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YOUR RESEARCHSkunk Works 964 "RS-4" project
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most comfortable car seat i've ever used
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Don't know what the recaros are like, but when this evo2 was in my car it was the most comfortable car seat I've ever used...
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Performed · outcome unconfirmed · Original poster
Most parts have arrived and are being trial-fitted before the car goes to paint.
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Performed · outcome unconfirmed · Original poster
Engine soundproofing is being replaced rather than removed.
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Performed · outcome unconfirmed · Original poster
The cams also showed signs of wear but are being replaced with billet ones anyway.
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Suggestion · Original poster
Inspiration is taken from the 73 RS, 964 RS & C4 LWT, even the 918 Spyder, while keeping the clean lines of the 964.
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Hi all,
You may have read in the intro thread that I recently acquired a 964 C4. I had been looking, unsuccessfully, for a C2 when this one popped up. Having done a lot of reading and talking to some very knowledgeable people I’m confident that the 2 main gripes people have with the C4, i.e. understeer and extra weight, can be ironed out fairly easily with nice suspension and a diet respectively. Given it will be a street car, the extra grip the C4 offers will be welcome.
The skunk works at Autohaus Hamilton have been entrusted to tackle the majority of the work. We have taken some ideas from their Group 4 car, as well as the C2 RS and C4 Lightweight, tweaked them and added plenty of our own.
Here is a summary:
Mechanical
Engine blueprinted and balanced
Custom grind Elgin cams
Titanium valve springs and retainers
Ported heads
ECU retune, MAF,
Motec M84 ECU
ARP rod bolts
993 head studs
Heavy duty clutch
RS flywheel
Semi-solid engine and trans mounts
Fabspeed RSR headers and muffler
Billet rocker covers
GT3 oil pump
Carbon RS heater pipe
Fuel pump
993 RS valves
Mahle high compression, moly-coated pistons
Rothsport (Jenvey) ITBs and plenum
Suspension & Brakes
Bilstein PSS10 coil overs and rear strut tops
Wheel alignment, corner balance and set ride heights
993 Turbo “Big red” brakes, braided lines
Brembo 355mm & 328mm brakes with 2 piece rotors
Braided lines
993 steering rack brace
18” Victor equipment - Zehn 18x8 ET45 and 18x9.5 ET49
Pirelli P-Zero tyres 225/40/18 and 265/35/18
Panel Work/Exterior
993 Cup mirrors
Rolled guards
Respray (997 GT3 RS grey-black)
Ducktail
Ducktail grille
3.6 grille badge
Engine lid hinge adaptors
Replace all rubbers and seals
Clear indicator lenses (front bar)
Brake ducts (front bar)
Side indicator delete
New tail lights
Rear reflector delete
Headlight washers deleted
New headlight lenses and HID upgrade
New rear bumper for dual exhaust
New windscreen
Interior
½ cage
Recaro pole position
Sparco Evo
seats
Momo Prototipo
Sparco R-345
steering wheel
Rennline quick release
Wevo shift coupler
RS door trims
RS carpet
Dash, knee pads, door tops and centre console retrimmed in alcantara
Rennline billet gear knob & door locks
Leather gearshift boot
Carbon fibre console inserts
New sun visors
New headlining
Rennline pedal pads
Rennline floor boards
Schroth 6 point harnesses
New seat belts
Extinguisher
Remove soundproofing
VDO headunit (CD9303UB)
Miscellaneous
Oil hoses
Diff seals
Steering rack boots
Drive shafts
Drive shaft boots
Engine soundproofing
Overhaul air-con
New alternator
Alarm and 3 point immobiliser
And a few (i.e. many!) other bits and pieces
My impression of how it will look, minus the ducky and a few other 918 inspired touches. Pics to follow.
nice list.
I'm not sure what "sport camshaft" means or "sport valve springs" but i do suggest getting your head worked to accommodate the camshafts with at least port work. or better, larger valves. Went through the same deal with my head.
Make sure you have an idea where you want your power band too. with a camshaft expect it to move right a bit so you'll loose some bottom end torque.
"almost"? ummmm, something like that
loads of progress shots to follow
Yes head work has been taken into consideration, as has the power band. It will be a nice "streetable" engine with broard torque curve. Not chasing absolute power.
Ducktail. Are we talking RS seventies ducktail? Liking it already. Autohaus will do a good job.
Re your 'almost' comment, I think we can safely say this project is 'almost an investment' (in the soul).
Sounds like a modern day RS 'interpretation'. Lots of tasty things on that spec list I love. I can only assume that your reference to engine soundproofing is 'removal' !
The only option now is to amend your log in name to skunkworks964.
I am salivating at the prospect of this build. Bring it on.
