HUGE BRAKE PROBLEM NEED HELP ASAP, fluids leaking!

HUGE BRAKE and TRANSMISSION PROBLEM NEED HELP ASAP, fluids leaking! The brake piston on my left rear caliper came completely out and now brake fluid is leaking everywhere. (being caught in a container now). I've tried to put the piston back in the lower right section of the caliper but it's not working. Please help. What should I do? I'm freaking out. Piston that came out: Another shot: UPDATE: Hey guys, just got back from the dealer. OK in a nut shell they called me in to discuss several issues with my car They said: 1. I need to replace BOTH rear calipers because the rear left was damaged. They said that you cannot just replace one, you need to replace both because they work in conjuntion with one another. Huhhh???? They said the damage was due to all the dust seals on the rear left caliper were broken. Incorrect. I inspected the caliper myself and only the rubber boot which the piston popped out of is torn. Does this make any sense!?! Replace both of the calipers?? Sounds like a bunch of hot air to me to get some extra $$$. I plan on getting the caliper repair kit and simply installing a new rubber dust seal. Putting the piston back in was actually very easy. I just took the rubber seal out of the caliper, put it on the piston, then re-inserted the two as one piece back in the caliper. 2. The Oil leak! Turns out the oil was leaking out of my transmission case. One of the 20 some bolts that holds the pan in place was missing (see pic below) and all the other ones he said were "not to the torque spec." As a result this caused ATF fluid to seap out through the seal. I was honestly surprised, how in the hell could one of the bolts have come loose and then fall off? I figured over the car's 4 years and 40k miles it could be plausible. I told the guy, ok at least we found the problem and it will be fixed under warranty... NO NO NO!!! "Sir, someone tampered with your car, it is ABSOLUTELY IMPOSSIBLE for this bolt to undue itself, they are torque spec!" As a result, whatever damage is done to your tranny will NOT be under waranty "somebody must have loosened these bolts, they cannot come loose by themselves" I was shocked I wanted to faint. I could see the bill in the mail for $10,000.00 for a new transmission. I will make this clear. NO BODY has touched my transmission EVER. The only shop that I've taken this car to besides Porsche was a Mr.Tire to get a tire change. All other work such as brake pads and rotors were performed by myself. I have changed my motor oil numerous times but have not touched the transmission. The service rep, tells me, " I don't know what happened to your car, you and I will never know. But somebody loosened these bolts and caused this damage." I thought to myself, hey bud! Do you think just maybe they loosened themselves!!!! Admit that it's possible, because quite frankly everything is, nothing is impossible. It would be like Toyota saying that these broken accelerators are impossible because they made a perfect car and nothing can go wrong with it. He says because he's never seen a problem like this in all his years it can't be possible. He says he wants to help me out (as he chuckles) but I know deep down he's out to screw me out of my warranty and money. This should be covered under warranty, nothing I did caused this error, and I'm really pissed off. The dealer is calling me back tomorrow to price everything out. How many thousands shall we guess??? Please help guys :helpme: I mean is my argument not valid? Picture of Tiptronic transmission taken from the articles section to show where the many bolts go in place.. This is not mine.

Stepped on the brake pedal while the caliper was off eh? That's a tough one. Might be new caliper time. Maybe the dealer or a brake shop could get it back together.

Yes, unfortunately. Was trying to get the pistons to come out a little. Does one think I should call Porsche roadside tomorrow and have them tow the car to the dealer? I already have an appointment with them on Monday for oil leaking out of the engine Things are not good.

Are you sure that isn't just the brake damper pad? Front Brake Pad Damper:Suncoast Automotive Porsche, Audi, & VW The "pistons" in our brakes are hollow. Now the leaking fluid is a whole other issue. Where is it seeping out of, the piston surround?

Humm, the more I look at the photo, I doubt it is the damper pad. My guess now is that the excess travel of the piston without a pad in place tore the rubber gasket in the caliper.

The brake fluid I presume (clear-ish fluid) is coming out of the hole where the caliper piston came out. The more I'm thinking about this the more I'm realizing I'm going to need a new caliper. At least it's the rear (smaller), so it will be cheaper... That is about the only light I can bring out of this situation. Somebody start throwing brake caliper prices at me :wall: According to Suncoast's brake upgrade kit http://www.suncoastparts.com/product/996BrakeKit.html?Category_Code=caymanSbrakes (assuming you get 4 new brakes) I'm estimating around $300 per caliper, I can digest that price. Just nothing over $500, or I'll faint.

Strange that it would fall out like that, I did that same "not-so-smart" move on my previous car, but the piston did not fall out, just popped and took like 2 hours to get in place. I do hope you get things going quickly, and what's with the engine oil problem?!

