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YOUR RESEARCHthat gunk in the oil filler tube
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Check intermix
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Performed · outcome unconfirmed
And believe me I checked for intermix on mine and never found water on the dipstick or in the oil.
Check gunk regularly cause if there's a problem i want
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Suggestion
Being I had just recently -- last June -- bought the car I checked for gunk regularly cause if there's a problem I want to identify it while car is still under CPO warranty.
Leading evidence: 'Check intermix' (no explicit attributable resolution; this is a reported action or suggestion). Across 1 matching discussions, The most frequently discussed action is 'Check gunk regularly cause if there's a problem i want' (1 discussions). For that action, 0 discussions report a resolution and 0 report an unsuccessful attempt. No action has an explicit, attributable resolution report under the current rules. These are forum reports and suggestions, not a confirmed diagnosis.
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Performed · outcome unconfirmed · Original poster
Buddy's 996 checked the other day with another oil in there has a major dose of gunk.
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Thats a good point, one other thing I did was removed the o'ring in the cap, cleaned it thouroghly, applied some o'ring grease, cleaned the top sealing lip on the filler tube and make sure your cap is on tight.........
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so, after the new motor installed my Indy turned me onto Motul, 5w-40 x-clean.
These are separate views of the same evidence. Frequency alone does not establish a fix, and these counts must not be added together.
Check gunk regularly cause if there's a problem i want
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Suggestion
Being I had just recently -- last June -- bought the car I checked for gunk regularly cause if there's a problem I want to identify it while car is still under CPO warranty.
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Suggestion
Those of use that drove VW beetles in the 50�s � 60�s as everyday transportation through cold winters were used to cleaning the emulsification out of the filler neck.
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Thats a good point, one other thing I did was removed the o'ring in the cap, cleaned it thouroghly, applied some o'ring grease, cleaned the top sealing lip on the filler tube and make sure your cap is on tight.........
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OK, first off this is risky, but been a while since we have had a disscussion...
not about what oil per-say (ends up there though) but about the gunk.
was one of my first posts here asking about what the yellow goo, gunk, slime in the oil filler tube was.
my first motor was strictly on a diet of Mobil 1, not my choice but whatever.
that motor calved. clearly not oil related (?) but I still feel all that moisture in there cant be good, can it?
so, after the new motor installed my Indy turned me onto Motul, 5w-40 x-clean.
no gunk in the oil fill tube ever again.....
Buddy's 996 checked the other day with another oil in there has a major dose of gunk. that car is driven lots, and not pussied about, 70 kilometers a day at least, so it's not a short drive symptom.
finally the question,
your thoughts please.
does the gunk matter? does it hurt the engine?
initially I was told it does not but I'm not so sure 'bout that now after three years of ownership.
do you get the gunk with the oil you use and if not what do you use?
I want an oil that won't give me the dose is what it's all about, just for piece of mind.
cheers,
Geoff
(apologies in advance if this turns ugly)
I use shell helix ultra (now name changed to Q power) 5-40 its a great oil for Seattle.
I had the gunk,
Made two changes and now its dry and very dry and brown in the tube - no creamy color and no frothy stuff.
The 2 changes - new AOS - and the oil.
Since you drive it, I won't compare that. I drive mine too and in Seattle we have plenty of moisture in the air (and oil)
My advice is 5k on oil, get a new aos and use one of the oils sure to be posted as "works for me"
Gunk in that area tells me you don't drive it long enough to get the engine really hot to bake out all that moisture. Now, quickly log off and start your engine. Go drive! Now!
I drive 50+ miles a day, but when I had my engine/transmission out two weeks for maintenance (AOS/tensioners/guides/chutch/IMS seal/bearing/RMS/water pump), the first start I had water dripping out of the exhaust couplers (near the cats). The next day I had a light build up of "the gunk". It's incredible how much water an engine collects, by just sitting.
Rick
99 996C4
87 944S
As the others have stated, higher moisture and cooler winter temperatures are the main contributing factors to gunk build up. Longer drives with engine fully up to normal operating temps will help reduce the gunk. More frequent oil changes could also help if you live in a humid/wet climate.
That is just condensation in the oil filler tube. Are you sure you have the cap on all the way? After I changed my oil for the first time, I didn't completely tighten the cap (you have to REALLY turn it, atleast on mine) and I had some condensation. I cleaned it up, reinstalled it and made sure it was completely tight, and I haven't had that issue again.