Yep the seventies ducktail. Inspiration is taken from the 73 RS, 964 RS & C4 LWT, even the 918 Spyder, while keeping the clean lines of the 964. Lines that I consider the last of the classic 911s.
Engine soundproofing is being replaced rather than removed. The engine mounts will amplify the noise a bit so I didn't want it to be too over the top.
And "almost"...yea well you onliy live once.
That's what we're thinking. Should be fun given we'll be able to pull a few kg out of the car.
As promised, some pics of the donor car which is, as you can see, a rather clean and very straight example. One could be happy cruising around in as is, albeit with the various leaks etc fixed. However we have other plans
It should be stripped within a couple of weeks. Excess parts (seats, wheels etc) will be sold off so let me know if you want to dibs anything.
And here is the first draft artist's impression. There are a few tweaks ie clear indicators but it is pretty close to how we envisage the end result.
We're looking at a couple of changes to the abovementioned build sheet including Brembo brakes with 2 piece rotors and a Motec computer for more precise tuning and allow us to de-clutter the engine bay even more.
So is the car with the reddish interior the one that you will end up driving or is that the one you are using to strip the mechanicals out of to install into the other chassis?
I only have the one car. It's the one with the burgundy interior.
By other chassis I assume you mean the shell in the background which is another customers car. From memory it's a 930 being backdated to 73 RSR look.
Getting close to finalising the colour scheme
Oh and the Recaro seats have been ditched in favour of Sparco Evos, as has the Prototipo steering wheel.
Miura Green for the highlights (cage, calipers, interior stitching).
Grigio Telesto (aka Battleship grey) for the body, albeit a shade darker.
And these are the brakes I mentioned yesterday. Still to be confirmed.
I'm sitting in a sparco evo right now (home-made office-chair). Don't know what the recaros are like, but when this evo2 was in my car it was the most comfortable car seat I've ever used...
If you haven't picked your colour, this non metallic looks the business:
http://m.rennlist.com/rennforums/attachment.php?attachmentid=790060&stc=1&d=1387838001
http://m.rennlist.com/rennforums/attachment.php?attachmentid=790061&stc=1&d=1387838001
The more I hear about this skunkworks the more I like. You will need to have a serious skunk house look at the exhaust, no use having a bad arse machine the sounds like it couldn't pull the skin off a rice pudding. You need something with serious intent emanating from the pipes.
I am also on the lookout for a fantastic solid grey and agree that Lamborghini have the best greys. Grigio telsto is 'stealth grey' from the superlegera. Apparently it changes quite a bit in different light shades. It is my favourite grey non metallic but I just can't bring myself to spend that much money and paint in a non period porsche colour. In a skunkworks car I say anything goes.
Your other option of course would be that grey with the orange interior / highlights we could have twins!
Ps how are you doing those cool sketch ups ? Is it an auto haus tool or is there a cool ap that can do that? I could spend hours playing with concepts.
Thanks Tit. Me likey.
Like the lambo it almost looks blue in the second shot
550 - any pics of your 964?
I had originally thought about orange but it's been done.
The Fabspeed RSR system we've chosen will sound the business without being too over the top (street car remember) and half the price of a full custom jobbie
Autohaus are doing the sketches. If I had a tool like that I'd spend hours playing with it
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https://media.invisioncic.com/o114742/emoticons/default_biggrin.png
http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p57/JV911/cars/635.jpeg
Me too and we could get away with not painting it as it's in that good a condition
A few more from yesterday's trial fit of the wheels. Really stoked with how they look. Going to look mental with Brembos behind them
Gorgeous hips...
Not a lot to tell really. Standard C4 with 140k in rather nice condition...straight and rust free. Pretty schmik apart from a broken head stud, leaky diff seals and a few other bits and pieces. Previous owner actually bought it as a project car but bought a 993tt so had to sell.
Would you consider just leaving the standard paint, drive it for a while and see how it goes. No need to toast $15k on new paint when the donor is so good and so close to what you are changing too?
That pony would fit some nice RS cams and likely a 3.8 upgrade?
Decisions, decisions.
Better off painting it while the car is stripped, rather than having to strip it again in future at additional cost.
Also having a mate who is a painter means I'm only paying for the cost of the materials
nice- have the same exhaust on my car sans heater boxes, they sound great (you might want to fabricate a removable bung for one of the muffler outlets as it can drone on the highway)
Exhaust all ready and engine is still on stands lol what kind of build is this?
Am picturing wads of cash being chucked at this thing it's awesome lol.
Umm, thorough?
Most parts have arrived and are being trial-fitted before the car goes to paint. Good excuse to play with all the bits and pieces anyway
As for the budget, well we're not scrimping nor are we throwing great wads of cash around. If we were it would be a different beast again. Probably a wide bodied 3.8 74 Carrera 3.0 RS or RSR replica...maybe when I win lotto.
