Manual 996 4D (AWD 4S) vs 2D

Hi Guys; I have been thinking of getting a low option clean coupe 966 (2002 - 2005) with decent miles and clean interior to hold and cherish, as I look around, I see a couple of decent 4S AWDs in the market that look and feel good and make me think why am I not getting a 4D instead of 2D. my question is, is there any preference for 2D over 4D? will I be losing much 911 spirit by driving a AWD in Socal? am I going to have more problem owning a 4D in the long run? what are you general thoughts on 4S vs 2D as a 911 driver? I have a clean 2003 C4S that I am eyeing right now. any feedback is appreciated. Thanks Sean

The C4S only comes in All-Wheel-Drive (hereafter known as "AWD"). In the 996 range it is the only non-turbo wide body. The narrow body cars come as AWD (C4) and not-AWD (C2). There is a way to completely remove the AWD system from C4S and C4 cars that is relatively simple. It seems much harder to "add" AWD to non-AWD cars. Frankly I have never heard of someone doing it. It may not be possible at all. I drove a C4, a C2 and a C4S prior to purchasing. My experience is that at anything less than driving like a hooligan, I can't even tell the difference. You should note that every 911 Turbo since 1994 has had AWD...not including the GT2s...

AWD 911s have slightly less space in the frunk due to the front differential. From a maintenance standpoint, the AWD system requires almost none and is entirely mechanical. With AWD you do need to pay attention to tire/wheel circumferences as they need to be kept to as close to the same as possible (front to back). As strathconaman mentioned, it is not terribly difficult to remove the AWD system completely if you're concerned about the roughly 130lb of extra weight or the handling/driving characteristics of AWD vs 2WD. The 911 launches ridiculously well due to the rear engine, but the addition of AWD is supposed to help you through corners. I haven't driven a C2 and C4 back to back, and most of my seat time has been in my C4S - including some track time - and I love it. I'm sure the C2 is a blast as well, but its not like you're giving up everything by going with a C4. I don't think there is enough of a difference to the average driver to say one is significantly better than the other - things like price, condition, maintenance records, and your personal preference are all much more important in the purchase decision IMHO.

I have only owned one and it is my current 2005 C4S. I love it and don't drive it like a hooligan . In my biased opinion the C4S is a better looking car than any of the C2. There will be disagreement on this but as I said I am biased. The 4S has the turbro-style body along with suspension. What's not to like. The front drive can be easily removed if you want a slightly lighter vehicle . Remember the front drive system does not make the car like a four wheel drive pickup. Good for tracking as that is when the front drive gets more transferred power through the disc. Other than that I think it is only 5%.

They are both great. I used to think a C2 was preferred so that I could have more control over the rear end, but my C2 hooks up too well that it there is no sliding the rear in my car under power. AWD might have a slight advantage on the track being 0.1% faster, which is what Porsche was going after, and there�s not much weight penalty. The body of the C4S, on the other hand, is the most attractive 996 body. That is reason enough to do it as long as you are going to get a 3.6, you might as well get the best body. If you were going to get a C2, I like the early Cars better for the dual-row IMSB, such as 99-00 models.

I have the C4S. I drove it on track with AWD and now with removal of AWD hence RWD (with LSD. Car does not come with this and doing a RWD conversion without it may not yield the same effects due to the open diff on later models). Big difference between the 2. AWD when pushed does not have the characteristic tendencies of a 911. On track it would require a lot of trail braking to get the rear to “come around”, throttle input would pull the car in towards apex and the lift of throttle application did not have the dreaded widow-maker phenomenon. AWD delete with LSD on the other hand, on track, made the care drive like a rear engine rear drive car. Rear swings with reducing throttle input even very small amounts, throttle input would push the car through the apex. Car feels way faster and requires more attention (also based on lap times). AWD can mask a lot of driver errors because it really does save you in instances where the tarmac is not predictable (liquid on track, dirt, change in surface conditions, etc) or surface changes (bumps, camber, etc). On the track the AWD was nice but RWD is way more fun and faster. It opens up different tire size options vs being limited due to tire diameter that must be maintained to prevent damage to the system. AWD is great on the road versus on the track because most things are repeated, the conditions are not changing, and when pushing the car there are people with flags who can warn you of certain dangers (fluids/rain/accident) which on the road you are totally blind. Also chances are you won’t be pushing anywhere near the levels of track driving conditions. AWD is fantastic on the road, rain, dry it feels great. Front diff requires servicing for the bearing but it is not something you have to do very year. It has a service interval of 50 or 60k (not sure what the time frame is but I’m sure its in some manual). The frunk is smaller, you can always get the roof box and not worry about frunk space. The other stuff mentioned above is also accurate so I did not want to repeat what was already stated.

