Need advice on keep/sell decision on my C4S

Hey All, I am in need of some real world advice on what to do with my beloved 2002 C4S. It is in mint shape, bone stock, arctic silver/black interior, 61K, sport seats, manual. I am torn because I need to address some spendy issues, and I know I won't get that money invested back if I sell it anytime soon. Here are the issues: 1) Passenger side cat is throwing faults constantly. Can't pass smog, so I'm looking at $2K minimum in new high flow cats (installed) just to get it to pass smog, benefit being some power and torque gain and better sound. 2) Haven't had the IMS/RMS upgraded. Some oil seepage, but no leak. I know, total crapshoot as to if it will go, but I do know this preventative issue could open a pandora's box and be anywhere from $2-4.5K depending on IMS/RMS only, IMS/RMS + clutch, IMS/RMS + clutch + flywheel.....won't know until they get into it. 3) PSM/ABS warning lights, hoping it's the brake switch, but wishful thinking. So, this is what I have to contend with. It drives wonderfully, but the above needs addressing so I can at least drive without a clenched sphinctor and track it some day. Atr the minimum, the cat issue is needed merely to register the car in September. These C4S don't seem to be appreciating, but also seem to be at the bottom of the depreciation curve. I figure it might be worth $29-30K as is, but dropping $4-7K as outlined above won't increase it's value accordingly. Part of me wants to keep it, drop the $4-7K plus chip it and track it. The other part makes me wonder if it's time to cut bait, sell, and put towards something else (996 TT, '08 997). Any insights/opinions greatly appreciated. Robert

If you haven't tracked it yet, I recommend doing a solid DE day (not autoX) before making a decision. It will totally change your perspective of the car, or at least it did mine.

Keep it. Your gonna have the same issues like IMS with a 997. You know the history of your car. Invest in it. Like yours said, no one sells a stock when it's bottomed out, it can only go up in value. It's a normally aspirated car. Everything is "turbo" these days (and not always by choice). It's a $100K car new, $4k is nothing in preventative maintained. Take a look into the Ferrari world and you will think your 911 is a bargain for what it is and what it cost to own.

I guess I should have said "track it again someday". I did track it once, and it completely delivered. Good advice above, I need to think of it as an investment, and it is relatively affordable upkeep compared to other sports cars. Just tough dumping that kind of money with little performance or resale value gain. I think I might just go the extra mile and do sports cat-back, intake and chip. Thanks for the input.

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This is inaccurate. Any right-minded buyer would have a PPI, so even if you didn't tell them about the issues (although you seem like a stand up guy so you probably would) they'd probably discover them, and make an offer accordingly. Sounds like you already made up your mind to keep it anyways!

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That's what I would do. Another preowned Porsche could have all new undiscovered issues. You at least know what's going on in your car.

Show it the love it deserves, you know you want to. And they are a helluva lot more fun than many new cars that depreciate 10-20k in their first year of ownership.

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I am so looking forward to tracking mine!

Have you ever driven a 996 turbo? If you can sell your C4S for 25k as is and add another 10k or 15k you can buy a turbo. I would at least consider that option before spending 4k to 6k on your C4S. The C4S is a wonderful car but considering the above is one of a few logical paths to take.

Keep it and make the investment. Small price to pay for this awesome ride! And, yes - take it to the track. No better (legal) fun/$

The lower mileage C4S market seems to be trending upwards, anything with sub-75k miles really. As much as I love the C4S (I had a spreadsheet of every one sold in the six months before I bought my car), 30-35k sounds a little crazy to me - 996TTs aren't too far from there, and neither are 997.1s. So I'd spend the money and try to get some of it back on resale if you decide to move up the range later on.

If you�re in an area that does smog testing, beware that high-flow cats typically won�t pass the visual. Only stock cats or approved replacements will pass, this is a hard and fast rule just about everywhere. Do check out the requirements before spending $2,000 plus on hi-flows.

Every once in a while I think about selling mine. Granted I don't have the issues that you stated (knock on wood) but sometimes I think about getting something newer and/or different. My problem is I don't drive it as much as I should. When I do drive it...I'm in love again. When it sits in the garage and I'm out...certain cars will catch my eye. I'd say just invest in the car since It's obvious that you still like it. I think the mechanical issues the car has is giving you grief. Take it to a reputable shop and see what the bottom line would be to get it healthy again. If you do invest in it and you still want to unload it later at least you can get top dollar for it by having all the issues addressed already.

