Seriously considering a 996 40th anniv purchase

Hi, I am a visitor from the 993 board. I have a pristine 1998 Carrera S that I love very much. I love the old air-cooled sounds, smells, connected feeling. If money was no object, I would never ever sell this car. However, having just become a father, I am considering a more "practical" move to a 996....specifically, to the 40th anniv. All the extra goodies and the 345hp make this quite a value in my mind. Definitely not decided on the switch yet, but am seriously considering it. There are several of these 40th anniv cars out there, in the less than 5k mile category, for near the $65k mark. I guess what I am looking for are general impressions of the difference in performance from the 345hp, detailed pics of happy owners, general thoughts, etc. thanks, Jonathan

why is the 996 more practical? doesnt your current car have backseats? second hand 40th anniversary cars are certainly a steal, they have experienced terrible depreciation and discounts at the time of the sale. for 60~k you may be able to pick up a C4S

Jonathan: I am a very happy owner of a 40th Anniversary. I truly enjoy this car. Last Sunday I entered my first PCA Concours and won big time. Here's some previous posts with pics, and initial impressions which are still true to this day: https://rennlist.com/forums/996-forum/209378-my-40th-anniversary-gets-best-in-show.html https://rennlist.com/forums/996-forum/163905-as-promised-pics-of-new-ride.html I too am a father of a young child, so I can relate to that part of your story. He was just entering todlerhood when I started looking at the purchase of a 911. The 40th Anniversary is a very special car indeed, in many ways it is raw and highly refined at the same time. The rawness comes from the added hp, lowered suspension, the sound at high rpms is simply intoxicating, and one look at the mean front gets my heart pumping. The refinement is all in the details -- paintwork in GT silver is amazing, the uniqueness of the wheels, the full leather appointments throughout the entire cabin, the silver details all over, and unique leather finishes on the seats, steering wheel and column boot, are constant reminders of how special the car is. I have ZERO regrets from this purchase. It meets all the requirements in my book as to what a Porsche 911 should be and feel like, and marks a great milestone in Porsche's history. It also fits my family "hauler" needs. I can easily fit a booster seat in the back for my son. He's comfy and happy there, just as my wife and I are in the front. There's certainly more room for all compared to a 993. Now with that said I want to make sure you exercise your emotions as well, since all purchases of 911s are tied to emotions. Here's a few reasons as to why you shouldn't consider a 40th Anniversary: Compared to a 993 the interior luxury in the 40th is radically different: I have no problem with this. But if your idea of the ideal 911 is less is more, you may have a problem with this. Also think how comfortable you will be with a little kid in the back: Some 911 owners cringe at the thought of having a little one in the back with crackers and a sippy cup. I could care less. It is life and I bought the car to enjoy it with my family. Just remember there's more to "cringe" about in a 40th vs. a 993. My only rule is shoes come off. And plastic mat protectors work great! Some people like big butts in their 911's: The 993S has a very nice butt, the 40th has a distiguished svelte butt -- kind of like Paris Hilton's butt... sorta Some people argue that the 993S is the pinnacle of what a 911 should be -- and consider water-pumper 911's junk. I'd say whatever!... but do consider the potential future collector's value inherent of the 993S... not sure how the 40th will do collector wise, IMHO too many 40th's were built (1963). Anyway, visualize what you want, especially with the family. Drive the 40th as much as you can, and if you decide on a 40th -- never look back! I initially contemplated getting into a 993S, then I moved into looking at a 996 C4S, and then I discovered the value and uniqueness of the 40th -- I couldn't resist! Best of luck!

Fast40th: That was a great writeup. You gave a very fair appraisal of the 40th Anniversary strengths as well as the shortcomings, ecspecially from the perspective of a happy 993 owner. mrsullivan: I agree with Moogle. Why is the 996 more practical? Although I'm guessing, I can't imagine that the rear seat area in a 996 is much different than a 993.

The only thing you will miss in the 993 is the sluggishness of acceleration

I agree with everyone. I have a 6 yr & a 4 yr old who loves to ride in the car. You just need to purchase a Brittax Star Raiser seat (Exact same a Porsche minus the logo). It's a daily driver for me where I put approx 700 Km per week on it. I don't have a single complaint..okay I had one, the sound of the engine but a new Fabspeed fixed that. At 65K US$ I think it's a steal. I paid at a discount the equivalent of $95 K US last October....which was already a discount. I love the car so much that I don't even think about the depreciation hit I took since I don't forsee selling the car anytime soon.