I am using Lubro-Moly 5w40 Synthetic. It's great stuff.
Thats a good point, one other thing I did was removed the o'ring in the cap, cleaned it thouroghly, applied some o'ring grease, cleaned the top sealing lip on the filler tube and make sure your cap is on tight.........
Hi Dan - I'm the subject of Geoff's post.
I drive my car every day, 50 miles per day and I drive hard. This is *not* an issue of the engine not getting hot enough. This is simply not the case.
Like Geoff, I ran Mobil 1 and got the gunk. Then we switched to Motul and the gunk disappeared. Then the Motul supply ran out so I switched to Total, now the gunk is back.
Geoff on the other hand drives his car relatively infrequently and he's a ***** compared to me. He has no gunk in his filler tube. Note that he is still on Motul, because he doesn't put the miles on like I do so he hasn't dumped his Motul yet.
The only variable here is the oil. Don't bother arguing.
So what oils are you guys that do *not* have the oil filler gunk using?
Cheers
Too much speculation going on here. If you want to find out how your engine is doing and how that affects the oil, spend 25 bucks on an oil analysis.
I can recommend
www.blackstone-labs.com
JP
I had Mobil1 originally in the car and there was condensation. After only 50 miles of driving without the cap completely tight, it looked like this:
I cleaned it, put it on tight, and it has been fine for the past 1500 miles. I would assume that if you are getting gunk, perhaps the seal isn't air-tight.
I had my previous oil analyzed as well, and I think I forgot to post that in here. I will create a new thread and do that now.
- Anthony
All right - I'll carry out the experiment. Clean out the tube, an inspection of the o-ring on the cap, then a film of oil on that o-ring to make a good seal, and run it for a week. I'll report back and eat crow if the gunk disappears. Mind you....whatever moisture was or wasn't in my oil when I first put it in might be cooked off and in my filler tube by now, so the test won't be a perfect negative test...it will be a good positive test though.
Mine filler tube is bad and the gunk is yellow. I took a picture today and will load it up tomorrow. The oil on the dipstick is clean and clear though.
The yellowy white gunk is clearly water emulsified in oil. No need for a lab analysis to figure that out. The big questions are:
1) Do certain oils contain significant amounts of water which vapourizes in the motor and then condenses in the relatively cool oil filler tube?
2) Do certain oils have a higher affinity for water, which leads to the same phenomenon?
3) Is a poor vapour seal at the oil filler capo to blame and this coincidentally shows up after an oil change when a brand switch may or may not have happened.
Time for some properly designed experiments.
I'll just say....
yes
yes
yes
There are so many things oils have in them its confusing. There are ingredients for high temp, metals, fancy this and that chemicals. When a lot of guys think their oil is dirty it is actually a coloring from the oil getting hot. Yes there is an additive that forstalls that too. You've got me for what the ingredients are in each oil. Seems race bike guys dive into particulars much more than car nuts. I've even recently been tempted to try 15w50 Motorex oil like my bike uses. I'm thinking 7000rpms max of a porsche verses 14000rpms of the gsx-r1000 bike would give the motorex oil a cake walk.
I have 170k miles on my 2002 c2. I have had the car since new.
From my experience, when I drive at high speeds in cold weather, I will get that gunk This even happens on 50+miles trips when I have redlined the engine more than a few times.
When I drive relatively slowly, in hot weather, I will not get it. This happens even when I have kept the rpms low for the whole trip.
What I am fairly sure happens is that the cold outside air blowing into that area (around the oil filler tube and cap) keeps that area cool, and the water condenses. High speed driving in cold weather makes it worse.
When I am driving slowly in the city, the hot air from the engine keeps that area warm/hot. The cold outside air does not blow in there as much. So there is no condensation.
As others have said, that gunk is simply moisture. For these cars, I consider the gunk in the filler tube and cap area to be normal.
Just my 2 cents.
b-man
It only happens to my 996 during cold weather. In the summer, I'm gunk free!
I just went out and checked mine, and it is gunky. I drive 30 miles to work, so I know my engine gets warm - but it has been very, very cold outside lately.
Why all of the concern about the transmogrified oil\water tapioca in the top of the long filler tube?
Those of use that drove VW beetles in the 50�s � 60�s as everyday transportation through cold winters were used to cleaning the emulsification out of the filler neck.