You bought the wrong car if your primary motive was for "investment" purposes. If you bought it to drive and plan on keeping her awhile, then spend the money and go enjoy the car. If you bought it to invest, then get those items taken care of and sell it and look for a clean 997.2 dfi NA car. I believe those will be more desireable(out of the modern 911's) as all the new models have gone turbo and the 997.2 represents the last NA breed that is free of any IMS issues and has the more traditional 911 headlights that will appeal to the masses.

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If the basic platform is sound you are generally better off staying with the car you own rather than buying another car. When you sell your current car you take a depreciatiion hit. And I dare say with those issues the car will have to be sold at a discount unless you get lucky and find someone willing to pay good money for a car that is in fair condition, needs work, some of it rather expensive work. Then you turn around and buy another car that can only depreciate and likely you have to deal with issues that come up. General rule is when buying a used car to have 10% and with Porsches I'd offer this should be 15% or even 20% of the car's purchase price set aside for just in case. Another car, another used car, is more of an unknown. Unless the laws in your area prohibit it -- and I guess they do in CA -- my advice would be to buy a pair of used exhaust manifolds from a Porsche salvage business. Best if you can pick these out yourself and give them a shake to ensure neither one makes any noise. I did this for a noisy converter on my 2002 Boxster the converter was noisy due to a loose converter brick. It knocked when cold, buzzed when hot, and generated a P0430 every once in a while. I always managed to get it through smog testing -- although once it failed and I had to take the car for a 50 mile highway drive and upon retesting (just a few hours later) the car passed -- with this marginal converter. Oh, I paid $450/each for the two exhaust manifolds, plus the labor to have the Porsche tech swap the old manifolds with the new ones. In CA there are aftermarket CARB approved converters that I have no experience with but I kind of recall reading about someone who went this route and it worked out for him. The aftermarket CARB approved converters are less expensive than the factory OEM ones. For the RMS leak I paid around $1700 for this for my 996 Turbo at a dealer. In the case of your car the SOP is to replace both the RMS and the IMS end flange and bolts with new/improved hardware. Often -- I was told when I had my 2002 Boxster in for this way back in 2002 -- it is the end flange that is leaking so both the RMS and end flange -- and new encapsulated bolts -- are replaced. This was done back in 2002 for my Boxster and the RMS/end flange area is leak free still. Whether you want to install an aftermarket IMSB is up to you. The clutch may not *need* to be replaced. When my Turbo was in for a new RMS at around 120K miles the clutch disc had no measurable wear. The clutch of my Boxster is original and the car has covered over 302K miles. Don't know about the ABS/PSM warning lights. A bit of diagnosis time with a PST2/PIWIS computer connected should let a tech know what's going on. My experience has been whenever I'm facing something wtih one of my cars I can't help but think maybe it is time to move on. However, both cars are in good shape, run very well, and do not have any issues. I take care of these as they come up. But I then look at replacing one or both cars and even a $3K (or more) repair is way less money than I would have to gather together to buy a replacement car. Oh, I have to warn you if you are not comfortable with "spendy issues" with your C4S you will likely be in for a worse time of it if you get a 996 Turbo. Every thing, every service, spare parts, insurance, etc., costs more with the Turbo. And on the subject of "spendy issues" I would advise you if you are uncomfortable with "spendy issues" for a street only car to stay the heck away from a track with your car. Tracking -- doing it right -- requires additional expense and brings with it the risk of something serious happening which can make the expense you are looking at now seem insignificant compared to what you could be facing after a tracking-triggered engine/transmission malfunction or an "off".

If you're in CA, you can't legally sell the car without passing smog... It is the sellers duty to have a current test. So you will need the cats no matter what. And 'investment' is the wrong word. You're looking for 'spend.' For now, a 996 is just another used car.

...I can't imagine anyone buying your car without all of the issues fixed, unless u r giving it away??? seriously, I was thinking of selling, then fixed the water pump, breaks, T-stat, oil pressure sender thingy, key switch, radiator, breaks, motor mounts, muffler noise, etc., etc.,...and 3 years L8r...

