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YOUR RESEARCHAir Suspension kit for C4S
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good sport about the whole thing
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Talk about somebody who got flamed at the start but turned out to be a good sport about the whole thing.
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Performed · outcome unconfirmed · Original poster
it's a pneumatic air chamber fitted on top of a coilover, in this case KWV3's which allow for 75mm lift to help get over curbs, speed bumps and driveways.
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What's more valuable to OP is if the person needed to change control arms, what struts were used, is there any interference between the bag and other parts, sensor locations.
Replace other person's mind and is likely (as evidenced here)
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Getting bent out of shape about it isn't going to change the other person's mind and is likely (as evidenced here) to cause a snowball effect.
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Performed · outcome unconfirmed · Original poster
it's a pneumatic air chamber fitted on top of a coilover, in this case KWV3's which allow for 75mm lift to help get over curbs, speed bumps and driveways.
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Suggestion
What's more valuable to OP is if the person needed to change control arms, what struts were used, is there any interference between the bag and other parts, sensor locations.
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Suggestion
These same guys who vomit in their mouth at the sound of "air suspension," would lick the used underwear of a guy like Rob Dickinson, who changes practically EVERY SINGLE PART on a Porsche 911, but since the result is a purist wet dream (including mine) it's okay and you won't here a peep.
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Suggestion
My reason was to be able to run the height low for driving on most roads and for autocross, but be able to raise it for steep driveways and parking-lot entrances.
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Suggestion
My suggestions to Johnny were that he instead look at a C2 so he doesn't have to worry about AWD system and if he must use a 4S that he think about protecting the front diff.
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Hi everyone. Soon to be new owner of a 2002 C4S and I'm researching what air suspension kits are available for it. The only company I've seen is AirRex but they only show a kit for the C2. Is there a kit that's made for the C4S?
If you have to ask you wouldn't understand... but let's get real, you really don't want to know why, you're just imposing your own preferences on others.
I understand why. And because I understand why and where you are coming from, I'll give the following advice.
You are on the wrong forum. Folks round here don't take too kindly to doing something like you are planning. You're one man, and from my short time here, I know you will not get anywhere with that question and your response.
I was once in the scene you are in and I left for my reasons. And I'm telling you, from one Air suspension guy to another, don't do it to yourself. Not here, It wont end well.
There is another forum where this question would probably be greeted with less...."disdain" for lack of a better word. Just PM me for details.
Well the question could have been...WTF are you thinking?....he went the reasonable route. Simple question deserves a simple answer. I'm thinking you want to hang in East LA..
It is your car, do what you want. But be sure anything you do is reversible in the future. Porsche's are a lot like Harley's. Very easy to add your own touch, albeit costly. As others have written, you will get some flames but hey, to each his own.
Best way to find out if they have a kit for a c4s is to email/call them directly. I've seen ((on mod bargains article "best mods for your 996")) a air bagged turbo, which utilizes the same suspension as your/our car. Best of luck with whatever you do with your car.
But like dgi 07 said, people around here tend to be more of the purist crowd. Which is nothing bad to say since it keeps with the mentality of true Porsche owners, which is a great thing. Other forums like the stance nation forum would be a good fit for questions about that kind of setup, but imo rennlist offers the best of resources when you need to find out other things about your car. I come from the Audi scene, so I get airbags and stance. But around here it will compare to asking your grandparents what they think of the new assassins creed game during monopoly night.
Best of luck to you and your future car. Don't forget to post some pictures when you get it.
I fall into the camp of really not knowing what the OP is trying to achieve. My Cayenne had air suspension to raise it for off-road driving. I assume that doing this in a 911 would be for another purpose, but I really don't know. Is the goal to lower the car or raise the car? If the goal is to lower the car, then there are plenty of ways to do this with suspension kits, springs, etc.
I guess I'll post something useful since you will get **** on all day with this thread. Can you believe people used to pay me in college to do this to their car? Needed to bring home the ramen.
