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YOUR RESEARCHLowered car Eating tires
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Install sport springs and this raises the car well enough
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I now have installed sport springs and this raises the car well enough to get into most drive ways without a lot of extra effort, although the rear tires on the inside are almost to the wear bar with only 1,600 miles on them, my mechanic has said the wear will be better on the next set.
Leading evidence: 'Install sport springs and this raises the car well enough' (no explicit attributable resolution; this is a reported action or suggestion). Across 1 matching discussions, The most frequently discussed action is 'Adjust alignment whereas the op indicates' (1 discussions). For that action, 0 discussions report a resolution and 0 report an unsuccessful attempt. No action has an explicit, attributable resolution report under the current rules. These are forum reports and suggestions, not a confirmed diagnosis.
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I am running 19" Toyo Proxes and I get about 5K on a set.
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I run -2.7 * of camber on all four corners of my 944.
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Suggestion
Deckman - PSS9 allows for adjusting the alignment whereas the OP indicates that he cannot.
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Suggestion
2- Can you adjust your camber without getting aditional parts, which break your pocket?
Install sport springs and this raises the car well enough
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I now have installed sport springs and this raises the car well enough to get into most drive ways without a lot of extra effort, although the rear tires on the inside are almost to the wear bar with only 1,600 miles on them, my mechanic has said the wear will be better on the next set.
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My 996 is pretty low- not sure what suspension is on it since I bought it used.
In any case, I had alot of exotic cars, including an NSX that ate rear tires, but this one takes the cake. I am running 19" Toyo Proxes and I get about 5K on a set. Fronts, have put 20K on and they look fine. The rears get totally worn on the inside half, while the outside half of the tread is decent. I cant switch sides because the Toyos are directional. The tire monkeys have said once the car gets that low, there isnt much they can do to get the camber back to spec- is that right? Even my NSX got 8-10K on the rears. And I don't drive the car hard.
Have attached a couple of pics showing the stance.
Can't you make the left tire the right one, and still maintain direction? I don't think you can flip them on the rim on the same side, but if you switch sides...
Also, why not raise it up a hair to get rid of some of the negative camber?
-td
Having a wore out outer edge on you tires wouldnt help the handling of the car and it would look really great! The short life of the rear tires is the price you pay for a lowered car,
so said my aligment guy.
Lowering the car increases the negative camber. it makes your tires hit the ground like this (seen from the back of the car) / -------- \
You can see why the inside edge will wear faster!
Depending on the driving you do, it's pretty normal mileage. I got about 7K on my rears with 6 or so autocrosses. The outer part of the trend is toast. I suspect, I'll be able to do a test and tune and another event but that will be it for these tires.
I wasn't implying swapping when the innder edge is corded or worn out. Do it earlier to extend the life of the tires. Lots of folks do it. You can almost double the life of the tire this way.
As for the handling issue, I think you miss the point - if you are running on the inside of a tire so bad you are eating it away, then it is clear that the outside of the tire isn't the part of the tire doing the real work (i.e., in contact with the road). That is, you are using the inner 1/2 to 2/3 of the tire more. So swapping sides increases the rubber on the inside (improving grip/handling) and moves the worn part to the outside (which isn't doing the "work" anyway). If you do it early enough, you shouldn't have any aesthetic issue.
And the price you pay for a slammed car isn't just tires. Besides front lips, engine mounts and oil pans (from bottoming out), shocks, and shock mounts, you can actually RUIN your engine from riding too low. You can literally rip apart your crankcase hitting something in the road...
-td
I think this is not normal. I have a lowered 996 with PSS9's. I just took off a pair of Toyo Proxes TR1's that had 7k miles on them and the tread depth was still 7/32 on the rears. I had the rears dismounted from the wheel and rotated about 2k miles ago, and the wear is almost even inside and out. You can do this because the each side of the tire has the same tread pattern. That said, these tires are 18's. I have just put on 19's and things could be completely different.
Deckman - PSS9 allows for adjusting the alignment whereas the OP indicates that he cannot. Could just be lowering springs in which case camber cannot be corrected to a normal value.
Perhaps you're looking at this all wrong. Camber is a wonderful thing. The problem isn't that your rears are wearing too fast, it's that the fronts are last too long!
DE = Drivers Education+ a place where grown men take overly expensive cars and spend way to much $$ on them to act like little boys.
Racing= a place where the men from the above mentioned group spend exponentially more $$ than the above group and the cars are not covered by insurance when you wreck them.
Changing
DE = Drivers Education+ a place where grown men take overly expensive cars and spend way to much $$ on them to act like little boys.