Normally the pistons when unostructed just come up to the lip, however a little more pressure behind them and they will pop out. I would think that there should be a caliper repair kit and couldn't imagine a new caliper is required....of course I could be wrong, but the cosntruction is relatively simple so can't imagine Porsche don't recommend repairing them. A seal kit may be all you need, but maybe not even that. It will need some pressure but should go back in IMO.

Getting the piston back in is one issue, but letting all the DOT 4 run dry is another.....ishh. Try to close off the system to prevent it running dry, if it does then the dealership will add even more $$. At this point you are looking at a rebuild of the caliper minimum, and new caliper bolts and cleaning up the dot 4, hope the pads didn't get wet. I can not suggest that you do anything other than take it to the dealership.

I don't think you will need to replace the entire caliper. I can't see clearly enough, but the picture could be the piston with the damper still installed and the first picture looks to me like an empty dust cover. Attached is a picture of a representative Brembo piston replacement kit so you can see the components. If you have pushed the piston out past the seal, then major leaking as described will happen.

Thank you all for the responses guys. I am having a mechanic come over later to put the piston back in. I'd say about 1/4 of a cup of brake fluid came out in total. As for my engine, it's been leaking oil for quite some time I presume. It came to my attention when I did my APE exhaust install. After reading here, I suspect RMS failure. We'll see on Monday/ later this coming week. Kenkg, there wasn't an attached photo in your post. Real quick, I know I need DOT-4 brake fluid. There is factory and Pentosin. I doubt Salvo Auto Parts will have the factory fluid. So I will go with Pentosin Racing Brake Fluid. Objections?

If you're replacing it the go for the high temp fluid like Motul ....just IMO of course.... :cheers:

I've taken the pistons out of a couple of calipers in the past. I had to put a set back in at the track once due to an overly helpul friend while changing the pads and bleading the brakes. First clean the area with brake cleaner . You do NOT want any dirt in the bore. Rebuild kits are available for most calipers. The trick to getting the piston back in is making sure the piston is normal to the caliper body. As you insert the piston use a slight rotation of the piston as you guide it in. Don't force it in. The piston should be lubed either with fluid or the rebuild kit may have a small lube packet with the new O rings and dust boots. A note on removing pistons with an air gun: put a small piece of a 2x4 or 1x4 cut to a size to fit the caliper and let the piston hit the soft wood. You don't want to let it hit the other side of the caliper.

ACH!! Probably operator error. My screen says an attachment is on this one. Good luck, but I'll bet the oil leak is harder to remedy.

You're onthe right track - just replace/re-use this piston via a seal kit. If the tech is qualified and careful, it'll be good as new. This happens sometimes on race cars, if the driver touches the pedal during a pad change sometimes pistons are flying around like hot potatoes. Not what you want to happen during a race. You do Not need a new caliper.

I'm sorry, but a I have dumb question. I've never see a caliper taken apart so bear with me. What is actually pushing the pistons out? Is it in direct contact with fluid in the caliper or is there a bladder behind there that pushes on the piston? If there is nothing behind the piston besides fluid, if it pops out, I assume all the brake fluid in the caliper would leak out and there'll be no more pressure in the entire system.

This happned to me once on a domestic. I was afraid that I tore the seal but that was not the case. I used a "C" clamp to slowly drive the piston back into the cyclinder. As already mentioned you need to follow-up with at least a bleed if not a complete flush (recommended) as your hygroscopic brake fluid has been ingesting moisture the entire time it has been exposed to air. Good luck. Probably not a big deal. It wasn't for me, just a PITA.

it's just fluid in the back pushing out the pistons. The brake system is not pressured, and only the lines are pressurized when you put your foot on the brake. So, fluid that seeps (per Golf's pictures) comes out will primarily come from gravity. BTW OP - hope you have rinsed the caliper with plenty of water... that brake fluid will eat your paint. BTW, brake fluid is a little slippery - almost dish soap like consistency. Have fun rebuilding the caliper. It's not too, too bad. I had rebuilt a pair of Boxster brakes to put on my A4. Good learning experience.

Pete, Simple hydraulics. Example: Divide the cross section area of the brake line into the cross secton area of the brake piston. Then multiply that number times the line psi. If you have 4 pistons multiply by 4. This is why single pistom floating calipers have larger pistons, no multiplier. Sent from my Droid using Tapatalk

Uhh...kinda sorta. The line diameter has essentially no effect on pressure or force - so one can just divide line PSI by caliper piston area to get force.