In case you haven't figured it out yet, the c4s is 4 wheel drive. Front axles take up a lot of room, so your strut would end up too close to the oem upper control arm. You may gain a tiny bit of clearance by switching to adjustable links, but I'm dubious. If you get any interference on the bag, have fun constantly changing out bags/sleeves.
While you're in the process of going full retard, don't bother with airrex. Any competent ape would realize pressure based systems are worth jack ****, because weight is going to be shifting around in your car, ergo, different pressures any time you go supplement shopping, pick up high school chicks in your hella flush ride, or take bros to the gym. Go for a height based system, the carrerra doesn't deserve to look like a lopsided ***** for the rest of her life.
Good luck in your quest for hella flushness.
I'm not sure if you know the general climate here and set up an account to troll or if you are asking a legitimate question.
If you are asking a legitimate question, I have nothing to offer in the area of air suspension, but it's your car. Do what you want to do with it and ignore the crowd in here that's bashing you. I'd love to see updates on how the process of fitting the air suspension goes and see some pics of the final product.
If you're trolling...good job! Look at all the previous posts!
I thought the same thing as you. I have given thought about how to lift the car a lot more to use it for off roading and rally. Then I read more of the post that followed to find out its for something completely stupid.
Thank you. I'm not trolling but legitametely asking for advice as I'm sure the owners on here have the best knowledge on the platform and what could be possible.
Maybe it's too much to ask but I was expecting more gentlemanly responses like this one but instead I see the Porsche community isn't much different than your typical parking lot car meet with people ragging on what others decide to do with their own cars. Imho, there's far more things to get butt hurt over than what someone chooses to do with their car.
I expected more frankly. Warm welcome indeed.
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Ok... lets get real for just one second....
He wants to drop his car... its not our regular cup of tea...
He gets the point... now lets try to be nice...
Pictures of the car you want to drop please...
And how far down do you want to go?
Amigo, if you want to spend $1000 buying a dual-cone carbon-fiber air intake that may or may not make a damn bit of difference, welcome home. If you want to instead spend $1,000 making the car be what you want it to be, you're going to get pushback from some Porsche drivers.
There are plenty of sites on the Internet where you can get useful feedback and encouragement for modding your car - regrettably, unless you're buying a full exhaust system that costs 4x what it should or installing a thousand bucks worth of carbon fiber overlay, you're unlikely to get that here.
If it makes you feel any better, the fact that I have a gen 1 996 with a gen-2 rear wing on it is an unforgivable offense to some.
One of the LS swap guys just up and left after the reception he got from some RL users - someone corrected his pronunciation of "Porsche" and that was enough to make him find somewhere less uptight.
We're not all d!cks - well, at least not about everything - but the regrettable truth is that the same Porsche owners who would crawl through a mile of broken glass to nuzzle Hurley Haywood's ******** have no problem calling YOU out for thinking about doing something unique to your car.
FWIW, I've considered adding adjustable ride height to my 996 so I can enter and exit driveways at normal angles instead of 45-degree angles like some damn oni-kyan Honda. If you decide to proceed, post up pics.
PS - for some reason it IS ok to screw gutter guard to your front bumper. It's weird.
Well is not my scene but being on this forum we always try to help each other no matter how ridiculous it may sound.
Here you go !!!!!
http://www.shop.com/Airbagit+Fbs+por...FUUTHwodHpsPNw
hey I looked into this, my car is going in March for this Set-Up
The local Go-To shop that does the Air Suspensions has quoted me this
HP drivetech struts they are from the uk so expensive but they are the only drop in struts for this car and they are $4400
Another option is universal bags and make custom struts for $2000. But they recommended going with the drive tech
Management you can go with
V2 for about $1200
Or Accuair elevel for $2000
Install on V2 is $1400
Install on elevel is $1600
V2 is made by airlift it's a digital system that runs on pressure base and has presets. It's a great beginner system easy to install not the most accurate but works
Accuair is a height based system that runs off height sensors, very accurate. Has presets for ride heights and will automatically adjust if the weight in car is different. Add a person it will adjust for the added weight. If you have the extra money I would go with this system. Also has an add on for wifi app to use your iPhone as the controller
Prices are Canadian so almost half for you guys in the US... Kill Me Exchange Rate but its happening no matter what for me
Same set up on the Red Car pictures from Vossen Tour Europe 2014, first 996 WB one ever done
While maybe not the most eloquent or verbose, "why" is a very valid question. As you have seen some people read that as going up while others read it as going down. Knowing your intent is key to getting any useful information.
