Annoyed with exhaust mod

I bought a fabspeed muffler system for my 996 What are these supposed to sound like? Mine sounds like a ricer honda civic!!! I bought it on the back of many positive reviews on this and other boards It does not really sound much like the video they have on their website seriously, the resonance in the cabin makes the center console and some window trim vibrate - its getting on my nerves Also, I really like the mechanical sound of the flat six - now it sounds like it could be some generic 4 cylinder... couple of questions: what does a gt2 come with as standard? how different is the PSE to the fabspeed product? are there any exhausts which have a more mechanical bark sound to them (like the gt2 i head once or a F-355?) are my thoughts common or am i just being a bit gay?

You need to join Rennlist and buy GHL mufflers. They sponser our board. Contact Eli at Pelican [phone removed]

that sounds fine but what do they sound like? i don't need to throw even more money away by installing another exhuast system which makes my car sound worse than stock comments on the sound of GHL and PSE greatly apprecaited

Do a search using "GHL". I believe there are sound clips.

haven't heard the ghl but the pse is by far the best sounding exhaust for the 996 that i have heard, but it is a little pricey. if you can get a deal on it buy it.

get the fabspeed bypass pipes you'll be hearing pure unadulterated engine

GHL quiet, slt louder than stock<3500rpm, sounds like a cup car whhen you're into it, zero resonance. Listen to mine if you're around nyc.

brandywine have it for 1500 - yes its 500 more than the fabspeed, but if it sounds better then its a good option. does the GT2 come with pse as standard?

no, the GT2/3/Turbo come with 'sport' mufflers that are different from the both the stock 996 and the PSE sport exhaust.

I'll take them off your hands, PM me when your ready.

Don't even compare a GT2 and Ferrari 355 with a standard 996, since there is nothing in common with the three engines. Ciao, Johannes E.

I have the PSE and bot the bullet and paid $1500 and installed myself--I like it but im wondering how the bypass pipes sound--just straight from engine to cats to the air we breathe!!! Anyone around NJ have it so I can listen??? Mike

thats a stupid response well for a start they all run on petrol rather than diesel both the GT2 and 996 engine are flat sixes all i want is a more agressive flat six sound rather than what sounds like I've drilled holes in the muffler

I had Fabspeed exhaust on my 996 C2 and did not think it sounded ricey at all. I described the Fabspeeds as deep and throaty with no interior resonance. By comparison the PSE is more raspy sounding. Neither system sounded "ricey" to me. Perhaps something was not hooked up or tightened down correctly.

I'm considering that possibility too with the PSE rasp - can you hear the engine itself?

I AM ABOUT TO ORDER THE FABSPEED . I NEVER HEARD ANYONE COMPLAIN LIKE THIS B4. I HOPE SOMEONE WILL DEFEND THEM OR IS THIS THE COMMON FEELING ABOUT FABSPEED. I BASE MY DECISION ON THE VIDEO AND SOUND CLIP AND NOW I HEAR A GUY SAY THEY SOUND RICEY? THAT WOULD NOT BE ACCEPTABLE. THEY SEEM TO HAVE THE BEST CONSTRUCTION THAT I COULD TELL AND THE LOOK LIKE JEWELRY. ANYWAY, SHOULD I CONSIDER ANOTHER SYSTEM OR STAY WITH FABSPEED....JEFF

The PSE Rasp is quieter though and I finding it much more pleasing to the ear. I heard a Fabspeed once but found it way too loud and "throaty" (not sure how to describe it) for my tastes. In my opinion, the GHLs were a better sound to my ears, with the PSE being the best sounding of the three. If you like the PSE sound, the GHLs are probably a bit closer to that.

This is common on the 951 board. People start bashing a vendor in order to promote another one. Or it's just pure personal. I bought the fabspeed because of the many good responses here and because I know their quality. I am getting my 996 this week :-) and I will give some feedback to what I think.

P-car fanatic, Well, the Ferrari 355 has a short stroke V8 engine with a very high pitched exhaust note and the GT2 has the engine block from the race bred Porsche GT1, with internals that does not share a whole lot with a standard 996. The only common things between the 996 and GT2 engine is that they are both 6 cylinder boxer engines and yes, they both run on petrol but that's about how much the two have in common. Let's compare apples with apples and not apples with oranges! Ciao, Johannes E.

