Oil Level - How do you do it

Hi, I have OCD about oil level so bad that I called it CDO (letters are in order ) I know the stick is on the left side of the sump and the electronic sensor is on the right. So I can appreciate is the car is leaning left/right it can make the car's oil level to read high/low depending. So today. I drove the car for 40 min and parked it for 2 hours. I then drove it 30 min to a petrol station and filled up. Everything is hot. No idea on oil temp but given the time/distance it should have been nice and hot. After letting the car sit for 5 min (time it took to dump a can of liqui moly fuel system cleaner and fill the car and pay for it) both the electronic and the dip stick indicated 1/3 and 1/2 respectively. I just then drove 1 hour (worse stop/start traffic) and parked the car on a very level surface at the shopping centre and now the oil level is all but on max on the stick and 1 notch off max on the sensor. Is there the 'best' way to check the oil level? Cheers Side note - first UOA on its way under my ownership

My MY99 shows the same: 1 segment below max on the display and max on the dipstick. That is enough oil and I don't give it another thought. Try the same!

That is the problem with having two watches, you never know what time it is. I use the dash gauge only. I did compare it to the dip stick once or twice and they agree well enough for me. If you are uncertain about the gauge use the stick, it is far simpler and therefor more reliable.

Take your oil level reading when the engine is cold after it has been sitting over night. I use the dipstick. Others prefer the dash. But the key thing to do is after you perform an oil change and you know how much oil has been put in, check your oil reading level to identify the starting point.

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So, see you've made the full circle from faulty aos to oil level,,, here is something to ponder ... have you got the updated dipstick, or the old style dipstick,? has the dash gauge been re-calibrated for the updated dipstick...??? Half quart difference from the updated to the original dipstick...iirr the change was made sometime during the 2002 model year. Some shops would update the old dipstick when car was in for service. Regardless, best way to get the actually exact reading is leaving the car overnight on a perfectly flat garage floor. Next morning pull dipstick, wipe it totally clean reinsert dipstick for at least 5 seconds, then checking with dipstick end facing down. The dash gauge is good for not exact, spot checks, like after fill ups, etc. Use dipstick for oil changes and exact readings imo. And be glad we still have a dipstick.

I fill with oil to .5 quarts less than full. (for my car with the LN +2qt deep sump that is 10 quarts) I go from a good long drive to get the car to temperature. When I return I check for any leaks and leave it for the night. The next morning I check the oil level and normally it is right in the middle where I want it. Since I have the +2qt deep sump, I know that even if I'm 1 quart low, I'm still .5 to 1 quart higher than the factory fill. No more oil level anxiety. With the UAOS with track drain, I also know that fully filled is just fine too.

Good strategy Tex. I just ran 12 qts with a 2qt deep sump and the UAOS Track last month on the track. No problems at all. UaOS T handled all the extra oil w/o a problem. Per Justin's question, the only way to measure all this oil is with the dipstick.

The dipstick never lies.

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But it can't read what's still pushed out in the heads. The oil still needs time to get back to the sump. I check my oil first thing before driving the car, i.e. after the car has been sitting for a LONG time, not just 30 minutes but several hours at least. I use the dash gauge personally. Then I simply forget about oil level for the rest of the day. Like @TexSquirrel my preferred max level is halfway up the dash gauge. I occasionally get a low oil warning after filling up at the gas station, which I ignore.

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@wdb out of curiosity, which dipstick/calibration are you running?

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+1. Always cold, flat, and after 12 hours.

Same here. I just spent a weekend driving through the mountains, and the electronic gauge was all over the place. At max during one stop, blinking at its lowest level at the next, and everywhere in between. The dipstick seemed a lot more consistent. The e-gauge is so sensitive it's almost useless when on a trip. The only use I have for it is to compare readings after leaving the car to cool several hours, parked in my garage.

I go by my digital gauge daily, and then confirm with the dip stick at minimum, every other fill up if not every fill up. Digital gauge has always proven to be accurate, and well, a dip sticks a dip stick. albeit a kinda crappy dip stick imo.

