1st Post - what is an IMS???

Before anyone says � DUDE USE SEARCH �, I�m just kidding about the IMS - please don't kill me. I do know how forums work, and I�m super glad to be here. A month ago I decided that I�m finally going to cross off Porsche 911 from my childhood bucket list. I�m turning 30 next year, and I want to already have one in my garage when my mid-life crisis comes around. Currently I�m researching and building this dream car in my head. I work for BMW and am currently in a company lease which I have to/want to keep until May 2015, so I have a little time to spend researching before tracking down and buying a car. There�s one thing I�m nervous about though, and a couple things I�m uncertain about that I'm hoping you guys can help me with... First, here�s my driving background regarding rear-drive sports cars� as you might guess, a lot of BMWs, a Corvette, an MR2, and an SL 55 Mercedes. I'm very comfortable driving most anything, and like most men say "I'm an above-average driver". I�ve also spent quite a few track days autocrossing the MR2, and I regularly drive with traction control off on all my cars. To hell with tires! Of all of my past cars the Corvette was the only intimidating car to drive aggressively. Even after two years of ownership, I never felt like I could push it very hard without feeling like it was going to kill me. I'm hoping that won't be the case with the 996. So here�s where my nerves come in. I�ve never had an opportunity to actually drive a 911, but you hear stories, right? I�ve heard people call 911s �widow makers� . I like the sound of that if I�m honest; it sounds bad ***. But I�m aware it got that nickname for a reason. I really want a 911, but I don�t want a car that I�m afraid to drive in the rain (Oregon here) and what little bit of snow we get � I LOVE driving my RWD BMWs in the rain (and snow) with the traction control off. I love how I can drift my car around corners and it feels perfectly balanced. I know the 911s R/R setup is different from the 50/50 weight distribution I�m used to, so it makes me wonder just how different. If it�s raining on my way to work, am I going to lose it just from lifting on the throttle around a corner? Is it forgiving at all? I�m feeling like a few words of encouragement would be useful from you owners. I want to hear that with some practice and patience, I can be a corner-carving 911 driver too. Okay, that aside � I�d like to share with you what I think I want in a 996 so far. I�ll be looking for a non-turbo Carrera coupe in RWD. Mk1s/Mk2s both seem great; looks and power-wise. If it were down to a Mk1 or Mk2, I�d pick whichever one has better miles and service history. If both were matched, I�d pick the Mk2 for the newer look. 6spd � M/T for me. I�m sure the tip is great and nice to live with, but this is a dream car, right? I�m hoping to find one in nice shape with fewer than 80k miles, preferably with the IMS/RMS issues already sorted out, for between twenty to twenty-five thousand dollars. From my current searches, the cars are out there. I have a couple questions for those of you who�ve hung in there and read all this� 1. Mk1 vs Mk2. From my research, the reliability and performance seems to be pretty similar. As a daily driver, are there any major reasons to get the Mk2 over the 1? I�ve heard cup-holder and glove box�anything else? 2. Brakes: About 8 out of 10 Carreras I look at on eBay and Craigslist have drilled rotors. I�m assuming they came standard? I think that�s it for now, PLEASE feel free to make any recommendations, additions, etc. in regards to this research project of mine.

Welcome! 1) MKII has variocam plus and 3.6 engine. Although 0-60 numbers are similar, mkII has more torque. Test drive both and you will see what I mean. 2) Yes, standard. If you corner real fast and lift the throttle, the tail is gonna step out, even on dry roads. It's a lot easier in the rain. Maybe you want to consider one with PSM for the peace of mind. Coming out from Corvette and AMG, you may feel the 996 under power though. Maybe look for the 40th anniversary version which has more power and torque. I think widow maker refers to GT2 (turbo + rwd) and not regular 996s

+996 Ahsai The 996 is underpowered compared to alot of sport cars these days. I have a 2014 corevtte sitting at home but it doesnt get driven as much as the 996 not because i dont want to put miles on it but because i get a whole lot more enjoyment from the 996. As you have said pushing the vet makes you think twice compared to the 996 its alot more forgiving. I would say as soon as you see something that you fall in love with just jump on it. You wont regret it.

You won't miss the glove box on a Mk I bcz it has two huge door pockets with lids. That was actually a pretty big concern for me when I was looking yet I have never missed it. I think the Mk II cupholders have less than optimal utility bcz of their location and capacity, but maybe one of the Mk II guys can chime in on that. I simply bought 2 Ultimate Cupholders for $25 each. They work great and easily hold a Big Gulp. The rest of the interior is pretty much a wash. I think the 3.6 increased power is offset by weight gain. Probably headlights are the biggest difference. I love the looks of both the Mk II C4S and the Mk I aero.

Mk2 is more refined but less raw imo. If you want a more primitive race car feeling, mk1 might do the trick. Depends on what you want. I would drive them both and see which you like. Also if you plan on modding it, comparing two stock models is sorta moot IMO. As Ahsai indicated the widow maker term was given to gt2 models because of the hp increase along with the decision to make it a RWD with no traction control. That's clearly a recipe for disaster for most non-professional drivers.

Don't want to turn this into an IMS thread, but if you go with an MK1 you will end up with a dual row bearing which has been mentioned to have an extremely low (<1%) failure rate. Just another thing to think about because IMS issue "sorted out" could very well mean that they just kept the original. Others with far more experience can add a little more.