Don't throw the baby out with the bathwater... double check all the mounting points as your complaints of resonance are out of character for a Fabspeed exhaust. The raspy sound of the PSE is probably more traditional than the throaty sound of the Fabspeed. Sound quality and tolerance for sound levels is all personal preference. I only found the Fabspeeds lound when under load. When cruising they were pretty quiet without souding like a Lexus. I found the PSE pleasing to the ear, but a bit more subtle. My choice of the Fabspeeds was based on their reputation for quality, the price, and the reduced weight over stock and PSE. I would certainly consider Fabspeed should I decide to make the mod to the GT3. Disclaimer... no affiliation, just a satisfied customer.

mundman: I really like my Fabspeed. I think it sounds excellent. Ricer is not something I would use to describe the sound. When I first heard it I was a little taken aback, but even the girlfriend prefers the Fabspeed and does not think its loud. I have heard that if its new, it needs a little time to break in. The build quality is second to none as well. The PSE, in my opinion, is a "why bother" change.

I have Fabspeeds and I don't find them too loud at all, unless you're lugging the engine, build quality and fit/finish are the best. The PSE sounds good but IMO there are some build quality issues on the early versions for sure, the valves are prone to rattles as they loosen up. I also found them not loud enough at the track, especially when in traffic.

What Sloth said. Double check and make sure that everything is on properly before you throw them out. I have PSE and it sounds nice!!! Im very interested in what the others(GHL, Fabspeed) sounds like since I have never heard them before.

I had Fabspeed mufflers installed on my 2004 Carrera coupe and am very pleased with the results. I don�t think there is a definitive answer as to which brand of muffler sounds best. To my ears, it now sounds like it should have sounded from the factory. Everyone has valid likes or dislikes about particular sounds, about the same as why some people like or dislike a particular type of food. I love the sound of my Fabspeed. But then, I like Brie. -my .02

Doesn't Fabspeed has "Satisfaction Guranteed" policy? Can't you return them?

I have the PSE and they sound sweeeeeeet.... I've NEVER heard of a complain for Fabspeed... seems Fabspeed or PSE is the way to go if your upgrading... maybe you just got a bad set or something else is wrong.. but then again how hard is it to hookup mufflers???!!

the video makes it sound mechaincal - which is what i like in reality it seems boomy with no real definition i get the the impression that if i put it on my niegbours volvo or jetta it would sound the same i'm not bashing fabspeed, sound is personal taste and i definitely don;t track it as much as other members here they do look awesome, but i am not sure i can live with the resonance or the likelihood of people mistaking me for a ricer right now i am leaning towards PSE

There is something inherent with the new, liquid cooled motors that make the exhaust's sound resonate making it sound almost electric or man made so to speak. I've heard most of them, and I completely prefer the sounds of the air cooled exhausts better. Does anyone know what makes the exhaust sounds different on the 996, from the 911, or 993. Again I am talking about exhaust sound and NOT engine sounds - obviously on the aircooled engines there is more and nicer IMO engine sounds. Is it the firing order of the pistons that most effects exaust sound?

I also could not live with the resonance but I don't know if I can justify price defference. Sure would love to hear them in person but the p-car population in Albuquerque is small. Also curious about the sound difference with an intake kit(Fabspeed or other). It will still be 2 weeks b4 I get my car as Passport is shipping it from PA....Jeff

The price diff between PSE and all others is well worth it, IMHO. I've heard them all live, and I bought the PSE. It is definitely a personal choice, as all the owners of the cars I've heard with their various exhausts love what they got. Another personal choice. I think the 996 watercooled with PSE sounds WAAAAY better than a 993 with motor sound. Both as a driver listening while driving, and as a spectator as the cars are exiting the turn and blasting down the front straight.

Have Fabspeed on my GT3 and they sound like the OE set should have sounded. There is absolutely no cabin resonance. I can't imagine a better sounding system. But to each his own.

For what its worth --- I bought an aftermarket muffler, thought it sounded great, but decided to return it. Why? I decided after the first 5 minutes that I was not a loud(er) muffler guy and that stock was OK for me.

The resonance should go away when you have some miles on them; the muffler packing takes time "settle in". Mine sounded great (with no resonance) although now I'm ditching it in favour of bypass pipes. The total sound package was also helped by an Evo intake.

