Tire recommendation

Hey everyone. Long time lurker first time poster. Porsche fan my whole life, currently driving a BRZ. My dad purchased a 2003 996 C2 Targa as his first Porsche about a year ago. Past owner had installed a set of Continentals which have been terrible. Not sure how long the car sat on these until she sold, so that can be a factor. Anyway, we are looking for a replacement but are unsure of where to go. He's been looking at the P Zero Rosso's but reviews have been pretty spotty. He's looking more for a touring tire. So good tread wear and low road noise are priority. Obviously, dry and wet performance as well but he doesn't drive spiritedly that often. We'd like to get Michelin PSS's but it doesn't look they are available in the proper size. Thank you for the information and help. Edit: sizes: 225/40-18 front 285/30-18 rear.

Where in the country? Will the car see sub-freezing temps? Doesn't sound like he cares about performance so much so I don't think PSS is the right tire. I looked on tirerack and was surprised at how limited selection is in those sizes. Best option I saw was the Continental all season tire, which might be what is on there now. What is it about the current tire that makes them "terrible"? Road noise or handling or....?

My advice is to stay away from cheap tires like Sumitomos. They are tempting because of the low price, but my experience is that they sacrifice performance and they become noisy as they wear. I have found the 996 to be sensitive to tire selection. Brand choice makes a noticeable impact on performance. I haven't found a tire that I like better than the Michelin Pilot Sport PS2. I know that lots of people say that they are too expensive and that it's not worth the money, but that hasn't been my experience. It has been worth the money. They handle very well, they are quiet and they perform well over their entire life. I just put a new set on my 997. My experience with Continentals has been mixed, and it hasn't been on a 911. I bought Continental ExtremeContact DWS tires for the Cayenne and they were great. They had good tread life and they were quiet. They obviously don't perform quite as well as a proper summer tire, but they were good in that application. I'm not sure if they are available in the sizes you need. I know some people run the "DW" version of the tire for their 996 and it seems to get good reviews. That being said, the Continental SportContact 4x4 N1 tires that came on my Cayenne from the factory were terrible. I don't think you'll be considering those for a 996 though... I'm surprised the Michelin PSS wasn't available. They are getting great reviews...

Clear #1 for me is Michelin PSS A distant #2 is Conti Extreme Contact DW, have them on my 911 now and they are solid, not superb. An even more distant #3 if you want to go cheap are the new Hankook Ventus EVO V12, not the older K110 version. Note that these are all summer tires, not all seasons.

PSS is a great DD capable on the track and autocross. 245 and 295 widths are nice on 8/10" wheels

I like my Potenza S02A N-spec to boot. http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires....e&autoModClar=

I for one have not seen issues with "cheap" tires such as Sumis. About 8K on my set and no issues, including a track day where they did as well as i would expect any tire to. We all have different reasons for tire selection but don't throw out a tire (or group of tires) based on one experience. There are many other inputs out there.

^^ Cheap tires is kind of a broad brush to use to describe a LOT of tires out there. My set of Hankook Ventus V12 evo2 XL tires probably falls under the "cheap" heading, but they are great tires. IMO, customer reviews and opinions from drivers of similar vehicles are the best way to help choose from the intimidating selection of tires out there. Unless you're on 19's, in which case the selection isn't quite as broad or intimidating...

Yes, I just get tired of hearing over and over that "cheap tires suck". I do not agree with that.

You will regret going cheap on tires. Just bite the bullet and buy the N3 or N4 tires.

Hell, once we're in for tires, should we talk about oil, too? TOTAL Quartz Energy 9000 5W40!

Get the dual-row LN bearing.

A puff on occasion at startup is probably OK.

Have you cleaned the MAF sensor?

All informed M96 996 owners MUST use JG DT40 or risk CEF. Replace the IMSB every 30,000 miles or risk CEF. If its crack or meth your puffing on you risk jail time and of course CEF.

N4 is no good, it must be N5 or better...

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If you get N5, you MUST get the n5 spec rated Porsche approved blinker fluid as well or it just plain won't stick and work like it should due to the massive grip of the N5 tires.

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You're the only person I know who uses the term "catastrophic engine failure" so often that an acronym is required...

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So that's what it stands for. I was wondering about that for a sec. Thought it could've been "curious engine future" or something...

Probably the window regulator or a micro switch.

