So your 996 transmission is starting to howl or whine...

My 996 has 137,000 miles on it, mostly on the freeway (although it has had a few track and autocross days thrown in for good measure). About 35,000 miles ago, I began to notice a faint whine - similar to the sound that straight cut gears in racing transmissions make - emanating from my transmission area. It would present itself mostly while load was applied - either through acceleration, or deceleration - and would quiet down during coasting. I eventually had my friend/Porsche mechanic take a look at it, and he told me it was either the Pinion bearing, which has a history of drying out and failing with these transmissions, or possibly the Carrier bearings, which can make a similar noise, but are a lot cheaper and a lot easier to replace. He was about to pull the transmission for a clutch replacement and while in there was going to replace the original IMS with the updated LN Engineering version and also replace the RMS. We figured - while the box was out - why not replace the cheaper Carrier bearings first and see if that solved the problem. Well, it didn't. I was up to my eyeballs in expenses at the time and the last thing I could afford was a full transmission teardown to replace the obviously worn Pinion bearing - at least for a while anyway (without putting it on my credit card, which I'm hesitant to do these days because I paid off my cards a few years ago want to keep myself off of that crack pot for good). He mentioned that the transmission would almost certainly NOT self destruct over the short term - it would just get louder and louder. So I put it off. And I put it off. For about 30,000 more miles. Well, it got SO loud that eventually it became deafening at highway speeds. It was awful. I mean, I couldn't even hear the engine over that racket. Interestingly, it never lost its shifting smoothness through all of that. At least until it got so bad that I decided I was playing with fire and decided to park it. The final straw was that I was feeling a weird vibration in the stick in second gear and the lever did not slot in on the upshift to second without a little hesitation and shudder. Uh Oh! Ok. I give up. Time to park this thing. So, I called my friend and told him it was parked until he rebuilt the transmission (which he gave me an AWESOME labor deal on, btw). A few weeks later, I drove it to the shop he uses for his little side jobs (a place run by another friend of ours) and we immediately tore into it. In no time, the transmission was out. He sent it to another guy he knows who has the equipment to press the gears and bearing off of and on to the tapered shafts. He called me a week later and told me that they had NEVER seen a bearing as trashed as mine! I was not surprised. Look at the pictures below... The ball bearing cage was coming apart. The ***** themselves were so worn they weren't even round anymore, and the inner races were scored beyond belief. Take a look at how much metal sludge is on the magnet. There was so much bearing material floating around that the carrier bearing he replaced the first time were trashed again, so I had to buy new ones - again. In fact, I decided to buy all new bearings for the transmission and differential. If it was a bearing, I replaced it. In all, I spent about $1350 on bearing alone. Luckily, the gears and syncros were all unscathed. They were all in nearly perfect as-new condition, thank God. The Spider gears, which apparently have a tendency to become pitted over time, were perfect. No pitting whatsoever Considering that the Pinion and Input shaft bearings are sealed units similar to the infamous IMS bearing, with the same inherent issue - namely the grease eventually exits the bearing, yet the transmission oil can't seem to get back in very well to lubricate the bearing - my mechanic decided to pull the seal off the new bearings in order to allow the transmission oil to lubricate the bearings, just as it does all of the other internals. He's in the process of putting it all back together and I should have the car back on the road by the end of the weekend. I'm looking forward to the peace and quiet again. A few things to be gained by this episode. One, unfortunately, due to the design of the bearings for this transmission, it seems that more and more of these units will begin to exhibit the same bearing failures we all know so well with the IMS issue. Two, DO NOT wait as long as I did to tear into the transmission once you begin to hear that whine or howl. Luckily for me, it seems that this transmission is quite robust - even when doofus me neglects it to the point that I should probably have my Porsche card permanently taken away from me. For an unreal number of miles, it soldiered on as I continued to drive it with a failing bearing. Amazing, really. Here are some pictures:

Hi, Great write up! I drove mine with that wine for about 7k and it drove me mad! Don’t know how you managed that for so long! When my mechanic removed the bearings they said that they were the worst pinion shaft bearings that they had ever seen. I’m sure not as bad as your 35k bearings though! I too opted to have all the bearings replaced. What a difference! I now change the transmission fluid every service. Jack

Been there done that.. :-) I drove mine only 10k extra miles.

I'm glad you got things resolved, but I'm surprised you opted to remove the seal on a stock bearing. The first one last quite a while. I'm no bearing expert, but I thought splash lubricated bearings were usually used in environments with relatively clean oil. In the transmission I'd think the metal particles that are generated would cause problems with an open, metal bearing setup. Ceramic bearings would seem a little safer. Again, I have no direct experience with this, just putting a thought out there. If it were me I'd certainly change my transmission fluid on a more regular basis if I had an open bearing inside of it. -S.