The M96 engine has a Factory fill of 9.3qts oil, on mid 2002 models this was lowered to 8.75 qts, due to AOS deficiencys and smoking on high G corners. But that is a LOT of oil considering that many Honda's and Toyota Camry's only have 4.5 qts oil total in them, and a lot of Motorcycles on 2 qts oil doing 15k RPM at over 200 mph ......and 200 HP 2 stroke V6 engines with no oil at all in the engine, just oil in the gas using only 1 oz oil every 10 seconds to lubricate the entire engine, crank,bearings, rods, and pistons/rings.... So, there is no need to be OCD over oil leve l..........there is a LOT of oil in there ...... you only need to be OCD "IF " you do over 1G maneuvers.....the M96 in the Carrera's is only designed to do under 1G without oil starvation..( there are upgrades for this....UAOS T System, TTP/UIDS Sump, 2 qt deeps sumps ect..) Over 1G can be achieved even on the street briefly if you are very "jerky" in aggressive corners....or even if you are smooth and have very good traction tires like tw200 or better.... If you drive normally no need to be OCD over oil level.....if you drive aggressively and don't know if you are exceeding 1G, you can get phone apps to display G levels, and also monitor oil pressure if you are concerned.. As mentioned, you can only get accurate oil level measurements on the M96 on level surface after at least 8 hours of resting time...

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I honestly haven't bothered to figure it out. I go by the electronic gauge. The only time I take the dipstick out is when the workshop overfills the car, which so far has been every. single. time. But that's only been twice because I mostly do my own oil changes.

Another user of the measure cold on a flat surface in the morning, and don't look at it otherwise. It's pretty simple really. 8 bars on the electronic gauge equals one quart, so when my cold level reading is on the last bar I add 1/2 qt. Works every time. Dipstick values follow the gauge values, or vice versa. I don't track the car, so the level works just fine. So don't sweat it. If a big enough leak develops to make a difference during the day, you'll see it before you start the car.

There's 1.5L between min & max on the e-gauge (6 bars)

Jake Raby once said �cold dead 24 hours� as a general time lapse for when the dipstick is accurate and I�ve been reliably using that methodology ever since.

Whatever you do, do it the same way every time. Also, keep in mind that oil as a fluid undergoes thermal expansion. Can't argue with science. While that may be negligible in some cases, when you run 10 quarts of oil with a deep sump, it can make a measurable difference. This is why you should not fill the oil to the top mark as once it expands you'll have a slightly larger volume. A while back I did an experiment where I measured oil level at cold (in the morning, same ambient temp) and then measured it hot after driving at least an hour and having the car sit for 30-45 minutes. All readings were consistent but hot readings were always a 1 or 2 markers higher on the digital gauge.

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Yep, the thermal expansion is significant from room temperature to operating temperature on ~10 qts oil, the expansion is 5-6% of total volume .. The M96 with its flat six layout and its "Integrated Dry Sump" separate the engine into a "loft area" and a "sump area" ( unlike regular "wet sumps")..... The "loft area" holds a very significant amount of oil that is "pumped" back down to the sump when the engine running, when the engine is turned off, it takes a loooong time for gravity to force this oil to drip down to the sump. This gravity drip time plus the thermal expansion/cooling time is what makes the complex measurement of oil level to vary so much at any time, ..The digital gauge has built in algorithms to supposedly calculate/compensate for engine OF/ON times ( gravity drip down), and also thermal expansion/retraction, but this is why the only truly accurate measurement is after at least 8 hours of rest time... One big false narrative that is widely spread on the Internet, ( especially on some FB pages of keyboard warriors)is that running the oil level too high will increase oil aeration, this is only true on "regular wet sumps", the opposite is true for the "Integrated Dry Sump",...the higher the oil level the less aerated the oil becomes due to the scavenge pumps are pumping more oil and less air with the end result being a less aerated better lubricating oil...This means better lubrication for all lubricated parts... And with the "Integrated Dry Sump" design, the windage from crankshaft high speed rotation cannot effect the oil in the Sump when the oil level is higher, unlike in regular wet sumps, and the reason wet sumps use "windage trays" for high performance, but they still don't compare to the "Integrated Dry Sump".. Also the false narrative that overfilling the oil level will cause oil leaks is not true due to the crankcase in under a slight vacuum at all times ( unless you have excessive low-by).. So the benefits of running a high oil level are deceased oil aeration, decreased risk of oil starvation, with the only risk being ingestion through the AOS, but with the 4x efficiency of the UAOS T, that risk is all but nullified and why the benefits are so crucial and desirable...