Your response to that, on the other hand, was the one that sounds a little "butt hurt". I would also suggest picking up some thicker skin next time you are out. While I disagree with the assessment that we are mainly purists (go try asking about any mod in some of the other variants, no matter how minor!), we still tend to focus on the car's intended purpose. So to come in here and either not expect to get some non-appeasing commentary and/or not be able to laugh it off shows you may not understand how the internet in general works. At the end of the day, our opinions don't matter, so getting upset about us not liking your idea is rather pointless.
As far as your project, sell the C4S (if you already have it) and pick up a C2. The 4S still has value and (unless you are talking about lifting for off road purposes) airbags are going to significantly impact/negate the benefit of it's AWD system. As I mentioned above, you'd also need to protect it's front diff where you wouldn't in a C2.
I cannot believe that no one has given the best piece of advice yet: The 996 Turbo forum is where you need to go for this question. All 996TT's have the same suspension as the C4S. Only a few of the normally aspirated cars are C4S's, so you'll get much more info over on the Turbo forum.
There are a couple of guys you might even want to send a private message to: Dock and rmc1148 Both very knowledgeable about the Turbo platform and mods to it.
Although I'm happy with my C2, it would be nice to have something adjustable for that reason (although for me at stock height it would be to go lower), or when I get a winter C4 beater it would be nice to have something that could bring it up a few inches for the snow.
Not a fan of super low cars, but hey, we all have our fetishes and I'm not going to get bent out of shape if someone wants to have fun with their car.
I'd be very interested in seeing pictures of this project to see how it's done .
Please stick around and post for those of us who care to see it.
It's not a mod I plan on doing but as a mechanical engineer I'm very interested.
You are always going to encounter nay sayers on a forum , on this forum I was discouraged from installing a limited slip diff in my 996 . I had guard build me one and it's really taken the car to another level grip wise .
I asked about putting a 997 3.8 into my 3.6 997 , and someone said " just because you can doesn't mean you should"
But others gave some good advice .
Alan - That's funny that you posted because I thought of you when reading this thread. Talk about somebody who got flamed at the start but turned out to be a good sport about the whole thing. If you don't have thick skin, this isn't the place for you. And, just for old time's sake
:
Like some of the other posters, I was looking into a rapidly height-adjustable suspension.
My reason was to be able to run the height low for driving on most roads and for autocross, but be able to raise it for steep driveways and parking-lot entrances. I also drive my 996 to go camping and fishing, which sometimes requires driving a few miles on unpaved roads, for which I'd raise it up. I already scraped the engine in a semi-paved campground, and that was when my car was stock US height. I now have the Porsche engine skid plate (see
https://rennlist.com/forums/996-foru...d-plate-4.html
).
I know you're looking for an air system, but KW makes a hydraulic system for a mere $10K (see
http://www.carid.com/kw-suspensions/...FYeBfgodq20ICQ
).
I think we can all agree that judging from the subtleties of 996pp�s five question marks following his �why� that his post really wasn�t a question but more so a criticism.
That being said, in the interest of providing a little more insight. I�m not a newcomer to air ride, just a newcomer to the 996 platform. I�ve always been passionate about euros and as some of you may have guessed am an ex Volkswagen stanced VW owner. I drove a couple of years static low and after moving to an air suspension setup, the benefits of practicality and looks (imho) outweighed the negligible loss in handling
My reasons for considering air suspension are:
I like the look of a car laid out while parked
I like the look of a low slammed look while cruising
I need the practicality of being able to raise the car over speed bumps and roads in poor condition.