Jonathan, just a quick note, AlonC of rennlist did just the opposite, he went from a 40th to 993C2S, you may want to p.m. him, Jeeva

I agree as well..Its a great car and everytime I think was it worth it (the car) I go for a 30min ride and come back with a grin ear to ear. It becomes intoxicating-but my new "family"car in 2 weeks will be a M3 convertible--I cant wait to evaluate and compare these two. Mike

I think you have exactly the right attitude regarding depreciation. I would much rather own a car that I loved for three years even though it depreciated significantly, rather than own a boring car that held its value. Enjoy your car and forget about depreciation.

I'm a big fan of 993s and own one but if I could only have one car to drive everyday and at the track on weekends it would be a 40th. The 3.6L X51 makes great power. A huge improvement over the 993. I have the package in my race car. Buy it and enjoy. Jim

I have had four Porsches, and my 40th is by far the most satisfying to drive. I never had a 993, but it is as quick to 100 as my 3.6 turbo (964 based) and about ten times more refined. Less surprising at the limits, too. I paid $90k for mine and couldn't care less what it is worth today since I won't be selling anytime soon. If you can, add PSE and X73 and the results will amaze you.

PHP Code: From Fast1 : .... I can 't imagine that the rear seat area in a 996 is much different than a 993. Actually the rear seat area in a 996 vs. a 993 is quite different. 996 is wider and with more headroom. Wider is great since sometimes is tough trying to fit a child seat in the back of a 993. No issues with a 996. Cheers.

Fast40th: Wow, I didn't know that. I never looked at either car from the perspective of a child seat. I just knew that neither car can accomodate an adult.

I'll move to a 40th in a heart beat. Specially from a 993 to a 40th Anniv 911. I sold my 993 too half a year ago and never regreted it. My first upgrade though if I get a 40th aniv (just my personal preference) is to replace those chromed 5 spoke carrera wheels.

I completely agree!

Alon did this for other reasons, he LOVED his 40th, I must say I love the 993 wide body, but after driving both cars , the 996 is a better daily for me. I say go for it if it makes you happy, when we are all dead none of this would have mattered anyways

in response to all the questions about practicality, let me clarify..nothing to do with backseats or room for kids... My 993 S is 7 yrs old, no warranty, extremely expensive to replace wheels, parts, etc. on a onesy-twosy basis... not very safe in wet weather, etc. To me, any 996 is more practical in that it is a more comfortable car, better lights, traction control, side airbags, warranty, the list goes on and on... Have always thought about the 996 as an infinitely more practical car than a 993... so somewhat surprised to hear that maybe people dont feel the same... All great feedback and write-ups... I have a lot of thinking to do

Actually the wheels are polished, not chromed. Match the polished tail pipes as well on the 40th. They are less shiny than chrome, clean easily, dont chip paint like standard wheels and just looook maaaahvelus!

Jonathan, See my post, # 17 on this thread https://rennlist.com/forums/996-forum/195446-former-993-owners.html OR Post # 13 on this one https://rennlist.com/forums/996-forum/186899-do-you-all-really-hate-your-996-s.html

Jonathan: From your response... then what are you waiting for?!?... get in a 40th right away!!!. I bet it is a seller's market out there for the 993S. Carrera Mike: What C4S/914-6 said. And like you, I can't stand chrome wheels myself. There's something "Guido" about them. But polished wheels are a different story and IMHO fit the 40th nicely. Pictures don't do justice got to see them in person.

I'm sorry guys about the "polished" wheels/wrong term. I've seen a couple of 40th Aniv Ed sitting on the dealers lot, of course they still have that 4x4 look, maybe if they're lowered a bit they will look deifferent to my taste. Just my opinion, my taste, no offense intended, I think they don't do justice on the beautiful(with power to go) 40th Aniv Ed.

i need to drive one first....here comes the controversial part.... the normal 996 c2 just doesnt do it for me compared to my 993 S.... i know that its faster, but it doesnt FEEL faster because when driving my 993 S i am so incredibly connected to car/road, etc.... my expectation is combination of 345hp, suspension, and all the niceties will make the 40th anniv a different experience... we will see.

Carrera Mike: No need to apologize... I don't think anyone was offended. It's just freaking wheels. Jonathan: If Porsche had considered making a 996 Carrera S, the 40th would be it!. Good luck!

Anyone wanting to sell their polished 996 wheels, please let me know. I'm considering a set of track tires/wheels and would love to keep my original look.

