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YOUR RESEARCHOK. It's really 10k for the rear tires.
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quite a surprise
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Given the number of similar printouts I've seen all of which have had the rear toe, either total toe or the toe on just one rear wheel, out and the front alignment numbers good that printout with front tire alignment obviously the issue is quite a surprise.
Leading evidence: 'quite a surprise' (1 discussions report identifying this cause; no attributable repair resolution). Across 1 matching discussions, the most frequently mentioned possible cause is 'quite a surprise' (1 discussions; 1 report identifying it and 0 suggest it). The most frequently discussed action is 'Check alignment' (1 discussions). For that action, 0 discussions report a resolution and 0 report an unsuccessful attempt. No action has an explicit, attributable resolution report under the current rules. These are forum reports and suggestions, not a confirmed diagnosis.
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The Michelin PS2 that replaced the Pirelli tires on the 996 were still decent at 15,000 miles.
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After I replaced the rear tires and after the alignment I can easy get 20K miles and this last set of Bridgestones I managed to get close to 24K miles and the tires were not quite to the wear bars but I was heading out on a long road trip and wanted fresh tires.
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Suggestion
I asked about having the car aligned then and there but the service manager told me the alignment's not bad enough to do it now, the alignment could wait until the rear tires are in need of replacing at which time I'll replace all 4 tires and have the Turbo aligned.)
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I asked about having the car aligned then and there but the service manager told me the alignment's not bad enough to do it now, the alignment could wait until the rear tires are in need of replacing at which time I'll replace all 4 tires and have the Turbo aligned.)
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After I replaced the rear tires and after the alignment I can easy get 20K miles and this last set of Bridgestones I managed to get close to 24K miles and the tires were not quite to the wear bars but I was heading out on a long road trip and wanted fresh tires.
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Suggestion
I asked about having the car aligned and was told the alignment -- based on the degree of cupping/wear in evidence -- was not bad enough to be worth the cost of an alignment -- and the alignment is best done with new tires installed -- and it would be ok to continue to drive the car and when the rear tires were due to be replaced which would then trigger the fronts being replaced too, to have the alignment done then.
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Suggestion
I asked about having the car aligned and was told the alignment -- based on the degree of cupping/wear in evidence -- was not bad enough to be worth the cost of an alignment -- and the alignment is best done with new tires installed -- and it would be ok to continue to drive the car and when the rear tires were due to be replaced which would then trigger the fronts being replaced too, to have the alignment done then.
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quite a surprise
No successful repair reported for this finding.
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Identified cause
0
Suspected cause
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Reported fixes
Read evidence and context
Discussions that report identifying a cause
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Reported cause
Given the number of similar printouts I've seen all of which have had the rear toe, either total toe or the toe on just one rear wheel, out and the front alignment numbers good that printout with front tire alignment obviously the issue is quite a surprise.
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I read in the forum that you get about 10k on the rear tires. I watched my tires and noticed very little wear on the outer tire and more on the inner tire. Tried to push it to 13k. Flat tire today and I got to see the belts on the inner side of the tires when they took them off. I'm converted and saved...10k any day.
The Pirelli tires on my 996 were toast at the 9,000 to 10,000 mile mark. Pirelli tires don't last long IMO. The Michelin PS2 that replaced the Pirelli tires on the 996 were still decent at 15,000 miles.
BTW, my 997.2 has 7,200 miles on it and the rear tires (Pirelli came on the car) are near the wear bars. Probably could get another 1,000 miles on them but I ordered 4 Michelin Pilot Super Sports today. Should be in next week.
I had this same exchange with LVDELL. I had Pirelli's on my car for 20,000 miles before I changed to Michelin PS2's. It depends on how you drive (and I didn't drive like a grandmother, either). There was wear on the rear inner, but the fronts were still pretty good.
Inner edge rear tire wear is a sign the alignment's out. I barely got 8K miles out of a brand new pair of Continental tires on my 03 Turbo due to a bad alignment.
After I replaced the rear tires and after the alignment I can easy get 20K miles and this last set of Bridgestones I managed to get close to 24K miles and the tires were not quite to the wear bars but I was heading out on a long road trip and wanted fresh tires.
Now my tire life is based on ensuring the alignment is right and keeping the tires properly inflated and reasonable driving. I hit the curvy roads once in a while but no tracking. Around town I cool my jets cause hard cornering will tend to eat up the tires.
Oh, my experience is none of the various brands of tires approved for use on Porsches have any better or worse wear. For instance I got as many miles from the Pirelli tires on my Boxster as I did with Michelin tires.
I've run Continentals and Bridgestones on my Turbo and both brands deliver equally good tire life.
What I did notice is the Pirelli tires got very noisy as they aged due to heat cycling I guess compared to the Michelin tires.
Be sure the alignment's correct and unless you have a brick on your right foot tire life should easily double to 16K miles and 20K (or more) miles is obtainable without much effort.
Sincerely,
Macster.
I normally get about 23~24K miles on my Michelin PS2s. I also have the rear camber set to a much more conservative setting. I have about 40K on the fronts.
Alignment is everything.
