966 without title help?

Here's the deal. My father made a deal with his friend to buy this Porsche and bike off him. His friends brother passed away and he was inheriting the 966 among everything else. The guy was desperate for money and sold the car to my father before everything got transferred to his ownership. This guy was older than my father so I kept pressing him to have the guy transfer it from his deceased brother to my father. Have had the car sitting for almost 4 yrs now at his place. Like I said, kept telling my father to have the guy switch it to his name and give my father the title. I then heard his health was deteriorating maybe over a year ago. I recently asked did the guy at least switch it from his brother to himself and my father said no, he also passed away. Now, my father says I can have the car. I originally wanted to use it as a track car but I know I'm going to want to have a title and drive it own the streets. Is there a way for me to get the title somehow? Of course now he's lost the key. Help please!!

I believe the rules for applying for a new title varies from state to state, you'll have to contact your local DMV to find out how to do that

Sounds like an attorney would be the best guide. DMV may help, but it's hit or miss if you get someone that really knows the answers. There could be issues with who is the rightful owner and hopefully you have a paper trail for that. Typically, when people die there is some form of estate (either someone is appointed as a personal representative or the state does it). Things can get tangled up in legal purgatory.

What state do you live in? You could also ask a lawyer that�s familiar with this sort of stuff.

There was an estate. Problem is that the guy never put in his name from his brother. He has control over the estate but now he has also passed away without switching the title from his brother's name to his own. A lot of time has passed since my father made the deal and he never put it into his own name. Next thing I heard he was sick and unable to. Ask my father if he has gotten him to get the title before that and he said no. Told me he would get it but never did. Now my father told me he's no longer alive. So it's in 1st brother's name that passed initial. Brother that inherited never took out his brother's name and is now deceased also. That's situation unfortunately. Sucks cause I was really urging my father to take care of this when everything was good but he kept saying his friend would do it. I told my pops it was very important because this could happen given his friends age and condition when I met the guy. It was a ridiculous deal. My father knew him for years. That's why he wasn't pushing it as much I guess. Don't believe there is a paper trail. My father gave him a deposit and he was going to give the other half once he received the title. Guessing once his friend got control of the state and got the house and money, he didn't find it important anymore. Also the guy has a money hungry girlfriend which is also why I was pushing my father to get the deal done asap.

Also I'm in ohio

In DE my local tow yard is liscenced to apply for titles for abandoned cars. Its a 6 month process and costs some money, involes a state police vin check, dmv notificatiin to the previous owners and a few other things. The risk is the estate can claim they didnt sell it and u would have to give the car back. Check with your dmv or local tag service company and go from there.

Do you have a signed/dated, with vin, bill of sale..? Without the BOS, and no keys, and no transferred title, and a new (more or less unknown) estate executor, sure could look like a stolen car to authorities. Especially as you say it wasn't even fully paid for, but you have possession of the vehicle... Can you prove a transfer of funds for the partial payment made...? If you have a cop for a friend have them run the vin for ya.. IMO, Be very careful how you proceed, get a lawyer for sure before you do anything. Or just track the car with no registration needed. Being your first thread on our forums, and your first 3 and only posts are about how to proceed with no keys/no title, makes me wonder why you come here for this general car question. Why not go to your states dmv/forum, or a local lawyer that knows state DMV laws. Why come here....? jmo

DMV is hit and miss for sure but you still need to find out what they require, many years ago when I lived in Detroit I bought a 56 chevy it was brought up from Alabama and at that time Alabama was a no title state I found out from the DMV that all I needed to apply for a title is get the vin checked by the state police to prove it wasn't stolen

Sounds like you have a free track car until someone takes it away. Seriously, it sounds like there is no family remaining to push the settling of the estate. I don't know what happens in these cases, but it seems the state won't move until they are owed sufficient taxes to go after the estate. The only way to get it moving would be to get a lawyer and make some kind of claim against the estate. I would meet with a lawyer to know how to start and figure out if it's even worth it. Maybe follow up on the rules to have a car declared abandoned. Good luck

What others have said, maybe if it's special then spend some money trying to see if it's possible. Sounds like you may not want to alert the friends family that you even have it. If you don't want to make it a track car, sell it to someone who does.