Racing= a place where the men from the above mentioned group spend exponentially more $$ than the above group and the cars are not covered by insurance when you wreck them.
Changing your alignment will help with tire life.
That's the problem. The way Porsches are setup, if you don't drive them hard they do that to the back tires. Now, when they're lowered, they do it even more to the back tires. You can get plates to bring the camber back for other cars, though I never looked into it for Porsche.
Thanks for all the input. I really have no problem buying tires every 5K I just wanted to confirm this was not unusual. My tire monkey basically said same thing, price yoiu pay for a lowered car. As mentioned above, not sure what type of springs are on it as I bought it used, but it looks pretty low, lower than the normal "sport" springs IMO. Combined with the 19"s = eating tires.
Actually if your fronts are still ok at 20k miles it probably means you have way more camber in back than in front. That's going to make the car push even more than it does stock which really isn't what you want. If you are just using the car on the street I would have the camber minimized in back and then see if you can get the front within a degree or so. Or, as has been suggested, raise the car a little. A good indy Porsche mechanic can really be of help here.
You also have to be careful that you are not too low. You could be outside the operating range of your shocks, or worse, riding on your bumpstops. Neither is optimal.
-td
Camber is not a bad thing at all. Camber with toe increases tire wear dramatically. One thing to check is to see where your alignment is. Rear camber is adjustable so you can dial it out if you want.
Me personally, I'd want more front and rear camber but it will have to wait until I get GT3 control arms and shims.
Hi guys,
First of all, I don't have a 996 yet, and looking into getting one. Can I have 2 related questions?
1- does stock 996 come with coil-over, so you can adjust your height?
2- Can you adjust your camber without getting aditional parts, which break your pocket? If you can, by how much?
Thanks in advance.
1: No, coil-overs are not stock equipment
2: THere is some camber adjustment in the stock cars, but not a ton. You can maybe get -1 deg max up front. Not sure on the rear, but I'm guessing -1.5 to -2.0 maximum.
I now have installed sport springs and this raises the car well enough to get into most drive ways without a lot of extra effort, although the rear tires on the inside are almost to the wear bar with only 1,600 miles on them, my mechanic has said the wear will be better on the next set. I also wonder about the clutchs impact on tire wear as when speed shifting I hear a thud, the tires might be breaking loose some. The clutch has been replaced and it might be an after market and not releasing smoothly. Also there is a lot of rubber dust on the rear quater panel, is this a dragster? I am not doing burn offs.
I run -2.7 * of camber on all four corners of my 944. Granted it is a lot easier on tires (16" ones) than a 996 but the way I've increased tire life is by making sure all 4 corners are
as close to zero toe as possible
. Just a heads up this will make the car very neutral (the car attitude will respond to throttle inputs) and won't be as "safe" as having a bit of toe-in in the rear. I got 12k or more miles on some tires doing an entire autocross season on them, and they wore evenly due to the autox.
Honestly if you didn't know what a DE is you should probably keep the toe at "factory" settings for now, and then go do one!
Running higher profile tires would increase tire life, too. Probably not what you wanted to hear, right?
Thoughts...good idea to get the toe checked. Too much will destroy the tires as quickly as too much camber. I wouldn't do zero toe in the rear, but have mine set that way in the front (probably not what you want if you're not tracking, car can be darty).
Unidirectional for tires only matters in the wet for most tires. Even then, the difference in performance is minimal.
So for my 2� worth, I've got an 02 with the ROW M030 sports suspension, and have the rear camber set at -1.1 on each side. I get 20 ~ 24K miles out of the rears. Wear is the usual inside tire wear. Fronts seem to be 40K+ miles.
Bless all of you that manage to go through tires at 6 ~ 8K. As a stockholder in all of the major tire manufacturers and publicly traded tire retailers, I appreciate your enthusiasm! Keep up the good work, and while you are at it, how about a new clutch?
Definitely sounds like you have a setup that lowered without allowing correction for negative camber. As previous posters have mentioned, if you want to correct the problem (and it
is
a problem), you'll have to make changes to the suspension, whether springs or adjustable camber links or etc. If at all possible, the first order of business would be to find out exactly what changes were made to the stock suspension. Any chance you can find out from the previous owner?
Just for completeness, with Pirelli P-Zero Rossos, I got 12.5k miles rear and 25k miles front (total of 6 tires in 25k miles). With Michelin PS2s, I'm getting better than that, more like 15k rear / 30k front (factory camber/caster/toe settings and no track days on my street tires).
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