Sometimes one could get more then � cup of the stuff. If you never cleaned it out it could almost choke the tube off completely. And believe me I checked for intermix on mine and never found water on the dipstick or in the oil. Just at the top of the filler. Also I�m pretty sure that the 3.5 quarts of oil got hot even though the engines were mostly under stressed.
I dissagree that it is normal, but dont believe it is a major issue.
Mine had it and after "whatever I did" or "however I drive it" I dont have ANY anymore...
The car lived only 30 miles away from me so the weather is the same........
I have had 5 VW bugs, none newer than 1973 and as old as 1960 - I have seen it on them, but not all of them......
New still in the original bottle engine oils have very low amounts of water. Even opened the oil does not attract or retain moisture like brake fluid which has an attraction for moisture.
(Note this may not be the case for other bottled engine oil or fuel additives. I used to own a diesel and would buy and add a diesel fuel additive once in a while to my car's fuel tank. I'd open the bottle, remove the foil seal, and pour the stuff into the fuel tank all but a quarter of a cup. Sometimes at the bottom there would be a small pea sized blob of water/gunk rolling around in the remaining fuel addtiive.)
AFAIK all modern engine oils have the same very low affinity for moisture.
The seal at the oil filler tube should be very good or that's a vacuum leak.
The real problem is that water vapor gets into the oil as a by product of combustion. The upper reaches of the oil filler tube are relatively cool compared to other areas so when engine is hot and the crankcase vapors are laden with water vapor then when you shut off the engine the fumes in the oil filler tube cool down very rapidly and the water condenses out on the colder surfaces where it mixes with the slight amount of oil that has collected there and the slightly discolored butter or thick cream-like stuff appears.
That this is present suggests several things: 1) The engine is not being run long enough and gotten hot enough to heat the oil up high enough to boil the water out of the oil. 2) Because of (1) the engine oil should be changed more often to keep the build up of water in the oil down.
As long as there are no water droplets on the dipstick, no smell of antifreeze in the exhaust and the coolant tank remains free of any signs of oil and there are are no other signs of engine distress -- oil and coolant levels remain constact or do not show signs of drastic drops in their levels -- the presence of that creamy junk in the oil filler tube around the bottom of the cap and at the uppermost reaches of the tube is normal.
Sincerely,
Macster.
Hmmmm no problem here in Hawaii. My advice is walk outside barefoot in shorts and t-shirt and take stock in what you are doing to yourself and family besides your cars.
The condensation is actually conveying some good info to the owner of the car. It is an indication of just how much moisture is present in the car's oil.
The solutiion is not to insulate the tube to avoid the condensation but to change the oil/filter more often to drain the oil with the water out of the engine and replace it with fresh water free oil.
Water in oil lowers the oil's viscosity and the last thing these engines need is lower viscosity oil.
Sincerely,
Macster.
thank you sir, finally, something that says water in the oil is not such a good thing.
I tend to believe it is a function of the oil used, just by observation, trial and error.
When I ran oil XXX no matter the driving habits the gunk was present, switch oil no gunk.
It may be "normal" but I can't believe it's harmless over the long term.
i'll have to think about this.
i change oil every 6 months or 2500 miles, whichever comes first, and i have gunk in the filler tube in winter. so i'm not sure if i should be changing more often or that the cause of the gunk is not indicative of water in the oil. there's always going to be a bit from the moisture in the air in the filler tube, but is that enough to form the gunk?
i'm still unsure.
Guys, what you are seeing is not condensation emulsifying with the oil, it is the grease inside your IMS bearing that has finally leaked out causing a reaction.
This is the first sign of an immenent IMS failure.....!!!!!!!!!!!
Relax......just kiddin'
Sorry, I had to do it!
As others said, the tube is a great ways away from the engine where it is cool which allows oil vapor to mix with condensation creating a nice, buttery goodness.
Any good suggestions on a good way to clean the filler tube? Should it be removed, or should I just try to reach down through the opening and scoop out the gunk?
I don't get this gunk, for some reason. My car frequently gets driven very short distances from a cold start in the winter, and I use The Oil That Dares Not Speak Its Name. About the only difference between me an some others here that I can see is that my car is parked underground at both ends of my commute.
Will follow with interest.
If you have a small crack on the filler tube, humidity will be creeping in and condensation/moisture may occur... ergo the gunk. even if the cap is tight.
It is normal absent any other sources of water in the oil like a cracked block, head, leaking gasket, or possibly a leaking oil/water cooler. Also, that this gunk's presence gets mentioned in various buyer guides for water cooled Porsches, at least in those buyer guides published in UK car mags, suggests it is rather common and normal.
