Anyone done a suspension overhaul?

Hey guys, I've got a 2002 Targa with ~90k miles on it, and I put a ROW 030 suspension kit on it a couple thousand miles ago. Started thinking about a suspension refresh because I have to replace a lower front control arm bushing which failed. There's a Pelican Parts article which recommends replacing all the wearable suspension parts around 80-100k miles: http://www.pelicanparts.com/techarti...n_Overhaul.htm Has anyone done this and if so, were the results noticeable? I added up all of the parts and it looks like it'd be around $1500, and I'd attempt to do the work myself. I'm hoping it'll tighten everything up and make her feel new again. Here's what I think I have to replace (let me know if I'm missing something, or if there's only a few key parts I should replace): Thanks, Chris

I am doing this as we speak - the parts from pelican bolt right up - I had a wheel bearing making noise( replace) Along with torn Cv boot on my C 4 - all easy also changed diff fluid. While doing suspension- I also replaced radiator hose,s - not easy but will have peace of mind. Do the tie rods as well - then get it aligned - God it looks good all freshened Sent from my iPad using Rennlist

I just did, the front control arms (wishbones/coffins) and links. They made a nice difference and also got rid of most of the squeaking noises from up front. Depending on how worn your parts are it might not be a night/day type difference, but I'm sure you'll feel something as the 996 is a very tactile driving experience. Good luck

Double post

I did all mine except I used British made powerflex poly bushes , the purple street ones . Much better performance and they will last 4x as long as the oem type. It really improved the handling without being too harsh . It would be a good compliment to your mo30 Kit. Pelican sells them, I ordered mine from larkspeed in the UK , they did a package deal It was about the same as oem for the full set minus the sway bar bushes , I already had those as they came with the h&r bars . http://www.larkspeed.com/category/view/PFLEXPORSCHE http://www.pelicanparts.com/catalog/...pg4.htm#item25 http://powerflexusa.com/9119961997-2005.aspx

Quotes source post: 13010424

So, you had to remove all the new oem bushings and replace them with the Powerflex ones? What was the work time on these and did you do them yourself (do you have a shop press? How large?) or send them out? I've thought about doing this my self (I've already done my sway bar bushings, but those are very simple) but frankly have been a little turned off by the amount of labor involved. I did a set of Powerflex control arm bushings on a BMW 540 a few years ago and it was a TON of work! - The second one went smoother than the first, but it was still a bear...

No you install them on your old parts Removing the old worn out ones is the bulk of the work . You have to burn , drill or brute force them out . The new ones go in with a basic press . It's a lot of work . Not complicated but it's labour . If you are going to get it done by an Indy , ask them for an estimate vs oem . With better equipment it will go quicker but powerflex are designed to be diy friendly

Yeah ^That's^ what I meant, but I thought maybe you did the new parts AND the Powerflex bushings... that's why it didn't make a whole lot of sense to me I guess. So, how long did it take you ? There are a lot of bushings in our front ends!

I can do that order for $1404.47 shipped to your door, no tax or nothing. I have everything but 999-034-037-09 Just enter RENNLIST at checkout to get that above price. -Jason

Quotes source post: 13011002

The tie rod locking nut (999-034-037-09) may not be needed.....it usually comes with the Inner Tie Rod.......saves another 5.50...... ....or reuse the old one !!

Quotes source post: 13009758

I only changed the outer tie rods....and I can feel a noticeable difference....

Quotes source post: 13011485

Yeah you're right the nut does come with the inner tie rod. Win win. -Jason

Looks like I missed the rear suspension castor control arms (2) and the upper wishbone control arms (4), so in case anyone is looking to replace the complete set I think this is it: Now I just need to decide if I want to spend that much... =) I may just end up doing the front control arms and tie rods to see if that tightens up the steering.

HI , Several month ago i did this analysis , mainly European sources of parts/info, since im in Europe, had idea to replace my 2003 C2 50Kmiles old suspension .. May be useful as compare to buy same parts in Germany .. If you add on top ~1300 E you will get OEM suspension replacement kit containing front/back struts, springs , sway bars ... Not necessary to stress you guys with Porsche service quote for replacing my old suspension with this OEM suspension replacement kit .. Regards, Kolja

Just finished mine

Did the same a few months ago with Adjustable parts and Powerflex. You'll notice a pretty big difference. Any reason you're not going adjustable arms for your rears? I thought you might need to in order to get proper alignment with ROW30?

Quotes source post: 13018691

Didn't know I needed adjustable arms in the rear with the ROW M030, can anyone confirm?