Thanks for the correction

What's the update Chad? I hope it's a quick/cheap fix! -Moto

Hey guys, just got back from the dealer. OK in a nut shell they called me in to discuss several issues with my car They said: 1. I need to replace BOTH rear calipers because the rear left was damaged. They said that you cannot just replace one, you need to replace both because they work in conjuntion with one another. Huhhh???? They said the damage was due to all the dust seals on the rear left caliper were broken. Incorrect. I inspected the caliper myself and only the rubber boot which the piston popped out of is torn. Does this make any sense!?! Replace both of the calipers?? Sounds like a bunch of hot air to me to get some extra $$$. I plan on getting the caliper repair kit and simply installing a new rubber dust seal. Putting the piston back in was actually very easy. I just took the rubber seal out of the caliper, put it on the piston, then re-inserted the two as one piece back in the caliper. 2. The Oil leak! Turns out the oil was leaking out of my transmission case. One of the 20 some bolts that holds the pan in place was missing (see pic below) and all the other ones he said were "not to the torque spec." As a result this caused ATF fluid to seap out through the seal. I was honestly surprised, how in the hell could one of the bolts have come loose and then fall off? I figured over the car's 4 years and 40k miles it could be plausible. I told the guy, ok at least we found the problem and it will be fixed under warranty... NO NO NO!!! "Sir, someone tampered with your car, it is ABSOLUTELY IMPOSSIBLE for this bolt to undue itself, they are torque spec!" As a result, whatever damage is done to your tranny will NOT be under waranty "somebody must have loosened these bolts, they cannot come loose by themselves" I was shocked I wanted to faint. I could see the bill in the mail for $10,000.00 for a new transmission. I will make this clear. NO BODY has touched my transmission EVER. The only shop that I've taken this car to besides Porsche was a Mr.Tire to get a tire change. All other work such as brake pads and rotors were performed by myself. I have changed my motor oil numerous times but have not touched the transmission. The service rep, tells me, " I don't know what happened to your car, you and I will never know. But somebody loosened these bolts and caused this damage." I thought to myself, hey bud! Do you think just maybe they loosened themselves!!!! Admit that it's possible, because quite frankly everything is, nothing is impossible. It would be like Toyota saying that these broken accelerators are impossible because they made a perfect car and nothing can go wrong with it. Just because you can't replicate a problem, it doesn't mean it never occurred. He says because he's never seen a problem like this in all his years it can't be possible. He says he wants to help me out (as he chuckles) but I know deep down he's out to screw me out of my warranty and money. This should be covered under warranty, nothing I did caused this error, and I'm really pissed off. The dealer is calling me back tomorrow to price everything out. How many thousands shall we guess??? Please help guys :helpme: Picture of Tiptronic transmission taken from the articles section to show where the many bolts go in place. This is not mine.

In these tough times it seems that dealers find new ways to make money in some instances. 1) You don't need to replace calipers in pairs, get the repair kit and do it yourself and you'll be fine. 2) If the bolt was loose or missing they should have replaced it, did you authorize them to take down your tranny pan??? This should be a no charge item to you other than the cost of the bolt that was missing and some labor to install it, but not removing a bunch of other stuff that wasn't necessary and a fluid refill. Have the 1-800 number handy for Porsche customer service and let them know you aren't pleased. (assuming you never touched your tranny of course and why would you?)

I agree with K-Man S - you definitely don't need two new calipers - or even one. Just rebuild the one. Disappointed they are so money-hungry. Sure, it's easy to say "you need two - we're conservative" - but then, I could say you may as well replace the whole car, just to be safe, you know.. As for the transmission - I must admit, my gut reaction was that someone had indeed removed the pan at some point. But, if I understand correctly - that you bought this car new, and you know it hasn't been touched - well, unless Porsche messed with it before delivery or something, then it sure appears something went wrong. Unless a gasket, say, broke down and collapsed, which could cause the bolts to lose tension - it is difficult to imagine them loosening on there own. But then, this is not Porsche's first rodeo - so I'm sure the seal/gasket design is just fine. You don't mention if the car had any tranny symptoms. If not, I'd have them button it up, fill with fluid, and be on my way - using K-Man S' points that you never asked them to tear in. Good luck.

some shops wont repair/rebuild a brake part if 5 years or older [eg replace leaking wheel cylinders rather than rebuild] as far as the missing bolt...is it possible some one mistook them for motor oil drain then retightened....i mean to say we err sometimes when we are working on something new....i vote changing both calip.

Thank you Ken. The dealer did not take down my transmission pan (to my knowledge). Only visual inspection was done to survey the damage (to my knowledge). So you suggest that I call Porsche Customer Service and explain to them my scenario to get some higher power over the dealer?

Hello Geff G, Thank you for all your advice and help so far. The transmission has no symptoms of problems, no grinding noises or anything that would make you think it has a problem. Every now and then I get an abrupt jolt when downshifting from 5th to 4th gear. I think I just need new transmission oil to smooth out the solenoids that engage the shift. My car was bought CPO with around 12k miles on it.

