The Disposable Porsche?

Disclaimer: I like 996s. I've test-driven several and I like the way they drive and I like the way they look (bit lukewarm to the interior, though). I would like to own one. I've owned my RS America for six years and I love Porsches. The questions I am about to pose may elicit emotional responses. There is no malicious intent behind this thread. I've been considering a 996 for several months but have been troubled by a few things that I can hopefully articulate and I'll sincerely appreciate your comments. 1. Do you think replacement engines will be available for 10 - 15 year old 996s? 2. If so, do you think they'll be much more expensive than they are now? 3. Will 996 engine rebuilds ever become feasible? 4. What about the availability of other key parts? 5. Do you think "replace the engine" will ever be replaced by " replace the car"? 6. Has the 996 become the "disposable Porsche?" Again, I'm not trying to start a war, I'm just interested in your opinions. If I buy a 2000 996, in six years (the length I've owned my RSA) it will be 10 years old. I would like to believe that it will be just as serviceable then as my 11 year old RSA is today.

It's a good question. There are probably more sources of parts for my 356's today than there were 40 years ago when the cars were built, but 356's have way way less parts than a 996. And other than the oddball, one-year-only alloy brake calipers, getting parts for my 76 930 is no big deal. But past isn't always prologue. Besides, in 15 years Porsche will go back to the 1900 technology developed by Dr Porsche, and that is the electric wheel hub motor. 150HP/wheel, no brakes, gasoline powered fuel cell, 1750 lbs. I know we will all miss the sound, but the radio can generate it for us with three settings: Wife in Car, Wife Not in Car, and 917. Steve 99 996 76 930 64 356C 62 356B 00 M5 1900 Porsche Lohner Hybrid

All Porsches can be disposable. It all depends on your purpose for owning one and how you treat it. I have 3 keepers and one 'disposable' in the sense that someday it will be owned by someone else. Not that it wont be treated right during my stewardship. Any Porsche can have a bad engine. My '91 911 had a nightmare motor! Wish I had just replaced that motor and kept the car though. If I found the right 356 it would be another keeper.

Let me clarify "disposable". It appears that the solution to 996 engine failures and multiple RMS failures is to replace the engine. If at some point in the future replacement engines are not available or prohibitively expensive will you have to dispose of the car because it is not repairable? It sounds extreme but I get nervous when the solution to a problem is replace instead of repair.

Agreed, it is a good question. I plan on keeping mine indefinitely, I love it so much. But who knows? It is a troubling thought, possibly having to replace the entire engine, having heard all of the stories. I can't imagine Porsche not offering an engine for it at some point. As the car ages more and more, I'm sure rebuilds will become a possiblity from Porsche engine builders from all over.

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It's an excellent question. So here am I with a 4 year + 996 with 38k miles. It's onto its 4th RMS and still leaking. It's very likely the engine will need replacing but I know for an absolute certain fact that Porsche UK will not replace it. I will have to pay for it or a fair chunk of it "if" they offer any good will. Then there's my gearbox. it's hosed too. It's been whining since about 27,000 miles. Again they won't replace it. I have to pay �3000 towards cost. So what will I do if shortly they tell me that I need a totally new powerplant and that I have to cough up the cash. I dunno. I am fairly certain I will take it to the courts. I hate to think of it as disposable but it shure is badly manufactured.

Surf, First off there is nothing about a 996 engine that keeps it from being rebuilt. Porsche and/or aftermarket suppliers could provide parts and the 996 engine could be repaired like any other 911 powerplant. I assume that over time that is what will happen. Porsche will either wind down the engine replacement program for 996s or increase the cost until it is no longer cost effective. For now I think the program is great. The engines are not disposable. They are rebuilt, only by Porsche rather than by the dealer or a local shop. This program is good for both the customer and for Porsche. Porsche gets revenue that would normally have gone to a local shop. They have a chance to gather a great deal of information about how the engines are wearing/breaking and they can control the quality of engine rebuilds. I happen to have a great local shop but we've all heard horror stories. It's great for the customer because you can replace your engine with one rebuilt by Porsche with a factory supported warranty for about half the price and a fraction of the time it used to take to have one rebuilt. Now the transmission is a completely different story. I think that replacement program is a joke. I hope it goes away real soon. Jim

Jim, that makes a lot of sense. I appreciate everyone's thoughtful responses.

Seeing how the 997 engine is just a slightly tweaked version of the existing M96 engine, it's a good chance that a MY1998 996 will still have many engine parts in common with an outgoing MY2008 997...

Doubt it very much. The engine will only be the same in so far as it being a flat 6. I think that's about all.

I wouldnt be so sure about the base engine in the 997 being so different from the 996. Hasnt it been suggested that the RMS issue may very well still be present on the 997? There is at least enough doubt that people are talking about it which means it is most likely not a massive redesign. As far as the longevity of the 996 goes, given that it was the best selling 911 in the history of Porsche and it put 911s in the hands of many, many more people than would have ever owned one in the past (due to its more mass market appeal), I think it's safe to assume that there will continue to be a healthy aftermarket for the car. The other thing is that the RMS failure is not an absolute. Many many cars have never had, and likely will never have, an RMS issue. Of course there are cases of people getting 4 bad engines in a row, but I have to think that's incredibly bad luck given that there are also plenty of people that have never had an RMS issue at all.

4 bad engines don't tell me this is true I may be on my second rebuilt ! What are they doing to there remanufactured engines comming from porsche ? Something in rebuilding process there must be problem porsche is not aware of or is it the casing materal ? My current 99C2 lasted 500miles on a remanufactured and 4 days of driving never over 4,200RPM.

Funny thing about the 997. My mechanic friend went to 997 training school 2 weeks ago and said the seal looked like the one used on a Cayenne. I looked up the part numbers and he is correct, they are the same.

is that a good or a bad thing?

What edges these cars toward becoming "disposable" is their increasing complexity. With every additional automatic motor, computerized sensor, etc. there are additional problems to address over time. It's kind of like the 928 situation. I've never heard anyone say that 928s are a breeze to work on. As time passes, more problems emerge and the cost of repair begins to exceed the value of the car. There's a 944 at my local mechanic's shop that was abandoned. The owner chose to ditch the entire car rather than fork out the cash to repair it! I look at the 997 and am impressed. Then I wonder what happens about 10 years down the line when PASM starts acting up. (leading to SPASM)