Can anyone give a comparison of the 996 40th to the new 997S. I know the cost are quite dif. seeing as the 40ths seem to be selling for low prices. Not sure why that is, they do seem to be a great value for such a nice new Porsche. Keep the opins coming, I too am in this exact same decision position and keep flipping around between 996 40th, 997s and used 996 TT. Yes, I do realize the cost difs, but it is not all about the cost, I want the right car, and I also, want to try and "loose" as little money as possible in the process. With the 997s I think I will loose a lot.

for me this comes down more to the money angle... lets say my budget is $65k...(it is). For that amount, i cannot get a base 997 or 2003-3004 996 turbo... MAYBE could get a 2003-2004 c4S. I count at least 3 2004 996 40th anniv w/ 345 hp and lots of goodies available on autotrader... less than 5k miles for that budget price. i believe that i can get near $60k for my 98 993 S.. i am the second owner and the car is in concours condition w/ 35k miles.... arctic silver/black combo... very hard to find. that is very little difference between my car and the 996 40th anniv in price... it just seems like a great value..... (but, sigh... still might lack the "soul" of my car).... it will take a few weeks for me to decide...

Yes, the 40th as well as all of the non-GT 996's lack the visceral feel of previous 911's. Yes, the 40th is the fastest normally aspirated non-GT3 996 that you can buy. Yes, the 40th is very easy to live with on a daily basis and can hold its own on the race track. No, this is not an easy decision. I drive my car to work and regularly take my wife and 3 year old boy out and about. I put PSS9's on the car within a few months of ownership, improving the ride, handling and appearance. The car looks much better when lowered appropriately.

Early apex, what did you do with your polished wheels?

You will regret selling one of the best Porsche's ever built. The last of the Air-Cooled cars will hold its value better and in the long-run be considered a more collectable car.

LiveNupe, I've got the OEM 5 spokes on my car right now. The BBS RE wheels are for sale though. I have to admit that the OEM wheels look good on this car and make it stand out without being obnoxious.

even if i am putting 7-10k miles on it per year?... believe me, i agree with your statement here...but i also dont have the money to have multiple Porsches sitting in my garage like some my concern is that the car is going to lose its collectibility because i actually drive it quite a bit...no question the last year wide body aircooled will hold value, but i think more so with very low miles....

At your current mileage and 7-10K per year I think you grossly over-estimate what your car will fetch, definitely not $60K, closer to $45-50K. Despite being the last of the aircooled, they are just used cars and when you use them, they are worth even less. They are not collectible at this point in time. Maybe another 15 years out. So get the one that best fits your needs, use it up, pass it on to a deserving soul and get another one.

i have an offer for $55k right now from private buyer....and offer at $50k from a dealer sight unseen... not trying to be boastful about my car or anything like that.... but i really disagree with your statements... i bought it for $56k a year ago... i felt lucky to even find it.... i have never seen a 98 Carrera S with a 1-2 owner history, less than 40k miles, silver/black combo for less than $50k on the market... if you have, i am interested where....

Then take it, it will be less next year.

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I'd wager that your 993 will be a cheaper ownership proposition than a 40ae, simply because the 40th's depreciation curve is significantly steeper. That, plus the 993 is the "devil you know". After recently buying my 20th car, I've come to realize that the car you own is almost always cheaper to own (taking into account depreciation, taxes, fixing what's broke, etc.) than the car you want to buy. If you love your 993, and enjoy driving it, why change? There's nothing inherently wrong with it in the wet; nothing good rain tires and a judicious right foot can't cope with. I'd just drive it like it was meant to be driven, and steel myself for a few dings+scratches and some depreciation over time. I don't doubt your valuation of your car, just stupified by how some value cars in the US. It's a C*2*S for goodness sakes. It's amazing what a wide rump and questionable performance implications will do to a car's popularity/value. Please don't take this as a jab against your car; it looks to be in beautiful shape. As I said, I just continue to be shocked by the money they bring. Congrats.

Truer words are hard to find.