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You're right - that is a broad brush. What exactly defines a "cheap" tire? In my mind, I classified tires for my 996 as follows: Cheap = under $1,000 for all four tires, installed Moderate = $1,000 - $1,500 for all four tires, installed Expensive = over $1,500 for all four tires, installed The only tire that I ever used on my 996 that fell into my cheap category was the Sumitomo HTR ZIII. They were fine for a while, but the car didn't handle as well as it does on some other tires and they were horrendously noisy after about 7,000 miles. The only tire that I ever used that fell into my moderate category was the Hankook Ventus at just over $1,000 for a set. I liked it better than the Sumitomo, but the car didn't feel as "planted" and stable during cornering as it did with Michelins. The tread life was better than the Sumis and it wasn't quite as loud as it wore. I rate my experience with them as okay. In the expensive category, I've used Pirelli P Zero and Michelin Pilot Sport PS2s. As previously mentioned, I love the PS2s. They provide the best combination of ride quality, quiet operation, looks and handling. I hated the P Zeros. They had horrendous tread life and they were horribly noisy. They handled very well, but they were howling at less then 5,000 miles. On my scale, the Michelin Pilot SuperSport would fall into the moderate category. They are available in the proper sizes for my new 997 TT, and I will probably go with that tire when the time comes. Tire selection is a very subjective thing. You'll find some people love a certain tire and some people hate it. Look in the customer reviews section at www.tirerack.com and you'll usually find a good cross section of people who have given reviews.

Thanks for the feedback guys. DTMiller, The car is in Northeast Ohio but he mostly drives it in during the summer and a bit in the fall. Therefore, cold weather performance isn't important. I didn't check the exact model of his current Continental's so I'm not sure. Dennis, your input on the P Zero's matches up with most of what I have read about them, noise and tread life. I will look into the PS2's. I wish they made PSS's in his sizes, I already have my eye on them as my next tire. I've struggled to find a bad review of the PSS.

I just purchased an '03 Carrera 4S, almost three-weeks ago, and the car had a "newer" set of Pirelli P-Zero Rosso's, with the nice red lettering. Within one-week of getting the car, I ran over a screw and needed to replace the tire. One-week later, Discount received the replacement P-Zero and installed it.... Later that evening, I looked at the tire and realized that it did not have that cool red lettering..... I called Pirelli, and they do not manufacture these tires with red lettering anymore, which leads me to believe that the dealer I purchased my car from put on the cheapest set of tires available to him at a discounted price, so I ended up ordering all new tires. I read a Car & Driver review, which popped up when searching for the Pirelli tires, and they placed 9th in this review... However, I didn't want to spend $400+ for each rear Michelin PS2 (and $260 for the fronts (each)), and found the second best tires -- the Bridgestone Potenza S-04s -- to meet my satisfaction. Each rear was only $261, and the front $159. I had Potenza's before, and they lasted much longer than the Dunlop's that were on my R-32. I have had Michelin's before, a couple of times, on my E39, and have had an excellent experience; however, knowing that I somehow talked my wife into letting me get this car, I was not about to spend a ton of money on the PS2s! The Potenza's are much grippier and way more quite than the Pirelli's! I recommend doing your research! Regards, Robert

I forgot to mention... Discount hooked me up with the "newer" Pirelli's: 75 for each front and 80 for the rear, which made this transaction that much smoother, and they transferred the certificates I purchased for all Pirelli tires over to the Potenza's! And, the "Second Best" tire falls within Dennis's "Cheap" category! I'm surprised that nobody else had discussed these tires! [At least Potenza's!] **EDIT** Sorry, Ahsai! You did mention the S02A - however, according to Discount, Bridgestone is no longer making these (phasing them out for the S04), and they will not be available in the 295 width, like the S02s.... The one positive for me, according to Discount, is that the S04s have a better tire composition, so they should last longer than the S02s.... I would not have a problem running an S02 with an S04, but I personally would not split up tire manufacturers....

I did in post #6. Very happy with my Potenza S02A. The best part is they are still being manufactured these days. A lot of models will obsolete once you get your rears worn out, you won't be able to get the same model to match the fronts. I went through conti contact sport 2 to michelin sport rib to Potenza. The first two were NLA by the time I needed new rear tires. I was forced to through away my 50% good front tires.

Another vote for Hankook Ventus V12's... I was impressed with them on track and off. Great tire, would do them again in a second. IMHO the key is also getting the right suspension alignment and front/back tire width balance...

I've had good experiences with both the Bridgestone SO2A & S04PP. For my next purchase, I will only buy tires that do as well as these, but that can be rotated (side to side) without having to remove and re-mount the tires. If you track your car, this rotation will add tire life. The S02As are uni-directional, but the S04PPs can be swapped from side to side at home.