Same story! My pinion bearing was almost in pieces when pulled apart, yet the transmission soldiered on for a year until the rebuild was done. Very noisy but never let me down. Rebuilt by Gbox and shifts like a dream and whisper quiet now! Pete

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Yeah, I have to agree here. At startup, the factory tranny fluid is thick and takes some time to heat up. It is also sitting in the lower half of the trans. What will be providing lubrication to the being while the trans fluid warms up? If you pack the bearing with grease and leave them unsealed, the grease will be removed after the first hard, high temp drive. Did you ever change the tranny fluid under your ownership and/or do you have proof that is was ever changed?

Thanks for the write up and photos.

Thanks guys. I'm not worried about the lubrication of those two bearings. The third bearing I replaced is an open design, and there are about four or more other needle bearing buried in the gear stacks. Those were deemed to be just fine. No wear. Not only that, but as far as I know, Porsche never used sealed bearings until this transmission. Not so surprisingly, those others are not known for bearing failures. Also, "Robin 993DX" has already done this - about 1 1/2 years ago. As far as I'm aware, all is still well with his transmission. Transmission oil changes will become a regular maintenance item for me now. Cheap insurance compared to another teardown.

450: Great write up. I will change my tranny oil soon. Those gears must be really tuff stuff to look so good coming out of a metal bath like you had going. I have become a big fan of tranny music since going to a single mass flywheel.

Looks like I have the same problem as well. Do any of you have a service manual for an 02 C2? I'm gonna tackle this on my own, just need something to follow incase I get stumped. Also does anyone know if its possible to use an unsealed bearing? seeing as how the complete bearing is inside the tranny, i dont really see a need for a sealed unit. Let the oil flow in and we will minimize our problems. IMO. Someone please correct me if I'm worng.

I'll start a new thread but if anyone's interested, I have a G-Box rebuilt trans sitting in my garage that I'm going to sell. Details on a new thread.....

What gear/trans oil did they recommend or do you plan to use?

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Step 1: Purchase a 50 ton press 450knot, I am amazed with that many miles that your ring and pinion didn't eat itself. That's just unheard of...

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No kidding! It was perfect though, as you can see. Looked brand new. My transmission is whisper quiet these days. Love it.

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I am not too sure that I would recommend trying this particular rebuild on your own. It is certainly possible if you have the correct tools, but it is also pretty easy to make things worse if you don't. As to the bearings, you can always pull off the seal rings on the bearing and allow this bearing to sit free flow in the oil. I am not sure if this is going to be a better solution or not, but it is certainly an option. I am glad to hear that you got your gearbox up and running again. I agree with Matt with relation to the ring and pinion not getting damaged, you got pretty lucky on that one. The rest of the gearbox looks like it was in great shape. Erik

+1 on Erik's assessment. I am pretty handy but ended up getting a used one off Ebay and have a couple of boxes sitting in the garage with tranny parts. BTW: Are you interested Erik? 2nd gear synchro is bad though.

Sent you a PM Thanks

Careful who you buy your rebuilt transmissions from... I wouldn't deal with GBOX; know lots of other customers who were ripped off... it's not about bad workmanship... that happens from time to time but to deliberately deceive customers... that's called FRAUD . check this out: http://www.ripoffreport.com/gbox-por...rado-d2005.htm

How does one equal lots?

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first of all there is a difference between fraud/misrepresentation and poor workmanship. I have posted Fraud... so even ONE post should concern anybody who does business with GBOX. as for more... thanks for asking... they are on there way.! stay tuned - we will present real customers of GBOX who were defrauded... nothing to do with poor workmanship.. but deliberately LIED to and DEFRAUDED for services never performed and/or hardware promised but never delivered - and also sold used hardware when customers bought new. in the market for a gearbox rebuild or repair... I highly suggest you look elsewhere.

Who is we, and are you all going to back your assertions in the court system?

One is enough...

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why do you ask... you affiliated with GBOX? afraid something will become of it? you should be. Clients who got ripped off and scammed aren't gonna roll over and play dead just yet.

If you change your trans and front dif oil on a regular basis I think you would see any issues earlier or maybe prevent them. 75-W90 Synthetic oil is cheap compared to a new trans and dif. I would change it at least every year or sooner since most of our cars spend most of their time garaged and will never come close to the recommended mileage intervals.