OK, didnt mean to demean you ride. Here's some examples of wide bodies that sold: Personal friend sold his 1997 C2S, 12K miles, glacier white/black in Spring 2002 for $57,000 Excellence mag June 2005, pg 130- 1996 C4S, 27,000 miles, polar silver/black, superb condition, sold for $49,500. Low mileage usually brings a 10% premium. The C4S is worth range $30,700-$46,750 according to Excellence market update. In the current 2005 market, yours is likely closer to the C4S now in value. But, its worth what a motivated buyer will pay. $55K is very good money for your car with those miles IMHO. If youre gonna bail, nows the time to do it. FWIW, most of the depreciation on a $90-96K 40th anniv. is out now, even on a "new" leftover one.

no worries, and no offense taken... i could be wrong of course, but i follow the 993 market pretty closely, both from purchasing only a year ago, and just natural interest. what i have found (along with many others) is that you cant use NADA or even Excellence as a good guide on these cars... again, every personal opinion is a bit difference, but many would agree that the silver/black combination adds value to these cars, last year 98 aircooled widebody adds more, 2-wheel drive adds yet more, relatively low mileage, 2-owner history, concours shape all adds more... again, i could be mistaken, but i suspect that if i got serious i could find the right buyer between $55-60k... i know that i wouldnt take a penny less than $55k for it...so who knows, maybe i wouldnt get that amount for it and then this whole situation would take care of itself... i wouldnt get rid of it :-)

Yep, dont get rid of it, add another. I couldnt part with my 993. What would I drive on weekends?

Forgive me for jumping in, but you've caught my attention. Why is it that the anniversary cars are depreciating so quickly? Is it happening to this model alone, or all '04's? I have been considering a 993 C2S, but also like the look of the anniversary car and would like to have a warranty. After reading this thread I found a local leftover anniversary car that has been marked down from $140K CDN to $101K - not too far off of my budget

The car is a limited edition, creature comfort option loaded, performance oriented rear wheel drive carrrera with great looks and added hp. I believe Porsche thought it would command the $90K + sticker last year as the options if ordered on a conventional carrera would have cost bundles more (>15K). So they did offer value at that price point. As word of the 997 came out last Spring, it probably made it more difficult to move the 40th anniv as its price would be similar to the 997S. Porsche eventually offered $10K discounts and some dealers an additional $10K, thereby discounting some new cars by $20K to the lucky. So there's most of your depreciation or entry point value, depending on where you came into the car. A used one is even greater value now, IMHO. It wont drop much now but should hold its value better than any other normally aspirated carrera (dont know about the GT3). I am still amazed at the pump and shove in the back that this motor gives at higher rpms. Kinda turbo-like.

out of curiousity, what does the power package cost if just added to a regular 996?..... for many (myself included), its the extra HP and rear-wheel drive that is most enticing about the 996 anniv... the paint and interior extras are nice, and I know very expensive... but not as important to me as the performance aspect...

The X51 power package when added goes (i believe) for about $15K or so. Here's some links that may be of interest to you: http://www3.us.porsche.com/english/u...el/default.htm and http://www3.us.porsche.com/english/u...rapowerkit.htm

I regret getting rid of my 993, boohoo. I am now searching for a 930 slant nose. Oh, wait this is about the 40th anniversary car. I say a man really needs 2 Porsches; a nice one for nice and one for a play toy. As soon as you sell your car you will regret it, you will try to fill the void with something ( 40th ann) that sounds to me like you are trying to talk yourself into. 993 vs 996 is comparing apples to oranges. Exactly the same but totally different. I had my 993 fully tweaked; the engine had been rebuilt with new heads, cams, pistons, crank, exhaust. I had roughly $25k in the engine alone. The suspension, wheels and interior were the way I wanted them. Silly me; I sold the car because I was bored and wanted a change. Matilda; as she was so affectionately called, was one of a kind. I never thought about losing money when I sold it; I wanted a 996. End of story. I like my 996, it is fast, handles great and is not a handful for my wife. I don't regret buying the 996, I regret selling my 993. Oh the troubles of choice.

very well put... i need more money!!!

I was in the same shoes between the 40th, 996c4s, 993 and targa. I went with the 40th. Here is what I found during my research. 993-- too old and I can't afford maintenace, looks awesome, not as safe as 996, too raw for everyday commutes. Sometimes you want to gun it but most of the time is normal driving. I don't do DE or AutoX. looks awesome, looks awesome, did I mention looks awesome? c4s-- looks awesome, I don't need all wheel drive as i live in texas. I wanted to buy a 911 for the rear wheel drive experience and i felt it may be muted with a 4s. targa-- cool glass roof, may be too hot for texas sun. less rigid body and i hate creaks from a car as I came from a boxster. 40th-- more power (x51), fully loaded interior. gt silver paint and limited edition. the main reason i chose this was the x51. any of the 911s above would have made me happy. I would keep the 993 if I were u though as you're already used to the 993 and the novelties of a 996 would wear off anyways. That and it would save you some money.