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THIS DISCUSSION / SOURCE-DERIVED OVERVIEW
Discussion summary
YOUR RESEARCHPrice check please
Leading reported evidence
Replace already and/or maintained more religiously(not in all cases)
Performed · outcome unconfirmed
No successful repair reported for this finding.
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Reported fixes
0
Unsuccessful attempts
1
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Read evidence and context
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Performed · outcome unconfirmed
Where as higher mileage cars have already had things fail and replaced already and/or maintained more religiously(not in all cases).
Leading evidence: 'Replace already and/or maintained more religiously(not in all cases)' (no explicit attributable resolution; this is a reported action or suggestion). Across 1 matching discussions, The most frequently discussed action is 'Repair "' (1 discussions). For that action, 0 discussions report a resolution and 0 report an unsuccessful attempt. No action has an explicit, attributable resolution report under the current rules. These are forum reports and suggestions, not a confirmed diagnosis.
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Suggestion · Original poster
It only shows one "repair", but notes it as an emissions inspection.
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Suggestion
In my case, all work was done by Porsche in Atlanta and I have full records of work and repair carried out on the car.
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Suggestion
The IMS being replaced could be a good sign, it means the previous owner knew something about the car and was willing to invest in it.
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Suggestion
Even the price difference between the two, although it seems like a lot, can be a drop in the bucket if you get into the cheaper one and start replacing things.
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Suggestion
Even the price difference between the two, although it seems like a lot, can be a drop in the bucket if you get into the cheaper one and start replacing things.
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24 eligible posts · 0 unverified posts · 1 discussions match the subject in their title or opening post.
Rennlist: 1 discussions
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Generation: 20261026T152433Z · outcome-qualification-6. Deterministic extraction; no AI model inference. How we use sources
Two similar C4S's in my area. This one is at a local porsche dealer now for $35.9k
http://denver.craigslist.org/cto/5738955656.html
And then this one:
http://denver.craigslist.org/ctd/5733496957.html
Which as far as I can tell has been reduced 1k recently.
Thanks
First one... too much money and if you notice, the airbag module (steering wheel) has been replaced. That could mean an accident or faulty air bag, but still, over priced.
The second one, is a much better deal for the miles. I've seen these cars list for the low 20s and so maybe you can shave off another $5,000 on the price. But at $29,000 for a low miles C4S, that's not bad at all.
I don't know why all these newbies pay a premium for low mileage ones as those are the ones that will most likely blow up or need quite a bit of work. Just my $.02
look at nada prices, look at the dirtest trade in value, and never buy a car untill you have it completely inspected and look at carfax and dealer service history
First one: New listing.
Second one: Has been listed for over year, started in the high 30s. Never looked at it due to price and being at an unfamiliar dealer lot.
That's all I have.
Low mileage cars blowing up??? You don't really believe a mint low mileage C4S (or any 911) is really going to blow up and need more work than a high mileage car do you? Thats absurd. Miles, options and condition are everything regardless what it is. If you want a pristine low mileage car, your gonna pay up for it. Nice clean low mileage PCA cars are not as cheap as dealer auction cars.
I recommend to keep looking. Any time a dealer (2nd one) says you can trust them, you can't trust them. Look for a car from a PCA member that has at least 2 or 3 years of service history. There are no guarantees when buying a 12yo+ German sports car but this will decrease your odds a little of buying a nightmare.
On Rennlist, there does not appear to be any ability to differentiate between cars that are low mileage because they were parked and not started for a decade vs. cars that are low-mileage but still normally maintained. There is another Rennlist mantra that goes something like this: "It's much better to buy a ragged-out POS that has been beaten on so hard that it leaks at every gasket and clamp than a carefully maintained, low-mileage vehicle. Everyone knows that low-mileage vehicles are destined to fail catastrophically."
I don't understand it.
I received the carfax from the dealer for the first one, 2002. Shows 8 owners! (is there anyway for me to post it? It's a .pdf). It's hard to decipher what was a real sale and when it may of been passed from one dealer to another. It only shows one "repair", but notes it as an emissions inspection. It's been through MI, CA, ND, AZ and finally CO.
At this point I think this is really just a fact finding mission for me, I don't think I'd consider this one for several reasons, not the least are which the potential accident b3freak pointed out or that I am unlikely to get this dealer to go down 8k.