I would be yelling and screaming in the general manager's office. The competency of the service rep that told you that you need to replace both calipers is in question. On the tranny, it is your word against theirs, but why would anyone loosen bolts??? It is time to be the squeaky wheel. Be willing to make yourself a PITA. Think of it this way: What hourly rate will you pay yourself for whatever you get??

About the transmission problem, I had this EXACT same problem last summer, and in my case too a bolt came loose COMPLETELY ON ITS OWN. Like you, the only place other than the dealer and me that touches my car is the tire shop. But in my case they replaced the screw and then the whole oil pan under warranty and said it is just a precaution! This is the link to the thread I made last summer when I had this problem. Perhaps you can use this as proof that this sort of thing does happen. The guys at the dealer said this could be due to extensive vibrations from road bumps! Please let us know how this goes!

As has been stated you don't need two calipers. If it makes you feel better rebuild both rears. Maintain a professional attitude with the service rep and the dealer. If this doesn't go the way you want contact PCNA and get the regional rep involved. You might want to take advantage of the information in post 33. This is one of the reasons I now have my service and oil changes done at the dealership. I helps building the relationship. Also, in my case, I really like my local dealers service department.

Perfect! This is exactly what I need. I'm going to print your thread out and shove it in their face and say "Impossible? Perhaps unlikely, but still possible." Thank you all for the advice and help. I'll report back tomorrow after the showdown.

Hello Chad, Be sure to open the bleeder valve when reinserting the piston. There have been times when I've found myself fighting the compressed air until I'd open the bleeder. Regards, Joe

Regarding the caliper. Remove the disc, remove the caliper and take one of the rubber bleeder valve covers and put it on the brake line where you disconnected from the caliper to stop further fluid loss (if theres any left ). Clean the caliper the best you can with brake cleaner . Blow it dry with compressed air. Carefully inspect the dislodged piston and the bore it came from then reassemble with a new dust cover applying even and gentle force to reseat it until it is as flush as possible with the inside wall of the caliper. Repeat with the other three pistons in the same careful way. Reinstall the caliper and disc, clean the disc and caliper again with brake cleaner . Install your brake pads exactly as they came out or replace with new in both rear wheels. Bleed your brakes. Fix your tranny leak and enjoy your car again. Have fun with your car. PM me with any questions. Oh and pump your brakes gently a few times before you drive it. Use caution as the pads will have to be reseated for a few miles..

Hey guys. Ok my ASE certified mechanic and I talked with the dealer today. 1. The reason why I need two new calipers according to the dealer is because they don't want me to have one new rear caliper and one with 4yrs/40k miles. They don't want old and new calipers in conjunction basically. Since there is a rear brake control unit, a front one and one to monitors front and back, they said it's not necessary to replace the fronts because of this. Since there is a rear brake control unit, they want the components of this unit (the calipers) to both be new. 2. The oil leak. After much deliberation I am glad we have come to some terms with this. He finally understands that this could be due to a non-sabotaging reason i.e. car vibrations. Some important person is coming to the dealer on Wednesday to have a look at the problem and make a decision as to what the final problem is and what will be done with warranty 3. I have the option to deny the dealers advice regarding the caliper replacement. I will have to sign some wavier though saying that I am neglecting the service advice and will be driving away with bad brakes. I had to do this for my seatbelt warning light so I could install my GT3 seats when they disabled the warning when the seatbelt is not clicked and the car is in motion. THE PRICE :dance: *1.0 service hour = $115 2 Rear Brake Calipers: $587 x 2 = $1,174 + 3.0 Service Hours ($345) =$1,519 1 Brake Pad Sensors: $60 + 1.5 Service hours ($172.5) = $232.50 2 Quarts of Brake Fluid: $70 1 Brake Flush: 1.0 Service Hour $115 1 40,000mi Service: $875 (flat rate) 1 Front brake pads: $210 + 1.5 Service Hours ($172.5) = $382.5 Total (so far): $3,193.50 Transmission: 1 Trans pan gasket: $40 6 Quarts of ATF: $150 22 Bolts for Transmission pan: $150 4 Service Hours: $460 Total: $800 Grand Total/ Worst case scenario (I do everything they say): $3,993.50 Oh almost forgot, can someone reference me a good caliper repair kit website? I found this but have never heard of the company before... http://www.autopartswarehouse.com/s.../6_Cyl_3-dot-4L/CE143-dot-37009.html?loc=Rear&tlc=Brakes,+Suspension+&+Steering A link to a Caliper Repair kit for a 2006 Cayman S 3.4L would be GREATLY appreciated.