I don't get why anyone would want to run less oil in their M96 so they don't "stress" the OEM AOS. It's like wasting a pick on an old running back in the fantasy football draft that you know won't make it thru the season.

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I wonder if my low pressure in turns is attributed to this. Maybe I'm just pushing the car in corners more than it was intended? Though I really find that hard to believe... but the canyons of Angeles Crest are very twisty, and you can really push the car hard through them. Is there a reliable app that can be used to measure this?

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Phone apps just read accelerometer/gyro data from your phone sensor. Any high-end phone from the last 10 years will have a pretty decent gyro. I basically lived on ACH, 1.2G on street tires (no aero) is possible but your car would show evidence of that. If your tire tread isn't feathered (as if you took them on track) you're probably not pushing the car too hard, we should look somewhere else for oil pressure drops.

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I've done some pretty aggressive cornering in mine after putting the scavenge pump the right way. The most I ever see is a .5 bar dip at constant revs. Most of the time, there is no visible pressure dip. Of course, the pressure will go down if you slow down & your revs go down.

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I own TrackAddict, Harry's lap Timer, and Dragy. I looked at all three and don't see where they can display lateral Gs. I may be wrong, but it's definitely not default.

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I wouldn't waste the money on technology to track it. You have already seen dips on the canyons so you may want to keep your revs up in combination with spending the money on (1) heavier and (2) more oil using the UAOST and a deep sump. Yep, it certainly helps.

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I live in Glendale, so I'm up there atleast every other week, sometimes more. Lunch drives midweek = empty roads. No, i'm not track-level abusing the tires on canyon roads, but they're getting to the edges. My oil issue is a whole other thread, which I am going to update now that it's back from indy (spoiler, nothing surprising to add). Rear and Front:

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Yup, we switched to 5w50 (just got it back today) and he filled to max this time for trial. And I told him about the UAOS as a follow up option.

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+1. My car also dips pressure in the turns as well as many others. I stopped worrying about it, and stopped tracking it, but like Glenn said, UAOS and a different sump can fix it.

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Well, there is your problem right there: Michelin tires. Tire tech over the last 20 years has been astounding, and you have selected the #1 brand.

Yeah, you just need a wee bit more camber.

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Nah, those are warm but not hot. Will have to take a look at your other thread, in the meantime as @GC996 said I would bump up camber next alignment just to keep the soft-sidewall Michelins happy.

After having read a bunch of oil level threads, I've concluded that we as a Porsche collective are very meticulous and obsessed. Not sure if that is a good or bad thing lol. Here is my oil level obsession over the last few days. Car: 2003 Porsche 996. Validated the .55 dipstick which is what I would expect. I used a see thru storage container that I labeled in 100ml increments above 8 litres. I also put a screen in the funnel into this container looking for anything untoward. Based on the LN and Slakker recommendations, I'm running my car at the full level (stock AOS btw). But of course, I'm concerned about too much oil so i have spent the last 3 days checking the oil level in my car. 1. After 3 hours, interior gauge shows 2 bars down. Dipstick, just below the top part of the plastic arrow, below the round thing. 2. After 14 hours - overnight, interior gauge shows 1 bar down. Dipstick, right at the top part of the plastic arrow, below the round thing. 3. After 36 hours, interior gauge shows zero - no bar down. Dipstick, just above the top part of the plastic arrow, below the round thing. Based on what I've read, watched videos, I think I'm at the correct level. I also believe that the interior gauge is pretty accurate since the reading align with the dipstick findings. So my final word is that, based on LN's recommendations of letting the car sit overnight, Interior gauge is one bar down and dipstick shows pretty much full, I am at the correct level. What I did find interesting is that it looks like the oil keeps draining for a really long time, beyond the overnight period. I also have a sloped floor in my garage, rear end out. So I assume that my readings show a tad bit higher than a perfectly flat floor. It also explains why my car seems to show more oil when parked on the garage floor versus on the lift - the lift is level. I will now end my oil level obsession.