Quotes source post: 13019999

Rear only: I don't think you'll need to but it might be nice to have a little more adjustment there should the 1/2" drop need a little more/less caster and camber. If you're replacing those arms anyway, the adjustable versions can be found for not much more and make alignments much easier.

Quotes source post: 13021135

If you have the option as mentioned above it does make your life easier. When I get mine aligned it's always on the cusp of being out of spec because of the lack of adjustability. So if you have the chance to change it out now it could help later. I'm thinking of doing something like this too as when I installed the ROW M030 kit I didn't change anything outside of what's included in the kit. Taking care of all those old components would probably work wonders in the handling department.

I went from stock comfort touring suspension to ROW to GT3 swaybars, GT3 coilovers, GT3 front Control arms, RSS dog bones, PMNA rear adjustable toe links, upper front CF strut brace. Thinking of either Powerflex or Elephant Racing poly bushings for the rest in the near future. Each upgrade stage was a major step up for me since I started with a worn out touring suspension to begin with. One thing to note is that upgrading the suspension will really reveal the weakness of your tires and/or engine mounts. I highly recommend updating your engine mounts if you haven't yet before doing a full suspension upgrade. If you upgrade more components than just the shocks/springs, you're main bottleneck now is your tires and is highly recommended to go with really good tires so that you can take full advantage of your suspension. I used to think my Evo tires was up to the task but now with the new suspension, I feel I can improve on my tires myself. Also if you plan on dropping the car anywhere close to 2" or more, the rear toe links helps you get your toe back in spec and prolongs your tires so they are def worth the investment. Some of the aftermarket ones also comes with the bump steer feature as well. Oh, quit showing off Nyoutftr.

[Image-only post; no author-written text. Original image references:] https://rennlist.com/forums/graemlins/surrender.gif

Just ordered all of the parts for this, wish me luck! Went the aftermarket route, parts were about $1800 vs $4200 OEM.

I did mine a few months ago. Noticeable difference in ride.

Parts arrived today!

Anyone have an image showing all the bolts for a suspension overhaul and their torque specs? I've been digging around for awhile but haven't been able to find one. Also this might be a silly question, but do I need to support the wheel from falling when taking off all these suspension parts? Thanks! Chris

Chris, A search for "996 Group 4 Running Gear" may yield useful information. I'm expecting that you'll take the wheel off before removing the suspension so, no, it shouldn't "fall". If your concern is for the hub, then follow the workshop manual carefully and it will tell you when you need to support parts. Iirc there is no need to compress the springs to remove the struts but you'll need a spring compressor if you wish to separate out the spring and damper (e.g. to re-use the bump-stop washer). Cheers, Z

Quotes source post: 15358487

Wow, great deal.

Hey guys, I read in the tech manual that the wishbones should be tightened when the car is on its wheels, and saw somewhere else that recommended all the rubber parts be tightened when the suspension is loaded. Should I try to jack up each wheel carrier before torquing all the bolts? Also, here are all the torque values I found laid out visually in case that helps anyone (I know it�s easier for me). As you can see I found some conflicting numbers for the tie rods... I'm pretty sure the lock nut is 37 ft-lbs, steering end is 59 ft-lbs, and the nut in the middle is 56 ft-lbs. Thanks! Chris

Hey Chris, where dis you source your parts and who makes them? im debating upgrading bushings, going aftermarket, going OEM or going RSS.... a large variation in cost for a project I intend to stay somewhat reasonable but the old �buy once, cry once� motto is ringing in the back of my head. fcpeuro.com would provide parts �for life� but would that offer the best bang for the buck?

Sourced all the parts from Pelican Parts, most are TRW or Meyle aftermarket which is why it was only $1600 vs $4200 for Porsche OEM parts. I also just ordered all new nuts and bolts for around $270 since they are supposed to be replaced. Local mechanic quotes me $1300 to have everything installed but looks like this should be a fairly easy DIY (famous last words)... I'm expecting the tie rods to be the hardest due to access issues. Here are the nuts and bolts I ordered (page references from "911 (996), 1998 - 2005.pdf"): Correction: You need 4 of the eccentric bolts for the rear (996-331-217), although Pelican Parts or Suncoast don't seem to have them in stock so I'm reusing those.

Now thats a list!!! thanks for the info! This will be very useful very shortly

Bump on my torque question, does the suspension have be to loaded when tightening all of the control arm bolts? I'm thinking about jacking up the wheel carrier before tightening everything down? Found this in the workshop manual about installing the main control arm:

Generally speaking any retained rubber bushing with a vulcanised sleeve should be tightened in the ride height position. U can tear out the sleeve if its in constant tension. Ball joints, heims, monoballs and poly bushings with loose sleeves can be tightened i any position.

