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YOUR RESEARCHFactory full throttle timing
Leading reported evidence
Adjust timing and fuel map's
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Suggestion
Good info here, now I'm sure that I need some way to adjust the timing and fuel map's.
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Suggestion · Original poster
I believe GIAC adjusts throttle response, lean out AFR a little and adjust timing tables?
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Suggestion
It would be nice to see how timing changes with difrent engine loads.
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Suggestion
Stock the mixture is already 'lean' at about 14.7:1 because it is at this air:fuel mixture a properly running healthy engine generates exhaust gases that are most fully processed by the converters.
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Suggestion
My OBD2 code reader/data viewer tools use 'timing' rather than 'angle'.
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Stock the mixture is already 'lean' at about 14.7:1 because it is at this air:fuel mixture a properly running healthy engine generates exhaust gases that are most fully processed by the converters.
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Ignition timing (advance) under WOT varies depending upon many factors.
In my cars the few times I've looked at this under hard acceleration timing advance may fall to 25 degs. or a bit less. As acceleration continues the advance may change as the engine controller adapts to various inputs.
Maximum ignition advance generally occurs under part throttle higher load operating conditions and can climb to 35 degs. maybe more.
Sincerely,
Macster.
I believe the terms are interchangable. The info comes from OBD2 Mode 1 Pid 0x0E (hex for 14 decimal) and is defined in my OBD2 reference as "Ignition Timing Advance".
My OBD2 code reader/data viewer tools use 'timing' rather than 'angle'. But IIRC in some sections of the factory manuals I believe I have come across the usage of 'angle'.
Sincerely,
Macster.
I have a GIAC flash. Part throttle...I usually see around 45. Full throttle I see about 32 to 34 around redline. I was just wondering what stock timing is like.
I believe GIAC adjusts throttle response, lean out AFR a little and adjust timing tables?
I also wanted to see how much less timings pulled with higher octane.
Max.ignition advance occurs during part throttle operation. Find a flat stretch of pavement and shift the tranny into 5th or 6th gear at around 2K or so. Play with the rpms though of course avoid lugging the engine. Without much effort you'll see the timing reach its max advance, whatever that is.
It has been too long since I bothered to view timing doing the above but 45 degs. advance is certainly within the realm of possible.
My WAG is the GIAC flash enrichens the fuel mixture at least part of the time.
Stock the mixture is already 'lean' at about 14.7:1 because it is at this air:fuel mixture a properly running healthy engine generates exhaust gases that are most fully processed by the converters.
Just a bit leaner or richer and the efficiency of the converters falls off drastically.
Even so, the stock DME under high torque demands can enrichen the mixture to a point the engine makes its best power/torque. At the same time it enrichens the mixture the DME will suspend converter monitoring. One can 'see' this happening with an OBD2 data viewer because the engine controller will go 'open loop'. But it remains in this state briefly, relatively speaking.
Sincerely,
Macster.
I was seeing via Durametric cable and software and also do see the higher numbers (39 deg) at the lower 3000 rpm range with a out of tune FVD flash for my SC'ed engine.
Stock timing seem's to be very "conservative"
Good info here, now I'm sure that I need some way to adjust the timing and fuel map's.
Macster, at low rpm's you need the high advance to keep the afr at 14.7 level. When you increace the fuel amount you must increace the timing to keep the same afr.
More fuel need's more time to burn. But like you said, there is many factors that ecu calculates to find best timing and fuel amount.
Ubermensch: Would you happen to have 3d timing map? It would be nice to see how timing changes with difrent engine loads. Or was that timing log file at WOT?
Below is one of the sessions I logged a while back with a stock map, 97 RON fuel (UK). You can see the timing during the series of shifts, car at WOT otherwise.
There are some other similar charts on my web page if your interested.
You may want to look at some ECU flashes (GIAC etc) to cleanup the throttle response - different fuels etc if that is what you are looking to accomplish. Custom tunes are worth it if allot of mods are done to the car. Just my opinion.
Flash would be othervise ok, but my car is older 5.2 motronic that can't be flashed thru OBD.
I have had stand alone ECU:s on all my "hobby"car's, and I have always tuned those my self.
Vipec has a nice reasonably priced ecu, but I would like the ecu to be plug and play. After all this is my DD.
Is the m96 engine prone to detonation, or are the Porsche engineers just overly cautious?