Tbred911 - I find it rather unfortunate that you continue to publish allegations that are simply not true with regard to the company I work for. I am very familiar with your build, and have the receipts to show and prove that the ring and pinion that you question was indeed brand new, even if it was originally date stamped in 08. I think that perhaps you should look up the definition of libel, before continuing down this path. If you are still unhappy with the fact that Albins would not warranty your racing ring and pinion which you damaged after several years of use, then perhaps you should take your anger and fight directly to them. I do think that it is unfortunate that we were not able to get them to extend you a warranty on this item, but this was their decision, not ours. As to any other possible issues, I suggest that you address these directly with us prior to posting here unless you intend to publish hearsay without the benefit of any context. I assume that these supposed additional issues did not happen directly to you? As many will report and testify to, GBox has been in this business for quite some time. We would not be able to continue to offer the services that we do for our clients if what you suggest was actually the truth. This is a small industry, news travels fast, and what you are reporting here as fact just simply is not. I apologize for addressing this in public, but we have tried and tried in the past to resolve this in other ways, unsuccessfully. I will not tolerate out and out lies to be laid out here as fact that have no basis in actual reality. Have a good day everyone. Erik Johnson GBox LLC

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Erik! I just saw this post as I was searching to see who else you were planning to approach for a "job". You NEVER followed up as you say in your email. Libel....? please. You have NEVER followed up with me and tried to resolve it... show me ONE email where you tried to RESOLVE this as you say... Erik your such a liar and and a crook and there are other who are just too proud to admit they were ripped off by you and they probably don't want to get harassed by you as well. I for one am glad of the forums where we can share our stories about experience with different outfits. You have NO customer service, portray USED parts for NEW and give bad advice just to serve your own commercial interests. http://www.ripoffreport.com/gbox-por...rado-d2005.htm Why don't others complain about you...? they will...wait and see... more stories on ripoffreport.com that's a promise for 2013 - more documented stories of your customers who got ripped of by YOU and GBOX. hearsay? I've spoken to some of your customers as this community is pretty tight and I am appalled at what I have discovered about your previous dealings and how you've treated them. Folks, when dealing with transmission work there are much more reputable shops to work with here; GBOX is not one of them based on my experience and the experience of others who will remain nameless at this time until they come forward. As I've emailed you before I'm open to a settlement as I feel your shop has wronged me and I've been very patient with you and sought the opinion of other shops here. You let me know if you want to settle out of court.

You know, this really doesnt seem fair to hash this out on the 996 forum but I would like to hear everything about any 996 trans build or problem because as I understand it there are only a few common faults with this trans. Sealed bearings seem to be the number one problem. Are the replacement "open" bearings available for the DIY guys?

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parts are not the problem... it's who does the work... get somebody who will install NEW parts and KNOWS what they are doing.

Thank you 450Knot, I suffered the same problem at 95,000 miles on my 2004 996 GT3. Despite my best attempts at changing the gearbox oil every year and being gentle with heel-toe changes, the whine got progressively louder. The garage I go to wants $7000 for parts (ring gear and pinion shaft, with the two taper roller bearings) and labor. Can someone guide me if this is a fair price? If not, what is a fair price?

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I'm planning to take mine apart this winter. It was howlng like a strait cut gearbox, changed the oil to Lucas 75W90 and it quieted down a lot but the oil that came out was metalic grey so I'm on borrowed time. A bearing is coming apart in there for sure. I'll document my work and any alternative parts that may go back in there.

The transmission was making a good bit of noise at speed. I pulled it and sent it to KMW Motorsports and Kevin confirmed the pinion bearing was bad. Kevin said it was in good order except for the pinion bearing and he also replaced the main shaft bearing which also is a sealed bearing. I also had a limited slip installed while it was apart. Here are the parts he replaced, 996 302 808 00, pinion bearing, Qty=1, 996 302 807 00, main shaft bearing, Qty=1 syncro rings ( 2nd 3rd 4th ), Qty=3 Pictures of pinion bearing, the main shaft bearing was starting to show signs of wear but the pinion was in bad shape.

Adker: How much would a job like this, cost you approximately, if you are so inclined to mention it? My #2 and #4 synchro rings are not notchy and although not in a rush, I need to start planning to do something about it. Thanks! Martin

Good to see folks posting their pictures after rebuild of the well-used/failing parts. The visual is worth a thousand words!

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My bill came to $2,175, very pleased with the cost and Kevin does really good work. He did a rebuild on the track car transmission last year and it is perfect. I did the R&R on the transmission.

I hear a pinion bearing in my near future. Any advice on who is doing a "good" transmission rebuild these days?