Does anyone have experience with Powerflex Bushings? Pros/Cons? I have a press at the house and it does seem like it would be a relatively simple/economical upgrade rather than buying new components (even aftermarket).

The manual is explicit about it. Follow the directions in the manual. The part you circled couldn't be much more clear. Can you do something differently? Sure. It might be fine. Why bother... You are at risk of tearing the rubber that bonds the center of the bushing to the control arm side of the bushing, resulting in additional redundant cost, and rework. Yes, powerflex bushings are great, but you need to be comfortable with the addition noise, vibration and harshness that comes when you replace rubber with polyurethane.

Quotes source post: 15380151

yes I did the whole set on my car . Big job but not complicated . All the labour is in removing the old bushings . They press in easily with a basic press . I sourced them from the UK which was cheaper than the us . They improve the handling significantly and given that the oem ones don�t last especially if you�re doing track days , the fact they last 4x longer than stock is a bonus if you�ve also done other suspension upgrades like coilovers and sway bars , which will put additional stress on the rubber Bush components , up rating to poly bushes is worth considering as they are much stronger if you�ve done other suspension upgrades , what I would say is up rating the bushes is what pulls it all together . i used the street purple ones . I wouldn�t reccomend the race black ones except in a true track car my earlier post post in this thread has a link to the uk source . ive used other brands in the past powerflex is much better to live with .

Quotes source post: 15380572

Thanks for the tip! I just ordered a ROW M030 kit from Carnewal and figure this would tie everything together a little tighter than stock. What did you do for arms with the ball joints? Are replacement ball joints available or are we stuck when the ball joints give out?

Anyone have any tips for getting the large end of the tie rod boot over the steering rack? I've been trying for over an hour and can't seem to get it on... tried screw drivers, needle nose pliers, but it just seems too stiff to get the whole thing over the lip. It's a TRW boot. Thanks, Chris

Try soaking it in a pan of close to boiling water to soften up the boot.

Finally got it on by soaking it in hot water, then stretching it out over a flashlight. Thanks for the quick response!

Anyone have any tips for getting the rear wishbone ball joint to pop out? It's pretty hard to get to, can't get my ball joint separator to it, and can't seem to get it to pop off with a pickle fork. Sprayed some PB Blaster on it for tonight, will try again tomorrow.

Are Elephant Racing or RSS Strut mounts complete overkill for a 98% Street car?

Finally finished up the project on Sunday afternoon, most of the ball joint seals were blown (2002 Targa with ~90k miles.) Are my old parts of any value to anyone, maybe if you want to put new bushings in them? Took it for a quick test drive, feels nice and tight with no rattles or squeaks anymore, going for an alignment tomorrow.

Very nice! How long did it take you to install? Pretty straight forward install excluding the times you posted questions? Just an FYI, TRW is the maker of OEM parts so most of your parts are OEM.

Yeah, pretty straight forward install, only troublesome part was getting those darn tie rod boots on. The rear wishbone ball joints popped out easily with a pickle fork once I released the other side from the chassis. Couldn't get a torque wrench on some of the parts so I just torqued them by hand. Spent a few hours a day Friday, Saturday, Sunday, overall not too bad. I think the only specialty tools I used were a pickle fork, ball joint splitter, 32 mm wrench for the tie rod, T40 torx socket, and I wish I had a thin 21mm wrench for one of the rear control arm bolts. Everything else was just normal size wrenches and sockets.

Here's some close-ups of the blown out ball joints:

Decided to come up with some current prices and figured I'd share what I've found so far. The "FCP OEM" Column references the prices that are "OEM Equivalents" offered by FCPeuro.com. They carry the same "lifetime" warranty that the company is known for. I still need to call my local Porsche dealer and get prices.

I have a couple of the �ro Control arms on my 996. https://www.rockauto.com/en/catalog/...trol+arm,10401 They've been on for over a year now and are just fine. I took a good look at them last month when I installed my Feal coilovers. I have a couple of �ro spares too in case I need them in the rear, or if the front ones ever wear out. I also found a great close-out deal earlier this year on quality control arm links (Can't remember the brand) from ECS Tuning. I didn't need them so they're spares for if/when I need them. Also picked up some clearance tie rod ends not too long ago from Rock Auto. I hope to keep my 996 on the road for a very long time.