OEM cats FS:m in SoCal: https://rennlist.com/forums/parts-ma...onverters.html

If I was in your position I would spring for the Turbo.

Never sell your Porsche unless you're replacing it with another, better Porsche. Regret has a particularly nasty sting to it..

It sounds like you are of a mind to keep it long term. If/when you reach that conclusion, make the IMS Solution part of your response. I cannot understand why a long-term owner would do anything else. Fix it and forget it.

I am new to the brand and just picked up a C4s that has the same issue with the Fabspeed exhaust. The owner tacked the car occasionally, Fabspeed informed me that I will need to change the x-pipe because the CAT went bad and they do not insure them for more than 2 years.

Mint condition but needs maintenance? Do the maintenance and KEEP IT. You know this car. Drop in some coilovers while you are at it (seriously do it). There is no way you are going to get $29-30k as it sits. And you're right doing necessary maintenance doesn't increase the value. Some guy on here was selling a mint 2009 with 30k miles on it and it took months for him to get $40k for that car. If you haven't tracked this car before get out there on a driver education day, it's fun.

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Was it a C4S and couldn get $40K?? A 09 C4S is real world $55-$60k car.

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Sorry, a stripped 2009 C2 with 30k miles is easily a $40K car all day long and I doubt the car was void of any options. Besides, that was a $75K car when new; whereas the 996 C4S was $100K+. There's more to that story. IMHO, when you get into those kinds of comparisons (different models, different gens), you've got to start asking a lot of different questions. Plenty of people would try to steer you away from a 996 simply because it's a 996. Others would steer you away from any 911 newer than a 993 simply because it's not water cooled. Some would steer you away from a C4S because its AWD and the "real" experience of driving/owning a 911 is reserved for the RWD cars. Then there are folks who will tell you to buy a Turbo because whatever your looking at is "getting close to the price of one..." and whatever the gap ($5-10K), it's worth it. When you get into that price range, there are also people who will tell you to forego the older bodied Turbo and get the best newer gen N/A car you can afford. The crap goes on and on endlessly. We've all undoubtedly heard the phrase that "opinions are like ********...everyone has one," well, when it comes to Porsches, there are lots of ******** and even more opinions. At some point the buyer needs to ignore everyone's opinions and figure out what THEY want. As for the OP, 996es will eventually appreciate in value. When? If that's what you're waiting for then sell and buy something else...not a 996. Personally, I'd keep it and maintain it unless you're just itching for a reason to upgrade to a 996 Turbo or 997 for some reason and don't really want to admit it to yourself. There's nothing wrong with that...but you need to figure out what you want. I agree with everyone's advice against buying another used 996 that you know nothing about. Not a good idea...but, you've got to figure out what's really bugging you, ignore all of us and follow your heart. My $.02, -Eric

I kept my '03 C2 when I got the GT3, and it is now my daily driver after the Cherokee crapped out one time too many. No regrets, just lots of happiness.

Like VitaminC indicated, you can't sell it private-party if the cat is shot. You might be able to dump it on an unsuspecting car dealership, but that's a whole lot of bad karma. Get a used cat from a salvage; the PSM/ABS is going to be the brake switch, the MAF, or one of a couple of other easily rectifiable issues. You're looking to dump the car for a few hundred bucks' worth of issues. I guess the real question is: do you really want to just get rid of the car (it seems like you don't, but you wouldn't be asking if some part of you wasn't compelled to offload it)? If so, deal with the cat and sell it; if not, don't sweat these issues. You referred to them as "spendy" - but they don't have to be. The IMS is the biggest possible expense you listed. Buy a used cat, use the money you saved to address the IMS (if you choose to do so) and keep enjoying your car. I'm not sure that "thinking of it as an investment" is sound - anecdotally 996's are appreciating, but realistically...who knows? Another option if you have the space is to register it as PNO (planned non-operation) which drops the registration to near zero and doesn't require you to address the cat situation now. Unless you need the capital that's tied up in the car, this would give you more time to consider what to do with the car without burning money on registration and insurance. In the (hopefully unlikely) event that my 996 ever craps out, I will change its status to PNO, drop it off my insurance, and warehouse it for a while until I can make a more unbiased decision and/or see how the market treats these cars.