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YOUR RESEARCHTiming Chain Help
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Install bank 4-5-6 as indicated
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Leading evidence: 'Install bank 4-5-6 as indicated' (no explicit attributable resolution; this is a reported action or suggestion). Across 1 matching discussions, The most frequently discussed action is 'Adjust device' (1 discussions). For that action, 0 discussions report a resolution and 0 report an unsuccessful attempt. No action has an explicit, attributable resolution report under the current rules. These are forum reports and suggestions, not a confirmed diagnosis.
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Loosely fit the bearing caps, they cannot be mixed up, they must be re-installed from were they were removed!!!
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(FYI, cams are installed on overlap because they are relaxed, no valves open, no pressure on cams for that bank), All you need to do is pull the cam plugs, (little green plugs, at the end of the cam cover) to see how the cams are allocated.
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This blind hole (all the other holes are oil passages!!) must be fitted onto the pin.
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The camshafts must be installed with the crank 60 deg before TDC.
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(FYI, cams are installed on overlap because they are relaxed, no valves open, no pressure on cams for that bank), All you need to do is pull the cam plugs, (little green plugs, at the end of the cam cover) to see how the cams are allocated.
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It is currently off, and I didn't take it off. The person I know who took it off just wanted to make sure if they're doing it right at the moment. Also the cams are off too if that makes a difference.
Sheng
Go here:
http://www.cannell.co.uk/Manuals.htm
and scroll down to Porsche 996 and 996 Workshop Manual - Engine Part 2 and download PDF file.
It has directions for assembling cams and setting timing. You still need to know what you are doing though.
Sincerely,
Macster.
Just wondering if anyone can give me the answers quickly to this.
What is the torque sequence of the cylinder head bolts.
Also what is the timing for the timing chain bank 4-6.
Sheng
This has to be the most confusing post I have seen in a while!!! I have some questions for you.
*How far down do you, your buddy, whoever have the engine torn down? Are the cases split? What are you doing? Why are the cams out? I assume the engine is out of the car correct??? Do you have any special tools?
WTF!!!
Engine is out for the correct car. There was an initial problem with the car losing power on fourth gear onward. Porsche said to replace the whole engine, so we ended up tearing down bank 4-6 to find there was something wrong with the valve. Now that bank 4-6 are opened up we have to put it all back together.
Sheng
OK. I am not at work to look at the Workshop Manual right now, but I can give some pointers until tomorrow AM. Cylinder head torque sequence is on page 19 in the PDF link provided above.
BUTT
that is all that manual is good for!!!!!!!!!!!!! That manual is for the 3.4L engine.
The cam timing procedure is COMPLETELY DIFFERENT for your 2004 3.6L VARIO CAM PLUS engine.
Are you a independent workshop, our just some guys building this engine at your house? You are going to need special tools to set cam timing and torque the cam sprocket bolts!!!!!!! The intake cam can be a little tricky to intstall correctly!!!!
Ah... makes sense, I was talking to my buddy and he said the diagram isn't all the same as the engine we currently have out. The car itself is for an uncle of mine. Other than that thanks for the help you're providing.
Sheng
Do you guys have much engine building experience? Porsche experience? Do you have all the parts you need to complete the job? What did you find wrong with the valve (intake or exhaust)?
Personally I'm not sure, as I have limited knowledge, my buddy rebuilt a 944 engine pretty much from scratch before. As well as other engine. The 996 this is our first one, that's why I'm trying to accumulate as much information as possible. Yes we have all the parts we need to complete the job.
Sheng
Do you have a porsche dealer or qualified indy close to your location? Because I can tell you step by step how to install the cams and set camshaft timing, but you are going to need special tools to do this!!!!!! There is no way around this!!!!! Trust me, you do not want to F-this thing up. It can get very expensive very quick.
I have a Porsche dealer nearby, but don't really trust them since they wanted to put in a re-manufactured engine right away. Unless you mean just to get the special tools? Other than that if you can let me know how to do it step by step that will be a huge bonus.