Quotes source post: 11697057

Actually '99 and some '00 models had the dual row bearing. The transition to single row bearing in '00(US models) led to some having single row and some having dual row. I just wanted to make that correction but PLEASE. DO NOT bring up the IXX again here in this thread and derail it's original questions.

First my recommedation. Mark I with aero kit. Best looking porsche ever. The mark 2's (I think because I have a 99) have different buttons. More satin finish and I guess wear better. Can't speak to throttle lift and losing it. Mine is a c4. Don't get caught up with the cup holders. You can mix and match the center console options pretty easily. For your price range you should be able to find a good one.

My recommendation would be to get a C4S and disable the AWD if you really want the AWD car You'll have NO trouble finding one in your price range. I think it was Pontifex that recently sold his car - it was gorgeous, completely sorted and I think he was only asking $22k or something like that. Don't quote me on the price...

Do it, I can honestly say of the 14 cars I have owned (5 have been Porsche's; haven't been Porsche less in a few years...something I hope I never experience again two Audi's just didn't cut the mustard). I Love my MK1 996 C2 Aero car. The P.Os did a lot of suspension work and fine tuning, Im just enjoying the he*l out of it. I smile every time I see the lines, the taco, how low she is (I hate "stanced" cars, etc) It's a car that I hope to own for a very long time. I haven't got the rush that a 911 will give someone from any other car I've owned...even my 951 which was must quicker. I don't have PSM, did a rear seat delete (all I need to c pillars without seat belt cut outs), have a Fabspeed Muffler Bypass pipe, headers, CAI...it is raw and I love it. Some times the bark is louder than the bite, but the fun factor is all that matters to me. These are great cars, you won't miss not having cup holders or a glove box. Unless your a pack rat. The IMS thing...I wouldn't let it get to you, preferable to find one with it fixed; but if the price is right, just plan to have it done. Clean the front radiators, change the oil, take care of preventative stuff and she'll treat you right. Lift in a high speed corner, you might get a kick in your ***...but its not the GT2 so they are not that crazy. Still takes more attention than most cars though

A Mk1 C2 should be the lightest car and for that reason might be the best to fling around. A Mk1 C4 is heavier due to the AWD equipment, but it has more stability and is torsionally stiffer. The AWD system was designed as a driving aid more than an all-weather aid, although it is good for slippery roads too. You will find people in both camps arguing which is better. I don't think it is a matter of which is better, they just have different strengths. Search the forums for more threads on this. Any 996 will tend to/try to swing it's rear out when you lift throttle in a corner. That's just physics. 996s have been engineered to reduce that tendency compared to earlier 911s, and PSM is a big aid in stabilizing the car when it happens. Good luck in your search!

Do it, I can honestly say of the 14 cars I have owned (5 have been Porsche's; haven't been Porsche less in a few years...something I hope I never experience again two Audi's just didn't cut the mustard). I Love my MK1 996 C2 Aero car. The P.Os did a lot of suspension work and fine tuning, Im just enjoying the he*l out of it. I smile every time I see the lines, the taco, how low she is (I hate "stanced" cars, etc) It's a car that I hope to own for a very long time. I haven't got the rush that a 911 will give someone from any other car I've owned...even my 951 which was must quicker. I don't have PSM, did a rear seat delete (all I need to c pillars without seat belt cut outs), have a Fabspeed Muffler Bypass pipe, headers, CAI...it is raw and I love it. Some times the bark is louder than the bite, but the fun factor is all that matters to me. These are great cars, you won't miss not having cup holders or a glove box. Unless your a pack rat. The IMS thing...I wouldn't let it get to you, preferable to find one with it fixed; but if the price is right, just plan to have it done. Clean the front radiators, change the oil, take care of preventative stuff and she'll treat you right. Lift in a high speed corner, you might get a kick in your ***...but its not the GT2 so they are not that crazy. Still takes more attention than most cars though

Another IMS thread ! Yeah !

For the record, the "widow maker" label attached to 911s goes back to the early 911s, especially pre-911SC series. Back in the day, most 911 owners had no prior experience with rear weight bias sports cars fitted with low grip tires (weren't they all!). Some learned about this characteristic the hard way; most adjusted their driving styles accordingly. The 911SC series was introduced in the late '70s when tire widths, compounds, etc., were rapidly evolving for sports cars, and Porsche adapted quickly by offering various wheel and tire choices as standard options for the series. Most experienced 911 owners feel the "widow maker" moniker is a myth perpetuated by those who have never driven a modern 911 on a track. relinuca

Some excellent information guys, thanks! I feel much better now, and will be looking to test drive something soon. Just curious, what is the difference between a C2 and a C4S besides the AWD? Is there a C2S?

C4S is a wide body and only Mk II. C4 is only Mk I and is narrow body. C2 is both Mk I and Mk II and are all narrow body. No C2S in 996 (there is 997 C2S). Besides wide body, the C4S has the slits in the lower rear fenders (like a Turbo, but no Turbo air inlets above & forward of the rear wheels). C4S also has Turbo brakes. Unlike previous generations, there is not a huge difference in rear widths between a narrow body and a wide body in the 996. I believe the wide body is 1 1/2 inches wider than the narrow body.

Reasons to consider '99s: - Lighter - Dual row IMS - LSD with Traction Control was available - Early 3.4's pull hard at the top end - Cheaper That said the most important consideration is getting a well maintained car. If not you will be paying for the deferred maintenance.