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Price does NOT equal performance, especially when it comes to tires; some of the cheapest tires outperform the most expensive in many tests- HTRZIII for instance. What you're going to find is a myraid of tire manufacturers out there, each of which create tires with different compromises between grip/longevity, cold/hot performance, wet/dry performance, etc. For a Porsche, I'd ignore any tire test that includes "comfort" as a qualitative factor- the characteristics that make a tire comfortable are terrible for performance. The ones with "N" stamped on the sites will just gouge the crap out of you because they know they can and you'll pay it. There have been some significant advances in tread compound the past two years: I would not buy a tire today that's a more than 2 year old design. If you're interested in grip & street performance, the top tires right now are Hankook R-S3 & Dunlop ZII*, BF Goodrich Rival; all of which are what TireRack considers "Extreme Performance" with 200TW, take advantage of the new tread compound technology, and do great both cold and wet. Bridgestone RE-11A is good as well. I've heard really great things about (dirt cheap) Federal 595R-SR, but don't know much about them. Michelin PSS and PS2 aren't even in the same performance category, as they're a severe compromise for mass consumption for people who want the image of a luxury car but care little about the actual performance; you can do much better. Further, don't be afraid to consider slightly different tire sizes than OEM; there are a lot of size tires will fit on OEM wheels, some sizes of which will give better than OEM performance.

I agree. My rating system was subjective, based on my experience with my car. I thought the Sumitomos were terrible. I also thought the Pirellis were terrible, and they were much more expensive. I don't like the PS2 the best because of the price, I like it the best because of the way my car handles and performs when I use that tire. I'm open to trying any new tire, which is evident by my experience with different tires.

If you want a more comfortable ride and good all season performance (even light snow) -- I've been very pleased with my Continental DWS tires -- the rears are just starting to show wear to the bars on the inside after 20,000 miles (which seems to be about double the summer high performance tires). If on the other hand, you want summer performance tires check out TireRack videos as they rate the top brands for handling, comfort etc. It seems that Michelin and Bridgestone always do well on their tests. I like Michelin tires and have them on my other car, but with the 40 AE they were simply too firm for a daily driver and had no snow/winter capability at all.

Tirerack is doing tire testing on the new Dunlop ZII Star Spec, and should have a test video (and charts) out soon comparing it to the Hankook R-S3 v2, BFG Rival, and the other top tires. Will be interesting to see what results their results are, and how they compare to other tire testing autocrossers are doing on the same tires.

It appears tire technology has evolved a great deal over the last few years, as has the comparative quality from various companies. So anecdotal data is of limited use, I think. That said, I have recent experience with 4 types of tires on my vehicles. 1. On the '02 996 C2: PSS. Just wow, blows everything else I've had away for handling and without comfort tradeoffs. Just tremendous. Unlike Michelins in the past, reasonably priced. Previous tires on this car were Pilot Sports, no PS2 or anything, and they were fairly old (6+ years), so comparisons are not fair (especially see below) but the PS were really awful -- much less traction and substantially harder riding, and significant tram lining. PSSs have none of those drawbacks. 2. On the '05 987: PS2. Superb as well, although without the power and suspension (the 996 has X74) difficult to tell at the limit. But comfortable, quiet, and as good a grip as I can get the suspension to push on them. Too expensive to buy again when worn out given the other choices likely available (couple of years from now). 3. On an '07 Toyota Sienna minivan (don't laugh). Previously had Continental Extreme Contact DWS which I absolutely loved at the beginning of their life for handling (yes, in a van!), a little louder and rougher than I would have liked but not objectionable. However, 5 years later and after only 29k miles, they are shot. By then the traction was much poorer than when they were new, squealing a lot on very moderate turns. Definitely loud. Disappointing. I am not a repeat buyer. Just replaced the DWSs with new Michelin Sport A/S 3, because of great TireRack test results and again, reasonable price. So far so good, far better traction than the DWS and much quieter. 4. On the '87 Carrera, my favorite tire was the S02 PP. Had I kept the car I would probably have moved to the S04 PP. The S02 had an excellent balance of price, grip, comfort, and life. I do not plan on any snow except light snow for the Sienna, and buy accordingly. PSSs will fit on the stock 18" wheels with a little oversizing. Use 285/35-18 on the rears and 235/40-18 on the fronts. They work perfectly although the PO did roll my front fenders.