Sheng
When you are just timing one bank, you must, I repeat MUST know for sure that the other bank (bank 1 in this case) is on TDC compression when you install the bank 2 cams in on overlap!! Cams are installed on OVERLAP (intake is just opening and exhaust is closing) For cyl#4 the camshaft lobes should point away from eachother when on overlap. (FYI, cams are installed on overlap because they are relaxed, no valves open, no pressure on cams for that bank), All you need to do is pull the cam plugs, (little green plugs, at the end of the cam cover) to see how the cams are allocated. When you pull out your green cam plugs, opposite end of camshaft sprockets. So for Bank 1 they will be on the front of the engine, below the alternator etc... for bank 2 they will be on the back of the engine (flywheel side). Once you have the plugs removed, you will see the ends of the camshafts. Rotate engine to TDC , the crank pully is marked "OT" and there will be a notch in the pully that lines up with a casting mark in the engine case the reads " OT Zyl 1". Fix the pully with pin, through hole marked "OT". You are now on either TDC compression #1 or overlap #1. This is why you must pull the green cam plugs. With the crank fixed @TDC, look at the ends of your camshafts for bank 1, If the smaller circular cutouts are pointing away from the engine then it can be said that cylinder #1 is on TDC overlap and cylinder #4 is on TDC compression. If the smaller circualr cutouts are pointing inward toward engine, then it can now be said that cyl #4 is on TDC overlap and cyl #1 is on TDC compression. Ok this is were it gets a little confusing. The camshafts must be installed with the crank 60 deg before TDC. If you look at the crankshaft pully, you will see the hole marked U6, you need to pin the crank threw this hole, so the crank is 60 deg before TDC "overlap" #4.
Prior to installing the camshafts, you should have installed all lifters with asseymbly lube or motor oil. The intake cam is very easy to screw up. The aluminum collar that covers the vario cam vane adjuster oil control rings, must be indexed to the cylinder head. You will see a pin in the center of bearing saddle, and then you must locate the blind hole in the aluminum collar on the intake camshaft. This blind hole (all the other holes are oil passages!!) must be fitted onto the pin. If you screw this up, you will have camshaft adjustment faults!!! Once the intake cam is installed on overlap, install the exhaust cam in on overlap (the lobes for cyl #4 should point away from eachother. Loosely fit the bearing caps, they cannot be mixed up, they must be re-installed from were they were removed!!! Fit the vario cam vane adjuster(sprocket), fit the exhaust cam gear (with the holes half coverd).
DO NOT
tighten Intake cam sprocket bolt at this time!!! Fit the chain guide rail between the sprockets, fit the chain tensioner. Remove pin from U6, Rotate the crank to TDC, hole OT and pin it.(this is how they remove slack from timing chain). The exhaust cam bolt holes should now come into view, install the special tool into to back of cams, tool #9686. Torque bearing sadles. Perform
inital
torque on the cams, 37 ftlbs on the intake and 10.5 on the exhasut.
Remove
cam timing tool from back of cams, (if you fail to do this, you run the risk of snapping the intake camshaft upon performing final torque.)
Install special tool that looks like a old school telephone(9685), torque
(new)
intake cam bolt by additional 110 deg and you are done. Rotate crank 360 deg to check bank 1 with special tool 9686, rotate 360 re-check bank 2.
Like I said, I will look at the Workshop manual tomorrow and provide more info (special tool #s and torque specs) and maybe some pics. Good Luck........
Notice comments in the manual about the special tool going in easy if the cams are set right. Not easily forced, close, kind of, and such. Also the crank comments are a must. Pretty much all the manual is a must do in sequences. I think I'll have a scarey dream now
Best thing is with pdf manuals you can print pages for the garage and not be greasing up the good book. Best of luck understanding the sequence to you. Pictures would be nice
Thanks for catching that. I didn't look for the 3.6l engine details until I read your post and found the 3.6l info not present at the link I provided.
To OP, sorry for posting incorrect info!
Sincerely,
Macster.
This is cam installation and timing (bank 2) from the workshop manual. Everything but the pictures.
Installing camshafts - cylinder bank 4 - 6
1. In order to remove the play from the control chain drive, turn the engine at the belt pulley of the crankshaft clockwise (engine direction of rotation) to 60� before TDC (identification U6 on the belt pulley is flush with the fixing bore in the crankcase). Fix with the special tool fixing pins as of mod. 98 9595/1 . Use short fixing pin.
2. Turn the engine at the assembly support until cylinder bank 4-6 stands vertically upwards.
Caution
Flat-base tappets have been run in in the fitting bores and must be inserted again in their original position (allocation). For oiling, only use new engine oil.
3. Install flat-base tappets, side 4-6. Coat the tappets with new engine oil and insert them according to the relevant allocation for each cylinder (as removed). Make sure that the dowel pins of the inlet stroke tappets are flush with the bores in the housing -arrow- .
4. Oil the bearing surfaces of the camshafts with new engine oil.
5. Insert inlet camshaft 4-6. If necessary, pre-assemble the inlet camshaft → 150537 Disassembling and assembling inlet camshaft. Pull the control chain out of the chain housing of the cylinder head with a welding wire and position on the toothed ring of the camshaft adjuster, at the same time inserting the camshaft at overlapping TDC of cylinder 4 (the cams of cylinder 4 point towards the bulkhead of the flat-base tappet housing -arrows- ).