I had a similar issue on a Boxster a few years ago, and a "Title Bond" was the answer..... I bought a Boxster from E-Bay from the northeast for cheap. When I got the car and the Title, I found out the guy who sold it to me didn't have the Title in his name, It was in the name of a deceased man who was the Title holder, but was signed over by his Daughter who was Hier of his Estate... I had a Bill OF Sale from the man I bougth it from, but the Title was twice removed from me...The State of Alabama DMV would not accept this...and there was no way to correct it... They suggested I get a "Title Bond" that insures the car is not stolen, ( you buy the Title Bond then take that to the DMV )..The Title Bond gives three years for someone to Claim they are the rightful owner...After the three years, and no one has Claimed to own the car, then it is mine to do with as I please as Title Holder.....That was 6 years ago and no issue, so everything is free and clear... If you are sure the car is not stolen or no one will try to claim ownership, then this is the procedure I would use....I think it cost me $100, and is based on car value and year model...

As has been mentioned, every state is different but I went through something similar here in California. I had tenant move out and leave a boat and trailer behind and he refused to do anything about and said he didn't want them anymore. It's been over 15 years but I remember it as not being that big of a deal to take ownership. It was some DMV paperwork and I had to take the boat and trailer to the DMV so they could see the V.I.N. of the trailer and the H.I.N. (Hull Identification Number) of the boat. BTW, I still have the boat & trailer. I redid the rigging to make it twice as hard to sail though.

Orrrrr�. Build yourself a genuine outlaw Porsche 😈

Quotes source post: 19681803

You have to scratch your head and ask, "Who does this???" (on ANY car deal not just Porsches) - that is, no bill of sale, no title, no notarized agreement, and to make matters worse... NO KEYS!!! LAWD HAVE MERCY!! Forgive my apprehension, but this screams "STOLEN PORSCHE"! We don't know YOU, but let's assume the story is truly legit, then your father didn't handle business appropriately and now you're both screwed! So basically all you have is your father's claimed verbal agreement that can NOT be backed up, lighter bank account (no proof it went to a car deal), and now the car is sitting on your father's property without keys or proof of ownership. A lawyer told me once, an oral agreement is about as good as the paper it's written on! Porsche will not provide YOU with a new fresh set of keys withOUT a title. You can try, but I've dealt with them and that's the case when a car is presented to them without keys. So you can kiss your track dreams with this car goodbye until all the mess is handled legally. IMHO, YOUR father's friend was NOT a good "friend". Booom! No friend would do that to another friend and let things slide for 4 years! All the "friend" and your father had to do was go to a bank and have an official agreement drafted and notarized before money was exchanged. The state title should have been in the possession of the (brother's brother) executor of the estate and then granted to the brother. But now it's been more than 4 years and the so called friend and brother are both dead.... and, so is this transaction. That being said, the car is legally NOT yours, you guys screwed up and now the car should be taken back to the executor of the estate. Maybe the family will believe the testimony of your father? Knowing how people act these days, I wouldn't hold my breath! As crazy as this sounds, this exact thing happened to my dear colleague as few years ago. She was trying to sell off items in her father's estate after he passed. Her father did an oral deal trading a tractor for a sports car, but never obtained the title. What happened? The title was lost. My colleague vaguely remembered the deal. The living mother was able to remember the name of the person. She then searched for the seller and was successful. They went together to the DMV and applied for a new title. Since the title was still in his name, the process was NOT painful since he presented legal ID and all necessary documentation. Thankfully, the seller was honest and helped with the process. He could have claimed the transaction was not legit and the car was "stolen" or something. In the end, the car was sold and all is happy. If you're truly honest, then why not post a picture of the car. That would help most people's skepticism.