Being normal however doesn't mean it is not harmless, or at least does not present some increased risk of harm to the engine.
As I mentioned, water in oil lower's the oil's viscosity and the last thing these engines need is lower viscosity oil.
I'm sure that when you changed the oil the gunk was absent afterwards. Draining the oil of course removes the water along with the old oil.
However, absence of any gunk afterwards is probably due to a change in climate conditions -- and I believe your claim you made no change in driving style -- and less attributable to the differences in the old oil vs. the new oil.
I've seen this gunk, but thankfully not that much, on my Turbo's oil cap and around the oil filler tube opening, but after wiping it away it has not returned.
Being I had just recently -- last June -- bought the car I checked for gunk regularly cause if there's a problem I want to identify it while car is still under CPO warranty. It has not reappeared and while I have changed the oil several times, once or twice using Mobil 1 0w-40 and then switching to Mobil 1 0W-40 and the last oil service switching to Castrol Syntec 5w-50, I do not believe the differences in oil viscosity or even brands accounts for the absence, only that I'm driving the car more often and now that I'm more comfortable with the car driving it longer distances and driving the car a bit more aggressively than when I first got it.
Sincerely,
Macster.
Yes. I moved into a new position with my company (I'm very excited about it) that is field based. I now have responsibility for sales, inventory, operations and managing a distributor network in the mountain area of the US. I cover 11 states, from west Texas up to Alaska, including Hawaii! We decided to move to the center of the area, someplace reasonably close to an airport hub due to all my travel. The two obvious choices were Denver and Salt Lake City. We chose Denver. We are currently looking for a house in the town of Evergreen, up in the foothills west of the city.
I'm excited about the possibility of driving the 996 on a road that actually has a curve!
Texan Hoosier Buffalo maybe... who knows...
I'll always be a Texan!
Thanks!
Moving always sucks, especially across the country. We have also only been in this house for two years. And we're moving two teenagers - both in high school. But... we'll get through it!
Will your move west be impacted by the weak real estate market, or does your company step up to the plate and lend you a hand with selling your current home?
I've got an excellent relocation package, and so they will step up if we don't sell it. We are required to have it listed within 105% of the appraised value for 45 days, and then we can accept the company offer if we choose. I also have a "loss on sale" provision in my relocation package, so the worst case scenario is one in which we break even on the house. If we are lucky enough to sell it in the first 60 days, we get a cash bonus of 3% of the sale price. We have priced it aggressively and hope to sell it quickly.
Fortunately, we may be able to take advantage of the market conditions when we buy a new house. However, even with the market depressed, houses in Evergreen, Colorado are much more expensive than in Fort Wayne, Indiana. We're still in a little bit of sticker shock. I think I'll get over it the first time I go skiing, only 30 minutes from my new home!
OK - thread revival because I have an update.
As stated earlier in this thread, I changed my oil about 4000 miles ago. It was filled with Total and I had sludge. I filled it with Motul this time, an oil I have had success with in the past.
The last 2 months have been some of the coldest wettest and coldest weather we have had for some time here in BC, and for those of you not in the know...Southern British Columbia is a very wet place in the late winter.
Result.....NO SLUDGE. The filler tube is nice and clean.
So as far as I'm concerned, there is no argument. Using Mobil 1 will result in sludge in your filler tube. Using Total oil will also result in sludge in your filler tube.
Use Motul and there will be no sludge in your filler tube...even in cold wet weather.
I drive my car 75 kilometres every day. Half of it normal, the other half too fast. It's the same every day. The sludge is *not* a result of under driving the car. I do not under drive my car. It's gets hot every day and it sees redline several times per day.
The sludge is a result of using lower quality oil.
+996, I used to use Mobil Water & would always get the sludge, I even tried additives & no luck. Plus I still had an oil leak even after switching out the RMS & the car also burned oil... Switched to Motul 300V after Mobil finished dissappointing me at the track when oil pressure started dropping & heat rising like crazy to the point that I had to end the day early. After switching to Motul, not only is the sludge gone, but it's also kept up amazingly at the track & my car doesn't leak & hardly burns any oil anymore. Sounds like a commercial, but I will never use anything other than Motul after seeing the huge difference it's made in everything. Porsche's slogan applies to Motul oil as well: There is no substitute.
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