I don�t plan to autocross or track the car
I plan to daily 24/7/365
I�ve done it before with a high performance car, I want to do it again
Thanks for the constructive advice received so far.
Picture for reference
Pasmag Spread
by
Jonathan Leung
, on Flickr
Pasmag Spread 2
by
Jonathan Leung
, on Flickr
2004 VW R32 Turbo - Skytrain Station
by
Jonathan Leung
, on Flickr
- DSC00427
by
Jonathan Leung
, on Flickr
Keeping my options open, I've looked at KW's HLS back when i had the R, it's a little cost prohibitive. I can compromise on the laid out when parked but i do still want the flexibility of raising the car over obstacles.
This is another option
http://www.umbrellaautodesign.com/vrh-lift-system
Other mod options need to include
Chain steering wheel
Skull valve stem covers
You're last name in sticker form on rear window
The make of car in sticker form on front wind shield
A R.I.P. Sticker for said homie
Tweety bird and or any looney tunes character themed seat covers.
Plastic louvers on front of car to cool down rear engine.
The new mooshoomobile is a 996? Which one? There's been a silver C4S on CL for sale for almost a year. I think there is one at company of cars too.
I'm talking out of my *** here, but I've got to think a C2 would be easier to deal with for air.
The other forum will be more receptive to this - and more helpful. Did PG build the R32? Just drop the C4S off and let them figure it out. Maybe shift would take a crack at it.
Yes I've taken a look at the silver one, and there's a black one at CofC as well. Im considering both.
It looks like there's a handful of guys with turbos who have managed to install air on theirs. Sounds like the c2 might be easier but I like the c4
Who is this btw?
Jonnymooshoo, thank you for hanging in there and being A LOT more civil that many on this board. I see 996pp never showed up again after you answered his question, very well I might add. And yes, you were completely right, "Why" was never a serious question and those who claim it was a legit question are completely full of SHEET. Everyone knows why. Air suspension means you either want the car to go up or down or both.
Rennlist if FULL of ******. These same guys who vomit in their mouth at the sound of "air suspension," would lick the used underwear of a guy like Rob Dickinson, who changes practically EVERY SINGLE PART on a Porsche 911, but since the result is a purist wet dream (including mine) it's okay and you won't here a peep.
If you ever do this air suspension thing I would like to see the final result. Good luck.
Air Lift is a good company. I prefer static for the 996, but air has come a long way performance wise.
If you need help with 2WD conversion, so you can run whatever wheel/tire combo of your choice, message me.
ej....the guy asked a question. Like him I had never even given it a thought to put an air suspension on a pcar. All mooshoo had to do was explain why but instead went off on a rant. The pics he posted made me understand his post and actually it looks like a cool project..not my cup of tea but whatever.
I also don't see a lot of ****** here but I was introduced to a few today.
Get off your high horse and bite me EJ. Why is indeed a valid question as all of those 3 options as well as what he intended to do with it have a significant impact on the final product. These were pieces of information that Johnny left out of OP. He didn't even really imply that he already knew what he was doing.
I'll grant you that 996pp was most likely being condescending with his post, but that doesn't negate that Johnny left critical information out of the first post. Then rather than simply brush off 996pp's probable view and provide us with a bit of background as to what he is trying to accomplish he chose to instead attack the forum as a whole.
So as I said before, "why" may not be eloquent nor verbose, but it does sum up "what are you trying to accomplish".
I don't know who this "Rod" is you mention and really couldn't care less. What anyone does to their car is their own business. If they ask for an opinion, I'll give it (which I have not seen Johnny ask for and I have thus not provided my thoughts on the idea). There is little in the aftermarket scene I care for, but I still applaud the effort/money/time people put into making it their car.