Get an attorney (civil or criminal as needed) and come back when this is all sorted.

Unless you have a paper trail of the amount your dad put down on the car, you're SOL. It would remain in the original owners estate because there's no proof of what transpired over the years unless you have it in writing. Maybe reach out to whoever is still alive on his part and see if you can make the transaction....

Ohio is the worst with titles, and the fact you said money hungry girlfriend leads you down a slippery path. This car isn�t yours, and isn�t even owned by the person who your father gave a deposit to .For all purposes you should treat it as a stolen car, because it may not even be in any of these people�s names. If any of the family members get wind of this and it is possibly in the brothers name, you have no right to the car whatsoever, as it would more than likely go tho the next of kin. At any point if the title is in anyone�s name, you now have a stolen vehicle in your possession. Turning it into a track car would be great, until the time when and if it is reported stolen( because you don�t have proof of ownership) it more than likely will become a big deal. Ohio doesn�t take this lightly. The best thing to do is contact who you think the owner is and buy the title back with the rest of the deposit. Make sure the title is in their name, not the deceased, as if it is it will be worth nothing. Make sure the notary stamp on the title in the next of kin is current, as if it isn�t in Ohio, it�s worth nothing. What you have in your possession , the state of Ohio will deem a stolen car because you don�t have any proof of ownership. I have been through this and it�s not fun and I can be a felony if the owner wants to push it. I would immediately make sure that this particular car isn�t reported stolen, and next find out that the brother or next of kin is the current owner. The last thing to do is contact these people and see if they would like to exchange a current title for the remainder of the car. Not sure about the title bond in Ohio, but like I have said, Ohio and California have very strict vehicle title laws.

I know its not reported stolen. My father was just trusting his friend. The guy just fell ill. Also he didn't drive so my father would've had to drive him around to do it. Hell, I had to pick my father up, go get the guy to go to the house he was inheriting to view and inspected it. I managed to get it started but engine sounded bad. After towing it to my property I got it running well. For my pops it was just about the money. He had no interest or use for a Porsche. I dropped be it home once and on a couple runs. Just kept getting on my father to finish the deal knowing the guy had to switch it from his brother's name into his own. Time would go by and id ask pops if he got it done. I moved and dropped it off at his house as it was his deal. Then he lost key. Had he not touched the key it would still be in same place out the way which was the idea. Before this, it had been garaged the whole time. Now it's been sitting outside ever since. Such as shame to see. My father up in age also, 65, and saw opportunity to make some money. Normally would have informed me and I would've gotten it. In that case I would've been all over getting it done as I deal with vehicles a lot. Also because of the guys age I knew to get it done asap so this wouldn't be a problem but it was out of my hands as he kept telling me he'd get it done. It only has 67k miles and came with hard top. So problem is also the value by Ohio rules. Lawyer says sol. Has to be a way.

Quotes source post: 19684783

You mean besides contacting the legal heir of the car?

Quotes source post: 19684811

This Contact the legal heir and ask if they�ll sell you the car. Not sure if �p ossession is nine-tenths of the law� is applicable to vehicles without a title or bill of sale.

Quotes source post: 19684783

A lot of even more irrelevant info. Except that a lawyer told you you�re sol and it�s a cab. Keeps getting worse. Next thing you�ll say is it�s an automatic.

U r missing the point. It doesnt matter if "know" its not stolen. Legally its not yours or your fathers car. It belongs to the estate. If u want the car u have to convince the estate to legally transfer the car or u can explore the many work arounds this thread has mentioned but be warned once the estate gets wind of u tring to title the car they can force u into returning it. if u can prove a transaction of money actually took place u may be able to argue that the car was calateral on a loan. At that point u can put a title lean on it and force the estate to sign it over? This would probably take years. Bottom line the car might be worth $15-20k unless it has some 1 off paint or option. It hasnt been maintained for a long time and its a cab that is stored outside. All bad news for value as it doent really matter that it has 70k miles because when these cars sit they rot from the inside out. I guess the question is how bad do u really want it?