The vast majority of drivers can’t tell the difference between a C2 and a C4 when driven on the street. Either one will give you the Porsche experience. On the track, you’ll feel the difference. The AWD feeling isn’t bad, it’s just different than RWD.

"I drove a C4, a C2 and a C4S prior to purchasing. My experience is that at anything less than driving like a hooligan, I can't even tell the difference." ^^This^^ The viscous clutch system delivers very little power to the front wheels under normal driving conditions (5-15%) under high speed and extreme loss of traction it will go to 40% front 60% rear. If you get into a situation where this is the case (track or street) you'll be glad you had it.

Quotes source post: 15196089

The aesthetics of the wide body, especially those rear quarters, make the C4S a very attractive car. I seem to recall it also gets the larger turbo brakes. I'd love to own one, but didn't find one with the right combination of price/condition/documentation when I was last in the market. I came very close on two but they both needed a ton of maintenance that would have quickly turned them into low to mid $30K cars.

I've had the pleasure of owning both a 2002 996 C4S and a 2004 C2 996 Anniversary Edition. Both cars were manuals, the RWD AE has the X51 and a few mods such as suspension, exhaust and engine mounts. The 2002 C4S was relatively worry free, never had a problem with AWD system, IMS was original and dry, RMS leaked at some point but was replaced. Overall it was a pretty solid car and a nice intro to owning a Porsche. Standard stuff like spark plugs, coils, AOS, Ignition Stalk required attention but nothing crazy. I loved how it looked, however I never really loved driving the car. From my perspective, it wasn't fast (I've probably driven like a hulligan in small doses), it handled fine, but it felt kind of floaty (Could have been worn shocks). I ultimately got rid of it because my tuned turbo 3 Series BMW was much faster and handled better with an aftermarket M suspension. My 2004 Anniversary Edition. I LOVE TO DRIVE THIS CAR. No other way to describe it. However it's not really a fair fight when you consider the extras the X51 comes with, and what I've been able to add to it. You can feel the extra power and when pushed the power in the upper rev range is much more than a standard 996. RWD 996 is also lighter. Couple that with a limited slip and aftermarket goodies like Wevo Engine mounts, Bilstein/Ruf Suspension, Dansk Exhaust etc. and it's a completely different driving experience, one that I prefer. The C4S in stock form was beautiful but just wasn't the 911 I was looking for. With a few slight exterior touches I think you can make the RWD C2 models look great too. The model you choose is all about personal preference and intended usage. Some people want a CAB to take advantage of beautiful weather, others want AWD to get a few extra drives based on climate, or AWD for extra sense of security when driving, some people want a turbo for maximum acceleration and power, some people want a standard RWD to remain true to the original 911's. There is literally a 911 for everyone and what everyone is looking for which makes the lineup so cool. For me, my AE is a weekend car that's only driven in the best conditions, on the best roads, with 100% the intentions of performance. I don't worry about getting any "utility" out of car. It is purely satisfaction based driving which is why I chose RWD specifically, X51 and the added upgrades. Pics of both both of mine are attached, I've got a thing for Silver I guess.

Quotes source post: 15196352

I don�t mean to contradict your direct experience, but how does one know if the handling of different cars isn�t related to the setup of the suspension (camber, toe, etc.) versus how many of the wheels are driven? Some folks experience the opposite of what you�ve experienced - well, not really, since they were comparing AWD of one car with RWD of a different car - but they did report that the RWD setups understeered quite a bit while the AWD versions were much better at turning in... I guess I�m not convinced that the setup isn�t the main cause of different handling characteristics versus the wheels driven.

Quotes source post: 15197024

Same thing in my experience, which is why I ended up with an early 3.4 C2, under $18k, almost 1/2 the cost.

Thats is what I was saying in my thread. Randy Pobst drove my car and that�s we were discussing as well. That would be stock alignment.[/left]

Suggest to read a couple of reviews of the C4S from Excellence Magazine (a very credible source): Here https://rennlist.com/forums/996-foru...l#post14125769 and https://rennlist.com/forums/996-foru...l#post14125785

if u would like a low mile extra clean 2003 Turbo X50 let me know... silver

Buy the 4S if you like the way it looks. Stock for stock, with the same tires & brake pads, a C2 will drive better & be faster every single time. edit: it's all pretty marginal though -- you can't go wrong either way.