Regardless of if you are changing the caliper color, wheels, adding/removing a wing, wrapping/painting, putting a new stereo in, or whatever, there will always be people to tell you they don't like it. There's nothing wrong with that as everyone is different. Getting bent out of shape about it isn't going to change the other person's mind and is likely (as evidenced here) to cause a snowball effect. All that matters as if you are happy with it.
My suggestions to Johnny were that he instead look at a C2 so he doesn't have to worry about AWD system and if he must use a 4S that he think about protecting the front diff. That is not out of some holy "respect" for the 4S (though as the only M96 996 variant that is holding some value it does seem a shame to do such major modifications to it) but purely a mechanical simplicity for him. I get that he may like the look of the 4S better though, many do.
It's not something I'd do for a few reasons, but I'd be curious to see the build as it progresses none the less. Its something that hasn't been done much and it's always interesting to see how things are accomplished.
Meh. I still couldn't care less. It's an interesting concept, but for the money I have a long list of other things on my list ahead of it. For those that do like it and have the money, more power to em and I hope they enjoy it.
Interesting thread. As I said before, I really didn't know why the original poster wanted air suspension. I know what an air suspension does, but I didn't know if it was to raise the car or lower the car. Now I see that it's intended to do both, although mainly to drop the car very, very low.
It's difficult for me to understand how a 911 driven on the street could be much lower. My 996 C4S frequently scraped on the ground on the stock suspension. My 997 turbo is even worse.
I have no issue whatsoever with people modding their cars, even if their mods aren't my style. I was just trying to understand the whole thing. I see this on the Audi boards too. Lots of SQ5 guys like to lower their car to the point that it looks like an A3. It seems silly to me, but it doesn't bother me at all.
More power to you!
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If I was going to drop my car that much, some sort of adjustable suspension would be required. Otherwise, I'd tear up my side skirts and rip off the front bumper my first day out of the garage.
I lifted my car half an inch two weeks after I bought it - the kidney abuse was too much for me...
This is the VRH Umbrella kit I was talking about... Option 2
it's a pneumatic air chamber fitted on top of a coilover, in this case KWV3's which allow for 75mm lift to help get over curbs, speed bumps and driveways. You can drive static low yet still maintain some daily practicality
Tank size for reference.
That's something else to consider in an AWD variant, where to keep the tank/compressor. Due to the front diff they have significantly less space in the frunk than the RWD cars.
Obviously it's been done to TTs as shown in this thread so it is possible, but it's something you will need to consider when picking your equipment.
Serious question.
When you drive around like this, aren't you stressed? Aren't you worried that a piece of gravel or an expansion joint might tear off your front bumper?
WOW! Can you believe it??!! SIX pages of discussion on a topic that the first few comments were trashing the subject!
Glad to see the question was accepted as legitimate, and that there were responses that were experience-based and truly useful.
NO! This forum should NOT be someone's safe little niche ("those ideas don't belong on this forum")("we are purists"). What crap.
The air management is the easiest part of an air ride system. What's more valuable to OP is if the person needed to change control arms, what struts were used, is there any interference between the bag and other parts, sensor locations.
I looked into this a few years back when I was considering something for my R. I vaguely remember it was $2500-3500 on top of the cost of your coilovers. Some people elect to do just the front struts, some do the front and rear.
Ride height is usually set at the same height as most lowered cars on coilovers. You are really only laid out and slammed when parked in fact, the added ability to go higher to clear driveways and speed bumps is very helpful
That hydraulic system looks good for what I would want it for, not sure I could get the some places on some back roads with only a 1.8" height increase though.