Quotes source post: 19684783

Gain some credibility here. Post an image of the Porsche in question. Post an image of the driver side door tag that notes the date of manufacture.

Sounds like your dads friend was the Hier to his Brothers Estate ( which would include legal ownership of the Porsche) .since he got his House/Money .So that takes away one step to other Claims to the Porsche...Your Dads friend that died also left an Estate, who is the Hier to that? The money hungry girlfriend? I agree with Dejeeper, once you start contacting the Estate to hand them over money, they will probably take you up on it.. Ask your dad if his friend had any other Hiers besides the money hungry girlfriend, then decide if you want to contact them...If he left a WILL, it should have mentioned the Porsche if money was still owed for it... Again, you could ask the Ohio DMV if you are eligible to apply for a "Surety Bond" / " Title Bond" and just sit back and wait to see if the Estate CONTACTS YOU...I would not spend a lot of $$ on the car for three years even if you do get the Title Bond just encase the Estate comes for the car , because you may have to pay out money to keep the car or you may decide to let them have it back.... With the Title Bond you can get a tag and insurance to drive/enjoy the car, but you are not free and clear to sell it for three years....

I have no idea who is now or even if the heir counts since his friend that had it never took care of it from his brother being it was never transferred. Legal heir passed away but never transferred ownership. Now someone else is heir but I don't see them having control over that. Maybe I'm just thinking on normal title transfer processes. I know everything he did transfer is heir to someone else. Don't know how all that works. She could have control. I would imagine that while he was I'll she probably had him sign over his assets. Well, just going to give up on that. I don't know the people and my father has no information on whats going on now. Thanks for trying to help. Didn't think there was an answer but I know some people out there somewhere has been thru this. Thanks again for trying. It's just a lost.

George, how old are you?

44 and my father is 67 now. I deal with a lot of cars but normally title is present. Just heard of other's getting titles for cars in no title situations not knowing previous owner. Never been thru it before. Never would actually. Just something father did. My wife passed and it was easy with hers. Understandably, I was heir. Just this is different. Not knowledgeable about this situation at all which is obvious. Just figured Porsche community would be determined on saving one in these circumstances.

Well several have given u proven options but its a gamble. U can always quietly part it out for profit.

That's what I was thinking at 1st. Just sucks. It's beautiful. I like to save vehicles. Why I'm so determined. It's a beautiful machine. Thank you everyone!

I vote against parting it out. I think it�s sacrilegious.

Quotes source post: 19684938

It may be more complicated than that. My limited experience as a personal representative for an estate is that this situation exists for a limited timeframe before the matters of the estate are either deemed settled to the court's satisfaction or the estate is taken over by the court. This probably depends on the state where this is executed, but my point is that there technically may no longer be an "estate", which makes things all the more fuzzy from a legal standpoint. I've no intent to be offensive, but in my opinion it is foolish to seek legal advice from a public forum just because "we" might be caring guys that have affections for 996 Porsches. That approach is neither sensible nor an effective means to a desired end. One would not do well to ask their barber for serious medical advice.

Quotes source post: 19685619

This is a technical subforum, It's not our duty to give legal advice or saving a person from a situation that should have been avoided in the first place. This is car buyer 101. Now, you never took my simple request to gain some credibility by posting an image of the car and door tag. Instead you chose to ignore it. Therefore, my opinion is the car doesn't exist or if it does exist, it's clearly stolen and should be returned to the rightful owners. Therefore, this drama that you've create here is nothing more than that... drama. Most here wont waste time posting because they've seen the same (no title, no keys) threads over and over on this forum. We're not your TOOL for your personal high. Prove me wrong!