I�ve read all comments and yes sound is definitely something that is different from quality. It�s sort of like taste, not everyone likes caviar and not everyone likes beer with pizza. In short it boils down to what your taste in sounds is and it must be one hell of a job as a vendor or to a manufacture to please the crowds when everyone wants to sound better than the next guy or a ting instead of a ping or a roar instead of a purr�. You get the picture� I�ve recently teamed up with GHL to offer out their systems because I know that the quality of their products is top notch and because they offer a MONEY BACK guarantee!!! If you are unhappy with your purchase simply return it within two weeks and that�s it!!!! How much better does it get? Here�s the link that I posted last week�� https://rennlist.com/forums/showthre...&highlight=ghl If you�d like to give GHL a Money Back Guarantee try then feel free to contact me directly at [email removed] or [phone removed] -Eli

Bottom line if you're not happy with the Fabspeeds, send them back. Joe is a good guy and will treat you right. Be careful what you wish for, PSE are not exactly quiet either. Any performance muffler is going to be loud, but how much is acceptable is an individual question. For example, I recently heard fabspeeds on a 993, easily twice as loud as my car.

it sounds like you ordered the fabspeed muffler bypass, and not the fabspeed mufflers.. did you pay $395 or $495 for it? the bypass sound describes what you are talking about... the fabspeed muffler bypass (which i have on my 996) is extremely intense.. it's not necessarilly ricey, but since the engine is in the rear, and the exhaust is right next to it.. it's pretty much as intense or comparable to an open exhaust harley when it's WOT if anyone wants to compare how loud it is.. car enthusiasts will be wowed.. non car people will be annoyed.. it sets off every single alarm within 1/2 a mile from your vehicle at WOT and 1/4 a mile when driving at regular speeds.. the fabspeed muffler bypass can't really be described, but it's like it says in the ad, just like a cup car on the track.. it is damn loud.. no exhaust for the porsche can even compare.. YET.. at certain times it can sound ricey or have some resonance at times... depending on how you engage the gas at certain rpms..

its defintely the mufflers - i paid 1100 inc tips... i'm a big fan of formula 1 and I don;t have an issue with a LOUD exhaust... its just the sound and the resonance which vibrates interior trim which i can't deal with on a daily driver when crusing at 55 in 4/5th and i accelerate the sound in nothing like an engine sound, more just a loud deep mooing - maybe i'm driving a 911 COWerra.. its all subjective - I will give it a couple more days and if i can;t cope i will speak to fabspeed about a return... anyone have sound clips of the PSE/GHL? (i did a search for the GHL)

Get the PSE... the moooing describes the fabspeed very well... PSE makes a porsche sound like a porsche... the fabspeed is just plain loud.. IMHO. You won't be dissapointed with PSE... A guy I know bought the fabspeed and noticed I had put on PSE... he said "mine is louder" and I'm thinking.. maybe but it doesn't sound as good.... louder ain't better.

just sent you a PM

P car fan just get the pse so you will be happy. What are you doing driving 55 LOL?

[Image-only post; no author-written text. Original image references:] https://rennlist.com/forums/graemlins/nono.gif

It's OK to go 55. You just have to be in 2nd with your foot in it on the way to more fun!

P car fan, I have the fabspeeds and love them. And I have a cab. I can hear my wife's cell phone beeping in the glove compartment of her car outside my house with all windows close and I can't hear any resonance with my fabspeeds on my 911. Are you sure it's installed correctly? It is very easy to not tighten everything down due to the constrained space. Before purchase, I heard the fabspeed and PSE head to head. No comparison in my opinion. The PSE sounded stock upon car start and, although a more "sophisticated" sound when running through the gears, it was just too sedate for me. I also heard the GHLs seperately but by then I was sold on the fabspeeds. My only complaint about the fabspeeds is that it has mellowed in the year+ since I installed them, not much but I notice that (too). Cheers

This is a really subjective topic based on the fact that most people have had exposure to only one or two of the exhausts. It would be great to have a 'true' comparison of the base Fabspeed, PSE, and GHL.

Link The above link has a few in-car clips of a 2003 C2 with PSE which may help out in a decision. If you hunt around you may find a clip called nutsplus2.wmv from one of (I think) the Texas based members called Scott who in that clip shows various standing start and fly bys of '03 (3.6) PSE, '02 Fabspeed, '00 (3.4) PSE, 03 C4S Stock exhaust, 04 Turbo stock exhaust.