Bingo!
I think the factory settings for rear camber support rear-engine performance at the expense of tire wear.
(Hey look... Two Orient Red cars next to each other!)
new set of ps2 @ 11.3k miles. i swapped them out for snow tires @ 23.2k miles. thats 11.9k miles. rears down to 3/32", fronts still very good. i thought the ps2 might last a bit longer - at least with my experience on my 540i. new rear ps2 going on this spring.
So what did your Indy tell you about your tire wear? Surely he gave you his opinion about the wear rate for your car. Normal? Driving style? Cabriolet?
What was his recommendation to you?
My experience with both my Boxster (after going through uncounted tires after nearly 250K miles of driving this car) and my Turbo (with now over 70K miles on my 'watch' and I'm starting to get tire experience with this car too, now) is that inner edge rear tire wear is an alignment problem. Everytime I'd observed this the before and after numbers mainly differ in the rear toe in settings.
(In fact, this last road trip the car starting making what I thought was a bearing noise and I took the car to OKC Porsche (Bob Moore Porsche IIRC) and the shop forman test drove the car and said the noise was tire noise, *front* tire noise. The inner edges of the front tires are showing signs of some feathering/cupping and this is a sign of alignment. I asked about having the car aligned then and there but the service manager told me the alignment's not bad enough to do it now, the alignment could wait until the rear tires are in need of replacing at which time I'll replace all 4 tires and have the Turbo aligned.)
I do not want to speak ill of your indy but I wonder if he's as savvy about these cars, their alignment, as he ought to be.
Giving the indy the benefit of the doubt the only other thing that can account for the tire wear is your driving style. Since I'm very aware of tire wear and seek to maximize tire life (I like to save the tires for long road trips not wearing then out around town) I tend to drive rather conservatively in town.
Sincerely,
Macster.
Given the number of similar printouts I've seen all of which have had the rear toe, either total toe or the toe on just one rear wheel, out and the front alignment numbers good that printout with front tire alignment obviously the issue is quite a surprise.
Based on your printout, it could very well be the front alignment is affecting the rear tire wear.
While I have never had any front end alignment issues with my Porsches, 'til now, I may have a chance to get some direct experience.
On a recent road trip in my Turbo I heard noise (at freeway speeds) that at first I thought was a wheel bearing, but the shop foreman at the OKC Porsche dealer test drove the car and said the noise was from the front tires, which were experiencing a bit of inner edge wear, cupping/feathering (one could feel it with one's hand), due to a slight case of front end misalignment.
I asked about having the car aligned and was told the alignment -- based on the degree of cupping/wear in evidence -- was not bad enough to be worth the cost of an alignment -- and the alignment is best done with new tires installed -- and it would be ok to continue to drive the car and when the rear tires were due to be replaced which would then trigger the fronts being replaced too, to have the alignment done then.
So, I now know I have a car with some front end alignment issues and I'll see what if any effect this has on the rear tire wear.
Sincerely,
Macster.
My experience is that the inner edge of the rear tires will wear more quickly than the outside edge when the vehicle is perfectly aligned. I switched to a less aggressive alignment and have enjoyed longer tire life at the expense of a little handling.
I'm just saying that the rear tires on a 996 not wearing perfectly evenly isn't necessarily an example of something being wrong--it often means that everything is RIGHT.
I have the X73 and I can get to a minimum of -2.1 camber on the left and -1.9 on the right. I have both set to -2.1 so I am expecting some additional inner tire wear. The car sure handles nice though.
If you have a lowered suspension, it tends to increase the minimum negative camber unless you have adjustable control arms.
12-15k is average I see, 18 is on the high side. Some do take the cars in and have the alignment set more neutral, but it will detract a bit from steering response. It depends on driving style. Some do performance all-seasons instead as the rubber compound is usually harder. You will get more life from them as opposed to a summer-only tire.
not to be a turd in the punch bowl, but:
you said:
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12-15k is average I see, 18 is on the high side. Some do take the cars in and have the alignment set more neutral, but it will detract a bit from steering response. It depends on driving style. Some do performance all-seasons instead as the rubber compound is usually harder. You will get more life from them as opposed to a summer-only tire.
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well my experience is previously posted:
new set of ps2 @ 11.3k miles. i swapped them out for snow tires @ 23.2k miles. thats 11.9k miles. rears down to 3/32", fronts still very good. i thought the ps2 might last a bit longer - at least with my experience on my 540i. new rear ps2 going on this spring.
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so tire rack web site says (where i have done much positive business)
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Warranty for tires purchased on or after 03/01/11 Treadlife Warranty: 6 Years /
20,000 Miles
Half mileage for rear if different size than front
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so damon i need a new set of rears in the spring (pirelli snowsports now). does my warranty cover 8000miles? please advise.
After the almost-new rear tires that came with my car were almost bald in <10K, I changed out all four for a set of all-seasons. Cost me a grand for all four, and so far after 8K they show no measurable wear whatsoever. I saw no reason to buy expensive, fast-wearing tires for suburban driving at (according to the on-board computer) a cumulative average speed of 27.5 mph
