start the PDK vs manual argument again (I like both) but I do think that many "manual" afficionados assume those who choose PDK are all the same and choose PDK because they are "automatics" when actually some of us couldn't care less whether PDK had an automatic mode at all. Clearly not all manual owners are the same either and some actually like auto blippers (can you believe it!), when others want it precisely because they want to heel and toe.

I contributed earlier but I've just had a 718 2.0 manual for the day while mine is at the opc and I wanted to say that the manual suits the engine very well since the power band is now much shorter than the 981. You are changing gear more often, potentially 15mph taken off 3rd since there is little point redlining it. There is some lag but keep the revs higher and it's not a problem, I would spec manual on the 718. I really enjoyed driving it, I thought the lack of noise/drama may disappoint and it did to begin with but the flat 4 begins to grow on you particularly at low rpm when it starts to show some character. Potentially handles a little better but difficult to tell at the moment, the steering has been improved, it wasn't bad in the 981 but you get more feel again and I like the new wheel with the mode dial, new pcm is better too but other than that it's business as usual. Economy wasn't really any better than my 981 S on the test route though! Definitely a good car and nice to see the manual making a comeback.

bcr5784 said: Yes you can drive around it - but PDK can do it far easier - either select Sport+ (revs never drop below 3500 once on the go, so no lag for practical purposes) or drive Pdk manually and use the fact that PDK changes gear much quicker than anyone (however good) can. I really don't want to start the PDK vs manual argument again (I like both) but I do think that many "manual" afficionados assume those who choose PDK are all the same and choose PDK because they are "automatics" when actually some of us couldn't care less whether PDK had an automatic mode at all. Clearly not all manual owners are the same either and some actually like auto blippers (can you believe it!), when others want it precisely because they want to heel and toe. I quite agree - for when I did the Porsche experience day I was really impressed with the pdk and it was certainly easier to drive .....my dealer was even checking to see if I could change my spec....lol but in the end I'm happy with my manual. Which is just as well as I gather there is a real shortage of supply at the moment . lovely car, and will certainly have another (unless a manual Dino is released and then I will order one of those). just wish I had more time to drive it

I will never buy into smaller capacity turbo engines. They are just fuel consumption BS. Or EV's. Not interested. Buy what makes you smile

I bought a 718s manual as a second car and enjoy the engagement of a manual box.... Every car nowdays is auto/pdk of somekind. Can't beat a bit of old school. It's alittle jekry in 1st gear when pulling off though.. So if you are mainly stop/start city driving get a PDK....

1rup said: I bought a 718s manual as a second car and enjoy the engagement of a manual box.... Every car nowdays is auto/pdk of somekind. Can't beat a bit of old school. It's alittle jekry in 1st gear when pulling off though.. So if you are mainly stop/start city driving get a PDK.... Have you really joined PH to say to people 'buy the best car for your own personal use/preference'??? You'll never last. Found the more annoying aspect of my manual 981 was it's discomfort in slow/stop-start traffic. I did exactly as you said tho - went PDK after that and I find that what I lost in 'right place, right time' engagement, I more than made up for in liveability - especially since I like to use mine pretty much as a daily during the drier weather. For the record, I also took my 718S PDK on track when I had it and I did not long for the manual at all. Frankly it was one less thing to worry about when sharing a track with lots of Fiestas being driven on their door handles.

The easy answer is; if you like manuals, you will love the cayman. Their manual boxes are sublime.

SRT Hellcat said: I will never buy into smaller capacity turbo engines. They are just fuel consumption BS. Or EV's. Not interested. Buy what makes you smile As the owner of a 5.5 litre V8 SLK55, I'm certainly enjoying the 1.6 turbo triple in my GR Yaris...the lightness vs power of the little engine is something to behold, plus I can get 300hp plus with a couple of hundred quid performance box. On the Cayster manual thing, I had extended test drives of both a 2.7 litre 981 and 2.0 turbo 718 Boxster, and found the manual was much more suited to the engine in the 718. One thing I did dislike however was I felt that the clutch pedal was set too high which caused me to end up with an aching ankle and it also made for jerky take offs in first, that applied to both cars.

Holgate86 said: SRT Hellcat said: I will never buy into smaller capacity turbo engines. They are just fuel consumption BS. Or EV's. Not interested. Buy what makes you smile As the owner of a 5.5 litre V8 SLK55, I'm certainly enjoying the 1.6 turbo triple in my GR Yaris...the lightness vs power of the little engine is something to behold, plus I can get 300hp plus with a couple of hundred quid performance box. On the Cayster manual thing, I had extended test drives of both a 2.7 litre 981 and 2.0 turbo 718 Boxster, and found the manual was much more suited to the engine in the 718. One thing I did dislike however was I felt that the clutch pedal was set too high which caused me to end up with an aching ankle and it also made for jerky take offs in first, that applied to both cars. Yep - that's something that catches everyone out I think. I remember first time sitting in my 981 moving my left foot and bashing off what I thought was the central bulkhead/console and it was actually the right-hand side of the clutch pedal. You get used to it, tho. It's quite a firm pedal action as well, if I recall. You have to put a bit of a shove into pushing it down.