Information
Make sure that the bearing sleeve of the inlet camshaft is positioned correctly.
6. The bearing sleeve of the inlet camshaft must be positioned so that the centrally bored blind hole points vertically upwards (the rib of the cylinder head should also be at the centre in relation to the bearing sleeve). In this position, the dowel pin in the bearing bore of the cylinder head will fit precisely into the opposite off-centre blind hole bore. Any other bores are through-holes for guiding the oil.
7. Insert exhaust camshaft 4-6. Lay the control chain on the flange for the chain sprocket, then insert the camshaft at overlapping TDC of cylinder 4 (the cams of cylinder 4 point towards the cams of the inlet camshaft -arrows- ).
8. Install the chain sprocket of the exhaust camshaft. Insert the chain sprocket in the control chain, then position on the camshaft flange. The four threaded bores in the camshaft flange must be approximately half covered to the right by the slots of the chain sprocket in the engine direction of rotation.
Information
Do not interchange the thrust bearings of the inlet and exhaust camshafts during assembly. Observe the identification (Figure shows inlet camshaft bearings).
Designation of inlet camshaft bearing: thrust bearing: E and pairing number on cylinder head/cylinder head cover, bearing cover of the bearing sleeve: only pairing number.
Designation of exhaust camshaft bearing: thrust bearing on chain sprocket: 1A and pairing number on cylinder head/cylinder head cover, 2nd thrust bearing: 2A and pairing number on cylinder head/cylinder head cover.
9. Insert three thrust bearings and one bearing cover for the bearing sleeve of the camshafts with the guide rail for the control chain. Eight hexagon socket bearing screws: position six M6 x 35 (Item 1) and two M6 x 40 (Item 2) screws for the camshaft bearings and the guide rail and tighten slightly.
Position of the bearing screws: Item 1 = M6 x 35, Item 2 = M6 x 40
Adjusting timing, side 4 - 6
1. Align camshafts. On both camshafts, the smaller circular cutouts must lie at the top -arrows- .
2. Fix the camshafts with special tool adjustment gauge 9686 and fasten the gauge with one M8 auxiliary screw (e.g. M8 x 16 hexagon-head bolt) (flat tool surface should face upwards). Only tighten the screw slightly.
3. Screw the bearing cover screws of the inlet and exhaust camshafts and the auxiliary screw of the adjustment gauge alternately by another approx. 90� until the specified tightening torque of 10 Nm (7.5 ftlb.) is reached.
Tightening torque: 10 Nm (7.5 ftlb.)
4. Insert the guide rail screw with a new O-ring and tighten. Hexagon socket M6, a/f 5.
Tightening torque: 10 Nm (7.5 ftlb.)
5. Fit the chain tensioner, side 4-6 (hexagon socket a/f 14). Replace sealing ring. Position the chain tensioner with new sealing ring and tighten with a torque wrench.
Tightening torque: 80 Nm (59 ftlb.)
Information
Move the engine at the belt pulley of the crankshaft to the TDC marking without fail.
6. Turn the engine at the belt pulley of the crankshaft clockwise (engine direction of rotation) to the TDC marking (the TDC bore in the belt pulley is flush with the fixing bore in the crankcase). Fix with the special tool fixing pins as of mod. 98 9595/1 . Use short fixing pin.
7. Position the four M6 x 12 hexagon-head bolts for the chain sprocket of the exhaust camshaft and tighten crosswise with a torque wrench.
Tightening torque: 14 Nm (10.5 ftlb.)
8. Tighten the central screw of the camshaft adjusting device. Position special tool retaining tool 9685 on the adapter of the central screw and place the loose contact block at the fitting bore of the oil extraction pump. Tighten the hexagon-head bolt on the contact block.
9. Tighten the central screw in two stages.
First stage: pre-tightening torque: 50 Nm (37 ftlb.).
Information
Before the final tightening of the central screw, remove special tool adjustment gauge 9686 without fail.
10. Remove special tool adjustment gauge 9686 . Unscrew the M8 auxiliary screw and pull off the gauge.
Second stage: final tightening of central screw: 110� torque angle with torque angle wrench.
Hi, I have been looking for this kind of detailled instructions for my 3 chains engine. Great. Thanks.
I installed bank 4-5-6 as indicated.
BUT, as I changed the intermediate shaft after the 1-2-3 timing chain was broken, I also have 1-2-3 to install.
I'm missing the crank position to fix, and which cylinder has to be at overlapping TDC when setting the camshafts on 1-2-3 head, assuming that everything else will be similar.
Could someone help me.
Thanks
Marc
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