Engine has been stripped. Pics to follow.
At this rate it will be finished in a few weeks! Where did you source the fabspeed components from, locally or os? It's the next thing on my list to do.
Ask and yee shall receive
They were really happy with the condition of the pistons. The magnesium oil pump on the other hand needs replacing, so a GT3 one is going in.
Also two of the rocker arms were worn beyond the point of being resurfaced so will be replaced. The cams also showed signs of wear but are being replaced with billet ones anyway.
Sussing out larger valves and later model plastic intake manifold which flow a lot better.
Love what you are doing and where this is going.
Seeing as I don't know too much about motors.. what's the plan regarding the rebuild?
Do you replace bearings, pistons, rings, hone bore? or replace everything?
In this case we don't need to replace the pistons and/or cylinders. If one was to do so you'd probably go JE and Mahle 3.8 respectively but they're ~$5k plus there is some additional machining required.
Given the condition of the engine we can reuse the existing pistons and cylinders with new rings, springs & retainers, seals, gaskets, conrod bolts, head studs and bearings etc. Engine will also be blueprinted and balanced, receive new cams and the aforementioned rockers and oil pump. Can't recall what was said about line honing (assume it would be done) and boring and resurfacing the cylinders (don't think it's necessary unless fitting oversized pistons). Then there are all the ancillaries like dizzy caps, rotor buttons, leads etc etc. No doubt a heap of things I've missed there.
We're thinking mid August but I'll be overseas from the 10th, which means delivery in September.
At least that gives some time for a thorough shakedown
Funny you mention that! Waiting on a price on GT3 plenum and ITBs like on Sydr's car but think I might be a bit exxy.
I actually don't know the exact breakdown but a full rebuild typically runs to $23-25k depending on what can be reused and top end rebuilds approx $15k. It can vary greatly especially if you need big ticket items like pistons and cylinders ($5k)
If I had to guess, labour would be $5-8k (50-60 hours at $80-90/hour). Others on here have done their own builds so should be able to confirm what parts and machining cost.
nice try
looking at the cams he's chosen they should work fine with the stock induction (i have RS/Cup cams or something in mine).
ITB's would be nice but it's icing on the cake haha
I've just caught on to this build. I like where it's headed.
A good tip for anyone pulling down an air cooled 911 is shown in a couple of your pics. Mark your cylinders with an engraver. This way you can put them back in the same order and avoid machining to match deck heights.
And my 2 c on the colour, original grey is beautiful, but if you're going for coloured highlights then a solid or even matte grey is a winner.
Well the deed is done. Pulled the trigger on the ITBs
Considered Mahle 3.8 P&Cs too but the price was getting eye-watering.
Engine build summary:
Blueprinted and balanced
ARP rod bolts
ARP head studs
High comp 3.6L pistons
Sport cams (custom grind)
Titanium valve springs and retainers
993 RS valves
Ported heads
Rothsport ITB kit
(Jenvey ITBs)
Motec M84 ECU and Sensors
Bosch injectors
GT3 oil pump
Billet rocker covers
Any ideas for alternative reverse lights once the rear reflector is replaced/painted?
I was thinking maybe it could be rewired so that both indicators come on but open to suggestions.
You could always leave the reverse lights unpainted. I tinted my lights with some nightshade red yesterday and masked off the reverse lights for the first few coats. They look great. I'm sure I've seen the center piece painted with the reverse lights still exposed somewhere.
I might be thinking of the ruf piece but I'm sure I've seen it with the reverse lights with the reddish stock tint.
I'll be posting something up about my lights soon. I decided they were not as glossy as I would like. Just wet sanded and gave it a few more clear coats. Once they back on the car I'll make a post.
Stunner.. any before and after shots .. its so hard to tell you car is so awesome.. i ownder what would happen if i did that to my 20yr old TT paintwork
Nope but I think you'll find some on www.projectdetail.com.au
If not of my car then of others. Taking my fiancee's CX5 there this week to get the swirls out from the pre-delivery "detail".
Just received a call to say the little 964 won Best Euro at the WTAC on the weekend. Given the demographic, I would have thought the J-Racing widebody R8 or one of the Liberty Walk cars would have taken home the trophy.
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http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p57/JV911/cars/14691349_895680543896021_7231008685866877682_o.jpg
Same guys who did the Autohaus ad last year (
http://www.rayayos.com
), actually the ad will be remade with additional footage.
Not sure what the drone was but it looked $$$
A little bit late to this thread but wanted to say what an inspirational car! Love the colours, love the upgrades, love the looks. Really really love the colour choices, including the wheels.
I would love to do this but for (1) needing seats in the rear and, perhaps more pertinently, (2) not wanting to spend that much, though I recognise the quality of the final product and that it may have been a profitable project.
I look forward to the next project!
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