What Porsce M96 owners "Should" be obsessing over is why Porsche went from 8.75 quarts, to 9.3 quarts, back to 8.75 quarts ( with TSB's that don't really explain "why" ) on the same M96 architect Integrated Dry Sump Engines....

You need to set up 24/7 surveillance, preferably with a rotating three man team, these cars are not stupid, if your cover is blown its game over. How are you at impersonating garden tools ?

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Garden tools are kept in garden shed. Garage is only for car related items. Need different costume.

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If new rebuilt M96-03 4.1L engine has the 997 oil return tubes and UAOS +TD, What is the maximum oil fill amount? Counting fluid ounces, 9qts = 288oz, so a 5%-6% is 14.4oz to 17.2oz expansion volume in engine. (sort of like a regular beer can to a tall beer can amount). If the 997 oil return tubes operate easier or faster (?) does this affect the initial maximum amount when engine is running at operating temp? If owner can calculate what the maximum will be when running with new engine + 997-tubes + UAOS + TD, what is that amount? Oh, and I have the earlier 2-band oil dipstick, got rid of the OEM '04 one. Since the 996 can exceed 1G, especially if wider wheels/tires on 4S/Turbo or "stickier" tires, what is the line to avoid oil starvation? (No deep sump or added baffles in sump). Would adding baffles in sump "help" avoid oil starvation? Curious and very interested. YMMV

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I suppose you have not checked your Engine Health/Blow-by/ for fully broken -in, so I'll just assume it is average, and you have no Deep Sump or UIDS which are imperative to mitigating oil starvation at high RPM and high G-force... But to answer your Question simply with the UAOS+ Track Drain you can run 10.3 qts oil If you want (assuming your engine truly is average health/sealing) People should not worry about oil expansion, ( yes it is 5-6% when hot) and should always be referenced cold......just like tire pressures should be checked when cold,, yes they will increase when hot but that is always factored in...Tire pressures and oil level should always be factored/spec'd COLD.. The 997 return tubes vs the 996 swirl pots, the speed of return really isn't that much difference, they are not restrictive... The purpose is to "de-aerate" the oil that is returned from the heads via the Scavenge Pumps which pump a lot of air along with the oil....If fact at times the Scavenge Pumps are pumping more air than oil......But the 996 swirl pots have been known to stop up with plastic debris from the chain guides/cam pads,or fall apart at the joints,( and they take up a lot of room ) the 997 return tubes are a more simple design with less issues.. To really keep from having oil starvation at high RPM and over 1G you really need to have about 11.75-12.00 qts oil inside the m96/7 COLD ...

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I just wanted to clarify our position has not changed in decades (almost literally), and that is not filled to the max. What I did do is make a directive for this years ago since there is confusion as to the dipstick revisions and people often add oil based on the dash reading when they shouldn't and end up overfilling the engine. https://lnengineering.com/free-downl...ayman-and-911/ And as I just posted on another thread, this is assuming a factory AOS and street use.

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Yes ^^^ .........and just to clarify more, everything I say is assuming you have or will have the UAOS System installed, because I think EVERY M96/7 should have came with the UAOS System, the OEM System is a poor and weak design and should be updated asap.. I think I was the first one to mention the dipstick changes and the Re-programmed Dash Oil Level Strategy on the mid-2002 models.... It came as a TSB as a "running change" in mid-2002 but I don't think it was ever discussed here until I was developing a better AOS System that could handle a higher oil level...( the UAOS System )