That was the video Scott did with some of us here in Houston, I don't know if I still have it around. If I recall from being there, most people liked the Fabspeeds and the 3.6 PSE. Compared to the 3.6, the 3.4 was pretty sedate but a bit more raspy sounding. The 3.6 PSE is deeper and throatier than a 3.4 PSE, as a matter of fact when I helped install a 3.6 PSE I could not even hear my car(3.4PSE) running next to it, and that was at idle. P car fan, I just tried 55mph in 4th gear (3000 rpm) and 5th (2800rpm), and there's nothing there besides a sedate rumble at the rear of the car. Absolutely ZERO resonance. So I don't know what to tell you, there must be something wrong with your setup or you just need to let it break in some more. My car is a C2 and the Fabs are about 3 months old if it helps.

are you referring to the different versions of PSE or different versions of engines (3.4 vs. 3.6) the 3.6 stock sounds louder and throatier than the 3.4 ever did... and the video showed I believe a 2000 carrera (3.4) the the PSE vs a 2002 3.6 carrera with PSE... they both sounded pretty good... the 3.6 throatier the 3.4 raspier but still somewhat throaty (not nearly as throaty as the 3.6 motor with pse on it)... I don't know how a newer version of PSE would sound on a 3.4 motor vs a 3.6... I still think the difference in sound is fundamentally inherent from the motor.

when you installed the 3.6 pse... what model year was the car you installed it on... a 3.4 motor or a 3.6 motor?

That was my '00 in the video with the 3.4 (aka early) version of the PSE, it did sound pretty good but not as "loud" as some of the others. One of those deals where I guess you had to be there to really appreciate the differences. The install was a 3.6 version (aka new style-PSE) on a C4S, the difference was dramatic between the different engines and their PSE mufflers.

yes the 3.4PSE on a 3.4 does sound sweet indeed... the C4S you speak of...was that a 3.6 L motor?

i like the sound of my fabspeed

I have a old set of 3.4 PSE floating around from my old car, got a 997 instead.

All C4s have the 3.6L.

ok... that definitely explains the difference in sound... I remember test driving a 2002 3.6 with stock mufflers and noticed how much different it sounded as compared to a 3.4 stock... HUGE difference..... the 3.4 really comes alive with the PSE though...

anyone got a copy they can link? i googled it and found a link but the domain had just expired

Here's the link from the PDE, click on the specs for the sound file of the PSE exhaust http://www.porschedriving.com/the_cars.asp

Yes it was an '02or3 C4S with the 3.6. I never really had a problem with the sound of the PSE other than being pretty raw sounding in the a.m. (always got the neighbors attention) and being too quiet at the track in fast traffic. The real problem I had was build quality issues like rattling valve actuators and heat shields falling off etc... but that's for another post.

Can anybody comment on the difference between the sound of the 3.4pse vs 3.6pse installed on a 3.4L engine?

Clearly it's personal preference, you should go out and listen to all of the exhaust's you are considering. I have the Fabspeed and am very pleased with the sound and have no resonance on the inside. It has a nice deep throaty sound, unlike the pse which is a little raspy for me. Actually wanted the Techart exhaust but it was too pricey.

after checking out the Porsche website and the sound clips, as well as the hot laps on the barber cicuit I think i will try out PSE it sounds like a 'cleaner' and less 'muddy' representation of the cars engine sound, albeit louder and harsher - which is what I think I want as numerous posters have mentioned - its all personal taste the only problem is my local HOPELESS dealer in Nashville has only had 1 car with PSE go through in the last couple of years, so I can't hear it in person.

I've heard every exhaust side by side and I'm sooo glad I bought the GHL mufflers. To me it's the best sounding exhaust AND almost everyone that has heard it tells me they like it. Zero resonance inside the cab and sounds stock when you're not getting on it. With WOT it sounds, oh so sweet!!

I started a new thread with all the good audio/video clips I could find. https://rennlist.com/forums/996-forum/187860-exhaust-sound-clips-pse-fabspeed-b-and-b-ghl-ruf.html

great new thread!

so does your fabspeed sound like the one in the audio clips?

no the one in the clips is the gt3 bypass - i beleive getting rid of the mufflers completely

no, the first one is the fabspeed muffler system, the second one is the muffler bypass Please listen to the first one!

that is actually a reasonable recording of the Fabspeeds like on my 996, its purely personal taste what you like I think it sounds more like a classic american muscle car sound and you lose the tightness of the finely tuned sound of the german flat 6 horses for courses

Great thread and clips. Can't wait for my GHL's to arrive!

If your car sounds like this with the fabspeed, then I am glad that I ordered mine.

anyone that has heard or tried any of the other exhausts, i don't think one can debate the awesome sound the fabspeed muffler bypass makes when the car is started up... it just puts a smile on my face every time.. (and scares the living sh*t out of anyone in the parking garage next to me) for all that have the fabspeed muffler bypass and have started the car in a parking garage, you all know what i'm talking about.. no exhaust, pse, ghl or whatever can even compare it's all worth it, just for the sound it makes upon startup... everywhere you go, at the gas station or at the store.. it just screams "don't mess with me, i'm a porsche, and i'm not stock.."

We'll have to meet for coffee so I can hear what it sounds like.