What is causing this blown engine problem on the 3.4's? What years does it affect?

I have been quite interested in a 996 c2 3.4l especially as of lately with the prices dropping. After some updated research, I am rather irked by the fact that everyone is crying about the engine blowing up, and at the rate porsche dealers charge. I would be too. I saw mention of it happening in both the 3.4l and 3.6l engines. Are all years of the watercooled non GT1 block plagued by this occurence? What the F is really happening? I've seen mentions of loss of power and then CEL. Other mentions of oil in cylinder, and some of oil in two cylinders. Could this be an oil leak and then a limp home ECU problem that porsche is ripping everyone on? Is it piston rings, or a gasket. Someone has to have had their engine rebuilt and not just go the porsche dealer reman route. Is there any reason to not trust the Porsche dealer/factory about this issue? They won't own up to the fault, but could they be making it out to be more than it is? Is it even an issue worth a full engine rebuild. Of course on a 911, but is it light oil consumption and some oil in the cylinder or is the cylinder bathed and the thing drinking dino juice like the old aircooled engines like too. Thanks for any replies and answers in advance, Ben Martin

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Ben, I highly recommend checking out the Sept. 2008 issue of Excellence magazine, which has an intelligent, sane, evaluation of the 996 and discusses the....ssshhhh.....(engine issues.) It's a sensitive topic on this board. I have a 1999 996 with 65K miles, which is 100% all original (except consumables oil, spark plugs, etc.). Yes, original clutch which operates perfectly. At today's prices how could you go wrong? seriously HOW? To say the 996 is a bargain is like saying stocks are down this year.

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There's a ton of info on the subject that can be found via the search. And lots of drama too... Anyways, the 996 Enthusiasts guide has good info, as does the Sept 2008 article in Excellence.

Well well, I'll have to remember that issue of excellence. I read one article about the reliability of the M96 blocks and it said they were golden and mentioned nothing of this, but it was comparing the watercooled series to the aircooled engines. Could it possibly be about cars that don't get driven like a Porsche SHOULD be driven. Not how most upper white class males baby them like a granny in a prius. Taking good care of a porsche by warming it up and not making short trips, and driving it like a chauffer are two diff things There is a similar issue in the renesis rotary engine in the RX-8. Engine replacement from cars that are not driven hard enough. They have not had this problem with anyone who is a track enthusiast, as they regularly redline the bajesus out of the engine. I know several porsche owners, and am not sure that they seek out the redline often enough. I do it every time I drive, but then again I drive rotary engines currently. zoom zoom boom -Ben Martin

Where may I find this enthusiast guide? Is it located within Rennlists website? And yes, I have been searching. It seems as if most of these are being handled by people shelling out $12-14k and having porsche blindly change it out for a reman. No one is reporting any actual pictures or data from an affected engine as far as I have found. And you guys are way more helpful than over at 6speed. 3 days, 1 response to no particular question that I asked. Thank you! -Ben Martin

It's a $100 book, you can order it from Amazon, Borders, etc. Expensive (as hell IMO) but it does have lots of good info. I got mine with my 40% off coupon from Borders so it was slightly more "reasonable"... The reality is that these motors do have some issues that cause failures, but the percentage of cars with the major issues is statistically minor (which doesn't mean much if it happens to YOU...). Porsche has released parts to fix a bunch of it and all the reman engines since 2005 I believe have those parts. This shouldn't really be a huge concern, it's either going to happen or not, with the chances leaning greatly towards "not". It's something to consider for sure, but the rest of the car outweighs the small chance of this happening. On the plus side, if it does happen and you replace the motor, you'll get a 2 year warranty on it and a car that is likely to last many many more miles without issue. As for the motors, they aren't sleeved like normal, so when you get hydrolock in one, you actually crack and break the CASING not the sleeve since the cylinder is part of the casting. edit: I wrote "this should really be a huge concern" but meant "shouldn't"

Great write up on this exact question from the UK (Total 911 Magazine) here: http://www.autofarm.co.uk/pdf/Total911_July06.pdf And you won't have to spend $100 to read it!

