Trying to diagnose a starting issue on my 4S and need HELP!

Hi Guys, Recently I've been running out of patience with my car and I'm really turned off by it. Besides the pressure plate failing for no reason (got a new clutch kit, plus RMS and some other $500 part inside) I decided to get the flywheel resurfaced. This was a big mistake which ended up costing me more as the flywheel literally broke from the rivets (mechanic said he's never seen this happen before) and towing, plus labour for both incidents ended up costing me approx 5K. Clutch Interlock Switch - Now this is a really magical part that I ended up changing out a few times... the symptoms for this one are beyond belief that vary in all sorts of weird clutch actions. Finally fixed this and I think I'll be good for a little while. Now to the starting issue - I've been having delayed starts forever and as the colder weather comes, it gets worst. I sometimes have to hold the key turned for more then 30 seconds for it to start. Turning the key back or taking it out and trying again does not seem to make a difference(yes, I do press down the clutch all the way down). I bought a new ignition switch and just swapped it out a few minutes ago (it seemed to fix my sunroof electrical problems) but the delayed start is still there. Sometimes I hear a minor click as if it was about to engage but then nothing again until it finally starts one shot. What can this starting issue be? Thanks, Alin

This will require some real-time troubleshooting when it occurs. Since you have replaced the clutch interlock switch and the ignition switch, the other two potential suspects are the interlock relay and the starter itself. Since it sounds like intermittent, the easiest is to wire some test light (where you can see when you crank) to the rear start lock relay power pin to the starter. If it happens next time and the light turns on when you try to crank, it means the starter has power but it doesn't activate. That means you need a new starter. If the light doesn't turn on when you crank, it means somehow the relay in not activating so you will need to troubleshoot that branch further.

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I'll head to the dealer tmrw and get the relay as I had this in mind as well. I for some reason doubt it's the problem. If the relay doesn't work, I'll look into further testing the starter. Once the engine is on and operating at it's normal operating temp, it will start up right away all the time. It's only after it sits for a longer period of time that I get these symptoms. So just to clarify, it's not like the engine is cranking and it just doesn't turn over... I turn the key and literally nothing happens. All the dash lights are on and everything is operating normally. It's just a very delayed start.

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That sounds more like the starter as it sounds like the symptom depends on the engine temp. If it happens all the time at cold start, you can just put the car in neutral, remove the start lock relay and jump the power pins to energize the starter directly. If the starter doesn't engage, its solenoid is bad.

My vote is the starter.

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You have the same syptoms I had with a bad clutch interlock switch, which appeared also to made the starter crank more slowly once it engaged. Since you have replaced this switch, maybe you could get the supplier to give you another one so you can make sure the first one wasn't a bad, new switch.

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Good point about trying another switch. Not sure about that making the starter crank slower though as i don't see how but I guess it's possible. Or you can just bypass the switch completely for now. Just unplug the two connectors from the switch and then short them together.

I went through 3 clutch interlock switches. (The red/black plastic one) Dealer also said the brown/black plastic one is the same part... for any reason if you push the plastic tab to much in, it's toast - so they say. I pulled the plastic back to it's original length and it works fine now. All the weird clutch symptoms went away, but the delayed starts are still happening. I haven't tried changing the interlock relay (one that makes a click when pressing down the clutch). I might try that but I doubt that would fail... You never know though.

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A question that is prompted by something you mentioned in an early post: Are you really leaving the key turned to the start position for sometimes 30 seconds then the engine starts?

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My goodness, you replaced the WRONG switch! The one that activates/deactivates the start relay is a GRAY microswitch with a silver lever. The one you keep replacing is for cruise control and has nothing to do with the starter!!

The one you need to check/replace is the one the yellow arrow points to image.jpg

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Yes. If I go back and forth it's pretty much the same thing. hit or miss. I have more of a chance to just keep it in the start position until it starts. 30 seconds is the longest, in the morning when it's colder. After that I usually hold it for 5-10 seconds at most, and if the car is fully warmed and it's been started a few times already (stopping at the bank, store, etc...) then it fires up right away with no delays.

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I switched the one I keep replacing because it in fact was causing me issues with my clutch response/throttle. My exhaust note would completely change (no more mean growl) my sweet spot for engagement would be off, and taking off from first would be extremely difficult cause my sweet spot was essentially gone. I'd have to stop, go under the pedals and pull the black plastic tab out and then voila, back to normal. But the proper fix was a new switch which I have now. I will install the new gray microswitch in the next 2 days and report back. If that doesn't fix it, it's most likely my starter.

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In this pic, I can't believe how close the tab part that sticks out of the red switch is. Mine is much longer. It touches the clutch point as well just like yours and there's no gap in between but if my tab was pushed that much in, it would cause me the problems I mentioned above. I opened the switch up, and there's tabs inside. So once you push it in past a certain tab, it is not meant to pull out. I pulled it out though forcefully and it worked fine for some time unless by accident you put your foot under the pedal and pull up, cause it to go in more.

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Ok, I think it's a terminology issue then. I call the gray switch the clutch interlock switch because it locks the starter from starting. If you have not replaced the gray switch, your odds are pretty good that it is the culprit of the starting problem.

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It sounds like your clutch pedal is not returning all of the way every time. Does your car still have the clutch assist spring? Is it functioning? IE: not broken inside the can. It is the red spring in the tan housing in the above pic.

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Mine is broken inside.

The gray switch fixed my starting issue. It also fixed my sunroof issues, and a weird window issue. The clicking noise is also much quieter with the new part.

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All right! It's only responsible for the starter so not sure how it fixed your other issues but who cares now everything seems to work fine