Ok. Appreciate people that were trying to help. I'm just a car guy that loves to save them. If I been through this before and an fellow car person asked me of this I would do everything to help as I always do when others have problems. Just I have no experience with this and have heard others have. Trying to find them. Thought this would be the right place. I always help people if I have the answer. Thanks everyone that were trying to help without judgement. You are true car people. ​​​​

Quotes source post: 19688343

Could you post a picture of the car? What year model/trim of 996? I assume it's a cabriolet, correct?

[Image-only post; no author-written text. Original image references:] https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/rennlist.com-vbulletin/768x1366/georgetriping_cc06ad6b927b58ff1723c63d1818c71ec49e8772.jpg

Quotes source post: 19681543

I've heard this kind of complex problem before and its always a three card monte. This is a plea for "how do I get around the law?" It doesn't belong on this forum.

Quotes source posts: 19681543, 19686132, 19682725

I just got through probate with a family member's estate and know a little of how it works at least in California. One of the first steps is to provide the court with an inventory of the deceased's assets so I'm wondering if this Porsche made it on to the inventory (public record in CA). The OP's description of events is very confusing but in California, based on the OP's comment, " The guy was desperate for money and sold the car to my father before everything got transferred to his ownership ", means brother 2 stole the car from brother 1's estate. Also as Marv mentioned, the "estate" is over when (at least in CA) the judge signs the final order after everything has been distributed. I looked at some of the paperwork and my situation doesn't really apply to the OP. I filed a lien against the boat and trailer for unpaid "storage fees". The last legal owner on file is notified of the lien and given an opportunity to respond. After a certain time with no response, it moves forward. This is for stuff with a value of $4,000 or less. I assume over $4,000 gets a LOT more complicated.

Quotes source post: 19681543

move to california and drive it...you'll fit right in

Thank you to all the people trying to be positive with their help on here. Greatly appreciated. I know there's always going to be people trying to be negative so I really thank the positive people Wow, forgot about asking for help on here. Also for the people question me being new and asking this question. Why would anybody join a car specific forum unless they end up with that type of car. If I have a car and I'm troubleshooting issues, I do online research 1st. Then I join forums related to car with the idea that people that have dealt with them for a while will have more useful knowledge from all different angles. I always help people when I know. So far, I've heard some positive types of responses that I would give others. Just process I'm going through a few people have mentioned. Other than this, I'm a bmw guy but Porsche 996 is new experience. Have had a 944 and a 928 self taught to work on. Even had to learn to rebuild a 92 bmw 750il transmission because transmission shops refused to do it. I'm just love to learn. I've heard of people going through no title process like this before but know nobody who has done it. Never came across a care i cared enough about to go thru the process. When you research this, everybody tells you to make sure the car is worth it. Well it definitely is and this will be a new learning experience. Talked to lawyer and he didn't mention process title bureau told me to follow.

Thank you to all the people trying to be positive with their help on here. Greatly appreciated. I know there's always going to be people trying to be negative so I really thank the positive people Wow, forgot about asking for help on here. Also for the people question me being new and asking this question. Why would anybody join a car specific forum unless they end up with that type of car. If I have a car and I'm troubleshooting issues, I do online research 1st. Then I join forums related to car with the idea that people that have dealt with them for a while will have more useful knowledge from all different angles. I always help people when I know. So far, I've heard some positive types of responses that I would give others. Just process I'm going through a few people have mentioned. Other than this, I'm a bmw guy but Porsche 996 is new experience. Have had a 944 and a 928 self taught to work on. Even had to learn to rebuild a 92 bmw 750il transmission because transmission shops refused to do it. I'm just love to learn. I've heard of people going through no title process like this before but know nobody who has done it. Never came across a care i cared enough about to go thru the process. When you research this, everybody tells you to make sure the car is worth it. Well it definitely is and this will be a new learning experience. Talked to lawyer and he didn't mention process title bureau told me to follow.