I am leaning heavily towards 997's, but wanted to give the 996 a fair shake before I rule them out. I did have a roommate with a 996 cabrio we drove the **** out of, so it's not a total unknown to me, but that was already a while ago and enough things are different to want to check it one last time.
Thanks for the advice!
If you haven't already, YOU MUST SEE THEM IN PERSON. It is absolutely impossible to try to gauge what a car like this is worth from 3 fuzzy pictures. There are so many 'little' things that are either in great shape or not and they can add up to cost thousands and thousands. Even the price difference between the two, although it seems like a lot, can be a drop in the bucket if you get into the cheaper one and start replacing things.
The IMS being replaced could be a good sign, it means the previous owner knew something about the car and was willing to invest in it. Getting the service history for each will help tell the story a bit better.
That being said, it feels like the black one is definitely on the high side. I bought my C4S in the in the very low 20s but it also had 94k miles and no service history (it was from a Porsche dealer btw).
Go drive them, decide which feels the best for you and talk to the seller about price. If it seems like you're in the same ballpark, get a pre purchase inspection done.
Another red flag is that based on the CarFax no regular maintenance has been carried out on this car for a least 14,000 miles. But there again, not all service centers report back to CarFax. Unfortunately, it's impossible to tell from the CarFax if even major repair was rendered, that could be good and that could be bad. CarFax reports tend to be hard to decipher. It better if the owner kept all service records with the car. In my case, all work was done by Porsche in Atlanta and I have full records of work and repair carried out on the car.
I'm basically making a generalization but it's the low mileage cars that's been stored and hasn't had anything touched on them, including owners that leave the oil in the car for a few years because they only put on a few hundred miles a year. Where as higher mileage cars have already had things fail and replaced already and/or maintained more religiously(not in all cases).
If you search on here, you may find that more low mileage cars have had failures vs. high mileage ones from this small sample pool here.
So basically, I'm of the belief that there is a loose correlation of lack of maintenance/knowledge from low mileage owners vs. high mileage owners. It's more a mentality issue rather than mileage but one that loosely correlates to it IMO.
This is one of the reasons why you see worn out chain guides/IMS paddle tensioners on a low mileage car for example(letting oil sit in too long) vs some cars with double or triple the mileage with less wear on those parts.
Alpine003, you're a grumpy old man and that's cool. Own it!
I'm intrigued about the car in your avatar, especially the suspension/wheel set up. Do you have good pics posted anywhere?
Lol, maybe not as "old" as some peeps on here.
Posting cars for me is so 1990's, early 2000's. I don't do it that much these days. You will not find hardly any pics of my car on here.(afraid someone not agree with my views and vandalize it if I park it. haha).
I have OEM GT3 Coilovers, top hats, sway bars, lower control arms, PCMNA rear toe links, RSS Dog bones, Tarret Adjustable sway links. Wheels are 18x8 and 18x10 BBS RS-GT Forged 2 piece wheels running Hankook V12 235/285 version 1's.
I agree. Any one involved with motorsports in some way knows even modern race cars still uses the gold livery in racing. It's not for everyone but having grown up watching the various race series, I've either gotten accustom to it or actually started liking it. Not really sure as I'm doing it more for the livery aspect.
Just got back from the dealer where I drove the silver one that's over priced. It's a real nice example of a pristine 996 C4S. It was much harder in person to tell that the airbag cover on the steering wheel didn't match. Never the less I brought it up and the salesman said he'd ask his shop about it.
The drive was a little disappointing. Last time I drove a 996 was a C2 and practically at sea level. This is in Denver and my DD is a tuned Audi b8 S4. The S4 is more than a little quicker/ powerful just about everywhere. Of course it's not a 911 with it's "analogue and visceral feel", but the difference in power makes the driving experience significantly different, especially considering the 911 is quite a bit smaller. Not too unexpected I guess but still a little disappointing. I think I'll be off next to check out a 997 C4S (when I find a good local candidate) to see how that tickles me.
Thanks for all the replies.
QK
If you're in Denver, you'll need a TT. Not sure even a 997s would satisfy you coming from a b8 S4 IMO. The C4S already has a weight/power penalty compared to the other models, pretty much lipstick on a pig as I put it.
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