I will resurrect an old post cause I'm in action with my C4 tranny and need an information. I would like to know if for everyone who had the pinion bearing issue, the Porsche magic grease was present at the bottom of the transmission? In my case I have the symptoms but no magic grease on the magnet washer. I heard the differential section of the tranny could make noise too. Any help is welcome. Thank's

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I'm having some similar issues and have a question regarding symptoms. I have a whine/howl going on when I'm in gear or nuetral regardless of clutch position or in gear or out of gear. The pitch changes with rpms. It has gotten worse over the last 5-10 k miles. I did remove the belt and the whine/howl was still there. My car is a manuall with 70k miles. Is it likely I could have this pinnion bearing transmission problem while I'm in neutral and not using the clutch at all? What all bearings are in motion when you start the car and do nothing but rev it? The sound seems loudest behind the oil pan area imo. I just changed the oil and not a single sparkle in the filter. My goal for this comment is to either rule out or confirm this could possibly be the problem. I will give any information I can. The shop i visited today wasn't sure and didn't want to jump the gun on it being the trans because the car is very clean underneath and there are 0 shifting issues.

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Do you have that noise when the car is not moving or only on the road either the clutch engaged or not?

this howl in every gear?

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It sounds the same when you press the gas pedal regardless of clutch pedal position or in gear or in neutral, moving or not moving. Sounds the same on cold start and when warm. Is it even possible that it could be a transmission issue? Anybody with a 996 in the Morris area that wants to compare car sounds?

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Every gear including out of gear.

Still don't understand why designers put 'sealed' bearings inside devices that have different oils or liquids, the seals won't hold, they leak! Instead why don't they have open bearings and splasher paddles to send oil to the bearings as parts rotate inside, then make sure the oils have appropriate additives like molybdenum etc

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I think your noise comes from the engine or pilot bearing. Not from transmission.

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I want to hear from the guys that replaced the bearing already.

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I was looking up the pilot bearing which took me to this post https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=1285949 People were replying that the 996 in the videos sounds completely normal. Mine sounds the exact same way. Sound normal to you? Maybe it's just the 996's with those color options that sound like that. I have the same interior and exterior as the car in the videos.

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me too!

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I did https://rennlist.com/forums/996-foru...nt-my-diy.html

ok....was the noise in every gear?

Yep but not when the car was still

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Did you find any solution on this? I have the same noise and can't figure it out..

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yes. It was the pinion bearing. Check for the DIY I made. It was for a Carrera 4 tranny rebuild my diy or something like that. It s a long time ago!!!

Perfect write up of what seems exactly my problem. I am also waiting for way too long to get the pinion bearings replaced. I have means of taking the gearbox out but I could not get any of the locally known or even Porsche specific gearbox repair shops to quote. Those bearings seem unavailable as Porsche spare parts for this G9600 type gearbox. GT2 and GT3 seem no problem. Junk gear boxes start at 3500 �, whereas others are available below 2000. So there must be some reason here. Now the question to you guys in the States is: Where did you source those spare parts? I have a US address to pick them up personally mid December if they would not ship to Europe. I just cant't find them. Thanks a lot..

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If you search the archive for threads you can find the part numbers and sources for the pinion bearings. It used to be a common thing here and many Rennlisters did there own repair...Although it does take a 50 ton press to get the gears off the shaft it can be done by average Techs if they are mechanically inclined... Here are the factory part numbers for the bearings you need....Used to be able to get them from ABC bearings at WAY less like $200 for the "800" bearing and $125 for the "700" bearing....The & ) bearing is also avilible from Audi/VW or at least it used to be .....Been a long time since someone here has done this.... Most just send them to G-Box or CMS and have them do it... It's kinda crazy that you can't get this done in Germany, since that where Porsche are manufactured....lol 99630280800 pinion bearing output list price $498usd 99630280700 input shaft bearing list price $348usd

Check out this thread https://rennlist.com/forums/996-foru...ent-diy-6.html Post #87 by @Coltti lists the equivalent/identical Audi part that may well be easily available.

It's kinda crazy that you can't get this done in Germany, since that where Porsche are manufactured....lol 99630280800 pinion bearing output list price $498usd 99630280700 input shaft bearing list price $348usd [/QUOTE] Thanks a lot. Found the 800 parts in Italy as INA bearings on stock (remaining) ( 722 0646 10 INA Supporto, Cambio manuale) . Crazy enough that INA and *** discontinued the parts as can be read in their own stores. As *** supplied Porsche it is no longer available as genuine spare part. And yes crazy, Not sure I need the 700 at all. Have asked ABC by mail though (they have no online shop). Sunsetporscheparts have them online at ca 300 delivered. Still no means to get them in Europe as it seems.

I believe that my new to me 1999 C2 has this issue. Changed the transmission fluid with the help of a fellow PCA member yesterday (he did all the actual work while I watched). The oil came out looking pretty good, at first, but there was a lot of metallic sludge that he removed with his finger. Plus there were actual pieces of metallic debris in the catch can. Now I need to find a place local to me that can work on this, although maybe it�s a job for next year.