I think the main issue I see here is that we don't have AutoFarm here in the US and that generally it seems that folks have to shell out for a new engine vs. doing bore-out and rebuild. Is the work being done by Flat Six Innovations and L&N Engineering comparable with how AutoFarm fixes a broken engine?

Dave-ROR; thanks for the reality check cdodkin; thanks for the only real information as to a cause and solution to the problem. That one link says a lot more than any of the many many pages of threads I've read through where people go on about porsche not taking responsibility and how much they charge for a reman and not WHY did this happen, and HOW can it be avoided or fixed. And I haven't even gotten through page 1 of that link.....sheesh -Ben Martin

Read this: download PDF file. Might have to join to view: http://www.renntech.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=6470

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Love the new avatar!

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Thanks.... ready for spring!

Totally off-topic, but you guys are awesome. Good forum members. Here is my thread from 6sp http://www.6speedonline.com/forums/9...t-3-4l-c2.html what a dick, i would say a bunch of dicks, but theres only one active member on the forum!!!

Think of it this way: The cars are really cheap and a true bargain. Even if you got a "bad" one and the engine blew up, you could just get a new engine put in it, with warranty - for a total cost which is less than something like a new Altima or Chevy Silverado or whatever.. Don't buy one if you are strapped for cash, or are required to drain your emergency fund to do it. Find one that runs good and drive it and be happy. I have 124k on mine and I drive the crap out of it - hit redline most days, and am not afraid to drive it like it was meant to be. Burns zero oil and is really strong. Just buy the newest one you can afford, and have fun with it. Worrying about something that probably won't happen anyway is a waste of time. If it DOES happen, make sure you can handle it financially and realize you still spent a total cost which is very low, considering the type of vehicle you have.

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Amazon has it for around $63, the book is well worth it. http://www.amazon.com/Porsche-996-Es...6365357&sr=8-1

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sounds like you just had a bad day there... and a good day here... gotta take these forums with a grain of salt till you've stayed there/here long enough and get to know some of these guys.... do you know how many newbies here and on the 6... asks ??? and never see them again? Youll see plenty of references to the 6, rentech and here... lots of 6 members are members of this sight and others. I find these sights have diff specific focuses and its all good.

blah blah blah....another engine thread. 1.Buy one from a owner that you know is not thrashing the car then you have a better chance of zero issues 1a. buy one with a warranty 2.there are more of us out there that have not have engine blow ups than there are that have 2a including me and my 1999 3.and if you can find one for 16-20k and the engine blows then you have about 30k invested which is what the cars should be worth anyway in a decent mkt. 4.you will spend money on the little things anyway like MAFs, alternators, coolant tanks and thermostats...combined with service bills...get used to it its a friggin porsche

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+1. Red your new avatar is da bomb. -td

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thanks... taking Photoshop classes, paying off already!

Ben, since you're being nicer here... The book people are talking about is "Porsche 96, The Essential Companion". Yeah, it's really expensive but if you truly want a 996 I think it's worth the investment especially if you do some work on cars yourself. In addition to having a lot of valuable information about specs, myths, and so on it also serves as a simplified shop manual compared to the OEM style. I spoke with a couple shops that have a large number of 996 customers (that scared me a bit LOL) and also asked about rebuilding versus geting one directly from Porsche. I should note that these shops do rebuild other model Porsches and build race engines. They basically told me that for the price of the Porsche engine, you get many, many new parts with it. Since it comes put together already, the labor rate is also much lower. In the end the difference in price was pretty minimal if not equal - why not get the one from Porsche with new parts? They also said the newer engines come with some updates that make it more reliable.

hahaha, gran. I've been spotted! At least its you and not some of the instigators. Oh well. Can't walk into the bullpen without stepping in ****.

You can get real good deals from a Ford dealership. Bob has a detailed explaination of this.

The 996 has gotten a bad rap which suits me just fine. I had one for two years, tracked the hell out of it and I was amazed at the abuse it took. I bought a cheaper track car (95 M3) and totaled it first time out on the track. Had to sell the 996 to buy another track car (and driving lessons). Now that prices have dropped so low I am looking to buy another 996 (as a weekend car). They are GREAT friggin cars and lots of fun. I'm glad the purist don't like them and the market has dropped so much. For $18-25K for a sub- 100K mile 911 with 296 or 300HP are you kidding me? It's a gift! Get a PPI from someone who knows these cars, make sure the engine is solid (RMS is no big deal), buy it and drive it like you stole it!!! K

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PM me, I have LOTS of pics. I am one of the ones who did a teardown to find out what acutally happened to my motor. Still cost me $9K, but I understand Auto Strasse is offering a full rebuild for around $7500 now WITH IMS updates.