My "why" question was just a simple why question. Im very far from being a purist, i just believe that if im buying a certain car i want to use that car for the purpose it was built for. You and i and everyone and their mother can do whatever the hell to their car and other belongings as they please. Most people wont buy a SP or GR car as it stands out more but I wouldn't have it any other way. So if you want to use your pcar as a low rider to cruise in thats all your business and do what pleases you. But when you are asked a simple question as in why out of curiosity you dont need to rant off as if you have to ask then you wouldn't understand. Your ride your choice. I myself have learned a lot from this forum and there is stuff that i learn each and every day. Just my .2 cents, if you want to learn then you need learn how to play
It also might help to introduce oneself instead of jumping in with what could be a controversial post
Introducing your self is always a good way to start rather than making snarky responses to a response to your first post
Ok, I'll put my two cents in. So, OP bought a Porsche and wants to remove the suspension which is arguably the #1 defining characteristic of a Porsche and replace it with air bags so it will look like a GTI and handle civic. Ok, yea I don't see a problem with that.
It's pretty clear to me, judging by the responses in this thread, that most of you have never even seen an air bagged car in real life, yet alone ridden in one. I've had and built several bagged cars, and they handle just fine when set up correctly. Today's air suspension is nothing like the early 90s mini trucks running repurposed semi truck suspension parts.
Modern air suspension handles comparably to a set of coil overs when set up properly, but still allows you to raise the car up instantly for rough streets/hazards, or lay the car on the ground when parked. Sure, it weighs a little more than standard suspension, but what's another 20 pounds on a street car?
So.. don't want to offend, and I don't get offended easy, just want info, asking here because I am sure someone has the info, got a c2 996 (rebuilt, not gonna sell) and want to lower for looks, raise to go over bumps ( on the fly) only have a 2200.00 budget, not a track car, just a pretty thing to look at and drive. Closest I have found is airbagit, 2100.00, and yes I know it is not a choice that most would choose, options?
Please allow me to introduce myself
I'm a man of wealth and taste
Pleased to meet you
Hope you guess my name,
sorry like to be silly...
One guys had a full set-up for sale on the classifieds over the summer. I had bought some other parts off of him, and he is a good guy. Maybe someone can search it up...
That would be awesome if anyone can post the classified, I did a search and couldn't find it, did an email to umbrella and might be out of my budget will find out more on Monday. I see these systems for every car except for a c2 996, called and emailed many places without success, only airbagit has what I am looking for, just a lot of inconsistent reviews of that product. The goal is to make this a show car (therefore the lowering) like the look. so.. it might be airbagit, got time, still getting painted.
https://rennlist.com/forums/parts-ma...nsion-kit.html
I bought a bunch of his parts before he went to air suspension. Good seller, high quality parts and shipping.
Airbagit is the WalMart of air suspension. They sell mostly ****ty rip-off versions of the good stuff.
Realistically, you're looking at around $5000 for a proper air suspension setup. For the suspension itself, look at
https://www.airliftperformance.com/
. For air management, I'm a fan of AccuAir.
Bagriders.com is a good place to get your stuff from if you go this route.
Another option instead of air suspension is air cups, which are basically mini air bags that go on your coilovers and can pop the front of your car up an inch or two for going over speedbumps or into steep driveways. This is a much cheaper option than a full air suspension setup. Personally, I'd go this route. I love air suspension, but I think 911s are the wrong car for it.
https://www.bcracing-usa.com/product...RoChRYQAvD_BwE
That is awesome! I have never even heard of that product, that would do what I was wanting, the car is getting painted and is already really low, but I think it has the standard suspension, but lowered somehow, I assume I would need to add coilovers to make this work, got any options for me, like I said on a budget, but want a working solution. thanks again
look at the requirements, does anybody see any red flags for a c2 996?, going to check how it was lowered. I know i should know more about this car, but it has sat for a long while because of money and just got a chance to get anything done to it
You will need coilovers for the air cups to work, they are not compatible with any factory suspension options besides the GT3, which has coil overs from the factory.
BC and Feal are popular affordable coil over options for these cars. I have personal experience with the BCs and I find them to be a good suspension for the money. Several users on this forum have the Feals and they also get good reviews. Both are about the same price and about $1000 less expensive than the next option (KWs, Bilstein, etc.).