Oh dear Lord not this S*&^ again......

I think the next time someone asks that question, I'm going to tell them not to buy a 996. PERIOD!

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Yep... that'll be easier.....

Many of us read and quote Excellence Magazine. In this month’s issue, May 2009, Bruce Anderson’s technical answer column, addressing a question about the design of the M96 engine, contains the following information. “When the Boxster and 996 were relatively new cars and the M96’s problems were not yet understood, rumors suggested that up to 50% of the cars were going to experience failure. Porsche addressed the problems and, today, I am hearing the number of cars that have had or will have a problem is closer to 20%, or one in five.” It is good to see that “Porsche has addressed the problems”. So those who have a Boxster/Cayman/996/997 with an M-type engine know that you have an 80% chance of not suffering a catastrophic engine problem. For the rest of us just make sure that PCNA has your current address and vin so you won’t miss the updated component install recall. NOT! Maybe we should start a club with a cloisonn� car badge and “T” shirts? “The 20% Club” Check the December Excellence Jim Pasha (RIP) authored a good M type article with pics of common problems.

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Yeah exactly. Or one could go buy a Japanese "sports car" and lose $10k just driving off the lot....

Just talked to friend who had a motor blow on a 00 or 01 cab, tip, 60k miles, wife's car. Dealer wanted 1500 to pull the motor out to tell him it was blown. I don't think you need to pull out the motor to tell it is blown? They quoted him $19k for an new motor and install. This car is worth maybe $18.5k. Does it make sense to replace it with a used motor? I have a good independent that I use, I will give him a call tomorrow and see what they have to say. Any ball park numbers $$$$$ to replace this motor, new or used? Thanks!

some of my questions were answered when I searched other threads, but any thoughts or comments would be appreciated.

after skimming over some blown engine threads, I am realizing this has be discussed to exhaustion in the past. And is even somewhat of a sensitive subject with some. But does anyone know what it should cost to replace a blown 3.4 motor?

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I paid $15,600, including a new clutch, about a year ago. My shop charged me halfway between the wholesale and retail pricing for the motor, which saved me a grand or so, IIRC. That worked out to be only a little more than what it would have cost me to from Sunset with the two way shipping (they take the core back).

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thanks, I don't know if it would be worth it for my friend to replace the engine at that price, considering his tip cab is worth maybe $19k on a good day, and I would assume a lot less after the motor is replaced. Someone said on an older thread that you could get the engine for 6800, and about 12-1500 to change it out. But I was looking for some more current feed back.

it's only the 3.7, neither the 3.4 or 3.6 are affected and run forever.

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Not sure how old that thread is but I remember those numbers too... Have the prices for a new motor and install gone up that much??? If I remember correctly, for some reason, I think the 3.6 was actually cheaper than the 3.4...

Porsche has stopped subsidizing the motors now that the population of 996 and 986 cars has aged out of warranty coverage. So the cost to Joe Public has gone up, or to the correct level, depending on which side of the equation you're on! This is where the critical issue now lies, as failing engines out of warranty now present a prohibitive cost vs the value of the complete vehicle.

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Wow, didn't know that...

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talked to my independent the other day, he said the number did go up. I will find out what he quotes my buddy for a new engine replacement, and post.

so whats the update? how much did your buddy get quoted on that replacement engine? and did he do it or sell the car..... PS thanks to those that posted the links to the Total911 article and the Renntech PDF. Both were very good articles

I just did a replacement... As of Fall '09, the best you can do is about $12K after core swap. I was able to wrangle not having to wait for the core swap with a local dealer - but it was tricky. Sunset Porsche had the best price when I called around, but then you gotta ship the engine to your location, plus ship the core back (~$250-$300 each way). I am stoked to have the car back!!